# How to Remove Obnoxious Paper-Backed Vinyl Wallpaper



## parodi

I just shot this vid while I was doing my own kitchen. It shows how the hohlenpoker is a must-have for the toolbox for removing thin PBV that just won't give you a break. Enjoy:

http://blip.tv/file/3681786


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## bikerboy

Nice video. Nice tool. We usually use a Porter Cable drywall sander hooked up to a vacuum and sand the face off. (may like the holenpoker more)


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## chrisn

I have one of the originals fashioned by Mr Parodi's own daughter I believe. I am sure that it will be worth millions down the road.:thumbup:


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## parodi

chrisn said:


> I have one of the originals fashioned by Mr Parodi's own daughter I believe. I am sure that it will be worth millions down the road.:thumbup:


That one was made by my wife's niece. She was in college an needed some money on the side so I put her to work. I don't know if iyours will be worth millions but there were only six made by her.... so it definitely was a limited edition.


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## aaron61

I would like to order 4 of the small ones and 4 of the 12" models please!!


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## Workaholic

Nice. :thumbsup:


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## chrisn

parodi said:


> That one was made by my wife's niece. She was in college an needed some money on the side so I put her to work. I don't know if iyours will be worth millions but there were only six made by her.... so it definitely was a limited edition.


 
Sorry,I knew there was some relation involved. Only 6 made,I think I will take it out of service and put it in a secure temperature controlled vault for my sons inheritance( since that is probably all that will be left!)


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## ProWallGuy

I too own one of the "original 6" but it usually sits up on a shelf in the shop. Why you ask? It works great just like Mr. Parodi shows on the video, but it is too small to use in an average size room. It works well under cabinets, over doors, etc, but on 8' walls, it takes forever to hohlenpoke any large amount of square feet. I'd be the first in line to buy one 9" wide or more.

And no, I don't have the patience to make one myself.


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## daArch

Many of us have made them. And have the scars to prove it. I found that it was such tedious work that I am now reluctant to use the thing except when absolutely necessary. Parodi first promoted then as a way to vent paper that had recently been installed and had some bubbles that needed to breathe. The pin points, when new and sharp, are virtually undetectable on new paper. I have used mine on a few small stripping situations and the points are not as sharp as they were when new.

I am not sure any manufacturer makes a 12" wide rubber roller which can be converted into a hohlenpoker, and I the task of making one would be exceptionally time consuming and bloody. The process involves snipping off the head of MANY stainless steel dress pins and then pushing the pins (dull end first) into the rubber roller. For the two inch one, I have 18 rows of seven pins. It took more hours than I can remember and many finger prickings to make it. Remember, each pin should be cut at the same length and inserted so that the each extend the same distance out of the rubber. This is tedious work. But worth it when you need it. 

So, one can understand why I would be judicious with its use. 

Jim, have you tried 36 grit sand paper in a palm sander? I will guarantee it is quicker, more effective, and less tiring than your wonderful little hohlenpoker. I've tried all the methods. Hohlenpoker, Mike Zekich's method of "carving" the vinyl off with a wallpaper stripper, the dreaded Paper Tiger, hand held sand paper, and finally the palm sander. I only wish I had a vacuum hook-up like bikerboy.


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## parodi

daArch said:


> Many of us have made them. And have the scars to prove it. I found that it was such tedious work that I am now reluctant to use the thing except when absolutely necessary. Parodi first promoted then as a way to vent paper that had recently been installed and had some bubbles that needed to breathe. The pin points, when new and sharp, are virtually undetectable on new paper. I have used mine on a few small stripping situations and the points are not as sharp as they were when new.
> 
> I am not sure any manufacturer makes a 12" wide rubber roller which can be converted into a hohlenpoker, and I the task of making one would be exceptionally time consuming and bloody. The process involves snipping off the head of MANY stainless steel dress pins and then pushing the pins (dull end first) into the rubber roller. For the two inch one, I have 18 rows of seven pins. It took more hours than I can remember and many finger prickings to make it. Remember, each pin should be cut at the same length and inserted so that the each extend the same distance out of the rubber. This is tedious work. But worth it when you need it.
> 
> So, one can understand why I would be judicious with its use.
> 
> Jim, have you tried 36 grit sand paper in a palm sander? I will guarantee it is quicker, more effective, and less tiring than your wonderful little hohlenpoker. I've tried all the methods. Hohlenpoker, Mike Zekich's method of "carving" the vinyl off with a wallpaper stripper, the dreaded Paper Tiger, hand held sand paper, and finally the palm sander. I only wish I had a vacuum hook-up like bikerboy.


Bill, Paper tigers, and coarse floor paper destroy the integrity of the vinyl portion of the laminate. The hohlenpoker does not impair vinyl integrity at all and that is what makes it possible to remove the vinyl in one full sheet. The removal solution get behind the vinyl thanks to capillarity and weakens the bond of the substrate paper from the vinyl front.... it shows quite well in the video how easily the vinyl then separates from the paper backing after a ten minute soak. With the paper tiger or lacerated vinyl using other methods, you still do not get a nice, full section of vinyl coming off.


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## parodi

ProWallGuy said:


> I too own one of the "original 6" but it usually sits up on a shelf in the shop. Why you ask? It works great just like Mr. Parodi shows on the video, but it is too small to use in an average size room. It works well under cabinets, over doors, etc, but on 8' walls, it takes forever to hohlenpoke any large amount of square feet. I'd be the first in line to buy one 9" wide or more.
> 
> And no, I don't have the patience to make one myself.


Tim, I have hohlenpoked entire rooms. Yes it is time consuming but in my experience it still consumes way less time than "picking at the foil wrapped chocolate easter egg." Also I had considered making one out of a hard rubber J roller but my problem with that is the per square inch pressure required. Pushing with about 10lbs of pressure on a 2" wide roller gives the perfect amount of pin penetration. A 9" wide roller would require 45 lbs of pressure to give the same result. That amount of push would put my arm in a sling after about a half hour of work.


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## daArch

Parodi said:


> Bill, Paper tigers, and coarse floor paper destroy the integrity of the vinyl portion of the laminate.


Don't quite understand what you mean by "integrity", but let me assume and address the issue. I agree that "lacerating" the face (making many slices with a sharp blade), makes it impossible to remove the whole sheets. As soon as you pull the stripp from the wall after the paste has released it's grab, the facing will rip along any one of the multitude of lacerations. 

But a quick buzz with the 36 grit merely removes enough of the water proof coating so that the solution can migrate and be absorbed by the paper substrate. And once the paste has been rewetted, the whole strip, vinyl coating and paper substrate, can be pulled off in one uninterrupted strip. I agree that the hohlenpoker enables this also, but I will accept any challenge to test the time, energy, and effectiveness of both methods in a "strip-off".

Perhaps your method and usage of "course floor paper" removes too much of the vinyl facing and there are large sections that have lost their structural integrity. A quick once-over with 36D does the trick. 

OH, this "36D buzz" method also works on the acrylic coated papers and the bane of my existence - painted wallpaper. 

I love my hohlenpoker and I ain't gonna dull it by scoring whole rooms. Now, if you made me an 18" version, that would perhaps be an ideal stripping tool.


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## vermontpainter

In stripping, 36D is huge.


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## KLaw

daArch said:


> Don't quite understand what you mean by "integrity", but let me assume and address the issue. I agree that "lacerating" the face (making many slices with a sharp blade), makes it impossible to remove the whole sheets. As soon as you pull the stripp from the wall after the paste has released it's grab, the facing will rip along any one of the multitude of lacerations.
> 
> But a quick buzz with the 36 grit merely removes enough of the water proof coating so that the solution can migrate and be absorbed by the paper substrate. And once the paste has been rewetted, the whole strip, vinyl coating and paper substrate, can be pulled off in one uninterrupted strip. I agree that the hohlenpoker enables this also, but I will accept any challenge to test the time, energy, and effectiveness of both methods in a "strip-off".
> 
> 
> Perhaps your method and usage of "course floor paper" removes too much of the vinyl facing and there are large sections that have lost their structural integrity. A quick once-over with 36D does the trick.
> 
> OH, this "36D buzz" method also works on the acrylic coated papers and the bane of my existence - painted wallpaper.
> 
> I love my hohlenpoker and I ain't gonna dull it by scoring whole rooms. Now, if you made me an 18" version, that would perhaps be an ideal stripping tool.


Gotta agree with Bill on this. 36 grit is definetly more effecient. Based on the video - I bet we could the do same work in half of the time. Tried and true method trumps all.

That being said, we have never used the hohlenboker (sp).


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## ewingpainting.net

...................


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## daArch

vermontpainter said:


> In stripping, 36D is huge.


THANK YOU Scott for picking up on the double entendre

I was wondering who would :thumbup:

But have YOU ever had a "36D buzz" ?


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## vermontpainter

daArch said:


> THANK YOU Scott for picking up on the double entendre
> 
> I was wondering who would :thumbup:
> 
> But have YOU ever had a "36D buzz" ?


Yes. For several months after the birth of my child.


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## Msargent

Rent a steamer!!


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## daArch

Msargent said:


> Rent a steamer!!


Why? 

How is steam going to bust through vinyl?

BTW, BTDT. They don't work as well as the above mentioned techniques, IMHO. Unless you have five layers of paper.


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## parodi

KLaw said:


> Gotta agree with Bill on this. 36 grit is definetly more effecient. Based on the video - I bet we could the do same work in half of the time. Tried and true method trumps all.
> 
> That being said, we have never used the hohlenboker (sp).


36 sandpaper may be tried and true but there is this problem called the RRP Lead law. I am currently banishing ALL abrasive implements from use on my job sites. This may sound overly cautious and stupid...so be it.


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## daArch

Jim,

You may want to consider whether ANY stripping from pre-78 housing will fall under the RRP rules. 

I just bowed out of stripping a small bath in a 1976 house. We all know the chance of lead paint being used to prime sheetrock prior to hanging in 1976 is about 0%. I know the orig painter, and he was not using lead paints. Lead interior paint had been phased out by the majors by then. YET, the test kits are not reliable on walls (or so our instructor said). I would need to proceed with the assumption there is lead on the walls. Even washing the residue paste from the primed walls would be designated as "disturbing" the primer. 

This is a process that I am not ready to ignore.


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## parodi

daArch said:


> Jim,
> 
> You may want to consider whether ANY stripping from pre-78 housing will fall under the RRP rules.
> 
> I just bowed out of stripping a small bath in a 1976 house. We all know the chance of lead paint being used to prime sheetrock prior to hanging in 1976 is about 0%. I know the orig painter, and he was not using lead paints. Lead interior paint had been phased out by the majors by then. YET, the test kits are not reliable on walls (or so our instructor said). I would need to proceed with the assumption there is lead on the walls. Even washing the residue paste from the primed walls would be designated as "disturbing" the primer.
> 
> This is a process that I am not ready to ignore.


Mr. Archibald, I just send the latest _*parodi on paperhanging*_ to the publisher. The subject this coming issue is about how the RRP affects paperhangers specifically. Instead of making stuff up as I usually do, I actually was in direct contact with the EPA in Washington. I got a direct response from the national spokesman concerning the concerns in your quote above. This important aspect of *wallpaper removal* as it concerns RRP and what the EPA thinks about is dealt with in the column...don't miss it. 

(If you or anyone else does not subscribe I will send it do you free of charge.) Unfortunately I never make a column public until I have been paid and the publisher takes their sweet asss time about sending checks. So what else is new.


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## BrushJockey

Cliffhanger! You bastid! ( JK- lol)


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## macrylinda1

bikerboy said:


> Nice video. Nice tool. We usually use a Porter Cable drywall sander hooked up to a vacuum and sand the face off. (may like the holenpoker more)


I have one of the originals fashioned by Mr Parodi's own daughter I believe. I am sure that it will be worth millions down the road.:thumbup:


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## handy vinny

Lol


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## Rayn Painting

I agree on the sand paper. I use 40 grit then spray it a couple times. The paper will come right off (most of the time). I've been doing it this way for over 20 years. One guy that works for me is always trying to find a better way but never has.


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## Mod Paint Works

Sanding is the #1. Your enemy is the vinyl. Once that's gone the paper will come right off with water and fabric softener or water and vinegar or DIFF stripper. If you don't do the sanding thing, try a 'Tigers Claw' - circular tool with perforating wheels inside that puncture the viny/paper and let water penetrate.
Have fun!


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## chrisn

macrylinda1 said:


> I have one of the originals fashioned by Mr Parodi's own daughter I believe. I am sure that it will be worth millions down the road.:thumbup:


 
Only 1 mil, as I have one also:whistling2:


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## WallpaperPaint man

I have been removing paper and cloth backed vinyl wallcovering for 19 years and never used an electric sander nor had to sand off the vinyl or top layer. If scoring does not work then I shave it off with a 4 in blade. Whether I use a dull or new blade determines on the integrity of the surface. If old or new the blade must worn on one side or it will dig into the surface with less control. Attacking at an angle is important .Steamer is a last resort.


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## WallpaperPaint man

I make straight cuts in foil 1 to 2 in apart to control the removal. Wet than Peel several at once or shave it off. Nothing gets the better of me


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## johnstp

I agree on the sandpaper, as well.


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