# Stix Primer Useless?



## loaded brush

Never used Stix primer before but have heard guys talk about it here. Went to HD for Wooster frames and saw they had a closeout sale on Stix at $9.00 a gallon:thumbup:. Bought last eight gallons they had. Now, was reading surface prep instructions. Surface must be free of any dirt, grease, oil, wax, soap residue, chalk, old paint, and other foreign matter. Remove grease and oil with lacquer solvent. Wash surface with strong detergent. Reduce any gloss by sanding. Remove sanding dust. Seal wood knots with shellac, and so on. If one would prep any surface as instructed above, what the hell would you need this or any primer for?(with the exception of needing holdout) Surfaces as prepped above would be ideal for straight paint. To me to do all this work for the primer negates the need for primer. Bought it mainly for adhesion to glossy surfaces. I'll stick to oil or Bullseye 123 for glossy surfaces without sanding or etching. These two have never failed me in all my years. Just a thought.


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## Slopmeyer

Thats just the manufacturer covering their arse. You can paint glass with STIX. It is super strong without any prep and ideal for really porous surfaces cause its so thin. Just remember you can't use it on poly'ed surfaces.
I used it on 1960 paneling with no real prep and in an hour it passed the finger nail test.
It is really thin and you have to watch for sags though.


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## paintball head

I used it for priming formica shelves. Muralo Ultra semi-gloss topcoat, no phone calls.


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## Schmidt & Co.

That's just the standard for surface prep that _every_ manufacturer recommends. Either way, anything you touch _should_ be clean, dull and dry.


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## DONZI

I found out that stix dose not like moisture! I primed some fiberglass exterior column with it and then top coated with aquaglo. Every time its humid or rainy the surface get plenty small bubbles. the Bm rep came out and said they were getting complaints of the same problem!


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## Damon T

To the op. Just try it. It's good stuff. Way better than 123 IMO.


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## Schmidt & Co.

Damon T said:


> To the op. Just try it. It's good stuff. Way better than 123 IMO.


Way, way WAY better.:yes::yes:


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## kdpaint

Stix is great. For sure better than 123. Plus, that price is insane. But, with HD you can never be sure that it is the same product that is sold somewhere else. HD is notorious for selling lower quality versions of stuff.


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## Repaint Florida

kdpaint said:


> stix is great. For sure better than 123. Plus, that price is insane. But, with hd you can never be sure that it is the same product that is sold somewhere else. Hd is notorious for selling lower quality versions of stuff.


what ? Omg


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## Susan

Slopmeyer, why are you saying that it can't be used on poly'd surfaces?


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## Damon T

Csheils said:


> Slopmeyer, why are you saying that it can't be used on poly'd surfaces?


Yeah that don't add up


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## NACE

DONZI said:


> I found out that stix dose not like moisture! I primed some fiberglass exterior column with it and then top coated with aquaglo. Every time its humid or rainy the surface get plenty small bubbles. the Bm rep came out and said they were getting complaints of the same problem!


 Did you mean MoorGlo? AquaGlo is an interior product. That may have been the issue.


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## DONZI

yes, meant moorglo! actually used the new regal select high build when it first came out. The rep thought that maybe that was the problem since it was new. Sanded down and went back with old faithful MOORGLO and same problem!


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## CliffK

DONZI said:


> I found out that stix dose not like moisture! I primed some fiberglass exterior column with it and then top coated with aquaglo. Every time its humid or rainy the surface get plenty small bubbles. the Bm rep came out and said they were getting complaints of the same problem!


 Fiberglass columns are notorious for having a film of release agent on them from the manufacturing process. It is critical that they are meticulously cleaned prior to priming with anything. I usually use lacquer thinner and /or denatured alcohol. I can't tell you how many columns I have stripped because the original paint/primer was applied without sufficient cleaning.
If they are sufficiently clean & free of release agent almost anything will adhere, if they are not.... nothing works!


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## loaded brush

kdpaint said:


> Stix is great. For sure better than 123. Plus, that price is insane. But, with HD you can never be sure that it is the same product that is sold somewhere else. HD is notorious for selling lower quality versions of stuff.


HD was normally selling Stix for around $45.00 a gallon. They no longer want to carry it. Not able to move it at that price, too expensive for the HO. $9.00 a gallon was a *closeout* sale price. Do you really think they could sell a knock off or lower quality version of Stix with the words "A Benjamin Moore Company" right on the front of the label? I believe that would be a lawsuit waiting to happen.


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## Schmidt & Co.

loaded brush said:


> HD was normally selling Stix for around $45.00 a gallon. They no longer want to carry it. Not able to move it at that price, too expensive for the HO. $9.00 a gallon was a *closeout* sale price. Do you really think they could sell a knock off or lower quality version of Stix with the words "A Benjamin Moore Company" right on the front of the label? I believe that would be a lawsuit waiting to happen.


Thats not the way it works. A big box store will set a price it is willing to pay for any given item. Then the manufacturer will build a product to meet that price point. Usually a dumbed down product from there normal offerings. Case in point: John Deer tractors at Lowes. Not the same as whats sold at a John Deer store, and different product numbers to prove it!


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## wje

Schmidt & Co. said:


> Thats not the way it works. A big box store will set a price it is willing to pay for any given item. Then the manufacturer will build a product to meet that price point. Usually a dumbed down product from there normal offerings. Case in point: John Deer tractors at Lowes. Not the same as whats sold at a John Deer store, and different product numbers to prove it!



And a lot of the dewalt tools sold at HD are the same.


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## kdpaint

I would check the product numbers of any tool before I bought it at HD. Makita has stuff at HD they don't sell anywhere else. And it's cheap. Like Schmidt said, manufacturers will make products for HD. Like Sikkens did....just saying.


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## NACE

wje said:


> And a lot of the dewalt tools sold at HD are the same.


Check the specs on a HD tool with the same model number and then one at an independent hardware store. Torque and rpm's will be different. Inside of tool different too. HD plastic parts and hardware store metal. Most of the time. We sell Dewalt, Makita, Festool, Porter Cable, Milwaukee, and tons of other construction tools. I read the specs all the time. Most of our building contractors don't buy their tools at Depot anymore since they just don't hold up.


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## South-FL-Painter

Whats next? Behr paint? I though we are talking about the stix primer.


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## chrisn

South-FL-Painter said:


> Whats next? Behr paint? I though we are talking about the stix primer.


 

nooooooooooooooooooo


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## Monstertruck

Schmidt & Co. said:


> Thats not the way it works. A big box store will set a price it is willing to pay for any given item. Then the manufacturer will build a product to meet that price point. *Usually a dumbed down product from there normal offerings. *Case in point: John Deer tractors at Lowes. Not the same as whats sold at a John Deer store, and different product numbers to prove it!


Less saving, more doing. That's Cheapot Depot, leading the way to the bottom.


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## Slopmeyer

Csheils said:


> Slopmeyer, why are you saying that it can't be used on poly'd surfaces?


It says it on the can and I tested it myself. The poly actually crumbled up under the STIX. I wish it was compatible nothing sticks like STIX.


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## Susan

Slopmeyer said:


> It says it on the can and I tested it myself. The poly actually crumbled up under the STIX. I wish it was compatible nothing sticks like STIX.


It's a modified urethane acrylic. I respectfully disagree that it is incompatible. I don't have a can handy, but priming poly'd and varnished trim is one of this primers main uses. It is not intended for use over polyethylene, which has some flex to it (plastic paint) because it dries harder and would subsequently crack. Know what I'm sayin?


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## Palnews26

Stix works fine on polyurethane.
Just remember it has no stain blocking ability at all. I mean none!
Within five minutes stains will start to bleed through.


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## Slopmeyer

Csheils said:


> It's a modified urethane acrylic. I respectfully disagree that it is incompatible. I don't have a can handy, but priming poly'd and varnished trim is one of this primers main uses. It is not intended for use over polyethylene, which has some flex to it (plastic paint) because it dries harder and would subsequently crack. Know what I'm sayin?


Stix® is a low VOC primer, which levels to a smooth surface and cleans up with soap and water.

Not intended for immersion service or continuous water contact. Not for below grade
applications. Not recommended for use over polyethylene, polypropylene or Kynar. Stix® must
be top coated for exterior use. Use as a spot primer only on exterior wood. On bare cedar or
redwood, use a tannin blocking prime


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## wje

NACE said:


> Check the specs on a HD tool with the same model number and then one at an independent hardware store. Torque and rpm's will be different. Inside of tool different too. HD plastic parts and hardware store metal. Most of the time. We sell Dewalt, Makita, Festool, Porter Cable, Milwaukee, and tons of other construction tools. I read the specs all the time. Most of our building contractors don't buy their tools at Depot anymore since they just don't hold up.


Yep. Sorry I was implying the tools were the same as the tractors... Same brand and look but different guts. I don't know any real contractors who buy their tools at the depot. Same as I don't know any real painters who.... Agh never mind


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## Susan

Right. Polyethylene, polypropylene, and kynar. Not polyurethane. It's good stuff, but does have it's limitations like most other products. Priming over polyurethane is not one of its' shortcomings.


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## South-FL-Painter

We used stix on some ceramic tile and it worked great,however we used it on some glass doors and i was not happy with it.


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## Slopmeyer

I stand corrected. .


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## BhamPainter

Palnews26 said:


> Stix works fine on polyurethane.
> Just remember it has no stain blocking ability at all. I mean none!
> Within five minutes stains will start to bleed through.


It really doesn't. I've found that two coats of Advance on top do a nice job of locking in stains, though.


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## Zoomer

We spot prime with a spray can of kilz or bin for stains that bleed.


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## McGregor

Stix is useless. It is water then, drips like crazy when sprayed. The Ben Moore store I bought it from claimed that I could use it on oil paint, then paint latex over that. I used it on 2 houses, didn't work for either, I could still scrape it off with my fingernail.


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## Slopmeyer

McGregor said:


> Stix is useless. It is water then, drips like crazy when sprayed. The Ben Moore store I bought it from claimed that I could use it on oil paint, then paint latex over that. I used it on 2 houses, didn't work for either, I could still scrape it off with my fingernail.


Thats odd. I've tried to scratch it and never could. Bad batch maybe?


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## kdpaint

Must have been a bad batch for sure. That stuff is crazy for adhesion.


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## Schmidt & Co.

kdpaint said:


> Must have been a bad batch for sure. That stuff is crazy for adhesion.


Agreed. I've NEVER had is disillusioned the scratch test.


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## Halsworth

Have you ever tried XIM from Sherwin Williams? Man, if you need an adhesion primer, that's the ticket.

Sent from my SPH-L720 using PaintTalk.com mobile app


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## Schmidt & Co.

Schmidt & Co. said:


> Agreed. I've NEVER had is disillusioned the scratch test.


Gotta love auto correct.


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## paintball head

Halsworth said:


> Have you ever tried XIM from Sherwin Williams? Man, if you need an adhesion primer, that's the ticket.
> 
> Sent from my SPH-L720 using PaintTalk.com mobile app


Are you referring to the solvent based or acrylic XIM? The solvent based is bullet proof, but REAL smelly. I've used the acrylic a few times with no issues but just not 100% sure about the acrylic.


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## Halsworth

paintball head said:


> Are you referring to the solvent based or acrylic XIM? The solvent based is bullet proof, but REAL smelly. I've used the acrylic a few times with no issues but just not 100% sure about the acrylic.


Yes, the solvent based XIM. You could put that on glass and you wouldn't be able to scratch it off. Haa


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## Epoxy Pro

I just tried this for the first time, was told it would cover the Ash cabinet doors we have with no bleeding, well it's bleeding. Lightly sanded doors and applied the Stix. Is this not a stain blocker and just a gripper primer?


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## kdpaint

cdpainting said:


> I just tried this for the first time, was told it would cover the Ash cabinet doors we have with no bleeding, well it's bleeding. Lightly sanded doors and applied the Stix. Is this not a stain blocker and just a gripper primer?


0 stain blocking. Great adhesion.


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## Epoxy Pro

kdpaint said:


> 0 stain blocking. Great adhesion.


I guess the BM store was wrong. I didn't see it saying stain blocking so I wasn't sure. Good thing these are sample doors I'm doing and not a customers.


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## Danahy

I just used Stix on some golden oak spindles and was ready for serious bleed through. However after I sanded. I shopvac'd each spindle followed by an alcohol wipe (rags were massively orange after that). Once dry hvlp'd a thin dust coat of Stix. Not a hint of bleed through, and couldn't scratch it off after 10 minutes. Currently (today) spraying bm black jack using advanced.


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## loaded brush

Danahy said:


> I just used Stix on some golden oak spindles and was ready for serious bleed through. However after I sanded. I shopvac'd each spindle followed by an alcohol wipe (rags were massively orange after that). Once dry hvlp'd a thin dust coat of Stix. Not a hint of bleed through, and couldn't scratch it off after 10 minutes. Currently (today) spraying bm black jack using advanced.


Looks fantastic! We've had a recent discussion about painting oak with the grain showing through. Some like it, some don't. I feel it makes painting oak with the grain showing through look elegant, as your picture proves.


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## Jmayspaint

Danahy said:


> I just used Stix on some golden oak spindles and was ready for serious bleed through. However after I sanded. I shopvac'd each spindle followed by an alcohol wipe (rags were massively orange after that). Once dry hvlp'd a thin dust coat of Stix. Not a hint of bleed through, and couldn't scratch it off after 10 minutes. Currently (today) spraying bm black jack using advanced.



That does look nice! I would think that the existing finish had already blocked the stain for the most part. That's been my experience when painted previously finished wood work, stain bleed is usually not an issue.


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## pinpointer999

Anybody used STIX on gloss ceramic bath tile? I tried SW Extreme Bond water based primer on a sample tile and both sanded and non scratched off with my thumbnail. 
I want to put a single component water epoxy over whatever primer will stick to the tile.


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## SWPB

In general, your bonding primers should not be great at blocking stains. After all, better bonding = less pigment (higher resin concentration), whereas better stain blocking requires a significant amount of pigment. That's why sometimes you will see semi-opaque primers or even clears specifically for bonding. Slow oils (aka long oils) block stains the best provided it's not a solvent based stain (you always use the opposite).


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## journeymanPainter

pinpointer999 said:


> Anybody used STIX on gloss ceramic bath tile? I tried SW Extreme Bond water based primer on a sample tile and both sanded and non scratched off with my thumbnail.
> I want to put a single component water epoxy over whatever primer will stick to the tile.


If you look at a thread I started a few months ago I put it on some tile baseboards in my home. They weren't really glossy/shiny but I did zero prep and they bonded perfectly

Sent from my SM-G903W using Tapatalk


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## PACman

journeymanPainter said:


> If you look at a thread I started a few months ago I put it on some tile baseboards in my home. They weren't really glossy/shiny but I did zero prep and they bonded perfectly
> 
> Sent from my SM-G903W using Tapatalk


Yeah the STIX primer sticks pretty well. Imagine that? But it doesn't seal stains......hmm.


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## journeymanPainter

PACman said:


> Yeah the STIX primer sticks pretty well. Imagine that? But it doesn't seal stains......hmm.


BUT....It's not advertised as a stain blocker 

Sent from my SM-G903W using Tapatalk


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## NACE

DONZI said:


> I found out that stix dose not like moisture! I primed some fiberglass exterior column with it and then top coated with aquaglo. Every time its humid or rainy the surface get plenty small bubbles. the Bm rep came out and said they were getting complaints of the same problem!


Possibly there was some residual release wax on the fiberglass. As with a boat mold, a release agent is used to enhance the release of the gel coat and mold. Always wipe new columns first before priming to remove wax and other contaminants. De-natured alcohol works best or aesetone. Coating did not bond entirely so rain made film expand and slip on surface causing moisture to intrude and cause bubbles. I think?


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## TrueColors

Danahy said:


> I just used Stix on some golden oak spindles and was ready for serious bleed through. However after I sanded. I shopvac'd each spindle followed by an alcohol wipe (rags were massively orange after that). Once dry hvlp'd a thin dust coat of Stix. Not a hint of bleed through, and couldn't scratch it off after 10 minutes. Currently (today) spraying bm black jack using advanced.




I just did a set of these in a junk box house. I sanded them all with 220 and went straight to advance in Oxford white. No primer at all, came back next day and couldn't even scratch it off, was on there good and tight.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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