# Patching a popcorn ceiling



## A-List Paint Pro (Aug 9, 2009)

Gentlemen,

I've been following these forums for quite some time now and as a young business owner I've generated a wealth of knowledge through the sagacity of the pros on this site. A client of mine recently inquired about patching a popcorn ceiling. This is the first time I've come across this problem, being that the most work I've done with a popcorn ceiling is remove one. The patch would be no bigger then 3x3. If the job is too big to tackle I will gladly pass it on, but this is information worth knowing. Any help is greatly appreciated.


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## Boden Painting (Dec 27, 2007)

it's easy, they sell it in an aerosol can, just follow the directions.


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

A section that size will not blend in and you will have to retexture the entire ceiling.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

if its got to be super perfect and blended you need to get a texture sprayer out and get it calibrated. If not, homax sells a premixed texture u can brush or roll on.


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## Ardee (Jun 9, 2008)

If you're talking 9 sq feet out comes the texture sprayer. If you're talking 9 sq inches we use texture rollers. To use the rollers just fill repaired area with premixed popcorn and roll the surface.


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## nEighter (Nov 14, 2008)

remove all the popcorn in the center of the 3X3. You will want to feather out the area being scraped. You will go from raw drywall to slowly fading the scraping into the rest of the ceiling. go out approx 18" from the bare drywall with this fading. There are a couple different ways to go about this, only you will know what you need to do. You can build the area up at the raw drywall then feather it out past the feathered scraping with a nice coat. Then come back after it has set for a little bit and you can see if you need to add more and just come back over it all again with a light coat. Or you can just do it at one time. Remember no sharp edges, make it circular and just act like you are painting a spot on a car that is bondoed and primed. You will want more on the primed area and not that much on the painted area. Just remember to feather it out.


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## A-List Paint Pro (Aug 9, 2009)

Thanks for the options and information fellas, it is greatly appreciated. I will take a good look at the job again and decide which option is best. They all seem very manageable and efficient. This customer is a realist and doesn't expect perfection, but if I produce anything close they will be very pleased.


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## johnpaint (Sep 20, 2008)

Yeah: Good luck with that. I remember when I use to have to deal with that stuff. Make sure you make yourself a curtain first or you will wish you had.


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## nEighter (Nov 14, 2008)

AND wear eye protection... seriously.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Yea, be careful with that stuff. And if you want someone to remove it because it contains asbestos, don't hire the lady in the following link.

http://www.epa.gov/compliance/criminal/fugitives/posters/deleon-09-wanted-poster.pdf


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Something "close" is possible. I would advise, since you apparently have little experience in applying pop corn, let alone repairing it, that you practice first. Any deviation in size and spacing will jump out at them . Feathering into the old is the real bugger because that's when the spacing get all jambed up.


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## Joepro0000 (Jul 27, 2009)

Also you will need to repaint the entire room. When you spray new popcorn into old popcorn, you will see the new white pop-corn vs the old dis-colored popcorn. Get a hopper, and practice spraying on a piece of drywall scrap, to get the right size. Best bet is to scrap it off, skim coat the ceiling, and spray a knockdown!


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## BrushJockey (Mar 15, 2009)

Homex makes a small hand pump that I have used with some success on smaller patches. I don't think you can get close enough with any hand applied method. And it is also important where in the room and how light hits it with what you can get away with. A small patch on and edge you have a chance, in the middle of a room with a window spilling light, nota.


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## aaron61 (Apr 29, 2007)

I would agree with only a few responses and trust me we do tons of popcorn removal, touch ups, etc.... Every situation is different! if it's a rental or apartment you could probably do a touch up but remember no matter how you approach a repair, it's going to look like a repair. Where the new popcorn meets the existing will have double the popcorn giving it a picture frame. Some worse than others. As mentioned the color will be an issue also. The best is to remove it all and re shoot it or sell a knock down which could possibly get you the rest of the house,


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## johnpaint (Sep 20, 2008)

This is the way to go, all others are just jerry rigs.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

i've done alot of repairs/patching of popcorn just brushing on the premix homax stuff. I paint all the ceiling afterward so color is no worry. If they want to pay to have the entire ceiling scraped and retextured, well kudos to them, for all the others, the former happens. This whole topic seems so remedial, but I find myself here anyway, go figure.


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## aaron61 (Apr 29, 2007)

TJ Paint said:


> i've done alot of repairs/patching of popcorn just brushing on the premix homax stuff. I paint all the ceiling afterward so color is no worry. If they want to pay to have the entire ceiling scraped and retextured, well kudos to them, for all the others, the former happens. This whole topic seems so remedial, but I find myself here anyway, go figure.


All kidding aside, I would love to see that....I just can't imagine how that could blend with a uniform popcorn spray finish.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

aaron61 said:


> All kidding aside, I would love to see that....I just can't imagine how that could blend with a uniform popcorn spray finish.


I'm not saying it does blend in perfectly, and it doesn't. There is no way to do that, other than to scrape the entire ceiling and retexture. When given the option, most HO choose the patch rather than several hundred or thousands of dollars extra for the perfection model. Besides, most areas are protected by shadows, and flat paint doesn't flash, so it hides said patch ok.


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## tedrin (Oct 22, 2008)

It's impossible to get a perfect repair unless you scrape it down and re-texture the entire room...

Wet the ceiling down with a garden sprayer and scrape it...That way you cut down on dust...When it dries you can sand it down with a Portercable 7800 drywall sander....Prime then re-texture...Remember to poly the walls and floor because that is messy stuff to work with.


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## NE MPLS (Sep 15, 2008)

Re-do. Its tough to match work that someone else did to your own.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

I have a feeling we are forgetting that that A-List said:



> This customer is a realist and doesn't expect perfection, but if I produce anything close they will be very pleased


I think he has been given a lot of decent advice on how to achieve acceptability for this particular customer.

I do hope the HO realizes how imperfect it will be. But hey, if A-list spends about 45 minutes on this an the HO finds a patch is too noticeable, he can always then strip and re-do.

I would advise A-List to advise his customer that the best possible repair may be further from perfection than the HO had hoped. Both parties need to be realistic about what is possible and also what is probable.


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## A-List Paint Pro (Aug 9, 2009)

daArch said:


> I have a feeling we are forgetting that that A-List said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for the advice man. With the information provided in previous posts I think your approach is best. The customer is very easy going and if he is not happy with the finished product of the patch he will be intelligent enough to let me remove and reapply texture. A general understanding will definitely not be hard to come to. Thanks again fellas.

Tom


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## Rob (Aug 9, 2009)

The can sucks!


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

Rob said:


> The can sucks!


I couldn't agree more.


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## nEighter (Nov 14, 2008)

Something I have found. if it looks like the pieces are not individual and the drywall mud looks soupy and the clumps are just that, take a rag and dab at them. It will actually take the excess water/mud mixture off and can actually help you blend the area better. That is for areas with too much buildup also. Just do it after it has set just a bit (3-5 min)


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## DarthPainter (Jul 26, 2009)

The absolute best way to approach this is to use an impression roller. Just put some mud on the patch area, roll the impression roller on an existing portion of the ceiling, roll the mudded area. Voila.

I've done this a good many times, and once you've really gotten it down to a science, it's nearly perfect.

Also, I never worry about paint flashing because it almost never does that badly on popcorn surface, especially flat and eggshell. Even semi gloss blends nicely.


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## BrushJockey (Mar 15, 2009)

Darth- What is this impression roller ? More info plse!


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## DarthPainter (Jul 26, 2009)

BrushJockey said:


> Darth- What is this impression roller ? More info plse!


They're roller covers that take impression upon whatever surface you roll them; if you roll them over popcorn, they imprint popcorn, roll over knockdown you get knock down, etc. You can't usually find them at most painting stores, for some bizarre reason, but I get them at my local art store. (I do a lot of charcoal and water color art on my own time).

Once you get the impression, you roll them over freshly spread mud and it will recreate whatever surface you used for the initial mold. This makes blending it into existing texture very easy and very close to the original.:thumbsup:


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

DarthPainter said:


> They're roller covers that take impression upon whatever surface you roll them; if you roll them over popcorn, they imprint popcorn, roll over knockdown you get knock down, etc. You can't usually find them at most painting stores, for some bizarre reason, but I get them at my local art store. (I do a lot of charcoal and water color art on my own time).
> 
> Once you get the impression, you roll them over freshly spread mud and it will recreate whatever surface you used for the initial mold. This makes blending it into existing texture very easy and very close to the original.:thumbsup:


sounds like an interesting item. Never heard of one myself. Do you have any links or info on who makes them?


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## DarthPainter (Jul 26, 2009)

Ha, not really. I can't claim to have invented the trick myself; my grandpa and his old buddies figured it out a long while ago, and I'm pretty sure it never caught on in a big way. I usually just go to a local art store and pick them up. I don't even know who makes them, they're only a couple bucks a piece. They also sell them in cookware stores, too; but they're usually for rolling pins, which could make rolling a ceiling a bit tricky, though it's worked for us in a pinch.

They're made of gel, usually, which is why it takes the impression. 

I'll look to see if I can dig up anything more specific than that. Like I said, it's more of an old trick than anything most painters would have need for.


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## BrushJockey (Mar 15, 2009)

Hey, I'm old. I like old tricks! Bring it! :thumbup:


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## nEighter (Nov 14, 2008)

ran across this tonight.. some pics of mine.










you have to feather the area a bit more than here.. I didn't take a pic between this pic and the ones below.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Feb 10, 2008)

its always dangerous for a drywaller to respond to a paint thread, but here goes. 

I have been dealing with spray since the early 70's, I can tell the type and the texure (heavy medium or fine) just by looking at it, but in MOST cases you are dealing with USG Imperial QT Medium. 

What I do is scrape the infested area clean. THen lay down a drop on the floor and then staple plastic around the cieling creating a "panit booth" around the area. Then spray (with a hopper) the scraped area, forget about feathering right now. Let this set for an hour or so, then come back and spray again, holding the hopper as far away as possible and feather the ENTIRE area, patch and a two or three foot area around patch EQUALLY.

The idea is not to try to patch and feather at the same time, just don't work well, Patch first, then BLEND the entire area togher, getting less OVER run or "feathering" as you get farhter away from the patch.

And of course you will have to paint the entire ceiling to deal with the yellowing effect that is just a fact of an ceiling thats been there for more than a cpl weeks.

Peace


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> What I do is scrape the infested area clean. THen lay down a drop on the floor and then staple plastic around the cieling creating a "panit booth" around the area. Then spray (with a hopper) the scraped area, forget about feathering right now. Let this set for an hour or so, then come back and spray again, holding the hopper as far away as possible and feather the ENTIRE area, patch and a two or three foot area around patch EQUALLY.


Clever Idea. Thanks.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Feb 10, 2008)

Workaholic said:


> Clever Idea. Thanks.


 The idea here is this

1) you can't really patch and feather at the same time

2) aftrer you patch, you can better BLEND the two together

hope this helps, if you think about it, it really makes some sense (I know thats rare for a drywaller, but we do have our moments)


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

good stuff


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## Latexfreak (Jun 28, 2009)

A-List Paint Pro said:


> Gentlemen,
> 
> I've been following these forums for quite some time now and as a young business owner I've generated a wealth of knowledge through the sagacity of the pros on this site. A client of mine recently inquired about patching a popcorn ceiling. This is the first time I've come across this problem, being that the most work I've done with a popcorn ceiling is remove one. The patch would be no bigger then 3x3. If the job is too big to tackle I will gladly pass it on, but this is information worth knowing. Any help is greatly appreciated.


Use a compressor and buy a hopper gun for $75 so you have it for the future. Use acoustic texture with the polyethlene (styrofoam) pieces in it and most bags are medium texture these days. mix paint in with the texture until it is the consistentcy of a good chili from the crock pot that we all like so much. Set the compressor at about 40 psi and texture away. Hold the hopper about a foot from the ceiling. take your time and match the rest of the ceiling as much as possible.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Feb 10, 2008)

Latexfreak said:


> Use a compressor and buy a hopper gun for $75 so you have it for the future. Use acoustic texture with the polyethlene (styrofoam) pieces in it and most bags are medium texture these days. mix paint in with the texture until it is the consistentcy of a good chili from the crock pot that we all like so much. Set the compressor at about 40 psi and texture away. Hold the hopper about a foot from the ceiling. take your time and match the rest of the ceiling as much as possible.


Mixing paint with spray,,, Can we talk????? Thats okay if its a new cieling. 

when your fixing an older ceiling,, thats a patch, and the entire ceiling will need to be repainted, so adding paint won't help you. Adding paint does this, it FIXES the texture so that it will not peal offunder druess, period, it does nothing else.

of course you have to have a compessor and a hopper, to even be in the patching game


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