# Breakthrough White & Pastel Base



## Gwarel (May 8, 2012)

I have only used the Breakthrough in black and white. The black covers great, but the white is pretty translucent. The finished product is a nice color, but I wonder if any of you add tint to the white and if so what formula you have found that you like. Thanks!


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## Damon T (Nov 22, 2008)

L4 is 4 drops of umber. Helps a lot. Allowed us to cover in two coats instead of three.


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## The Cutting Edge (May 25, 2014)

I used breakthrough on my last cabinets in white also. Didn't have any colorant at all in it. Three courts plus a primer coat. Covered awful. Next time it will definitely be tinted.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Gwarel said:


> I have only used the Breakthrough in black and white. The black covers great, but the white is pretty translucent. The finished product is a nice color, but I wonder if any of you add tint to the white and if so what formula you have found that you like. Thanks!


I'm confused

The title of the thread contains "White & Pastel Base", Can I assume you are NOT using the pastel base and thinking it is not covering well?

Damon says to use L4, but that adds raw umber, which although is a pleasing tone, it is NOT white.

I would suggest the manufacturer's stated max amount of white colorant (is that still KX ?) in the white - NOT the pastel base.

as to pastel base, often an off white calls for pastel base with a small amount of colorant, and we would have trouble with coverage. One trick I used to do was to START with white base and add appropriate color. Obviously this would call for more colorant than in a pastel base, but the coverage was much better.


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## DrakeB (Jun 6, 2011)

As Damon mentioned, just a few drops of some colorant can make a big difference in hide (generally speaking, I've not tested with the Breakthrough). Umber is particularly good, white can help, and in Gennex I've noticed the S1 (black) seems to add a lot as well. A little bit of any or a combination of these can increase your hide without changing the color too much (in fact, most people prefer a slightly softened off-white to a stark white). As always, follow manufacturer recommendations for amount of tint to use.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

The "JET" formula based on the old Porter colorants has worked best for me. It maximizes the hide without toning the white.
j=yellow oxide
e=lamp black
t=raw umber

We used 1/2 of an increment of each (1/32oz increments, so it would be 1/64 of an oz.)
Although with the Trillion colorants it is 1/8 of an increment in 1/48 scale.(1/348 oz.)


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Oh I forgot. Hide was always an issue when i sold this product under the Vanex brand. Even the package white seemed to be lacking a bit. But there are always performance trade offs in paint. There are many newer products on the market that out perform Breakthrough in an all around comparison. It does have some benefits that keeps it a prime contender though.


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## Gwarel (May 8, 2012)

daArch said:


> I'm confused
> 
> The title of the thread contains "White & Pastel Base", Can I assume you are NOT using the pastel base and thinking it is not covering well?


Sorry for the confusion, 'White & Pastel Base' is the color. That is how the label reads.


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## slinger58 (Feb 11, 2013)

Gwarel said:


> Sorry for the confusion, 'White & Pastel Base' is the color. That is how the label reads.


Pics of the label would be helpful.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Gwarel said:


> Sorry for the confusion, 'White & Pastel Base' is the color. That is how the label reads.


no wonder it don't cover. Pastel bases ain't meant to apply w/o add'l colorant


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

daArch said:


> no wonder it don't cover. Pastel bases ain't meant to apply w/o add'l colorant



Hey Arch, you're may not have noticed that many lines have combined their white and pastel bases. I guess it's cheaper/easier to have one base for the color range instead of two. Breakthrough is one that has combined the two. 

Heard several complaints about the hide of Breakthrough white. Perhaps that's a compromise result of that. 

I know it technically doesn't increase hide, I like a shot of white in stuff sometimes. I like the brighter whites myself.


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

daArch said:


> I'm confused
> 
> The title of the thread contains "White & Pastel Base", Can I assume you are NOT using the pastel base and thinking it is not covering well?
> 
> ...


I used to do that all the time with the BM Regal Classic. Easy colors in the pastel base weren't hiding but if it was mixed in the white base with the white in the formula left out it would be fine. 

Sent from my LG-H810 using Tapatalk


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

daArch said:


> no wonder it don't cover. Pastel bases ain't meant to apply w/o add'l colorant


Correct. But if the manufacturer labels it as "white/pastel base" they are saying that it can be used as a white without any colorant added. Which I say is buuuuulllll5hit! Just a way to reduce sku's and it really doesn't mean it can be used as white over anything but white. And more often then not that is bs too.

Both P&L and California have "package" whites that are slightly off shaded and all of their pastel bases say they must be tinted before use. This is truth in labeling. Some companies try to claim that their pastel base will work as a white but they are just using that as a gimmick to try to convince consumers that their paint hides better then their competition.


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## The Cutting Edge (May 25, 2014)

My breakthrough experience cost me money being white with no tint. I used to always have the store tint to an extra white or something this time ho just said white and I didn't. Big mistake. Told them at my paint store I figured problems were do to having no colorant they looked totally dumbfounded.:blink:
Nice picture Pac. I used to think I wished you had a store in my town. Now I'm not so sure.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

The Cutting Edge said:


> My breakthrough experience cost me money being white with no tint. I used to always have the store tint to an extra white or something this time ho just said white and I didn't. Big mistake. Told them at my paint store I figured problems were do to having no colorant they looked totally dumbfounded.:blink:
> Nice picture Pac. I used to think I wished you had a store in my town. Now I'm not so sure.


Don't worry. That isn't me. just some sexy picture i put in there to attract attention. If you know that guy you should move.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

The Cutting Edge said:


> My breakthrough experience cost me money being white with no tint. I used to always have the store tint to an extra white or something this time ho just said white and I didn't. Big mistake. Told them at my paint store I figured problems were do to having no colorant they looked totally dumbfounded.:blink:
> Nice picture Pac. I used to think I wished you had a store in my town. Now I'm not so sure.


Not surprising. Was it a PPG,Glidden,Porter,Pittsburgh,olympic "PRO" store by chance? They have had a tendency the last few years of letting their most qualified salespeople go and trying to replace them with Lowe's and Home Depot former paint specialists. I don't think it is working out so well for them for some reason.


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## The Cutting Edge (May 25, 2014)

No just PPG. They've been in business since 1946. Worst thing about it is I've got to go there to get paint than drive across town to Sherwin to get tips and 3m plastic and such. I hate walking into Sherwin anymore but I have to. They're kind of old school you might say. Fine finish tips :no:.
9' 3m plastic. Xim:blink:


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## Gwarel (May 8, 2012)

slinger58 said:


> pics of the label would be helpful.


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## Gwarel (May 8, 2012)

I'm working on some built in cabinets on a remodel job. Specs are to match existing trim in the house. The existing color is similar to Glidden's High Hide White formula so I used that color to tint the Breakthrough.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Gwarel said:


> I'm working on some built in cabinets on a remodel job. Specs are to match existing trim in the house. The existing color is similar to Glidden's High Hide White formula so I used that color to tint the Breakthrough.


That should help the high significantly. let us know how it works.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

My package white is "SUPER hide white" so it is better. lol.


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## Gwarel (May 8, 2012)

Here's a picture of the finished product. I shot the cabinets with 2 coats of Gripper and 2 coats of Breakthrough tinted to match Glidden's High Hiding White. The tinted formula definitely covered better, but was a bit too 'Dirty White' for my liking. No one seemed to notice, because the color matched the existing trim of the house, and over all the job turned out great. I'm going to keep experimenting with the white formula. I may try the JET formula next chance I get.


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

I never use package white. Just have em "boost" it at the paint store...stock NEVER covers well. The higher the sheen, the worse it is ime...


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