# First Commercial Exterior



## Deanigirl (Jul 29, 2018)

Hi there  

Ive been stalking painttalk post for a few years and made an account today to ask a few questions.
My husband and I usually do interiors or exteriors of residential but we have been given an opportunity to bid on a bank exterior. 

The difficulty is not only have we not done a commercial exterior but we have a history of bidding very low ( I think ) because we grew up poor and came from a poor town. We barely make ends meet and work our butts off, Ive seen some of the conversations in here tossing around some very high numbers and it blows my mind .
I'm not sure what to bid and I know people dont usually give actual numbers in here but I could use some advice. 

Its a bank in a small town , very rich town because its a gold mine town. All the contractors are busy with huge builds and booked for years in advance so I don't think we have any competition. 

A friend that also does reno suggested we quote $30,000 and considering my husband was suggesting $3,000 it seems like quite a lot lol.
is $30,000 reasonable? does the fact its a bank matter? 

its about 36,000 sf painted brick, 16 feet high that needs pressure washing , scraping and repairs .
I know , i know about the quoting ourselves into bankruptcy idea:vs_worry: , I'm really trying to see it differently this time and maybe get ahead for once instead of going broke everyday .


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

Got any pics?


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

While pricing questions are frowned upon, we can offer you some suggestions on what goes into estimating a project like that and let you figure it out on your own. You alone know your overhead, production rates and market so numbers are of no value to you from us. However, systems are VERY valuable. It's all about math. Not feelings or demographics. (A rich man and a poor man pay the same shop rate. The difference (imo) is how much time is spent on the project. The rich man likely wants more details....=$$$$ The poor man wants fresh color =$ Just an example)
Figure out your shop rates, multiply by your hours, add materials and dont forget to add profit. Dont be afraid of "big" numbers. You are an employee of the business. The business needs to get paid or you become unemployed.

Commercial stuff is usually more of a sq ft deal which ,personally, I dont do much of. Your local paint store rep would be a valuable resource for that info and several other things related to your geographic market. It's their job. It's a free service. USE IT!
Other folks may chime in with many more helpful suggestions but if we wander into numbers I gotta shut it down.
Thats the best thinking I've got for tonight....others will be far more insightful I'm sure.Good luck. And yes, send pics.




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## Pete Martin the Painter (Nov 8, 2012)

Just wondering, if you are in a very rich area, why are you guys barely getting by. If your customers can afford to pay more, why are you bidding so low?

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## Deanigirl (Jul 29, 2018)

i cant seem to add photos


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## Deanigirl (Jul 29, 2018)

Because we are having a hard time shifting our thinking that painters can charge a lot I guess or maybe just that we could


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## Deanigirl (Jul 29, 2018)

Pete Martin the Painter said:


> Just wondering, if you are in a very rich area, why are you guys barely getting by. If your customers can afford to pay more, why are you bidding so low?
> 
> Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk





lilpaintchic said:


> While pricing questions are frowned upon, we can offer you some suggestions on what goes into estimating a project like that and let you figure it out on your own. You alone know your overhead, production rates and market so numbers are of no value to you from us. However, systems are VERY valuable. It's all about math. Not feelings or demographics. (A rich man and a poor man pay the same shop rate. The difference (imo) is how much time is spent on the project. The rich man likely wants more details....=$$$$ The poor man wants fresh color =$ Just an example)
> Figure out your shop rates, multiply by your hours, add materials and dont forget to add profit. Dont be afraid of "big" numbers. You are an employee of the business. The business needs to get paid or you become unemployed.
> 
> Commercial stuff is usually more of a sq ft deal which ,personally, I dont do much of. Your local paint store rep would be a valuable resource for that info and several other things related to your geographic market. It's their job. It's a free service. USE IT!
> ...


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## northcountrypainter (Dec 7, 2012)

lilpaintchic is absolutely correct I think...its all about math. Put your quote together without having a pre-determined idea of how much you think you would pay. Perh aps you need to adjust your thinking. Sounds like you have a habit of undervaluing the things that you bring to the table. Skills, experience, service, integrity etc. etc. have a lot of value to many customers so maybe you are worth a lot more than you think.


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## MikeCalifornia (Aug 26, 2012)

I don't think you are grasping the scale of this. 36k of brick is a tough undertaking, you would obviously spray if you can. Two coats will be a must for a color change. Say you get 300 sq/ft per gallon, that's 240 gallons of paint. How much is that? $8500 at $35/gallon decent paint. 16' up you will need a lift and since it is a bank you will need to get permits to block off the sidewalks and provide entry into the bank, may even need to build some sort of shelter for the entry. Lifts cost money, powerwashing and containing water cost money. I personally think you are looking at 75-100k for a building of that size.


If your husband looked at that building and thought he could paint for 3k, I think you need to walk away as this will bury you.


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

Deanigirl said:


> lilpaintchic said:
> 
> 
> > While pricing questions are frowned upon, we can offer you some suggestions on what goes into estimating a project like that and let you figure it out on your own. You alone know your overhead, production rates and market so numbers are of no value to you from us. However, systems are VERY valuable. It's all about math. Not feelings or demographics. (A rich man and a poor man pay the same shop rate. The difference (imo) is how much time is spent on the project. The rich man likely wants more details....=$$$$ The poor man wants fresh color =$ Just an example)
> ...


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

MikeCalifornia said:


> I don't think you are grasping the scale of this. 36k of brick is a tough undertaking, you would obviously spray if you can. Two coats will be a must for a color change. Say you get 300 sq/ft per gallon, that's 240 gallons of paint. How much is that? $8500 at $35/gallon decent paint. 16' up you will need a lift and since it is a bank you will need to get permits to block off the sidewalks and provide entry into the bank, may even need to build some sort of shelter for the entry. Lifts cost money, powerwashing and containing water cost money. I personally think you are looking at 75-100k for a building of that size.
> 
> 
> If your husband looked at that building and thought he could paint for 3k, I think you need to walk away as this will bury you.


THIS. again, I'd get a rep out there pronto.they'll happily help you to adjust your thinking!

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## PaPainter724 (Apr 22, 2016)

Does the bank have any specs? As in, did they give you papers specifying what paint they expect you to use and the underlying prep work? I can help you figure out your gameplan, but we need to know what you're working with.


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## Deanigirl (Jul 29, 2018)

I went with a $25,000 quote :vs_whistle: we are planning to spray the brick.
So far the asked for more information / details and some photos to send to their client. 

I think the problem is we never added profit to our quotes and only charges based on exactly what we thought it would cost in labor .
I've done some reading up on this to try and familiarize myself with the idea of profit , not easy for me lol.
wish us luck and thank you for all the advice :kiss:


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## MikeCalifornia (Aug 26, 2012)

Wow!! .70/wall sq ft for a commercial bank. Good luck paying your personal bills for the next three months. You better hope they say no.


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## Deanigirl (Jul 29, 2018)

MikeCalifornia said:


> Wow!! .70/wall sq ft for a commercial bank. Good luck paying your personal bills for the next three months. You better hope they say no.


I calculate it at $8.33 per sq foot 

3000 sq feet


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## kmp (Jan 30, 2011)

Won't comment on the project but not figuring in profit and overhead you are basically working for beer money.


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

Deanigirl said:


> I calculate it at $8.33 per sq foot
> 
> 3000 sq feet


In your OP you said 36,000 sf of brick, @ 8.33 per sq ft would come to just a shade under $300,000. Which is it 36,000 or 3000?


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## Mr Smith (Mar 11, 2016)

I'm also a newbie in commercial exteriors. This thread makes me nervous.

Is there anyone who teaches this stuff? 

Sorry but I don't want to take advice from a dozen different answers. There seems to be a shortage of educational opportunities in this trade. I don't want to lose my shirt "learning" how not to do something.

Who's the best teacher of this stuff?


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

Mr Smith said:


> I'm also a newbie in commercial exteriors. This thread makes me nervous.
> 
> Is there anyone who teaches this stuff?
> 
> ...


The school of hard knocks!


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## CK_68847 (Apr 17, 2010)

I would say 1.50 a square foot is reasonable if the prep work is simple. Outsides typically go fast. With a a week of good weather it sounds like a job you could knock out and make good profit. You’re nuts to do that at 3,000.


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## Deanigirl (Jul 29, 2018)

Brushman4 said:


> In your OP you said 36,000 sf of brick, @ 8.33 per sq ft would come to just a shade under $300,000. Which is it 36,000 or 3000?



I have no idea where I got that number from lol.


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

Annnnnd we have wandered into numbers....:/ gee, who'd a guessed THAT would happen? 

THE END.

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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Well that was a rather “interesting” thread.


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