# Who has been inspected by OSHA???



## Safety Guy

The company I work for has probably been inspected close to 50 times over the last 15 years. All but 1 inspection was gererated off the Dodge reports.

As a follow up question if you were cited did you just send a check or did you fight it either through the informal conference or in court??


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## Wolverine

Wolverine Coatings Corporation has not been inspected. However, when I was the General Manager of Bridgeport Chemical we got popped.  

We did rack up a few fines but they were pretty lenient on us since we already had addressed most of the issues and had plans in place when they came. 

We contested the fines... I want to say that we ended up paying 30-40% of the original fines. The inspectors stated that they felt we deserved a break for the efforts we made.


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## timhag

*OSHA is a four letter word. Please don't use it around me. lol*


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## Rich

Not me....they don't chase owner/operators much


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## Tmrrptr

Company I worked for had a convoy of government abbreviations stumble on to a jobsite. It was messy.
The fines started out HUGE!!!!!

With time, and expense, the fines were lowered significantly, mostly because there had been no priors.

Do NOT get caught in violation!
r


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## Workaholic

I am with Rich, have never seen an OSHA rep on job sites for residential.


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## Kelly Painting

Was doing a Nuclear Power plant once... Was the foreman.... we didn't have steel toes.... hard hats...safety glasses.... gloves.... they told us to stop working that instant.... a few minutes later... and a trip to the paint store/ lumber yard... and we were back to work....When I called my boss he said
in a trembling voice....." buy anything thing they suggest. And be polite about it.


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## Rich

hey kell...isn't it fun to paint with all that stuff on? :no: (I've done it) 

did you need a background check and fingerprints and such?
just wondering, my wife used to work at a plant and they we're pretty serious


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## Kelly Painting

Ya.... I forgot to mention it was 90 degree's that day... and we were outside.

Great story: I was working for someone else at the time in Conn. when the boss showed up to talk to the guy in charge of that department..I was out side on a lift.... we were prepping steel beams. The boss just got done telling me to be careful... when I went straight up and hit one of there globes that holds a security camera... loud bang... pieces fell and my boss just shook his head.
And when the lift was delivered, it just got done raining allot and the grass was holding some water. I drove it over the lawn... and it sank down about a foot. Spent the next hour digging myself deeper. A tow truck had to be called to pull it out.... but that got stuck.... so they called one of those trailer truck tow trucks... and we got them both out.... My boss showed up the next day with rakes and seed. The lawn looked a mess.



> did you need a background check and fingerprints and such?
> just wondering, my wife used to work at a plant and they we're pretty serious


 Ya, and I didn't have the best record... didn't think they would let me in.
Every day they would check our trucks like crazy before we were allowed 
to enter..And we worked the anniversary of 9/11 lots of machine guns that day.... and we were only on the outskirts..(the fire training building) security levels were higher the closer to the reactor you got... I guess we weren't that close.


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## Joewho

Not me personally, but been on jobs when the inspector was around.


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## Tonyg

Never OSHA but daily visits by the inspectors (DoD). I would have been happy to see the OSHA guy, he probably would have been more pleasant!


While the topic is up, my insurance agent is running a 10 hour OSHA Certification Seminar to "Learn what is required to be in compliance with the 29 CFR OSHA Construction Industry Regulations". Its free but 2 consecutive days at 5 hours each next month.

I will be making a concerted effort to target more commercial GC's and was wondering if this could help with marketing. Has anyone heard of this or think it would be worth the time? I am thinking about it from a marketing stand point but it may help in a commercial setting if we are approached by an OSHA inspector. 

Any thoughts? I am not exited about killing two days worth of schedule to attend.


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## Safety Guy

The G.C.s in our area are starting to REQUIRE 10 hour certs for all guys on the job and 30 hour certs for foreman. I think it would be a great tool to market to G.C.s. A good safety record and low EMR have helped us tremendously. There are a few plants in the area where we are the only "preapproved" contractor allowed in the plant. Knowing this can really help your profit margin, no competition.


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## Tmrrptr

Safety Guy,

A while back, before leaving the big paint company, I was directed to attend a safety seminar hosted by one of our large clients.

Lots of good information was presented.
Included within that was a real eye opener...

The courts have ruled that "the veil of corporate protection shall not shield those corporate officers from civil and criminal penalties in an instance of violation. This includes the safety officer."

Upon returning from the seminar, I presented all valuable information to the head of our company, and all of the foreman. I then advised the owner/head of the corporation that under no circumstances would I be the designated safety officer. He could find someone else!

If some clown did something stupid, not only could you be held personally liable and sued, causing a personal financial disaster even if successfully defended, but if you lost, you could be jailed.

No thank you. I wanted no part of that!

If I were you, I would investigate what I have stated herein.

Good luck!


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## Joewho

Tmrrptr said:


> Safety Guy,
> 
> A while back, before leaving the big paint company, I was directed to attend a safety seminar hosted by one of our large clients.
> 
> Lots of good information was presented.
> Included within that was a real eye opener...
> 
> The courts have ruled that "the veil of corporate protection shall not shield those corporate officers from civil and criminal penalties in an instance of violation. This includes the safety officer."
> 
> Upon returning from the seminar, I presented all valuable information to the head of our company, and all of the foreman. I then advised the owner/head of the corporation that under no circumstances would I be the designated safety officer. He could find someone else!
> 
> If some clown did something stupid, not only could you be held personally liable and sued, causing a personal financial disaster even if successfully defended, but if you lost, you could be jailed.
> 
> No thank you. I wanted no part of that!
> 
> If I were you, I would investigate what I have stated herein.
> 
> Good luck!


Any idea how much the saftey guy makes? I think it's pretty darn good pay.
Friend of mine is the saftey officer for a company in Alaska that is taking core sampes for valuable minerals. He makes a buttload of money.


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## ProWallGuy

Workaholic said:


> I am with Rich, have never seen an OSHA rep on job sites for residential.


Ditto. 



Kelly Painting said:


> When I called my boss he said
> in a trembling voice....." buy anything thing they suggest. And be polite about it.


:laughing: No kidding!


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## Safety Guy

Some great points brought up!! I'll comment on a few.

OSHA on residential sites.
For literally decades there was no OSHA presence on any housing developments, OSHA followed the $$$ and pounded the commercial contractors. We whined and complained for years to no avail. Then OSHA hired a new inspector that was a commercial contractor safety guy before going to OSHA. The residential guys did not know what hit them!! He was not unfair but he mixed up his inspections between the 2 industries. I don't know of any painting contractors that were fined but a few framers decided it was easier to close up shop and open under another name.

Crimanal Liability.
There has to be knowledge for an owner of a company or a safety director to go to jail when someone gets maimed or killed. Training and good record keeping are your best defense. If you provide the training and equipment and make a resonable effort to ensure it is used properly you really do not need to worry. A good example would be I am on a job and see a guy 40' up on a scaffold with no gaurdrails. I ask him what the heck is he doing up there, his reply is "hey I only need to be up here for another 1/2 hour and I will be done, it will take longer to put up the gaurdrail than it will to finish up". I tell him go ahead and finish up, don't worry about the rails. If that guy would fall and get killed I could be held crimanally negligent for letting him continue working even though I knew it was unsafe.

A good example of this was a few years back. OSHA had been on a jobsite and told the superintendent the powerlines were too low to safely dump the backfill in that area. A safety guy was also on site and told the superintendent the same thing. OSHA and the safety guy left and he told the dumptrucks to continue. A twenty-something dump truck drivers bed came in contact with the powerlines and set his truck on fire, he tried to escape the fire and came in contact with the energized metal of the truck and was killed. If memory serves me that superintendent was sentenced to 18 months in prison. I am not sure how all of the lawsuits came out.

The threat of jail is really my ace in the hole if the company does not want to spend the $$ on safety training or equipment. I will flat out tell my boss "we need to do this, I am not gonna be on the hook if we don't and someone gets hurt." At that point I have shifted the liability to him and he knows it!! I have only had to do this once in almost 15 years. I really get front office support for any safety related items I think we need. Hell in 2007 I think I spent almost $10,000 just on gloves. That sounds like alot but it costs $1000 to get a guy stiched up, I only need to prevent 10 cuts a year and the gloves more than pay for themselves.

As far as pay for a safety person it can vary greatly. In our area I would guess the salary range would be from 40-90k. It depends on the size of the company and amount of responsibility.


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## Tmrrptr

Joe, the money made would probably of little consequence if you were on forced vacation...

Pro, the one situation I was sorta involved in was residential.

Safety, all well and good. Long as you are aware...
We had a guy spray at his left hand while cleaning a tip.
Cut the skin and filled up a finger like a full stuffed weinie dog that had been put in a microwave. $4k

What we have here is a failure to communicate.


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## Joewho

True story.

I met a guy who was all f'cked up. He's a carpenter and was working for one of the big mormon owned companies out here. Commercial building with scaffolding. He told the boss he wasn't going on the scaffolding because the planks were weak.

The owner of the company was there that day and ordered the guy up, he said no. It went on to the point that the c'penter was going to walk.
Owner grabs his tool belt off the bench and takes it up the scaffolding. Tells the guy if he wants his belt he has to go get it. He goes up, falls through the plank and has a multimillion dollar lawsuit. He's been offered 4 mil, (after the owner tried to pay off his lawyer), but turned it down. He's going to need medical attention the rest of his life and 4 mil won't cover it. Also, keep in mind that whatever insurance has been paid will probably be sought for recovery if he wins a bit lawsuit.

If you keep up on the construction news in las vegas, it's easy to believe. Thing like this happen all the time. Iron workers are always falling to their death out here.


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## uglyjoe

Jimmy Carters Baby - but its a good thing

my dad is an OSHA (NPC GS17) General Services Administration

he is only looking out for you when he says "where are your boots ya barefooted monkey"?

kindly thank him and walk away slowly with your hands at your side


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