# Alex Flex. Sigh



## mbob (Aug 23, 2013)

Hey folks, just wondering if any of u guys have tried the DAP's new product "Alex Flex" (crackproof/lifetime around $4.5 a tube). I've been working a 1920's mansion which has not been painted in 25 years. Each room has extensive trim-work/wall paneling and every seam needed to be caulked. After applying the alex flex i primed everything (several days later) and put on 2 coats of BM Aura. Everything was looking mint; the floors guys came in for two weeks and when they were done i took the plastic off the wall to find almost every bead of caulking was beginning to crack (get to stress out over christmas, great). Due to the shifting nature of paneling i was expecting a few cracks but really? Anyways, was wondering what other people's experience with this product is. thanks 
http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p669/marcuscaman/1222131003-00_zpsca9ada25.jpg
http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p669/marcuscaman/1222131105-00_zps92bb3934.jpg

Sorry for the bad quality but it gives the idea. The one wall shown is the only paneling in the living room but the dining room is all paneling. I have since switched over to tower tech urethane caulking, stuff is going no-wheres.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Haven't tried it. I've pretty much gotten away from using DAP products. I feel they aim for the DIY market through brand name recognition rather than quality products. I've been using _Tower Tech 2_ for about a year and half now without any issues.


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## Schmidt & Co. (Nov 6, 2008)

RH said:


> Haven't tried it. I've pretty much gotten away from using DAP products. I feel they aim for the DIY market through brand name recognition rather than quality products. I've been using _Tower Tech 2_ for about a year and half now without any issues.


Tower Tech, great stuff! :thumbsup:


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## mbob (Aug 23, 2013)

Tower tech II for life. Its just really bumming me out this happened because its my first high profile job and the Real Estate queen is coming tomorrow to see the progress. I feel like DAP owes me $800 for time wasted. Oh, and every single tube blew out the back making a  mess. steer clear.


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## Hines Painting (Jun 22, 2013)

That first picture looks like a lot of movement in the trim piece. 

TDS says it only has a a joint movement of 12.5%, which is the same as regular dap caulking.

You could try calling DAP, but if the trim is moving that much I suspect it is your problem, not theirs.


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## Stretch67 (Oct 7, 2013)

Just repainted my house. Wood paneling enameled the trim n cabinets etc Used Alex Plus for its fast dry time. Cracks everywhere the stuff is crap.


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## mbob (Aug 23, 2013)

It costs twice as much as Alex Plus


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## Jasonthep8nter (Aug 7, 2013)

Don't use Dap ever stuff is s**t


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## rwransom (Aug 7, 2013)

Sorry mbob to hear about your troubles. We use Sherwin Williams Shermax and have had no problems. Spec sheet says it can handle joint movement up to 35%.


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## ridesarize (Jun 19, 2012)

Sherwin 850a cracked out all over a milpack I just did. Some areas may be primer cracking on top of caulking. seems hard to match up flexible enough paint/primer to go with flex caulking. Can't do elastomeric everywhere..


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## aaron61 (Apr 29, 2007)

Interesting that everyone seems to be having issues with caulk failing. We just had a problem with the 850 cracking out of columns on the back of a very large home.

I'm wondering if there might be something going on with manufacturing?
Some change in the process or raw materials??


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## Wolfgang (Nov 16, 2008)

I gave up on the SW850 well over 5 years ago due to these problems. But Aaron may have a valid point about the mfg process; how many times have we experienced it with other products?


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## jacob33 (Jun 2, 2009)

I was told that the caulking got reformulated. I have had to change my approach to taping and masking a house because of this. We used to tape/caulk every room we were going to do first than start painting. Now we have to tape only what we can finish in a day and remove the next morning. If the caulking dries for more than 24 hrs its far more difficult to remove the tape never used to have that issue. Obviously not the same as cracking but I was told it was reformulated we only use sw caulking.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

If you want cheap and decent,


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## more_prep (Dec 7, 2009)

I used Alex Flex around door and window casings recently, over primer, and topcoated with BM Advance. No issues or cracking, but there is little movement. The reason	I tried it was that it meets ASTM C920 (rigorous adhesion and flexibility tests), the fast dry time, and it was easy to apply. Have had cracking with alex plus, though. The other problem I have with caulks is the paint cracking when applied over caulk. Didn't see that with alex flex.


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## Damon T (Nov 22, 2008)

Sorry for your problem. There's so many things in the world of painting that can go wrong. The 2nd pic was really hard to see. I've been using the fast dry caulking lately for interior work, I get it from BM. I think it's All-pro label, formerly Accelerator. Prior to that always used SW 60 year power house. You may need to re-caulk all the cracks with more flexible caulking, and shoot again. One of the downsides of using a caulk that you don't get from the same store as your paint is it's harder to get a rep to stand behind you. I'm assuming you didn't get it at your store, I could be wrong. I've never seen the Alex flex, but I don't buy Alex anything. I've used the dyna-something 290. Astm 920.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

Damon T said:


> Sorry for your problem. There's so many things in the world of painting that can go wrong. The 2nd pic was really hard to see. I've been using the fast dry caulking lately for interior work, I get it from BM. I think it's All-pro label, formerly Accelerator. Prior to that always used SW 60 year power house. You may need to re-caulk all the cracks with more flexible caulking, and shoot again. One of the downsides of using a caulk that you don't get from the same store as your paint is it's harder to get a rep to stand behind you. I'm assuming you didn't get it at your store, I could be wrong. I've never seen the Alex flex, but I don't buy Alex anything. I've used the dyna-something 290. Astm 920.


DynaFlex 230 or DynaFlex 920? Both meet/exceed ASTM 920. We've gotten good service from the 230, although I make take a look at the 920.


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

Gough said:


> DynaFlex 230 or DynaFlex 920? Both meet/exceed ASTM 920. We've gotten good service from the 230, although I make take a look at the 920.


 
Agreed on the 230. 

I was forced to use it on a job that customer was supplying the material for and have been using it fairly often with good results.


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## kdpaint (Aug 14, 2010)

mbob said:


> After applying the alex flex i primed everything (several days later) and put on 2 coats of BM Aura.
> 
> I don't know if this may be a reason, but caulking UNDER primer is not a good plan. Maybe the caulk did not adhere to previous coating and 2 different coatings on top screwed it up. Oh yeah, ALEX blows, Tower is the way.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

kdpaint said:


> mbob said:
> 
> 
> > After applying the alex flex i primed everything (several days later) and put on 2 coats of BM Aura.
> ...


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## ridesarize (Jun 19, 2012)

I always have caulked under primer, and I wouldn't switch . I don't like primer filling or bridging gaps. Plus I prime caulking, when both is needed.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

I feel better applying beads to primed surfaces. Ensures adhesion.


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## Carl (Jun 18, 2011)

ridesarize said:


> I always have caulked under primer, and I wouldn't switch . I don't like primer filling or bridging gaps. Plus I prime caulking, when both is needed.


Your reasoning makes sense, but caulk is going to adhere better to a primed surface than to anything else in the world and that is the reason we painters may like to prime first and then caulk.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Not to defend DAP or any other caulk, but we found a couple of procedures would that greatly help the longevity of caulk.

Prime before - helps resist the over absorption of adhesive components into the material.

And what we found to help was to REALLY and DEEPLY fill the crack/gap. Don't just go over all those areas with a quick cover, take your time and FILL the gap until the caulk mounds up a little just behind the nozzle. 

When I gutted the first floor of this house 15 - 20 years ago, I used whatever DAP was making then for long life acrylic caulk. Between the warped bed molding and the uneven ceiling (very old house), there was a LOT of opportunity to fill between the ceiling and the bed molding. I REALLY packed the caulk in. Today, there are just fine cracks showing, and this house is not environmentally controlled, so there is lots of swelling and shrinking through the seasons.


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## ridesarize (Jun 19, 2012)

Carl said:


> Your reasoning makes sense, but caulk is going to adhere better to a primed surface than to anything else in the world and that is the reason we painters may like to prime first and then caulk.


Thanks for giving me SOME credit, lol. I have good results with caulking first, I don't think I've had caulking lift that way. But on repaints I have scraped off peeling paint/primer to see the caulk go with it and I could see primer/paint on bottom side of that caulking. It seems caulking does great on raw wood making a cohesive bond, any future peeling would leave the caulking behind.. sorry don't mean to sound oppositional, I'm glad to be able to chat about stuff while off the clock.
DaArch, I agree fill it up. I say it's like packing bearings, leave no air inside.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

The specs for every caulk I've ever used has stipulated priming first.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

RH said:


> The specs for every caulk I've ever used has stipulated priming first.


Well, there's that...


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

RH said:


> The specs for every caulk I've ever used has stipulated priming first.


Wait, there are instructions on those tubes???

Next, you'll be telling us that there is similar information on cans of paint. Nice try, we're not falling for THAT!


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Gough said:


> Wait, there are instructions on those tubes???
> 
> Next, you'll be telling us that there is similar information on cans of paint. Nice try, we're not falling for THAT!



there are rumors in this industry that wallpaper also comes with instructions. Unfortunately, I always wipe before reading them.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Gough said:


> Wait, there are instructions on those tubes???
> 
> Next, you'll be telling us that there is similar information on cans of paint. Nice try, we're not falling for THAT!


It's that notorious "fine print". :yes:


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## Damon T (Nov 22, 2008)

Gough said:


> DynaFlex 230 or DynaFlex 920? Both meet/exceed ASTM 920. We've gotten good service from the 230, although I make take a look at the 920.


I think I was confused. Dyna flex 230 sounds right. I was thinking of the Astm rating


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

Damon T said:


> I think I was confused. Dyna flex 230 sounds right. I was thinking of the Astm rating


There is a DynaFlex 920, although I haven't seen it around here. The motto for a lot of the suppliers around here seems to be, "Unless everybody wants it, nobody gets it."


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Gough said:


> There is a DynaFlex 920, although I haven't seen it around here. The motto for a lot of the suppliers around here seems to be, "Unless everybody wants it, nobody gets it."


Can't get Big Stretch around here - unless HD carries it.

And if I have to go there... well... :no:


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

RH said:


> Can't get Big Stretch around here - unless HD carries it.
> 
> And if I have to go there... well... :no:


Yeah, but you can get TowerTech, right?


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## andy1015 (Apr 28, 2011)

i have had so much trouble with dap caulk…and will never use it again. I have been using osi quad caulk lately. Its a bear to work with, as it isn't water based. But on the plus side, my caulking technique has improved, and i never get shrinkage or cracking...


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Gough said:


> Yeah, but you can get TowerTech, right?


Miller used to carry Big Stretch but stopped and started stocking Tower Tech instead. I've never had an issue with either one.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

andy1015 said:


> i have had so much trouble with dap caulk…and will never use it again. I have been using osi quad caulk lately. Its a bear to work with, as it isn't water based. But on the plus side, my caulking technique has improved, and i never get shrinkage or cracking...


Is not being able to tool the quad a problem from the standpoint of appearance, or has that just forced you to improve your technique?


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## andy1015 (Apr 28, 2011)

it's possible to tool quad..u have to put a bit of mineral spirit on your finger, and get in there quick. I don't know what else to do, but use quad. Literally every job i used dap on has failed…quad doesn't fail….


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

andy1015 said:


> it's possible to tool quad..u have to put a bit of mineral spirit on your finger, and get in there quick. I don't know what else to do, but use quad. Literally every job i used dap on has failed…quad doesn't fail….


I know you can, you're just not to supposed to. Went to a window-installation workshop by OSI, they were adamant about not tooling it. 

If it hasn't failed, maybe that's not such a big deal.


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## andy1015 (Apr 28, 2011)

yeah…quad is also not intended to be used inside….but….i never want to go back on a job and see that cracking again. Dap failure has cost me a ridiculous amount of time and money. I'd love to use a water based product, as quad can definitely get messy….as i said tho, it has improved my caulking technique greatly. You want to get that stuff laid down just right, so that you barely have to finger it. If anyone has a better, water based product, that guaranteed won't fail….I'm all ears...


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## Monstertruck (Oct 26, 2013)

TJ Paint said:


> I feel better applying beads to primed surfaces. Ensures adhesion.


That's what most manufacturers say.
I've got one guy who thinks caulking is primer!


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## Tonyg (Dec 9, 2007)

mbob said:


> Hey folks, just wondering if any of u guys have tried the DAP's new product "Alex Flex" (crackproof/lifetime around $4.5 a tube). I've been working a 1920's mansion which has not been painted in 25 years. Each room has extensive trim-work/wall paneling and every seam needed to be caulked. After applying the alex flex i primed everything (several days later) and put on 2 coats of BM Aura. Everything was looking mint; the floors guys came in for two weeks and when they were done i took the plastic off the wall to find almost every bead of caulking was beginning to crack (get to stress out over christmas, great). Due to the shifting nature of paneling i was expecting a few cracks but really? Anyways, was wondering what other people's experience with this product is. thanks
> http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p669/marcuscaman/1222131003-00_zpsca9ada25.jpg
> http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p669/marcuscaman/1222131105-00_zps92bb3934.jpg
> 
> Sorry for the bad quality but it gives the idea. The one wall shown is the only paneling in the living room but the dining room is all paneling. I have since switched over to tower tech urethane caulking, stuff is going no-wheres.


A professional elastomeric is all I use. Alex if for home owners. 

If that your work vehicle in the pics? How do you get the ladders to stay on in the air? :blink:


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## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

Gough said:


> I know you can, you're just not to supposed to. Went to a window-installation workshop by OSI, they were adamant about not tooling it.
> 
> If it hasn't failed, maybe that's not such a big deal.


Thats probably cause window guys have no business caulking to began with!


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

mudbone said:


> Thats probably cause window guys have no business caulking to began with!


True that! They seem ****e to use the same caulk for everything, which usually means SILiCONE!

There's one guy around here who uses the siding next to the window as a place to wipe the excess caulk off of his hands.


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