# Emerald Flat showing lines



## mrpaintman (Dec 1, 2017)

Hey all,

I just switched from Duration to Emerald, working on a two story foyer and noticed some fairly distinct lines from rolling. I talked to Sherwin williams and they told me Emerald flat was even flatter than Duration. I probably rolled the wall within 30-45 minutes of cutting it in. Anyone else use Emerald flat and have issues with flashing? Can only see on angle with sun coming in. By the time I cut in, got off scaffolding I rolled, any other ideas?

Picture is attached.


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## MikeCalifornia (Aug 26, 2012)

One coat or two? There are a lot of paints that exhibit different colors between brush and roll finish. Two coats of any product takes care of any minor differences, but after that, I'm not sure.


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## mrpaintman (Dec 1, 2017)

this was the second coat


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## Gymschu (Mar 11, 2011)

I just applied some Emerald flat in almost the exact same color. I didn't have that issue, but then again, I wasn't looking for it either. I would be highly disappointed if that's the case as I really like the Emerald flat.


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## SWPB (Oct 6, 2016)

It could have been happening with the Duration Home Matte as well, but no one ever saw it due to the lighting. Lighting plays a crucial role and I cringe when I see a two story open foyer with a nice beam of direct light on it. Sometimes, I will thin it out a bit to add some wet edge time. I'm actually surprised that the drywall work did not rear it's head. It's difficult to find a good drywall job on these two story foyers.


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## DEK Painting inc. (Dec 31, 2016)

I eliminated problems like this 20 years ago ! Floetrol is your answer , especially with high end flat paints .


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## Eagle Cap Painter (Nov 14, 2016)

DEK Painting inc. said:


> I eliminated problems like this 20 years ago ! Floetrol is your answer , especially with high end flat paints .


Floetrol actually leaves chemicals behind that have the potential to cause issues and for my money just doesn't perform very well. Give the XIM or BM Extender a shot.


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## 804 Paint (Jan 31, 2014)

Looks to me from the picture that your rolling pattern is inconsistent. It doesn’t look like you roll as tight to the cut as possible, and it doesn’t seem that you put the paint on with a consistent film thickness. I’m just saying that because I can see the roller pattern on the wall. 

Try using a fully dipped sleeve per each 1.5 roller widths top to bottom. After every three widths, go back and lay off the previous two with a gentle, straight down motion. This will get rid of your roller marks. 

You may still see a line at the cut...the only answer to that may be to chase your cuts with a mini (and make sure your cuts are dry before rolling). 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

That happens when certain colors have a crapload of tint in them. Sherwin paints are especially notorious for it. Take a weenie roller and carboard and go over your cut line, and hopefully it will disappear and blend in.


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## Painting Practice (Jul 21, 2013)

Is that called picture framing? It usually happens with me on the first coat, but you said this was the second so I don't know. The cause is still apparently different stipple or lack thereof. This is why I usually have the weenie in my pot to go over the brushing.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

Its caused by different drying rates. Paint that dries slower can sometimes get darker. So, the cut ins dry quicker than the rolling, and they end up slightly different colors.


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## burchptg (Jun 30, 2013)

I did a rental with Emerald flat and was disappointed. Like all SW paints, it has poor flow. You have the roll the heck out of it to work into the texture. SuperPaint is better and half the price. They market Emerald to compete with BM Aura and claim 1 coat is all you need. Bullshizz. It has as much hide as Promar. I could still see the primer through the 1st coat. I did not have the hat banding problem you had because I always keep a wet edge, but when the owner did some touch ups between renters, she called me because the touch ups did not match. That was the 1st and last time I ever use it. For the same price I can use Aura and get results that match the hype. SW paints are for budget conscious customers, but in my opinion, they don't make high-end products.

@Painting Practice, yes, it is called picture framing (or hat banding). Flashing is a hide problem, like when spackle or magic marker is visible through the paint.


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## allcitypaintingwi (Aug 16, 2016)

mrpaintman said:


> Hey all,
> 
> I just switched from Duration to Emerald, working on a two story foyer and noticed some fairly distinct lines from rolling. I talked to Sherwin williams and they told me Emerald flat was even flatter than Duration. I probably rolled the wall within 30-45 minutes of cutting it in. Anyone else use Emerald flat and have issues with flashing? Can only see on angle with sun coming in. By the time I cut in, got off scaffolding I rolled, any other ideas?
> 
> Picture is attached.


Tape molding do a quick cut roll up to tape.


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## Eagle Cap Painter (Nov 14, 2016)

burchptg said:


> Flashing is a hide problem, like when spackle or magic marker is visible through the paint.


Gonna disagree here and say that flashing is *rarely* a hide issue and almost always an application failure: unmixed paint, inconsistent mil thickness, overworking, environmental issues, etc. For testier paints like Aura or Emerald, maybe try letting cuts dry fully before rolling, laying off in the same direction, rolling tighter to the cut, boxing the paint, or stirring paint more frequently.


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## mrpaintman (Dec 1, 2017)

never thought too much about stirring paint through the process, usually use it fairly quickly but i'll give that a thought. Have you been able to let the cut ins dry without issue? I have always been a paint when wet mentality.

Thanks!


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## Mr Smith (Mar 11, 2016)

Some paints just dry too fast and you get lap lines. Last year I did an interior job on a hot day with BM Bath and Spa which is matte and some entire walls were striped vertically every 9". I was super careful and even added BM extender to extend the open time, but it still looked like crap. I ended up repainting with BM Regal Select matte with BM Extender added. That worked out well.

The same thing happened with BM Aura on a large wall. I ended up thinning 15% with water and BM extender. That helped level it out and extend the dry time.


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## Gymschu (Mar 11, 2011)

mrpaintman said:


> never thought too much about stirring paint through the process, usually use it fairly quickly but i'll give that a thought. Have you been able to let the cut ins dry without issue? I have always been a paint when wet mentality.
> 
> Thanks!


mrpaintman, I am old school and always rolled into the wet cut. That worked with all the OLD paint formulas but today's fast dry paints allow you to let that cut line dry completely before you roll into it. I've not had any problems doing it that way with the new paint formulas........fingers crossed.


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## lawsan (Dec 13, 2014)

I would say if you only see it when the sun comes in close the blinds until the check is cashed! 

Really though it looks like a texture/stipple issue. My guess is your nap was 1/2 inch or greater. Any high solids paint is going to show this more often. 

I almost always choose emerald on the little shacks I paint. It took me a minute to overcome some problems but now we are killing it.

This was painted only with emerald flat and semi-gloss and no lines. Even when cutting in on top of the over spray from the trim.


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## DEK Painting inc. (Dec 31, 2016)

Eagle Cap Painter said:


> Floetrol actually leaves chemicals behind that have the potential to cause issues and for my money just doesn't perform very well. Give the XIM or BM Extender a shot.


I never had an issue with floetrol. However XIM I have ! XIM did nothing when I used it , could still see brush strokes on some ext. doors I did. And that was after adding 2x the amount they recommend. I talked to a few other painters and they had similar issues . However I never used Emerald paint , but from what he described sounds like picture framing , or paint drying before it levels out .


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## mrpaintman (Dec 1, 2017)

yeah it was only like a few hours a day when the sun would hit it, it was a good client so I wanted to take care of him. I do normally use 1/2 roller but has never been a problem before. Hoping this was a once and a lifetime thing, but maybe i'll have to switch to 3/8 if it happens again to see.


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## mrpaintman (Dec 1, 2017)

looks great, what was the height on that?


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

mrpaintman said:


> yeah it was only like a few hours a day when the sun would hit it, it was a good client so I wanted to take care of him. I do normally use 1/2 roller but has never been a problem before. Hoping this was a once and a lifetime thing, but maybe i'll have to switch to 3/8 if it happens again to see.


Did you try a miniroller touchup on the hatband area to see if it blended in? It usually takes care of it without having to reroll the whole wall, but not always.


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## burchptg (Jun 30, 2013)

Eagle Cap Painter said:


> Gonna disagree here and say that flashing is *rarely* a hide issue and almost always an application failure: unmixed paint, inconsistent mil thickness, overworking, environmental issues, etc. For testier paints like Aura or Emerald, maybe try letting cuts dry fully before rolling, laying off in the same direction, rolling tighter to the cut, boxing the paint, or stirring paint more frequently.



Well I guess we are going to disagree then. The issue here is the terminology, not the cause. _Flashing _refers to a hide issue. Magic marker _flashes_. What you and the original poster are talking about is hat banding/picture framing. Separate problems, separate causes. On the other hand, you are 100% correct in your reasons for_ hat banding_.


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## Eagle Cap Painter (Nov 14, 2016)

burchptg said:


> Well I guess we are going to disagree then. The issue here is the terminology, not the cause. _Flashing _refers to a hide issue. Magic marker _flashes_. What you and the original poster are talking about is hat banding/picture framing. Separate problems, separate causes. On the other hand, you are 100% correct in your reasons for_ hat banding_.


Uneven sheen is the only thing I've ever heard it referred to and it's the only thing I can find searching around. It's not in the PDCA books I have, so I guess it's just jargon anyway so doesn't matter much.

Dulux: Flashing
A fault usually in non-glossy finishes, in which patches of uneven gloss occur/appear especially at the joints or laps.

Sherwin: DESCRIPTION
Uneven appearance of a coating's gloss, sheen or luster due to deterioration of the paint film.

POSSIBLE CAUSE

Use of a gloss alkyd/oil-based paint or solvent-based epoxy in areas of direct sunlight.
Heavy dew, moisture, or condensation getting onto a coating (e.g. primer, paint or stain) while drying.
Temperature fluctuations during drying.
Coating over a porous surface.
Paint applied at uneven film thickness (i.e. lapping).
Insufficient film build (e.g. coating applied too thin).
Use of an interior paint outdoors.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

I've known flashing as any kind of uneven sheen, whether its the reasons stated above, or something like a spackle spot showing dull due to it only having one coat of paint. Maybe the spackle thing isnt a correct terminology, but its an easy, one word description, unless theres a better one Im not aware of.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

I blame the acrylic microspheres they are using for a filler pigment. They are not dead flat and if there is any un-even coat they will show at the right angle. Ceramic microspheres are dead flat, and won't show like that in the flat finishes they are used in. So what company uses ceramic microspheres and not acrylic you ask?

forgot the hint! Ceramic spheres cost 5-6 times as much as acrylic ones do.


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## deadend (Aug 1, 2013)

Gymschu said:


> mrpaintman said:
> 
> 
> > never thought too much about stirring paint through the process, usually use it fairly quickly but i'll give that a thought. Have you been able to let the cut ins dry without issue? I have always been a paint when wet mentality.
> ...


 ...I've NEVER had that issues with anything...makes me think some guys just don't know how to feather brush...or I've just been lucky with batches...Speedhide is the only thing I've ever had banding issues with and that was once a decade ago...


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

What does featherbrushing have to do with it?


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