# Vinyl over vinyl prep....



## Havebrushwilltravel (Feb 13, 2009)

I realize that most paperhangers would strip old vinyl wallcovering off a wall and prep the wall properly. However certain cicumstances and time constraints require hanging vinyl over vinyl. I read somewhere that the the old vinyl should be cleaned with mineral spirits and then clean water to make sure the surface is clean for the vinyl to vinyl adhesive to have a good bond. Is the mineral spirits part really necessary? What do you guys do to prep existing vinyl before hanging new? :001_unsure:


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Havebrushwilltravel said:


> I realize that most paperhangers would strip old vinyl wallcovering off a wall and prep the wall properly. However certain cicumstances and time constraints require hanging vinyl over vinyl. I read somewhere that the the old vinyl should be cleaned with mineral spirits and then clean water to make sure the surface is clean for the vinyl to vinyl adhesive to have a good bond. Is the mineral spirits part really necessary? What do you guys do to prep existing vinyl before hanging new? :001_unsure:



Is this commercial or residential? I don't do commercial, but there has been talk on other forums about fire codes prohibiting hanging vinyl over vinyl in commercial buildings. 

If this is a commercial building, I would strongly suggest you check the fire and other building codes. 

Other than that, I can not give advice for something I haven't done, nor would do.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

If this is a commercial building, I would strongly suggest you check the fire and other building codes. 

Other than that, I can not give advice for something I haven't done, nor would do.

Plus,I cannot imagine you would need to do ANY prep work if you were using VOV( the liquid nails of paste)


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## TooledUp (May 17, 2008)

I wouldn't guarantee it in any way, nor would I do it.


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## Traidr977 (Apr 8, 2008)

simply prime the area w/ oil base primer then go ahead and paper.use a good heavy oil . if you need to patch any seams so they r not coming thru the new paper do so after priming then prime the patches w/ oil prime. ive done this many times on old homes where there r layers of paper or the old paper was not put on properly & wont come down


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Traidr977 said:


> simply prime the area w/ oil base primer then go ahead and paper.use a good heavy oil . if you need to patch any seams so they r not coming thru the new paper do so after priming then prime the patches w/ oil prime. ive done this many times on old homes where there r layers of paper or the old paper was not put on properly & wont come down


Do you ever think of those who have to deal with what you have done ??

You do realize your own little corner of Karma will be stripping layers and layers of painted paper for eternity.


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## TooledUp (May 17, 2008)

daArch said:


> Do you ever think of those who have to deal with what you have done ??
> 
> You do realize your own little corner of Karma will be stripping layers and layers of painted paper for eternity.


:thumbsup:

As our missing friend John The Painter would say...


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## Traidr977 (Apr 8, 2008)

no i dont


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

no i dont

Great attitude. Our industry needs more just like you:no:


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Traidr977 said:


> no i dont


Those who have to deal with your mess would sincerley appreciate it if you thought more about the cost and aggravation you cause future PROFESSIONALS than your quick dollar earned now.


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## DMWalls (Dec 30, 2008)

One of the reasons that most people do not want to continue to use wallpaper is because of problems removing existing wallpaper. If the walls were properly prepared the existing paper can be easily removed. Do it right the first time, but don't make it worse by sealing the existing paper with oil. 

DMW


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

One of the reasons that most people do not want to continue to use wallpaper is because of problems removing existing wallpaper. If the walls were properly prepared the existing paper can be easily removed. Do it right the first time, but don't make it worse by sealing the existing paper with oil. :notworthy:


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## Hanger in VT (Aug 5, 2008)

The only reason a hanger would consider hanging over existing VWC, would be in cases where proper priming was not done previously, otherwise the vinyl would come off readily. Back when I used to do a bit of hotel renovation, there were quite a few times when removing the existing vinyl would have torn the drywall paper to shreds, and the only reasonable alternative was to hang over it. To use VOV adhesive, the only prep required was to first cut out and mud any loose areas or protruding seams. Still, using VOV is a pain, as it is messy and takes forever to dry in between two non-porous layers of vinyl. I often preferred to prime the existing vinyl with R-35, or similar adhesion promoting primer, and just hang the new vinyl with a thin coat of clay. It grabbed better than the VOV, was easier to clean, and dried quicker, too. 

As a rule, that kind of work was all about the GC's budget, and not much consideration for the next guy down the line. I'm glad I don't do that kind of work anymore, though I miss the money sometimes.


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## DMWalls (Dec 30, 2008)

I agree that if the walls were not prepared properly it may be necessary to leave the existing paper or vinyl on the wall and install over it. DO NOT seal the old paper or vinyl with Oil, unless you want to add a coat of Acrylic Wallpaper primer on top of the Oil. It is true that in the old days (Before EPA regulations) Oil was the way to go for most applications. Not anymore! Check the Surface preparation instructions on the adhesive. All that I run across say to "Prime all surfaces (including oil based coatings) with an acrylic primer". If I must go over existing vinyl, I'll use Romans R-35. If it's paper, Gardz is my choice.

J


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## lay64 (Apr 13, 2009)

*VOV Nightmare!*

Been doing commercial wall covering over forty years and thought I had seen and heard it all. I am looking at a job and so far have only looked at a couple of rooms, small, old hotel. The couple of rooms I have looked at have three layers of VWC, the third being covered in mold! They just want to do around 20 of the rooms which I am assuming are in the same state or worse condition and I absolutely will not be the one to put layer # 4 on top of this. I can only imagine the liability of this one if there ever was a fire. Anyone know of something or somewhere I could refer these people to so that they could see that adding another layer of vinyl is not the solution and the safety hazards of trying to even consider doing this? I want to at least open their eyes to what they are wanting to do since I already know that there are plenty of installers out there that will do it for a price, even knowing it is wrong, especially in this economy. Thanks for any help.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

Anyone know of something or somewhere I could refer these people 

Look at the building codes for where ever you are.


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