# New Benjamin Moore paint



## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

Does anybody know when the new alkyd hybrid paint is coming out from Benjamin Moore.
I heard throughthe grapevine that there is a new paint by Benjamin Moore that will dry harder than Advance and dry faster.
Possibly in the Corotech line.
I would be very anxious to try this paint on kitchen cabinets.


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Zoomer said:


> Does anybody know when the new alkyd hybrid paint is coming out from Benjamin Moore.
> I heard throughthe grapevine that there is a new paint by Benjamin Moore that will dry harder than Advance and dry faster.
> Possibly in the Corotech line.
> I would be very anxious to try this paint on kitchen cabinets.


 Apparently in April..ish. Talk of the town. My rep says hes getting it in my hands ASAP. Super pumped on this. Hopefully not overhyped.


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

I stoked to give it a try too. From what I've been hearing it's more along the lines of Breakthrough not an alkyd hybrid. 

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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

I think Coco and Pac knew something about this. Sounds pretty interesting. I asked the girls in the paint department I go to about it, but they had no clue what I was talking about. Sadly, there hasn't been a BM rep show up around these parts in decades.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Zoomer said:


> Does anybody know when the new alkyd hybrid paint is coming out from Benjamin Moore.
> I heard throughthe grapevine that there is a new paint by Benjamin Moore that will dry harder than Advance and dry faster.
> Possibly in the Corotech line.
> I would be very anxious to try this paint on kitchen cabinets.



It is under corotech label, and will tint on gennex. Seems BM is moving other waterborne inslx and corotech products to gennex as well. No word on cabinet coat yet.



Urethane acrylic. Interior/exterior. Floors, DTM, Cabinets, Trim... designed for spray application very fast dry though though supposed to be able to roll small sections.


I've heard sometime in the late spring, but nothing official.


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## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

👍👍


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

I think it is going to be called Commander or something like that. I could be wrong though. My BM rep was in town with the chemist that created Scuff-X and I got to quiz him for a few minutes on stuff. I could be remember the name wrong though.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

DeanV said:


> I think it is going to be called Commander or something like that. I could be wrong though. My BM rep was in town with the chemist that created Scuff-X and I got to quiz him for a few minutes on stuff. I could be remember the name wrong though.



Corotech 'Command'. All I have seen was a picture of a product label.


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## Mr Smith (Mar 11, 2016)

DeanV said:


> I think it is going to be called Commander or something like that. I could be wrong though. My BM rep was in town with the chemist that created Scuff-X and I got to quiz him for a few minutes on stuff. I could be remember the name wrong though.


So it's better than Scuff-X? I guess the poly component protects it from chemicals and hand oils. I wonder how well it will perform in dark colors? That's the real test for scuff resistance.

Why would they not put it under the BM label? Few know about Corotech.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Mr Smith said:


> So it's better than Scuff-X? I guess the poly component protects it from chemicals and hand oils. I wonder how well it will perform in dark colors? That's the real test for scuff resistance.
> 
> Why would they not put it under the BM label? Few know about Corotech.



My understanding is that it will be marketed more towards the industrial clients rather than interior painters.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

I warned him that painters are waiting and ready to try it on cabinets. We will see how the learning curve is. My crews like how scuff-X hand applies so hopefully it matches that.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

DeanV said:


> I warned him that painters are waiting and ready to try it on cabinets. We will see how the learning curve is. My crews like how scuff-X hand applies so hopefully it matches that.



Designed for spray application. supposed to be _very _fast dry


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

I brush and roll Breakthrough on my frames, figure if I can do that I should be fine with the new command. 

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## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

DeanV said:


> I warned him that painters are waiting and ready to try it on cabinets. We will see how the learning curve is. My crews like how scuff-X hand applies so hopefully it matches that.


Yes we are waiting and ready 👍


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## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

Can we assume that if this new paint is going to be similar to PPG breakthrough that Benjamin Moore will probably work out all of the problems. As with all Ben Moore paints all of the issues and drawbacks are usually figured out in the factory before they release the product to the general public. I would hope the same with this new paint that we are excited to try out.if what we hear is true, this paint will take the place of oil since oil enamel will no longer be available for sale and this paint will also be harder and it's finish then Advance


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

Cali Ultraplate fits the Breakthrough replacement bill but most people don't have access to it. I have high hopes for this new bm product. 

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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Rbriggs82 said:


> Cali Ultraplate fits the Breakthrough replacement bill but most people don't have access to it. I have high hopes for this new bm product.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3a using Tapatalk


Isn't ultraplate only available in satin and only a light tint base like cabinet coat used to?


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

Honestly I'm not sure. Satin is all I use in cabinets so that's fine but I'm pretty sure it comes in semi too. I only used it on a couple jobs because I was having it shipped to SC from a store in New Hampshire. Those jobs were a standard off whites. It's such a nice paint but having it shipped was taking a risk that I wouldn't need another gallon and not be able to get it. Plus they would only tint Cali colors which was a pain in the arse but I understood their logic. 

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## Pete Martin the Painter (Nov 8, 2012)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> Isn't ultraplate only available in satin and only a light tint base like cabinet coat used to?


Yes and Yes. But, it is a great product. 

Sent from my SM-A600U using Tapatalk


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## Respec (Sep 13, 2015)

*Cabinet coat with Gennex tints*



cocomonkeynuts said:


> It is under corotech label, and will tint on gennex. Seems BM is moving other waterborne inslx and corotech products to gennex as well. No word on cabinet coat yet.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Cabinet Coat can already be tinted on Gennex. It is the only way we do it. We had a problem with cratering on two jobs and we narrowed it down to a reaction with the raw umber tint. The BM technical specialist suggested we use the Gennex instead and it solved the problem. Ever since then, we always use the Gennex tint.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Respec said:


> Cabinet Coat can already be tinted on Gennex. It is the only way we do it. We had a problem with cratering on two jobs and we narrowed it down to a reaction with the raw umber tint. The BM technical specialist suggested we use the Gennex instead and it solved the problem. Ever since then, we always use the Gennex tint.



My Inslx rep doesn't recommend tinting with gennex. I was told due to the urethane content it cannot be tinted on gennex. In any case BM doesn't recommend it in the data sheet so sort of on your own tinting with gennex.


I have also found the off white formulas for N310 dispensed into cabinetcoat match more closely than formula for CC5x base.


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

Mr Smith said:


> So it's better than Scuff-X? I guess the poly component protects it from chemicals and hand oils. I wonder how well it will perform in dark colors? That's the real test for scuff resistance.
> 
> Why would they not put it under the BM label? Few know about Corotech.



any update on the new paint? I really would like to understand better the pros/cons vs Scuff-X


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

stoyania said:


> Mr Smith said:
> 
> 
> > So it's better than Scuff-X? I guess the poly component protects it from chemicals and hand oils. I wonder how well it will perform in dark colors? That's the real test for scuff resistance.
> ...


It's in testing markets in the south, probably see it late April/may.

It's not a wall paint, more designed to be a more modern version of PPG breakthrough.


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> It's in testing markets in the south, probably see it late April/may.
> 
> It's not a wall paint, more designed to be a more modern version of PPG breakthrough.


 ---
good to read it is progressing, hopefully we hear more soon


i wasn't planning to use it on walls. i have wood doors, floor trim and stairs to be repainted in white


my biggest worry with scuff-x is the potential issue to hand-oils. Hopefully the new BM paint is better in that aspect


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

stoyania said:


> cocomonkeynuts said:
> 
> 
> > It's in testing markets in the south, probably see it late April/may.
> ...


It's a urethane acrylic. Interior exterior floors DTM cabinets trim. Will hold up to hand oils just fine. Designed for spray application but supposed to be able to roll in small amounts. Tint on GenneX colorants.


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## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> stoyania said:
> 
> 
> > cocomonkeynuts said:
> ...


Very optimistic. Hard as oil, better than Advance.


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## Mr Smith (Mar 11, 2016)

Polyurethane acrylic?

I wonder if this will make Cabinet Coat redundant in their product line?

or maybe they are going after the higher end 1K & 2K poly market. I'm paying well over $100/gallon for those coatings from Italy. Competing with Breakthrough would also be a good thing for us. BT is still a grade lower than Kem Aqua and Sayerlack in terms of durability. That said Breakthrough beats those two in ease of application.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Mr Smith said:


> Polyurethane acrylic?
> 
> I wonder if this will make Cabinet Coat redundant in their product line?
> 
> or maybe they are going after the higher end 1K & 2K poly market. I'm paying well over $100/gallon for those coatings from Italy. Competing with Breakthrough would also be a good thing for us. BT is still a grade lower than Kem Aqua and Sayerlack in terms of durability. That said Breakthrough beats those two in ease of application.



Cabinetcoat I imagine will be more homeowner friendly. Again I have only seen a _picture _of a label... Breakthrough has to be over 30 years old at this point.


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## SWPB (Oct 6, 2016)

It's a Breakthrough killer with tenacious adhesion and better open time. Command is not designed to compete w Scuff X, Advance, or Cabinet Coat. All 3 products have a time & place. Advance & Cabinet Coat are similar because they're housed under two different brands within the Ben Moore family. Expect all Benjamin Moore coatings to tint with Gennex in the next year or so. Command is simply the one-coating-fits-all for facility maintenance (handrails, doors, floor stripes, etc). Could you use it on cabinets? Sure, but I'd stick with spraying it. Not so sure it will have that Distinctness of Image that Advance has.


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## vwbowman (May 15, 2017)

*Take COMMAND, one paint to rule them all!*










Touted as the one paint for just about everything!


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

vwbowman said:


> Touted as the one paint for just about everything!



your image is broken


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## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

Should we wait for Command or should we consider other waterbornes
Target coatings EM6500
KemAqua
Sayerlack
General finishes
Renner
Lenmar duralaq
Aqualiente
Milasei
Just to name a few.
We are really considering EM6500 with their cross linker.
Any opinions?


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## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

SWPB said:


> It's a Breakthrough killer with tenacious adhesion and better open time. Command is not designed to compete w Scuff X, Advance, or Cabinet Coat. All 3 products have a time & place. Advance & Cabinet Coat are similar because they're housed under two different brands within the Ben Moore family. Expect all Benjamin Moore coatings to tint with Gennex in the next year or so. Command is simply the one-coating-fits-all for facility maintenance (handrails, doors, floor stripes, etc). Could you use it on cabinets? Sure, but I'd stick with spraying it. Not so sure it will have that Distinctness of Image that Advance has.


 Tenacious adhesion. Hmmm🤔
Sounds like it's a Coronado product. Rustscat and Waterborne acrylic alkyd are two of their products that have tenacious adhesion


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> It's a urethane acrylic. Interior exterior floors DTM cabinets trim. Will hold up to hand oils just fine. Designed for spray application but supposed to be able to roll in small amounts. Tint on GenneX colorants.



it is almost april...any update on the availability of this new paint?


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

stoyania said:


> it is almost april...any update on the availability of this new paint?



No news other than it is in some testing markets currently.


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## SWPB (Oct 6, 2016)

Can't do a test market with the current travel / COVID-19 restrictions. Q4 sounds more like it.


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Zoomer said:


> Should we wait for Command or should we consider other waterbornes
> Target coatings EM6500
> KemAqua
> Sayerlack
> ...


Most of of these are interior and spray only if I'm not mistaking. Also alot are designed for new application, AKA total film build of 5mils max..But I'm assuming you have cabinets on you mind..


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

SWPB said:


> It's a Breakthrough killer with tenacious adhesion and better open time. Command is not designed to compete w Scuff X, Advance, or Cabinet Coat. All 3 products have a time & place. Advance & Cabinet Coat are similar because they're housed under two different brands within the Ben Moore family. Expect all Benjamin Moore coatings to tint with Gennex in the next year or so. Command is simply the one-coating-fits-all for facility maintenance (handrails, doors, floor stripes, etc). Could you use it on cabinets? Sure, but I'd stick with spraying it. Not so sure it will have that Distinctness of Image that Advance has.



my project is repainting wood/oak doors, window frames, staircase railings and base moldings. 


unfortunately don't think i can wait for Command much longer. what would be my best available semi-gloss durable paint option?


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

stoyania said:


> my project is repainting wood/oak doors, window frames, staircase railings and base moldings.
> 
> 
> unfortunately don't think i can wait for Command much longer. what would be my best available semi-gloss durable paint option?


I'd go Cabinet Coat or Advance. Prime with BIN first.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Command release is delayed due to covid.


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

finishesbykevyn said:


> I'd go Cabinet Coat or Advance. Prime with BIN first.



yes, i was definitely planning on using BIN primer first


thanks for the advice! just curious, what is your view on Scuff-X vs Advance?


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## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

stoyania said:


> finishesbykevyn said:
> 
> 
> > I'd go Cabinet Coat or Advance. Prime with BIN first.
> ...


Or you could consider Coronado acrylic waterborne alkyd. It's fast drying and can recoat the same day.


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Zoomer said:


> Or you could consider Coronado acrylic waterborne alkyd. It's fast drying and can recoat the same day.


Was just thinking about that product the other day. The SK5000. How does that compare to the Advance? Liking the quicker recoat time for sure..


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

stoyania said:


> yes, i was definitely planning on using BIN primer first
> 
> 
> thanks for the advice! just curious, what is your view on Scuff-X vs Advance?


Advance is a completly different animal than ScuffX. Advance is more like an oil paint with 16 hr recoat time. Superior brushing and leveling properties.
ScuffX is tough, but not really designed for trim or handrails etc..Although it would be a pretty good hard finish for certain stuff..


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

finishesbykevyn said:


> Was just thinking about that product the other day. The SK5000. How does that compare to the Advance? Liking the quicker recoat time for sure..


I tested out the sk5000 on my vanity, it was alright but I preferred both the quick recoat times and overall finish of the v50 Breakthrough instead. 

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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

finishesbykevyn said:


> Zoomer said:
> 
> 
> > Or you could consider Coronado acrylic waterborne alkyd. It's fast drying and can recoat the same day.
> ...


Doesn't harden up quite as much as advance and cabinet coat cover way better. Otherwise it preforms really nice for $25/gallon. I don't mind saying BM made it too good at that price point. They should have put it under the ultraspec label and sold it for $35-40/gal. I would say it's most similar to a budget version of advance. Very similar application properties and less prone to curtains.


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

finishesbykevyn said:


> Advance is a completly different animal than ScuffX. Advance is more like an oil paint with 16 hr recoat time. Superior brushing and leveling properties.
> ScuffX is tough, but not really designed for trim or handrails etc..Although it would be a pretty good hard finish for certain stuff..



a friend recommended California Paint Ultra Aquaborne Ceramic semigloss. Anyone has experience with it?


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

stoyania said:


> a friend recommended California Paint Ultra Aquaborne Ceramic semigloss. Anyone has experience with it?



Ya, I've heard really good things about California Paints. Never tried though as I can't get in Canada. Some others can tell more..


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## Pete Martin the Painter (Nov 8, 2012)

stoyania said:


> a friend recommended California Paint Ultra Aquaborne Ceramic semigloss. Anyone has experience with it?


I am not sure if I have used the semi-gloss, but the Ultra line is great. As far as I am concerned it is everything that Aura promises to be (but is not) at a much lower price point. The first time I used it I painted over a wallpaper removal wall that I realized I had not sanded enough. I was able to sand after an hour...that paint was as hard as a rock...no gumming up like most paints when you sand too early. I have painted a deep red and it almost covered in one coat. 

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## SWPB (Oct 6, 2016)

Back to the topic: look for Command in June / July.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

SWPB said:


> Back to the topic: look for Command in June / July.


Good I have a hotel where I need to spec this stuff


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

SWPB said:


> Back to the topic: look for Command in June / July.


I wonder what the recoat time and low temp app will be..


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

SWPB said:


> Back to the topic: look for Command in June / July.



any update on Command availability in the midwest?


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## vwbowman (May 15, 2017)

stoyania said:


> any update on Command availability in the midwest?


So far BM is being very tight-lipped about a launch date. Queried my rep just today and he claims nobody is talking. :sad:


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

vwbowman said:


> So far BM is being very tight-lipped about a launch date. Queried my rep just today and he claims *nobody is talking.* :sad:



That comes directly from corporate.


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## Iam Uprise (May 27, 2018)

Was sent this a week ago.Not sure if this was what everyone is looking for.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Iam Uprise said:


> Was sent this a week ago.Not sure if this was what everyone is looking for.



Nope that is the possibly the new Aura reformulation


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

vwbowman said:


> So far BM is being very tight-lipped about a launch date. Queried my rep just today and he claims nobody is talking. :sad:


it is July already....i thought this new paint is supposed to be out in May


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

stoyania said:


> vwbowman said:
> 
> 
> > So far BM is being very tight-lipped about a launch date. Queried my rep just today and he claims nobody is talking.
> ...


Delays due to covid...


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## SWPB (Oct 6, 2016)

It's test marketing in AL, KY, LA, MS, and TN. I'm hearing good things about it, so Q3 might be a good bet.


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

SWPB said:


> It's test marketing in AL, KY, LA, MS, and TN. I'm hearing good things about it, so Q3 might be a good bet.



can a gallon be purchased and shipped from a BM dealer in those states?


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## SWPB (Oct 6, 2016)

I suppose so... national launch should be in late Q3


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

SWPB said:


> I suppose so... national launch should be in late Q3



do you know if all dealers offer it in those states or just select dealers?
i really want to buy a gallon to test it myself on a couple surfaces.


any idea who would ship to WI?


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## SWPB (Oct 6, 2016)

Only select dealers currently have it on hand in the test area. You could ask Hikes Point Paint in Louisville to ship it to you. They're the closest one to you that currently has it from what I hear. 2nd option would be The Painted Horse in Lexington. I believe those guys have shipping capability.


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## DONZI (Dec 23, 2013)

They were displaying the product at my local dealer in new orleans yesterday. More of an industrial product sticks to anything and 15 min dry. Said it was a product similar to ppg breakthrough . waterborne urethane satin and gloss.


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Yes, my BM rep here in Eastern Canada said he would have some for me in August. Interested to check it out.


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

Folks at my local BM supplier still have no idea what I'm talking about when I ask about this. Then again, we've never actually met a BM rep.


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Wildbill7145 said:


> Folks at my local BM supplier still have no idea what I'm talking about when I ask about this. Then again, we've never actually met a BM rep.


Weird. Ian Callihan is the Rep for BM here in Atlantic Canada. He's all over it. Then again, your pretty remote up in Northern Ontario is it?


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

finishesbykevyn said:


> Weird. Ian Callihan is the Rep for BM here in Atlantic Canada. He's all over it. Then again, your pretty remote up in Northern Ontario is it?



Eastern shore of Lake Huron.


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## tomaszg (May 16, 2019)

Got the first glimpse today , was told that it should be out sometime in September, got picture of it but not sure how to post it.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Heard sometime first quarter next year due to covid related supply chain worries.


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## tomaszg (May 16, 2019)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> Heard sometime first quarter next year due to covid related supply chain worries.


That’s what I was told today shortage of cans probably


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## monarchski (Jun 21, 2019)

DONZI said:


> They were displaying the product at my local dealer in new orleans yesterday. More of an industrial product sticks to anything and 15 min dry. Said it was a product similar to ppg breakthrough . waterborne urethane satin and gloss.


I'm curious about it as a cabinet paint.


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## SWPB (Oct 6, 2016)

Confirmed: moved back to the first quarter of 2021.


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## mug (Dec 22, 2010)

"Well, we'll all look forward to that, Greg!"


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

monarchski said:


> I'm curious about it as a cabinet paint.


i tried the satin yesterday, it seems a bit of dull finish to me.

i rolled an old oak base molding, just as a test, it did stick to it, no problem

the biggest issue for me is the really quick dry time, seems worse than BM Advance in rolling it. not much time to correct mistakes, if any. maybe i need to thin it a bit?


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

stoyania said:


> i tried the satin yesterday, it seems a bit of dull finish to me.
> 
> i rolled an old oak base molding, just as a test, it did stick to it, no problem
> 
> the biggest issue for me is the really quick dry time, seems worse than BM Advance in rolling it. not much time to correct mistakes, if any. maybe i need to thin it a bit?


How did you get your hands on some? I have a feeling, its more designed for spray application. Maybe try some extender for brushing properties.


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

stoyania said:


> i tried the satin yesterday, it seems a bit of dull finish to me.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The quick dry time is what I'm hoping for. I brush and roll bin and v50 Breakthrough all the time so I'm no stranger to it

Sent from my IN2017 using Tapatalk


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## stoyania (Mar 10, 2020)

finishesbykevyn said:


> How did you get your hands on some? I have a feeling, its more designed for spray application. Maybe try some extender for brushing properties.


a friend of mine got it from a BM dealer in TN ...but with the shipping is about $60 so a bit expensive


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## mug (Dec 22, 2010)

stoyania said:


> finishesbykevyn said:
> 
> 
> > How did you get your hands on some? I have a feeling, its more designed for spray application. Maybe try some extender for brushing properties.
> ...


Where in TN? That is my area


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## becolouring (Mar 30, 2020)

Does anybody have an update on this Thread?



mug said:


> Where in TN? That is my area


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Still in testing markets in the south. Won't be available until Q2 this year at the earliest.


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## monarchski (Jun 21, 2019)

becolouring said:


> Does anybody have an update on this Thread?


Got my hands on a couple of gallons yesterday to try out. Being told end of March.


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## Deanie Jo (Feb 8, 2021)

Hello, I haven't read through all this thread, but here goes: I live in SE Tennessee. I am remodeling my bathroom and wanted my vanity refreshed. My general contractor hired a cabinet painter to repaint it . He used a white BM Command Waterborne Acrylic Urethane in the gloss finish. I am VERY unhappy with it because it shows every little tiny thing. You can barely touch this and it will show a gray mark. If the band of my wedding ring barely, I mean barely, should brush across this, it shows a gray streak. If I take some water and soap on a rag it will come off, but you have to do this every day. I hate it. Perhaps it needs a coat of something else on it to protect it, I don't know. If anyone here can help me out, please feel free!


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Deanie Jo said:


> Hello, I haven't read through all this thread, but here goes: I live in SE Tennessee. I am remodeling my bathroom and wanted my vanity refreshed. My general contractor hired a cabinet painter to repaint it . He used a white BM Command Waterborne Acrylic Urethane in the gloss finish. I am VERY unhappy with it because it shows every little tiny thing. You can barely touch this and it will show a gray mark. If the band of my wedding ring barely, I mean barely, should brush across this, it shows a gray streak. If I take some water and soap on a rag it will come off, but you have to do this every day. I hate it. Perhaps it needs a coat of something else on it to protect it, I don't know. If anyone here can help me out, please feel free!


 Thanks for the feed back Deanie. That totally sux about the finish marring so easily. Alot of people were looking forward to this product. Most Acrylics have a 30day setup period fyi. However, You could try lightly sanding and applying a clearcoat to add a bit of protection. On the other hand, this site is for professionals and would prefer that you discuss this on our DIY site. Thanks for sharing.


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## Deanie Jo (Feb 8, 2021)

finishesbykevyn said:


> Thanks for the feed back Deanie. That totally sux about the finish marring so easily. Alot of people were looking forward to this product. Most Acrylics have a 30day setup period fyi. However, You could try lightly sanding and applying a clearcoat to add a bit of protection. On the other hand, this site is for professionals and would prefer that you discuss this on our DIY site. Thanks for sharing.


Thank you, WildBill, for the suggestion. I just found this site while researching what to do about my vanity paint job. Didn't know there was a DIY site. Thank you. Apparently, whomever my GC hired decided to use this brand new product and I feel like we were his guinea pigs. Maybe after 30 days it will improve?? It's been about three weeks.


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Deanie Jo said:


> Thank you, WildBill, for the suggestion. I just found this site while researching what to do about my vanity paint job. Didn't know there was a DIY site. Thank you. Apparently, whomever my GC hired decided to use this brand new product and I feel like we were his guinea pigs. Maybe after 30 days it will improve?? It's been about three weeks.


 I really hope so. Was it a dark colour? Unfortunately the acrylic paints just don't seem to be as tough as the oil and laquer finishes. Benefit is the Low VOC and brush friendly properties.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

so basically, its just like cabinet coat....


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Woodco said:


> so basically, its just like cabinet coat....


😂😂


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## Deanie Jo (Feb 8, 2021)

finishesbykevyn said:


> I really hope so. Was it a dark colour? Unfortunately the acrylic paints just don't seem to be as tough as the oil and laquer finishes. Benefit is the Low VOC and brush friendly properties.


The color is white.


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## monarchski (Jun 21, 2019)

Woodco said:


> so basically, its just like cabinet coat....


No, its Cabinet Coat on crack. I got my hands on a gallon of stock satin black and a gallon of gloss safety yellow. I've been playing with it on different substrates and you can NOT get this stuff off after it's been on 24 hours. Put it over some powder coated metal, won't come off. Just lightly sanded and applied. Put some on some steel beams that had an industrial enamel on them, won't come off and I didn't clean or sand. Brushed some out on some wood in both sheens, two coats and it's extremely hard but is flexible and laid down fairly decent. Like Breakthrough, you have to get it the way you want it fairly quickly. Also put some on an interior concrete floor that was very slick and didn't doing any etching, just cleaned it and that stuff is NOT coming off and fork lifts are driven over it starting 24 hours later. Incredible product.


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Believe it or not, my Rep here says he has some Command for me to sample. What should I try to paint first?! Sounds more like it's designed for industrial doors or something. We'll see..


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

In my possession. Going to paint a couple sample doors and then maybe a dresser unit if I like the finish. Stay tuned..Have 1 gal. Stock Black and 1 gal. In a 3x base. Colour BM Van Duesen Blue. Full Gloss.


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## monarchski (Jun 21, 2019)

finishesbykevyn said:


> Believe it or not, my Rep here says he has some Command for me to sample. What should I try to paint first?! Sounds more like it's designed for industrial doors or something. We'll see..


BM gets preconceived ideas on how to market something for a specific segment and they run with it. Dumb. Like the ScuffX which to me shouldn't be under the UltraSpec label. The Command will be just as popular on Res Repaint as it will on the Industrial side.


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

monarchski said:


> BM gets preconceived ideas on how to market something for a specific segment and they run with it. Dumb. Like the ScuffX which to me shouldn't be under the UltraSpec label. The Command will be just as popular on Res Repaint as it will on the Industrial side.


Maybe for the professional, but not for the DIYer. These products are not super user friendly, which is why they market them to the commercial side of painting. Plus, they don't want to compete with the residential DIY sector..


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

Do it state anywhere that it can be used on cabinets? 🤞


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Rbriggs82 said:


> Do it state anywhere that it can be used on cabinets? 🤞


Yes cabinetry will be in the datasheet BM wanted a product to use on literally _everything_ for facility maintenance.


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Rbriggs82 said:


> Do it state anywhere that it can be used on cabinets? 🤞


Yep. It actually does. Mind you, I can't seem to find an actual tds on this stuff yet. I imagine it is quite like the breakthrough. I rolled a first coat on some mdf panels last night. Was very brush/roller friendly, but you do have to move pretty quick. No different then trying to work with Aura really. 20 mins later, the stuff was candy shell hard. Crazy. Will apply 2nd coat today as well as some spray tests. Hopefully it levels off fairly well for spray application.


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## kentdalimp (Aug 15, 2013)

Holland said:


> Until I hear back from you on these experiments, i'm sticking with BIN. Atleast for the first coat. I am currently experimenting with ppg sealgrip at the shop on some dark stained wood..just don't have confidence in the latex primers.


If you are anywhere near California, Vista Paint has a material called PrimeZall [LINK]

We use it religiously for anything where we worry about adhesion, It actually blocks Stain and Tannins well, and it sands really easily. 

Only problem is they only exist in CA and I believe 2-3 stores in Las Vegas. 

Plus for us it is Compliant in CA which is over half the battle!


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## Masterwork (Sep 13, 2020)

finishesbykevyn said:


> Wait a minute. Didn't I say that?


Deja vu. 

Are you going to brush and roll a sample of that command, too?


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Masterwork said:


> Deja vu.
> 
> Are you going to brush and roll a sample of that command, too?


 Yep. I did. It's fine. You have to move pretty fast though, as it sets up pretty quick and it doesn't quite flow out like the Advance. Although the big benefit is the very quick recoat and blocking time for sure. I only have the high gloss right now. Need to get my hands on the Satin..


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

Picked up a gallon of ultra spec flat yesterday for a ceiling I had to paint. The entire can was plastic, lid and everything except for the handle. The lid actually snaps into place rather than just pressure fitting. Not sure that I like this.

When did this become a thing? Are they going to make this change to all their paint cans or just ultra spec?


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## Joe67 (Aug 12, 2016)

Wildbill7145 said:


> Picked up a gallon of ultra spec flat yesterday for a ceiling I had to paint. The entire can was plastic, lid and everything except for the handle. The lid actually snaps into place rather than just pressure fitting. Not sure that I like this.
> 
> When did this become a thing? Are they going to make this change to all their paint cans or just ultra spec?


I just got a gal of Arborcoat - same thing. Those cans suck. Also got some Moorgard, but that came in normal metal.


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

Joe67 said:


> I just got a gal of Arborcoat - same thing. Those cans suck. Also got some Moorgard, but that came in normal metal.


That makes me think the change is going to be on everything, once the inventory gets pushed through. I didn't have to work out of the plastic can just dump it in my tray, but it certainly felt different.


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## Masterwork (Sep 13, 2020)

Be careful when the plastic ones get cold. I've broken 2 empties that I kept in my vehicle for cutting in.


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

Masterwork said:


> Be careful when the plastic ones get cold. I've broken 2 empties that I kept in my vehicle for cutting in.


Wow. Never thought about that, but it certainly makes sense. I was just thinking about exterior season and the sun hitting the black cans and cooking the paint or at least warming it to the point that once applied it dries too fast.


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## Joe67 (Aug 12, 2016)

Wildbill7145 said:


> Wow. Never thought about that, but it certainly makes sense. I was just thinking about exterior season and the sun hitting the black cans and cooking the paint or at least warming it to the point that once applied it dries too fast.


Yeah, I was having to work in full sun - and also just poured out into my bucket. And it was only low 50s, but I kept the can in the shade.

The biggest problem will be that the the channel is incredibly narrow, and with the "click-fit" rather than pressure, it will often incredibly annoying, if not sometimes impossible, to keep the rims clean enough to reseal cans properly.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Wildbill7145 said:


> Picked up a gallon of ultra spec flat yesterday for a ceiling I had to paint. The entire can was plastic, lid and everything except for the handle. The lid actually snaps into place rather than just pressure fitting. Not sure that I like this.
> 
> When did this become a thing? Are they going to make this change to all their paint cans or just ultra spec?


Its pretty recent and due to a nation wide can shortage. The colorants are also in plastic cans and yes all of us retailers hate this design. The best plastic design seems to be a plastic can with a metal lid but for some reason BM went with the plastic lid... The change to plastic cans is only for select products at this point.


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

I was just at my paint supplier and they said the same thing. Material shortages causing metal can shortages. She said the rep told her that BM would be keeping it to specific lines of paint/stains in an attempt to keep the more popular lines in the metal cans. She also said she hates it because she's never 100% sure the cans have completely sealed when she hands them over to the customer. I asked her if she was worried that customers would start complaining when they go to reopen a can to find it's skinned over because of a bad seal on a messy can. She just shook her head muttering. lol. I'm so glad I haven't been in retail since I was in university.


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## Packard (May 2, 2018)

The traditional 1, 2, and 5 gallon pails are made from HDPE (High Density Polyethelene) resin and (I just looked it up) does not get brittle until -70 Centigrade (-94 F.). It is all virgin material as those cans are also used to contain food. 

And I just looked up the resin used for the new black 1 gallon paint pails and and that is polypropylene and is recycled plastic (not for food products). It becomes brittle below 0 degrees Centigrade (below 32 degrees F.).

So Masterwork's warning about the black 1 gallon pails is a very valid one. The white 1 gallon, 2 gallon, and 5 gallon pail we've been familiar with are "shippping" containers. That is they are rated to ship with just a label attached. They have to pass several types of destruction tests and they cannot tip over easily. 

The black pails have to be placed in cartons in order to ship.

The 1 gallon steel pails are not shipping containers, but the 5 gallon steel pails (with a spout or with a removable lid) are shipping containers.

Years ago I worked in that industry. 

As an aside, because the 5 gallon pails are designed to not tip over they become a drowning risk for small children if left unattended and filled with water (like for washing a car). The only data I could find covered the years, 1984 - 1989 during which time 160 infants drowned in buckets. 

It is not a major risk, but something to be aware of anyhow.


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