# Sherwin Williams Vinyl Paint



## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

So I'm Painting a vinyl exterior this week, and Sherwin Williams tells me that they have a paint (used to be super paint) that they can tint any colour and put it on the vinyl without it warping. I tell the client this and they pick a mustardy/browny yellow. I go to Sherwin Williams and now they say they can't tint the paint to that colour....didn't you guys just say any colour?

Any of you guys use this stuff? I think its called either duration, or reliance.

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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

journeymanPainter said:


> So I'm Painting a vinyl exterior this week, and Sherwin Williams tells me that they have a paint (used to be super paint) that they can tint any colour and put it on the vinyl without it warping. I tell the client this and they pick a mustardy/browny yellow. I go to Sherwin Williams and now they say they can't tint the paint to that colour....didn't you guys just say any colour?
> 
> Any of you guys use this stuff? I think its called either duration, or reliance.
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T989D using PaintTalk.com mobile app


"VinylSafe" colors. Not any color, but a surprising range, including some pretty dark colors. 

http://www.sherwin-williams.com/hom...collection/vinylsafe-colors-for-vinyl-siding/

Put me down in the "Skeptical" column. I'd be interested in their explanation as to how those dark colors stay cool.


EDIT: here's a thread from 2009 about the product:

http://www.painttalk.com/f2/duration-vinyl-now-its-warping-6249/index3/


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## MikeCalifornia (Aug 26, 2012)

Its not the product per se, but the color chart that is approved for vinyl siding. There are about 50 colors on it, ranging from light to dark. It has everything to do with LRV, too little and the siding will heat up too much. The colors are supposed to be mixed into Superpaint, Duration, or Emerald since they have the best adhesion and are ok for vinyl. When those colors are tinted, the label will not have a formula on it.


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

Gough said:


> "VinylSafe" colors. Not any color, but a surprising range, including some pretty dark colors.
> 
> http://www.sherwin-williams.com/hom...collection/vinylsafe-colors-for-vinyl-siding/
> 
> Put me down in the "Skeptical" column. I'd be interested in their explanation as to how those dark colors stay cool.


The Sherwin rep said they put the colour in the machine and it tells them how to tint it for vinyl. I think they muddy up the colors instead of using darker/true colors

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## SemiproJohn (Jul 29, 2013)

Is there any chance you can persuade the customer to have you color match the existing paint on the vinyl siding? That takes the pressure off you. I've painted a lot of vinyl. Pressure wash, SealKrete, and usually Superpaint. I've never had a buckling issue, but then, I've never applied a substantially darker color to the vinyl's original color. Siding gets really hot here in Central Florida, and I don't have experience with the SW 'vinyl safe' paint. Sticking with the original color is best, obviously.


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

SemiproJohn said:


> Is there any chance you can persuade the customer to have you color match the existing paint on the vinyl siding? That takes the pressure off you. I've painted a lot of vinyl. Pressure wash, SealKrete, and usually Superpaint. I've never had a buckling issue, but then, I've never applied a substantially darker color to the vinyl's original color. Siding gets really hot here in Central Florida, and I don't have experience with the SW 'vinyl safe' paint. Sticking with the original color is best, obviously.


She wants a drastic change (in memory of her husband) very eclectic taste in colors.

Sherwin won't get me the colour in there 'colour safe vinyl' so I'm using Duluxs diamond. Its formulated to go directly on vinyl, and the samples that were done all bonded....lets just hope the vinyl doesn't warp

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## SemiproJohn (Jul 29, 2013)

journeymanPainter said:


> She wants a drastic change (in memory of her husband) very eclectic taste in colors.
> 
> Sherwin won't get me the colour in there 'colour safe vinyl' so I'm using Duluxs diamond. Its formulated to go directly on vinyl, and the samples that were done all bonded....lets just hope the vinyl doesn't warp
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T989D using PaintTalk.com mobile app


I hope you have no problems.

I know about customers with eclectic tastes...mustard brown.

Here's a before/after of a side of a house I did for a guy that wanted "that" mustard color. I remember having neighbors of his walk by while I was painting and tell me how much they hated the new color.


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

SemiproJohn said:


> I hope you have no problems.
> 
> I know about customers with eclectic tastes...mustard brown.
> 
> Here's a before/after of a side of a house I did for a guy that wanted "that" mustard color. I remember having neighbors of his walk by while I was painting and tell me how much they hated the new color.


I think that's the exact colour she chose! Going from a nice light powder blue to that.

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## MikeCalifornia (Aug 26, 2012)

journeymanPainter said:


> The Sherwin rep said they put the colour in the machine and it tells them how to tint it for vinyl. I think they muddy up the colors instead of using darker/true colors
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T989D using PaintTalk.com mobile app


True, the store can use the "vinyl siding" match function, but it is not a match per se, just the closest LRV color to what you want. It is better to choose off the chart or you will be disappointed with what the eyematch will spit out.


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## Boco (May 18, 2013)

I think you should be all right with that color. I think its the dark brown, green and blues that sometimes have issues. Did you go with a satin?


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

Boco said:


> I think you should be all right with that color. I think its the dark brown, green and blues that sometimes have issues. Did you go with a satin?


Always flat on or exteriors (unless otherwise requested). Its a quality vinyl too. After we did our samples (hottest time of the day) the substrate wasn't hot(yes)

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## Boco (May 18, 2013)

I always thought the satin had a little more flex and you can apply it a bit thinner. We have rough winters here though and for us thats when crap starts to move. Place looks nice.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

journeymanPainter said:


> Always flat on or exteriors (unless otherwise requested). Its a quality vinyl too. After we did our samples (hottest time of the day) the substrate wasn't hot(yes)
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T989D using PaintTalk.com mobile app


Air temperature isn't the problem...it's surface temperature. Depending on the angle of the sun to the surface, the surface temp of the vinyl can be 50 degrees (F) hotter than the air (28 degrees C).


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

Gough said:


> Air temperature isn't the problem...it's surface temperature. Depending on the angle of the sun to the surface, the surface temp of the vinyl can be 50 degrees (F) hotter than the air (28 degrees C).


When you were here in BC last week that was our 'heat wave'. That's the hottest its been in a few years, and its also a rain forest. Flat is the norm over here.

I used to use satin all the time, but soon realized the product that I was using was a higher quality than some of the others, and pretty much everyone else was using flat too

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## Will22 (Feb 3, 2011)

LRV is the primary factor in painting vinyl, plastic wood, etc. LRV runs from 0 (Black) to 99 (Pure White). The general recommendation is to apply a color with an LRV of 55 or above. Otherwise, heat is absorbed, and warping occurs.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

Will22 said:


> LRV is the primary factor in painting vinyl, plastic wood, etc. LRV runs from 0 (Black) to 99 (Pure White). The general recommendation is to apply a color with an LRV of 55 or above. Otherwise, heat is absorbed, and warping occurs.


With traditional colorants, LRV was a general indicator of the radiant load on a surface, but only by coincidence. LRV is a measure of the reflectance in the visible range, but that's not really important with regard to heat absorption. What matters is the absorption/reflectance in the infrared wavelengths (>700nm). The traditional pigments have a very broad absorption spectrum, so they not only absorb much of the visible light, but also much of the infrared. The "vinyl-safe " colors are based on a new generation of tints, which are reflective in the IR range.


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

For $300/five this paint better work. Cool to the touch at the hottest point of the day. I don't think I've met a customer so happy to have their house painted.

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## Painter-Aaron (Jan 17, 2013)

The cool thing about this paint. Is that the technology comes from the us navy as they use it to hide the heat source on their submarines for stealth reasons.


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

Painter-Aaron said:


> The cool thing about this paint. Is that the technology comes from the us navy as they use it to hide the heat source on their submarines for stealth reasons.


Wow, that's crazy.....no wonder Sherwin Williams offers it, they just need to advertise it better

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## VAInteriors (May 12, 2007)

Maybe worth a shot next time...

http://www.benjaminmoore.com/en-us/for-contractors/regal-select-exterior-revive#advs=0&tab=3


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## richmondpainting (Feb 24, 2012)

Alot of yellows are "interior only" colors.....they will fade drastically and sw won't tint them unless you really understand it


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

We were looking at the 'stock' safe colors, and none of them have black, or yellow colorants. Its an interesting system, but they won't give us the colour code because of proprietary reasons.

It was finely
Definitely interesting to work with, not my favorite product (reliance). Flashed to much, coverage was garbage, but if they are going to guarantee no warping, then we'll cough up the $300/pail (we normally pay $100).

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## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

richmondpainting said:


> Alot of yellows are "interior only" colors.....they will fade drastically and sw won't tint them unless you really understand it


What about the yellow submarine? :blink:


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

mudbone said:


> What about the yellow submarine? :blink:


We all live in it, not outside of it, who cares what it looks like

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## Scannell Painting (Sep 25, 2010)

SemiproJohn said:


> Is there any chance you can persuade the customer to have you color match the existing paint on the vinyl siding? That takes the pressure off you. I've painted a lot of vinyl. Pressure wash, SealKrete, and usually Superpaint. I've never had a buckling issue, but then, I've never applied a substantially darker color to the vinyl's original color. Siding gets really hot here in Central Florida, and I don't have experience with the SW 'vinyl safe' paint. Sticking with the original color is best, obviously.


Sealkrete, is this the water repellent you use? I have a fair amount of aluminum to spray & after numerous soft brush cleanings it's still chalky. I've heard of using sealkrete but never tried it so wondering which sealkrete product should I try? I'll be using the "vinyl safe" in Duration as the finish.


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

Scannell Painting said:


> Sealkrete, is this the water repellent you use? I have a fair amount of aluminum to spray & after numerous soft brush cleanings it's still chalky. I've heard of using sealkrete but never tried it so wondering which sealkrete product should I try? I'll be using the "vinyl safe" in Duration as the finish.



Pretty sure John is talking about Seal Krete Original. Great stuff, locks down chalk well. 

http://www.seal-krete.com/media/3125/Original_100812.pdf


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