# Sprayer Dilemma



## dylanhky (Sep 21, 2014)

Hello everyone,

As an entry level paint spray contractor I have just ordered a Graco 395 but I'm quite confused on the opinions given to me by the sales rep. For background purposes, from where I come from, all contractors suffer from severe labor problems, workers are simply inconsistent and unreliable..to some extent incompetent. They come to work when they feel like it. Most contractors rely on sending out hordes of laborers with basic manual tools while some have upgraded to using better equipment. Generally, its more about production,but less emphasis on detail and precision. The general motto is "Quantity over quality" or "Measure once, cut many..many times". In my case, paint contractors with airless sprayers just let their workers go trigger happy , with lots of thinning and overspray, (I pretend to be knowledgeable since I've done quite alot of research online and observed contractors in action ) . Around here, airless sprayers are frequently used on new large construction sites but rarely if ever on interior/exterior repainting of small projects. I plan to fill in that market gap, with more emphasis on quality.

1. The sales rep ( long distance phone call )seems to repeatedly emphasize that this sprayer is not meant for large scale projects . I'm well aware I'm not purchasing a sports car in terms of spraying equipment and I don't expect my sprayer to perform like one. Still, I am still curious as what constitutes a large project that will break this camel's back. What project is considered too large for the 395? I've attached a pic of the project I'll be undertaking.

2. He also emphasized that the voltage irregularities in my area will fry the circuit boards on the 395. Something about single phase, 3 phase , 3400 , 2900 ... I have no idea what he was talking about on the phone. Can someone enlighten me ?Btw, it's 240v power sockets on my side of the world.

3. We talked about the performance difference between the 390 and 395, I've scoured this forum's threads to find an answer but it just leaves me with more questions. The sales rep seems to think that the production performance is identical apart from the SMartComp but upon looking at the specs I don't think so. Will the difference in horsepower affect the maximum length of the spray hose? Or will it affect how high I can drag the hose away from the sprayer? Or will it run longer?

4. In retrospect, do I need a .23 max tip capability for a small workhorse like the 395? or is the 390 adequate ? I plan to mainly spray emulsions and exterior latex. The price difference enables me to purchase accessories like extensions and spray tips. Is it worth the tradeoff or should I go with the 395 and save up for accessories?.

5. My partner , who worked as a project manager for a large painting company, thinks that exterior spray painting on residential areas is not suitable, citing overspray and cleaning costs to neighbouring tenants, no matter how close the gun is to wall . I've had the misfortune of engaging their services to spray a ceiling area, and I ended up having to scrape off the emulsion from the tiles, 14000 feet worth of floorspace...alone. They had covered the floors with plastic sheeting but it was not enough and they moved the coverings along the spraying activity. The paint dripped heavily from the ceiling and the whole enclosed space was filled with fine paint mist, the scene look like an hazy aftermath of a volcano eruption. It was horrible. I also noticed that the sprayer guy pointed his gun well over SIX FEET away from the ceiling,cranked the gas powered engine to max and shot like a drunk cowboy with an uzi . A lot of areas were not covered evenly. Apparently , its normal practice to spray that way and multiple coats are needed . The average thinning ratio is 30%, and the estimated wastage is 30%.

My question is, can spraying be done in one coat? What is the sweet spot on the thinning ratio/psi/spray tip size to reduce overspray? Do I really need to thin? 
If I can spray in the correct manner, lets say on a wall in a mall, do I need to canvas the surrounding areas like biohazard site or just the immediate areas around it?

6. I had initially wanted to purchase the Wagner Procoat 9185g gas powered airless spray on Amazon, it costs less than the 390/395 but has a max tip of .17 with cheap accessories/tips . The electric models run on 110v and I would need to use step down/up transformers which might be pricey if not cumbersome to lug around. There is no local presence as it is based in New Zeland/Australia which made me hesitate and settle on the uber expensive Graco. Still, 9185g's low costs keeps me interested and I might purchase it for projects in rural areas. Can anyone comment on this?

I know my post seems long and winding, I'm set to confirm my purchase this Monday and have it shipped in. Any comments and opinions would really help me decide if I should get the 390 or the 395.

Thanks in advance.


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## PremierPaintingMa (Nov 30, 2014)

dylanhky!
From what i read, I think you have never use sprayed before, spraying take practice and knowledge what i advise you is do some practice before you go out on the field and start spraying or you'll be in big trouble.
The voltage in the US is 110V if you plug the sprayer to 220V you will fry it, you need a transformer to convert power from 220v to 110v.
I never seen someone spraying SIX FEET away from ceiling the spray will not reach that far.
Thumb of rule when spraying is to be away from target about 12".
Good luck with that.


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## dylanhky (Sep 21, 2014)

PremierPaintingMa said:


> dylanhky!
> From what i read, I think you have never use sprayed before, spraying take practice and knowledge what i advise you is do some practice before you go out on the field and start spraying or you'll be in big trouble.
> The voltage in the US is 110V if you plug the sprayer to 220V you will fry it, you need a transformer to convert power from 220v to 110v.
> I never seen someone spraying SIX FEET away from ceiling the spray will not reach that far.
> ...


Thank you for your comment. Yes I am seriously inexperienced with spraying , which is why I will be practising on this upcoming project. Its an empty block with only white on its interior walls and ceilings. 

SIX FEET... true story. It was like he was trying to douse a fire with a fountain of paint. It was a heavy duty gas driven graco hi-boy, not sure about the model though everything was obscured by paint. 

I have been the butt of jokes by my peers for planning this purchase. Entry level sprayers from the magnum to 390/395 are being phased out of sales here due to almost zero sales. I will probably be the only one on this side of my country to own one.


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## PremierPaintingMa (Nov 30, 2014)

I would go with the 395. The SMartComp delivers a consistent spray fan.
Every sprayer has specification on how many gallons you can spray per week true out the year.
I never thin my paint, I thin my oil primer little bit.


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## WestEndPainting (Aug 29, 2014)

I'm going to guess that you're in a mixed urban area. Sprayers make you money by saving labor. The savings are negated when you spray paint outdoors and it lands on adjacent buildings and cars. Likewise interior spraying is all about your experience in masking and protection of the occupied dwelling or business. Do your homework and you will find tons of resources from YouTube to the Web to get the knowledge you are looking for. 

If you are in a rural area or looking for new construction work get the gas rig and get the extra hose so you can go do jobs in powerless areas of a property. 

Once you've sprayed a few small jobs take a look at the profitability and decide if you want to stay in the spray business. If not, just sell it. 

The Graco pumps are awesome. I concur with the last post, it's a paint pump, not a paint and water pump. Don't thin a product that the manufacturer spent research time on to assure you that it will perform when sprayed. 

Best of luck to you. Find a niche market for that sprayer and you can make a pile of cash with it with less labor.


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## dylanhky (Sep 21, 2014)

I thought the SMArtControl was meant for fine finishes?


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## dylanhky (Sep 21, 2014)

WestEndPainting said:


> I'm going to guess that you're in a mixed urban area. Sprayers make you money by saving labor. The savings are negated when you spray paint outdoors and it lands on adjacent buildings and cars. Likewise interior spraying is all about your experience in masking and protection of the occupied dwelling or business. Do your homework and you will find tons of resources from YouTube to the Web to get the knowledge you are looking for.
> 
> If you are in a rural area or looking for new construction work get the gas rig and get the extra hose so you can go do jobs in powerless areas of a property.
> 
> ...


Thank you. The painting industry players here rely on big projects due to the profit margins by volume, so they tend to gloss over smaller projects. The downside is that just one bad debt would take down the entire operation. Meanwhile, small time painters like me rely on traditional roller and brush, and workers that come and go as they please, we don't even use an angle brush for cutting in. Sash brushes has since disappeared from the local hardware stores. 

Hopefully my investment might be able to solve the delays caused.

If it goes well I plan to have groups 2-3 people running around with a little sprayers.


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

dylanhky said:


> I thought the SMArtControl was meant for fine finishes?



Smart Control keeps the pressure consistent when spraying at lower pressures, say less than 1000 psi or so. Without it the material flow pulses at such low pressures. IMO it's not absolutely necessary for most standard spray jobs like the building pictured. 

I ran 390's and 395's for years doing things like your building. They are a tad undersized for such work, but not unworkable. You may run into some restrictions if trying to spray heavy materials like block filler, but for normal acrylic paint they're fine. 

Spray work can be done without all the mess like you describe. It's all about overspray control. Lots of guys teach themselves to spray, I sure you can too. Do your homework and check out the Graco site for some pointers.


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## dylanhky (Sep 21, 2014)

Jmayspaint said:


> Smart Control keeps the pressure consistent when spraying at lower pressures, say less than 1000 psi or so. peers. ut it the material flow pulses at such low pressures. IMO it's not absolutely necessary for most standard spray jobs like the building pictured.
> 
> I ran 390's and 395's for years doing things like your building. They are a tad undersized for such work, but not unworkable. You may run into some restrictions if trying to spray heavy materials like block filler, but for normal acrylic paint they're fine.
> 
> Spray work can be done without all the mess like you describe. It's all about overspray control. Lots of guys teach themselves to spray, I sure you can too. Do your homework and check out the Graco site for some pointers.


Thank you, so technically it acts like a HVLP spray right? 
I've ruled out use for elastonomeric and block fillers so it would greatly help in my decision. 
Seriously i find that advice from the online community is much more logical and informative compared to the flak i'm getting from my peers.

One thing though, i'm not sure if the paint quality and composition in my country is similar those found at your side which is why i'm worried about whether or not i should thin.


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## Bender (Aug 10, 2008)

I'd be scared to death to use an American airless with European voltage. 

You might think about a gas rig.


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

dylanhky said:


> Thank you, so technically it acts like a HVLP spray right?
> .....
> 
> One thing though, i'm not sure if the paint quality and composition in my country is similar those found at your side which is why i'm worried about whether or not i should thin.


 No, HVLP is in the conventional spraying category. In HVLP air is used to push the material and break it up. As opposed to airless sprayers that we're discussing here. Essentially you were right the first time, it facilities fine finish spraying, or any time lower pressure is desired. 

The data sheets for the products your using should have recommendations for thinning. Most modern acrylics I'm familiar with do not require or recommend thinning for airless spray applications. Though its still commonly done. I rarely if ever thin for airless spraying. There's no benefit as I see it.


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## two fingers (Sep 28, 2014)

Was there no video with the sprayer? It sounds like your thinking to much about it. Spraying takes time to learn. I painted for four years before tuching a sprayer. Typically you don't need to thin your product for an airless sprayer. Upon that size I wouldn't expect it to last long. Your accessories or outlive your sprayer. Good luck with your new toy


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## dylanhky (Sep 21, 2014)

Bender said:


> I'd be scared to death to use an American airless with European voltage.
> 
> You might think about a gas rig.


I hail east from the country where airliners drop like flies, points if you can guess the location


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## dylanhky (Sep 21, 2014)

Jmayspaint said:


> No, HVLP is in the conventional spraying category. In HVLP air is used to push the material and break it up. As opposed to airless sprayers that we're discussing here. Essentially you were right the first time, it facilities fine finish spraying, or any time lower pressure is desired.
> 
> The data sheets for the products your using should have recommendations for thinning. Most modern acrylics I'm familiar with do not require or recommend thinning for airless spray applications. Though its still commonly done. I rarely if ever thin for airless spraying. There's no benefit as I see it.


I've run through the product data sheets, generally it's 5% thinning for 1st and 2nd coat.


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## dylanhky (Sep 21, 2014)

two fingers said:


> Was there no video with the sprayer? It sounds like your thinking to much about it. Spraying takes time to learn. I painted for four years before tuching a sprayer. Typically you don't need to thin your product for an airless sprayer. Upon that size I wouldn't expect it to last long. Your accessories or outlive your sprayer. Good luck with your new toy


Thanks for commenting. I've been painting for a year but I've selling paint products and consulting for 3 years prior to that for Dulux and other paint brands, both decorative and performance coatings. Of course , the range of products are nowhere near the range found in western countries . After meeting with contractors, developers and visiting projects sites I observed that reliance on manual labor alone had costed them more than they realized. Comparing their prices and the costing strategies i also found out that almost all of them never factored overhead into their quotes. There is a perpetual deadlock between the developers, main contractors, subcobtractors and their respective workers.


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