# Spraying smooth ceilings?



## whodog94 (Aug 10, 2012)

Do you just spray or do you spray and back roll? What are the advantages?


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## driftweed (May 26, 2013)

personal preference.

We backrollers have 100 excuses to do it, the non backrollers have 100 excuses not too.

I'm a backroller kind of guy.


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## OwensboroPainting (Aug 22, 2013)

I back roll the first coat to lay down the stipple in case I have to touch up later, then I just spray the second coat if one is required.


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## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

OwensboroPainting said:


> I back roll the first coat to lay down the stipple in case I have to touch up later, then I just spray the second coat if one is required.


Usually one or the other. Sometimes I Backroll the first and spray it off again. Sometimes a spray. Let it dey. Then spray and Backroll it.


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## whodog94 (Aug 10, 2012)

But still it's only for touch up reasons


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## GSP82 (Feb 20, 2014)

I spray first coat and then roll the last coat.


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## jacob33 (Jun 2, 2009)

A little off topic but the most important thing is making sure you have a dead flat paint.


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## OwensboroPainting (Aug 22, 2013)

I like SW CHB. Its flat


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## OwensboroPainting (Aug 22, 2013)

whodog94 said:


> But still it's only for touch up reasons
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using PaintTalk.com


If you don't back roll on a new smooth ceiling you will see where it was sanded. 
If its a textured ceiling then I usually won't back roll


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

OwensboroPainting said:


> If you don't back roll on a new smooth ceiling you will see where it was sanded.
> If its a textured ceiling then I usually won't back roll


Not always true.

I use Dulux ultra hide cloud white on 99% of my ceilings. Spray three first cost (411 tip), once it sets up sand it with the circular sanding head (120-150 grit), then spray it again without backrolling.

I like not backrolling because of the finish, purely because of that. The ultra hide touches up so nicely with a brush, you'll never see the lines

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## robladd (Nov 22, 2010)

I just find it hard to believe that anyone can do it with 2 coats anymore.

It's been 3 coats for longest time on smooth surfaces from my experience on NC.


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## GSP82 (Feb 20, 2014)

A decent flat covers in two coats and have you tried the newer ceiling paint from Ben Moore covers like a dream and dead flat.


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## robladd (Nov 22, 2010)

GSP82 said:


> A decent flat covers in two coats and have you tried the newer ceiling paint from Ben Moore covers like a dream and dead flat.


Your saying you use the the finish flat for your 1st coat?



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## GSP82 (Feb 20, 2014)

In a new house coat of primer and two coat of flat paint on the ceilings


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## OwensboroPainting (Aug 22, 2013)

Even the high end builders I have worked for never sprang for a primer on ceilings. 2 coats flat is what has always been spec'd on smooth ceilings. We don't even sand between coats, just dust them and paint them. 
I know of one local guy who primes his ceilings, but he's a joke. He has the builder install all the trim including crown on raw drywall. Then they spray drywall primer and back roll the walls and ceilings. Smack the hell out of the crown and trim with their rollers. Makes it look real nice. This guy also refuses to put filters in his guns, says they restrict the flow. So you have a lot of lines sprayed on his trim and walls where their guns clog every 10 seconds. 
I ain't sure how he stays in business. They shoot the trim the same way, lines and splatter from the guns clogging, then they sand it all down and brush it because the spray job looks so bad. This is every single house he does. They also sand the ceilings with a round sanding head so they never get into the corners, looks real nice, they would be better off not sanding at all, then it would at least all look the same.


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## nextlevelpaintco. (Jun 21, 2007)

If you you mean a repaint then no on the back rolling. If you you mean new dry wall then you have to back roll atleast the first coat, simply because if you don't it will fuzz up like crazy. I like like 2 back rollers on every ceiling and wall, a spray man with a 521 and one 18 spreading and mashing, with another 18 smoothing it out. Thats how you do high production interior spraying with a first class finish


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## nextlevelpaintco. (Jun 21, 2007)

OwensboroPainting said:


> Then they spray drywall primer and back roll the walls and ceilings. Smack the hell out of the crown and trim with their rollers.


I always have my guys bump their rollers. whats wrong with that? Someone will have a 9 in corners... but if its anything else it gets bumped


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## OwensboroPainting (Aug 22, 2013)

So you sand it all off or leave it ?
Seems like it would be a waste of time to sand it back down, and leaving it would look like hell.


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## nextlevelpaintco. (Jun 21, 2007)

OwensboroPainting said:


> So you sand it all off or leave it ?
> Seems like it would be a waste of time to sand it back down, and leaving it would look like hell.


You just bump it. Unless you take a fully loaded roller in it, you cant see the bump. However, if you dont bump, you can see the smoothness. Thats why I like a 9 running all corners, because if you don't do that, you can see the variation. The way I like to do it is the first back roller gets close and the second bumps. Now, if you have crown and the bump releases to much, just slide it side ways and that will take it out, but the roll team is good there should be no need for any sliding.


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## Red dog (Jul 20, 2014)

I have never sprayed a ceiling I didn't back roll.


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## Repaintpro (Oct 2, 2012)

Funny how we do things differently. I would never ever hit the cornice or mouldings with a roller! 

Always backroll the first coat as stated before, this stops furry lines appearing on the edge of the plaster!


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

I will paint crown along with the ceiling any time it's appropriate. I don't prefer the texture left by a roller on it most cases, so I will brush out the crown with a brush on an extender instead of rolling it.


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## nextlevelpaintco. (Jun 21, 2007)

Repaintpro said:


> Always backroll the first coat as stated before, this stops furry lines appearing on the edge of the plaster!


Furry lines? Lines? When you spray new drywall without back rolling the whole wall is fuzzy, its a mess. When I say a fuzzy wall... I mean the entire wall, not just lines. Go ahead... Try it


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## nextlevelpaintco. (Jun 21, 2007)

Correction. Unless its a level 5 finish where the finishers skim everything (typical for higher end ceilings) On a level 5... No fuzz


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## Repaintpro (Oct 2, 2012)

nextlevelpaintco. said:


> Furry lines? Lines? When you spray new drywall without back rolling the whole wall is fuzzy, its a mess. When I say a fuzzy wall... I mean the entire wall, not just lines. Go ahead... Try it


We only backroll anyway. My issue is if you don't the main problem tends to be furry lines on either side of the plaster joints on a ceiling.


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## nextlevelpaintco. (Jun 21, 2007)

Repaintpro said:


> We only backroll anyway. My issue is if you don't the main problem tends to be furry lines on either side of the plaster joints on a ceiling.


 I have minimal experience with plaster. I have only seen it on historic homes. Im talking drywall.


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

It is either the "drywall" and/or "primer or paint" product that cause the drywall surface to turn fuzzy, not an airless. A paint or primer can be "rolled" over new drywall and produce a "fuzzy" appearance. Another product applied with a roller on the same job will not turn the wall fuzzy. 

You can take the product that did not turn the drywall fuzzy and apply it on another job with drywall from another company and it might turn that board fuzzy. Likewise, you would also be able to find a paint or primer product that will not turn the 2nd drywall fuzzy.

You can, again, take a paint or primer product and apply it via airless sprayer without backrolling to bare drywall and not have a fuzzy appearance. You can take another paint or primer product and spray via airless on the same job and produce a fuzzy appearance. 

In this photo a drywall primer was applied with a roller and it turned the wall very fuzzy.










In this next photo, a paint was applied over bare drywall with a roller and did not turn the wall fuzzy.


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## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

jack pauhl said:


> It is either the "drywall" and/or "primer or paint" product that cause the drywall surface to turn fuzzy, not an airless. A paint or primer can be "rolled" over new drywall and produce a "fuzzy" appearance. Another product applied with a roller on the same job will not turn the wall fuzzy. You can take the product that did not turn the drywall fuzzy and apply it on another job with drywall from another company and it might turn that board fuzzy. Likewise, you would also be able to find a paint or primer product that will not turn the 2nd drywall fuzzy. You can, again, take a paint or primer product and apply it via airless sprayer without backrolling to bare drywall and not have a fuzzy appearance. You can take another paint or primer product and spray via airless on the same job and produce a fuzzy appearance. In this photo a drywall primer was applied with a roller and it turned the wall very fuzzy. In this next photo, a paint was applied over bare drywall with a roller and did not turn the wall fuzzy.


A lot of tapers overshoot their seems and nail heads when they sand. They sand the board and when paint hits that sanded board it will be fuzzy. If it is backrolled it will be less fuzzy.

It is more on the taper than the painter how fuzzy that first coat lays by their seems.

And if ur smart prime and Backroll the walls before the ceilings. Helps lay down them sanded boards.

Pretty rudimentary,


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## Repaintpro (Oct 2, 2012)

Oden said:


> A lot of tapers overshoot their seems and nail heads when they sand. They sand the board and when paint hits that sanded board it will be fuzzy. If it is backrolled it will be less fuzzy.
> 
> It is more on the taper than the painter how fuzzy that first coat lays by their seems.
> 
> ...


Thats what I was trying to say previously. Nothing to do with paint or spray. Thanks Oden.


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Okay, now we are talking about two different issues. #1 the drywall paper surface as a factory finish, and #2 that same surface damaged by over-sanding as Oden mentioned. I do not agree that backrolling helps anything when talking about damaged paper. It more often makes the areas stand out more because of a torn paper surface and the texture from a roller with cheap flat paints. Backrolling does help work paint into those torn areas better than spraying.

Regardless. Backrolling should always be performed when spraying smooth drywall. Unless of course adhesion is not an issue. In that case, blow and go. Even still, new drywall needs a saturated coat of primer or paint. That type of "millage" rarely looks good sprayed and left alone. Most people do not spray heavy coats, instead they spray coats that look right sprayed, which are often very light. The board should not look dry seconds after its sprayed. A heavy coat will stay wet well into the next wall.

Someone posted a video of a guy spraying and a guy backrolling. The person backrolling was rolling dry paint. Thats not how it works.


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

This is what happens when spraying and backrolling drywall over damage due to over-sanding. To make matters worse, a top of the line flat paint was used as a primer coat. Adding further to the disaster, a top of the line white woven roller cover was used which exaggerated the roughness of the torn paper surface due the roller covers extremely nappy finish over a porous surface with lousy paint.

It's really the perfect storm for a mess and that is why it looks like a mess in the photo. Very difficult to get this area to look right under direct sunlight.










Orignal photo: https://www.flickr.com/photos/jackpauhl/15100222842/sizes/l


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