# Benjamin Moore paint issues.



## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

so last job i did was all in Benjamin Moore from the designers request. Aura matte and Regal matte. Almost all of the walls have flashing issues. The owner never noticed or the designer but i sure do. I also noticed it does not level out very well. Nor did i find if overly durable. Any 1 else have these issues or was it just me. At the price they want a gallon i find it a little annoying. Also aura satin was on the trim. It looks OK but not as durable as i was hoping. All doors where sprayed and looked great. OFC people hit them and they need to be repainted. I sanded them down and rolled them with 10 mill roller. Texture Aura leave is well, excessive.


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## ElTacoPaco (Dec 11, 2015)

Do not think Aura comes in Pearl


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

my mistake satin not pearl


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## Delta Painting (Apr 27, 2010)

I find the newer VOC compliant paint can be a pain in the azz they sure don't level out without some extender added witch compromises the integrity of the coating...


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

Aura is...different for sure. The first wall I rolled with it looked like a$$. I applied it like I had been used to doing with slower drying acrylics expecting it to flow out and it just didn't. Now that I've got the hang of it though, I like it. 

Thing is it will level out well, but the window for that happening is very short. You have to get it on fast with minimal tooling and start with a pretty tight stipple. It's very easy to overwork. I used to roll out three foot sections or so then go back and lay it off. That doesn't work with Aura. Makes a mess. 

If you can get the hang of the speed of Aura Matte, I've found it to be very forgiving as far as flashing/lapping are concerned. It's quite flat for a matte paint, even in the darker colors. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

Jmayspaint said:


> Aura is...different for sure. The first wall I rolled with it looked like a$$. I applied it like I had been used to doing with slower drying acrylics expecting it to flow out and it just didn't. Now that I've got the hang of it though, I like it.
> 
> Thing is it will level out well, but the window for that happening is very short. You have to get it on fast with minimal tooling and start with a pretty tight stipple. It's very easy to overwork. I used to roll out three foot sections or so then go back and lay it off. That doesn't work with Aura. Makes a mess.
> 
> ...


I noticed that as well. So i went faster with less back rolling and it helped but far from perfect. Just find it weird that every 1 loves BM yet SW or say Dulux gets bashed. Any paint that needs to be applied a special way or else it looks bad and cost 2 times as much is not worth it. I need my paint to be painter friendly lol.


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## bobross (Jun 27, 2016)

Why is it all the higher dollar paints require more work. Always thought it should be the other way around.


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## Exactoman (Mar 28, 2013)

Aura and Regal are both very simple to use if you take the time to understand the product before applying them. 
Your Aura will best be applied by cutting in and then letting your cut totally dry before rolling. Also, adding 2-4 Oz floetrol per can will solve half your flashing problem. The other half will be solved by using a 9" 5/16 microfiber by Wooster and rolling in the same direction up and down and side to side. 
You can probably do this with Regal as well. 
Problem solved.


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## Exactoman (Mar 28, 2013)

bobross said:


> Why is it all the higher dollar paints require more work. Always thought it should be the other way around.


They don't. But if you know how to use them they look 10x better than sh1t paints aka sherwin.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

AlphaWolf said:


> I noticed that as well. So i went faster with less back rolling and it helped but far from perfect. Just find it weird that every 1 loves BM yet SW or say Dulux gets bashed. Any paint that needs to be applied a special way or else it looks bad and cost 2 times as much is not worth it. I need my paint to be painter friendly lol.


What are you comparing SW and Dulux to as far as ease of application is concerned? They are both pretty much middle of the road in that respect as far as my side by side testing is concerned. Better then typical box store brands but not up to snuff with some good regional brands or P&L. There is a lot of personal preference involved as well, of course. That being said I really don't think Aura is actually harder to apply, it's just different to apply. Let the cut dry, roll quick, and don't re-roll an area until it is completely. Different then SW but not really any more difficult.


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

I did you use a microfiber. it was 15 mill. Sherwin paints are not as bad as you say. Say aura around 60 a gallon. I can get Cashmere/Opulence for 20. No special way to use it always looks perfect. don't see how that is "sh1t" paint. also 1/3rd the cost. Aura not worst paint i have ever used buy any means. But hard for me to justify the 3x the cost. Also have a house coming up with Aura on the exterior. I hope that goes a little better.


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

PACman said:


> What are you comparing SW and Dulux to as far as ease of application is concerned? They are both pretty much middle of the road in that respect as far as my side by side testing is concerned. Better then typical box store brands but not up to snuff with some good regional brands or P&L. There is a lot of personal preference involved as well, of course. That being said I really don't think Aura is actually harder to apply, it's just different to apply. Let the cut dry, roll quick, and don't re-roll an area until it is completely. Different then SW but not really any more difficult.


I've had very little issues in almost 13 years of painting with Dulux. Every time I use aura it looks like a dogs breakfast. Customer likes it, I don't. It drags, it pulls, it flashes, leaves heavy indentations from anything. It's incredibly thick too


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

journeymanPainter said:


> I've had very little issues in almost 13 years of painting with Dulux. Every time I use aura it looks like a dogs breakfast. Customer likes it, I don't. It drags, it pulls, it flashes, leaves heavy indentations from anything. It's incredibly thick too


You hit the nail on the head. Diamond for me is 35 vs aura at 60. Diamond always looks perfect and is just as durable. Even Lifemaster matte 0VOC is is nicer to use imo. More durable than Regal matte and cheaper than diamond. Got to love good marketing lol.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

journeymanPainter said:


> I've had very little issues in almost 13 years of painting with Dulux. Every time I use aura it looks like a dogs breakfast. Customer likes it, I don't. It drags, it pulls, it flashes, leaves heavy indentations from anything. It's incredibly thick too


Actually the Dulux you have in Canada is entirely different then what we used to have in the states so I really don't have any experience with it. But, when I wipe with Northern it drags more than Charmin so does that make the Charmin a better tp? Lots of variables come in to play in the field when it comes to paint application. That's why I always go with what lab testing comes up with. Not perfect by any means but that is why I may have differing opinions to what you painters are experiencing in the field. BUT! What I am doing to test paint is what the paint companies themselves do when they do benchmark testing between their products and their competitors. So take it for what's it's worth and don't get upset about it ! Lol!

So when I do a side by side brushout with my custom deluxe master brushout tester device, and the Durations drags and doesn't "travel" as far as Aura, what does that mean? Not exactly what happens on a wall by any means, but important to consider nonetheless.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Dulux must be making a pretty good paint! Maybe that's why they left the United States market. ? Maybe just not worth the marketing effort for PPG anymore? Or the price Akzo Noble wanted for the trademark rights? Idk. But if PPG thought for a minute that the Dulux formulations were that much better then SW believe me they would have paid a good chunk of change for them.


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## ElTacoPaco (Dec 11, 2015)

AlphaWolf said:


> I noticed that as well. So i went faster with less back rolling and it helped but far from perfect. Just find it weird that every 1 loves BM yet SW or say Dulux gets bashed. Any paint that needs to be applied a special way or else it looks bad and cost 2 times as much is not worth it. I need my paint to be painter friendly lol.


It does not cost two times as more as far as I am concerned


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## ElTacoPaco (Dec 11, 2015)

AlphaWolf said:


> I did you use a microfiber. it was 15 mill. Sherwin paints are not as bad as you say. Say aura around 60 a gallon. I can get Cashmere/Opulence for 20. No special way to use it always looks perfect. don't see how that is "sh1t" paint. also 1/3rd the cost. Aura not worst paint i have ever used buy any means. But hard for me to justify the 3x the cost. Also have a house coming up with Aura on the exterior. I hope that goes a little better.


A better question to ask is what price is your Emerald at? By no way shape or form am I saying they are comparable bc I would never pay more that 30 Emerald


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## ElTacoPaco (Dec 11, 2015)

PACman said:


> Dulux must be making a pretty good paint! Maybe that's why they left the United States market. ? Maybe just not worth the marketing effort for PPG anymore? Or the price Akzo Noble wanted for the trademark rights? Idk. But if PPG thought for a minute that the Dulux formulations were that much better then SW believe me they would have paid a good chunk of change for them.


Have only heard good things about Dulux Pac. What is the Diammond that ICI has? Was ICI not Dulux?


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## Exactoman (Mar 28, 2013)

AlphaWolf said:


> I did you use a microfiber. it was 15 mill. Sherwin paints are not as bad as you say. Say aura around 60 a gallon. I can get Cashmere/Opulence for 20. No special way to use it always looks perfect. don't see how that is "sh1t" paint. also 1/3rd the cost. Aura not worst paint i have ever used buy any means. But hard for me to justify the 3x the cost. Also have a house coming up with Aura on the exterior. I hope that goes a little better.


First off, not all microfibers are the same. Aura looks best with 5/16 stipple. 
When you apply the product CORRECTLY, Aura, there is a huge finish difference between it and other products, especially cashmere. But, it matters what your customers want. Your customer base may not need Aura and Regal. I'm a firm believer of don't fix something if it ain't broke. If you know your products you use now and love em, then no need to change. 
But if you want to try and can get this product, you gotta try Richard's signature eggshell. It is a cashmere, Regal, comparable, and looks almost as good as Aura.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

ElTacoPaco said:


> Have only heard good things about Dulux Pac. What is the Diammond that ICI has? Was ICI not Dulux?


Yes it was. But ICI is gone from the US. (here anyway). many of those old ICI products are under the Glidden name now and some of them have been labeled as various other PPG products. But if there was any marketability to the Dulux trademark, PPG wouldn't have just walked away from it. It didn't have a particularly strong following in some areas.


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

ElTacoPaco said:


> A better question to ask is what price is your Emerald at? By no way shape or form am I saying they are comparable bc I would never pay more that 30 Emerald


Not sure my emerald price to be honest. I got a demo and tried it. Brushed out nice and rolled nice but left flashing kind of reminds of of aura in that way never got it again. Ill try some more Aura coming soon and ill use the rollers u all suggested see how it goes. PAC i wish i could send you a gallon of the Diamond and lifemaster i use here in Canada. Love to know your thoughts as well as for you to use your paint testing tools as well.


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## AlphaWolf (Nov 23, 2014)

Exactoman said:


> First off, not all microfibers are the same. Aura looks best with 5/16 stipple.
> When you apply the product CORRECTLY, Aura, there is a huge finish difference between it and other products, especially cashmere. But, it matters what your customers want. Your customer base may not need Aura and Regal. I'm a firm believer of don't fix something if it ain't broke. If you know your products you use now and love em, then no need to change.
> But if you want to try and can get this product, you gotta try Richard's signature eggshell. It is a cashmere, Regal, comparable, and looks almost as good as Aura.


You make it sound like i have never painted in my life. I know how to use a roller lol. Im thinking maybe its the roller its self was the issue so ill try the sleeve every 1 recommended. God this paint is picky lol.


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## Exactoman (Mar 28, 2013)

AlphaWolf said:


> You make it sound like i have never painted in my life. I know how to use a roller lol. Im thinking maybe its the roller its self was the issue so ill try the sleeve every 1 recommended. God this paint is picky lol.


I had same trouble when I first used Aura. I'm sure everyone here has. It's just better paint though. Look at it this way. Do I wear my good whites in a 145,000 house? Prob not. Do I use Aura there. Prob not. I use Richard's. And I paint awesome. Still use 5/16" nap on any sheen paint, 3/8" Wooster fuzzy on flat. 
But what do I use on the 250k+ homes? Aura. Advance. My whites are crisp-er. Theres still paint on em. There's time and place for all the paints. The key with Aura though is it can be a money maker and time saver. It can damn near cover in one coat over most similar colors. Just don't forget the floetrol. 2 Oz per can for 8 ft. 4 Oz per can for big walls!


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## thinkpainting/nick (Dec 25, 2012)

Search my posts been saying forever. Matte is glorified Flat and does not wash or hold up any better than a flat. $50 bucks a gallon come on for what? Duration is the worst! Regal is easier to work with but its still a flat. If the designers or HO doesn't have issues get your check and 👍🏻


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## 804 Paint (Jan 31, 2014)

I like the finish of both Aura and Regal matte. I haven't used either in my own home so I can't say how washable they are. Duration is by far the worst interior matte ever. Just awful. Emerald is not user-friendly and can flash if you don't do everything to a T (prime patches and then hit with a light coat of paint before your first coat, but I have to say, it really does hold up extremely well. I have washed a ton of crap off my kitchen wall I never thought would come off, but it did.

Now, I'll tell you one thing that Aura is awesome for. Those customers that INSIST their trim only needs one coat. Put some BM extender in that, paint your doors and trim and feel pretty darn good about it when you're done. As a pro you can tell it would look better with two, but that's mostly because you know it only has one. It always looks pretty darn good! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

804 Paint said:


> I like the finish of both Aura and Regal matte. I haven't used either in my own home so I can't say how washable they are. Duration is by far the worst interior matte ever. Just awful. Emerald is not user-friendly and can flash if you don't do everything to a T (prime patches and then hit with a light coat of paint before your first coat, but I have to say, it really does hold up extremely well. I have washed a ton of crap off my kitchen wall I never thought would come off, but it did.
> 
> Now, I'll tell you one thing that Aura is awesome for. Those customers that INSIST their trim only needs one coat. Put some BM extender in that, paint your doors and trim and feel pretty darn good about it when you're done. As a pro you can tell it would look better with two, but that's mostly because you know it only has one. It always looks pretty darn good!
> 
> ...


The durability of Emerald is to me it's only redeeming feature. It's tough as hell! Is it an extra $30 a gallon worth of tough? Not to me.


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## Mr Smith (Mar 11, 2016)

bobross said:


> Why is it all the higher dollar paints require more work. Always thought it should be the other way around.


Emerald is SW's top dog and it is fantastic to work with. I'm a BM guy but Emerald is much better than Aura or any other paint that BM carries IMO. I just used it for the 2nd time and it is the best paint that I have ever applied in my life. I rolled walls the first time and it was like butter,it didn't run, and the satin finish was beautiful!

The 2nd time I sprayed an exterior door with it and I had an accident with the hose nicking it while wet. TWO hours later after it baked in the sun I could sand it with 180 grit paper and sand down it down to perfection without harming the finish. I was worried that I would have to setup and spray it the next day.:thumbup:


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## Exactoman (Mar 28, 2013)

Mr Smith said:


> Emerald is SW's top dog and it is fantastic to work with. I'm a BM guy but Emerald is much better than Aura or any other paint that BM carries IMO. I just used it for the 2nd time and it is the best paint that I have ever applied in my life. I rolled walls the first time and it was like butter,it didn't run, and the satin finish was beautiful!
> 
> The 2nd time I sprayed an exterior door with it and I had an accident with the hose nicking it while wet. TWO hours later after it baked in the sun I could sand it with 180 grit paper and sand down it down to perfection without harming the finish. I was worried that I would have to setup and spray it the next day.:thumbup:


Emerald sucks. It's a serious fact. It doesn't even compare to aura. Any Coronado product is better than emerald. Ultra spec is better than emerald. Cashmere is better than emerald.


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## Mr Smith (Mar 11, 2016)

Exactoman said:


> Emerald sucks. It's a serious fact. It doesn't even compare to aura. Any Coronado product is better than emerald. Ultra spec is better than emerald. Cashmere is better than emerald.


Aura is one of the worst paints on the market in terms of usability. I'm sure it's a tough durable coating after it has cured. It's similar to Behr Premium Plus Ultra in that it runs and dries super fast. I certainly wouldn't use it on a big wall or high stairwell.

I do like Aura Bath & Spa though.

Emerald is the best paint that I have ever used and I've used most of them.


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## Clearlycut (Dec 1, 2013)

Aura matte i agree is prolly not the best solution for a wall that gets alot of angular light. Aura has a very high amount of solids. It levels like a dream tho in all sheens. Eggshell is the best to work with in my opinion.
Regal matte rolls better than anything. And ive never had flashing issues very slightly in darker colors i suppose. (Mind u i dont use ben moore but love it). 
Ive found that most issues i have encountered in the past were application related.
It is a beast of a paint almost too much in the can.
Aura will look good 8 yrs from now though on those walls

Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk


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## Seattlepainting (Jun 8, 2010)

PACman said:


> What are you comparing SW and Dulux to as far as ease of application is concerned? They are both pretty much middle of the road in that respect as far as my side by side testing is concerned. Better then typical box store brands but not up to snuff with some good regional brands or P&L. There is a lot of personal preference involved as well, of course. That being said I really don't think Aura is actually harder to apply, it's just different to apply. Let the cut dry, roll quick, and don't re-roll an area until it is completely. Different then SW but not really any more difficult.


Love your Avatar!!


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Seattlepainting said:


> Love your Avatar!!


I was wondering how long it would take for someone to notice it! Kind of a subversive political statement.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Good paint, bad paint?*



Exactoman said:


> Emerald sucks. It's a serious fact. It doesn't even compare to aura. Any Coronado product is better than emerald. Ultra spec is better than emerald. Cashmere is better than emerald.


I find it interesting to read the various comments on different paints. From reading some of the posts here, I am inclined to think that various members are in parallel universes. In some universes Aura is king and Emerald is garbage. In another parallel universe the opposite is true. How could this be? I have not had the good fortune to use either yet. 

Most of my work is for people who are getting their houses ready for sale, so I try to use paint that is reasonably priced and performs well. When I started painting again back in 2012, I went with Behr because it was easy for me to get and did not have a price that would send a customer into an apoplectic fit. Also, I was not getting any significant discount at the BM or SW stores.

I have had very good success with a number of Behr products, both interior and exterior. I just used their Low-Lustre Porch & Patio floor paint and it almost covered the white 123 primer on the basement stairs in one coat. A friend who does maintenance on a VFW post near me said that he has tried a number of different paints for exterior wooden steps and this one performs the best. How will it hold up on the basement stairs? I probably will never know since the house will be sold. 

I am not saying that all of Behr's products are good. I am slow to try new things unless I get enough good feedback, either positive or negative, to go and try something. Or, if a certain paint is spec'd on a job and I have to use it.

I used BM Ultra on walls in a condo last year. The GC bought it because his client picked out BM colors, so he figured why not just get BM paint. Based on my experience with that, I would never use it again, especially when I have the low tier Behr Premium Plus available. I much prefer the Behr PP Ultra Interior over the plain PP, but I find that the Behr PP outperforms the BM ULtra, at least in my parallel universe!

I do look forward to using left over paint on touch-up jobs so I can see how the various brands of paint apply. I have had some good success with Cashmere Low Lustre and semi-gloss as well as some Dutch Boy semi-gloss that allowed me to make a bunch of problems just dissapear. The CHB flat wall paint did not seem to cover that well, good enough for touching up over itself, but I would not buy it for a new job.

I am reluctant to say that I am a Behr paint enthusiast for fear of most here coming down on me like a pack of ravenous wolves, but after reading the pro and con posts here for Aura and Emerald (and others), I am coming to the conclusion that we all may be in separate, but parallel universes. In some of those, Aura is the best. In others, Emerald. Who am I to argue with what others say about a particular product without actually seeing the jobs that they used a particular product on? Conversely, who here can tell me that Behr sucks when most (not all) of my experiences have been very positive with the Behr paint I have used? The only valid argument I could imagine against using Behr would probably come from PACman where he might say "yeah, it goes on okay, but it does not perform over the long haul." And he may very well be correct. Hopefully I won't ever get the same complaints like Jpaints111 got from using Promar 200!

If I get a chance to use Aura or Emerald and fall in love with either (or both, but that might not happen in the parallel universe I find myself in!), then I will be able to comment on my experience with them.

I just find it hard to believe that one member here will swear that paint A is the best and B the worst and have another say the opposite and that both painters can be correct.

Could it be that the main problem is in the application of a particular paint and that some painters are so used to applying paint a certain way that they do not want to learn a new way to apply a different paint? How many here can afford to do experiments on every job like PACman experiments with paint in his shop? Don't most of you just want to get the job done right the first time and get a check?

All that being said, I do like Exactoman's comment in #8 (and #23) about using a Wooster 9 " wide 5/16" Micro Plush cover for any paint with a sheen (the Micro Plush also comes in 14 and 18 inch wide covers). This is my new go-to roller cover. I also use it for flat paint as the Behr PP Ultra has a slight sheen to it like many flats do today. The 5/16" Micro Plush does need to have the edge trimmed to avoid roller lines (both before and during the first use of rolling), but it seems to me that it rolls almost the same going up or down as far as getting an even coat without producing the subtle "mohair" effect, or lap marks, that makes us all want to finish rolling in one direction only.

Enough for now. 

futtyos


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## AngieM (Apr 13, 2016)

Very insightful @futtyos. I hate to admit I'm a PM200 fan. I've used it my repeat costumers homes, and every time I go back, it looks great. Time will tell.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

AngieM said:


> Very insightful @futtyos. I hate to admit I'm a PM200 fan. I've used it my repeat costumers homes, and every time I go back, it looks great. Time will tell.


AngieM, thank you for your kind words. 

I just reread all of the posts in the thread "My first real problem in 20 years" and found that the OP Jpaints111 never actually mentions the lower tier paint that he used on the job, even though several members asked him. You mentioned that you like to use Pro Mar 200 and several others posted comments about PM 200. I believe I may have used this to touch-up a house that was going to be sold and don't recall having any problems with it, although how much of a problem can one have touching up a repair job with the original paint (provided it is still usable)?

The only paint that I definitely recall being unhappy using is BM Ultra Spec. This was on a job where I was working around the GC (he remodels condos in a downtown Chicago highrise) who was busy doing all kinds of other tasks in and around where I was working. I was not very enthusiastic with how the Ultra Spec flat did not withstand getting scuff marks from touching it in the slightest way. I don't recall the Behr Premium Plus doing that and that is the GC's normal go to flat paint for walls.

If PM 200 works for you, more power to you. In the other thread you mentioned that "I use PM 200/'s new Low Sheen. Perhaps I'm drinking the kool aid, but I've been really impressed by the hide, low sheen and touch up ability. I don't have any feedback on the long term durability so maybe that will come to bite me. But I can get highly reflective window walls to look great using this contractor grade paint.
It covers in one coat with the extra white base." 
I will have to mention this to the GC I work for down in Chicago.

futtyos


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

futtyos said:


> AngieM, thank you for your kind words.
> 
> I just reread all of the posts in the thread "My first real problem in 20 years" and found that the OP Jpaints111 never actually mentions the lower tier paint that he used on the job, even though several members asked him. You mentioned that you like to use Pro Mar 200 and several others posted comments about PM 200. I believe I may have used this to touch-up a house that was going to be sold and don't recall having any problems with it, although how much of a problem can one have touching up a repair job with the original paint (provided it is still usable)?
> 
> ...


I believe he only states that he used a SW product. Others made the leap to it being PM200.


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

futtyos said:


> AngieM, thank you for your kind words.
> 
> I just reread all of the posts in the thread "My first real problem in 20 years" and found that the OP Jpaints111 never actually mentions the lower tier paint that he used on the job, even though several members asked him. You mentioned that you like to use Pro Mar 200 and several others posted comments about PM 200. I believe I may have used this to touch-up a house that was going to be sold and don't recall having any problems with it, although how much of a problem can one have touching up a repair job with the original paint (provided it is still usable)?
> 
> ...


Nope you're not drinking the Kool Aid. The PM200 Low Sheen is pretty good stuff. I painted a small hall that gets tons of abuse with it in my own house. It's been three years and has stood up well against the beating my two little kids dish out. :thumbsup:


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

RH said:


> I believe he only states that he used a SW product. Others made the leap to it being PM200.


Short jump, i might add.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*My bad.*



RH said:


> I believe he only states that he used a SW product. Others made the leap to it being PM200.


Guilty as charged!


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## stl911 (Jul 16, 2014)

futtyos said:


> I find it interesting to read the various comments on different paints. From reading some of the posts here, I am inclined to think that various members are in parallel universes. In some universes Aura is king and Emerald is garbage. In another parallel universe the opposite is true. How could this be? I have not had the good fortune to use either yet.
> 
> Most of my work is for people who are getting their houses ready for sale, so I try to use paint that is reasonably priced and performs well. When I started painting again back in 2012, I went with Behr because it was easy for me to get and did not have a price that would send a customer into an apoplectic fit. Also, I was not getting any significant discount at the BM or SW stores.
> 
> ...


i am not sure why most people here does not like behr, i never had any issue with it. it covers and hide very well for one coat. futtyos, do you have any chance to try behr pro i100? i am thinking to use it for low end job instead of bm ultraspec


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## ElTacoPaco (Dec 11, 2015)

stl911 said:


> i am not sure why most people here does not like behr, i never had any issue with it. it covers and hide very well for one coat. futtyos, do you have any chance to try behr pro i100? i am thinking to use it for low end job instead of bm ultraspec


What are your opinions on that new pro behr series


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

ElTacoPaco said:


> What are your opinions on that new pro behr series


It a relabel of the old Kilz commercial paint, that's all. Saw them doing it with my own eyes. Somewhere on my old phone I have a video.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

So coverage is the only criteria for using a particular paint? That's what all paints are judged by and nothing else? Interesting. 

What about how much time one brand can save you over another? Not important I suppose if you can save a couple bucks using Behr.


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

PACman said:


> So coverage is the only criteria for using a particular paint? That's what all paints are judged by and nothing else? Interesting.
> 
> What about how much time one brand can save you over another? Not important I suppose if you can save a couple bucks using Behr.


I wouldn't say it's the only criteria but it's certainly a big factor. Better coverage normally equals time saved. Unless it's the same sheen and color, I'm giving everything two coats no matter what. So I'm never looking for anything to go in one but I've used paints in the past that need three for apparently no reason, that's something that I can't tolerate.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Rbriggs82 said:


> I wouldn't say it's the only criteria but it's certainly a big factor. Better coverage normally equals time saved. Unless it's the same sheen and color, I'm giving everything two coats no matter what. So I'm never looking for anything to go in one but I've used paints in the past that need three for apparently no reason, that's something that I can't tolerate.


So if brand xyz covers just as well as brand abc, but when you use brand abc you can do the same amount of square footage in 20% less time, would you be willing to spend a few dollars more or travel a few miles further for brand abc?


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

PACman said:


> So if brand xyz covers just as well as brand abc, but when you use brand abc you can do the same amount of square footage in 20% less time, would you be willing to spend a few dollars more or travel a few miles further for brand abc?


I sure would but I'm not convinced any brand or line of paint could save 20% less time if they both covered the same. I'm pretty sure I could paint just as fast with pm200 as I could with Aura. Excessive drag could slow you down, but a little water or extender of your choice solves that problem. 

What drives me to pay more or travel out of my way for paint is overall appearance and durability, labor savings (unless it takes more coats than planned) is a kind of a non factor for me.


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## Exactoman (Mar 28, 2013)

Here's bottom line. Yall gonna run your business how you gonna run it. If your clients like the products you're using fantastic. This game is how you make money so I'm not gonna knock any of the people behind this business, especially you great people here on paint talk. But... Sherwin williams and ppg beer Valspar all have shareholders they have to report to... And continually profit... So if cutting some corners, downgrading paint with more less costly additives, then they do it. Ben moore on the other hand is owned by Warren buffet, and he has told ben moore they cannot sell out to big boxes, that he likes them remaining as an independent store and keeping quality high. Ben moore is in fact the superior product. NOT FAR behind is a paint made by a company called Richard's which has old Ben Moore chemists working for them. If yall are having problems with new products it's because your not researching how to effectively use these products. But I promise you, they will save you time and money. And Aura does in fact dominate every paint out there. Fact. But yall keep keeping on!! 😎


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Exactoman said:


> Here's bottom line. Yall gonna run your business how you gonna run it. If your clients like the products you're using fantastic. This game is how you make money so I'm not gonna knock any of the people behind this business, especially you great people here on paint talk. But... Sherwin williams and ppg beer Valspar all have shareholders they have to report to... And continually profit... So if cutting some corners, downgrading paint with more less costly additives, then they do it. Ben moore on the other hand is owned by Warren buffet, and he has told ben moore they cannot sell out to big boxes, that he likes them remaining as an independent store and keeping quality high. Ben moore is in fact the superior product. NOT FAR behind is a paint made by a company called Richard's which has old Ben Moore chemists working for them. If yall are having problems with new products it's because your not researching how to effectively use these products. But I promise you, they will save you time and money. And Aura does in fact dominate every paint out there. Fact. But yall keep keeping on!! 😎


What do you think in general of the Richard's line. I have an opportunity to carry it but no one around here has ever used any of it. Any good? Generally speaking? (as has been mentioned before, not every line made by any given paint manufacturer is worth a crap!)


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

Exactoman said:


> Here's bottom line. Yall gonna run your business how you gonna run it. If your clients like the products you're using fantastic. This game is how you make money so I'm not gonna knock any of the people behind this business, especially you great people here on paint talk. But... Sherwin williams and ppg beer Valspar all have shareholders they have to report to... And continually profit... So if cutting some corners, downgrading paint with more less costly additives, then they do it. Ben moore on the other hand is owned by Warren buffet, and he has told ben moore they cannot sell out to big boxes, that he likes them remaining as an independent store and keeping quality high. Ben moore is in fact the superior product. NOT FAR behind is a paint made by a company called Richard's which has old Ben Moore chemists working for them. If yall are having problems with new products it's because your not researching how to effectively use these products. But I promise you, they will save you time and money. And Aura does in fact dominate every paint out there. Fact. But yall keep keeping on!! 😎


I'm with you on Aura, it's a fantastic product, probably the best wall paint available on the market. 

As for answering to shareholders, I'm sure Berkshire Hathaway shareholders expect a profit just the same as any other publicly owned company. Warren Buffet is the CEO and owns around 30% of it, he does not own Ben Moore. The entire Berkshire Hathaway business model is built on the companies it both owns and invests in making profit, that's it. It's not a charity or some do gooding organization that makes good paint because they feel the overwhelming need to. No, they make paint for profit just the same as SW, PPG, and answer to shareholders just like every other publicly traded company.


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## Exactoman (Mar 28, 2013)

PACman said:


> What do you think in general of the Richard's line. I have an opportunity to carry it but no one around here has ever used any of it. Any good? Generally speaking? (as has been mentioned before, not every line made by any given paint manufacturer is worth a crap!)


I use Richard's more than any other paint besides Aura. The signature line is the best. The eggshell signature line is my go to. Blows out Regal. I would put it a slight 2nd to aura. They make all kinds of products. I like their ceiling paint too!


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## Exactoman (Mar 28, 2013)

Rbriggs82 said:


> I'm with you on Aura, it's a fantastic product, probably the best wall paint available on the market.
> 
> As for answering to shareholders, I'm sure Berkshire Hathaway shareholders expect a profit just the same as any other publicly owned company. Warren Buffet is the CEO and owns around 30% of it, he does not own Ben Moore. The entire Berkshire Hathaway business model is built on the companies it both owns and invests in making profit, that's it. It's not a charity or some do gooding organization that makes good paint because they feel the overwhelming need to. No, they make paint for profit just the same as SW, PPG, and answer to shareholders just like every other publicly traded company.


Yeah but it's different than being a public company. Sure ben moore must be profitable... But they are profitable not by purchasing other companies and getting bigger, they are profitable by sticking to paint.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Exactoman said:


> I use Richard's more than any other paint besides Aura. The signature line is the best. The eggshell signature line is my go to. Blows out Regal. I would put it a slight 2nd to aura. They make all kinds of products. I like their ceiling paint too!


I tested several of their products and the Signature line stood out. It seems to have a very good performance for it's price range and it will probably be the first Richard's line I bring in.

Thanks for your input!


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