# Concrete Floor Prep For Epoxy



## philcav7 (Sep 12, 2013)

I'm bidding a project that includes 1000sf of armor seal 7100. I haven't been able to do a walk through so it's tough to make a full decision on exactly what is needed. It's an existing interior space that's being renovated, not new concrete. 

What is your typical prep protocol for concrete floors? Plans simply reference ASTM standards. What's the best "play it safe" approach without going overboard and pricing myself out of the job. 


I have done a few residential garages in the past and used acid to prep, this current job is in a shopping center with limited access to water. I don't own a grinder, but can grab one if needed.


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

First you should really look to see what condition the floor is in so you can bid it right. Check for cracks and chunks missing.

Do a moisture test. We use painters plastic 12"x12" squares taped on all 4 sides tight to the floor (I do 5 spots per 2 bay garage, one in each corner and one in the center) Leave them down for at least 24 hrs.

Grind the floor acids do not work the best and with a limited water supply grinding is your best option.

We use Corotech epoxy, we have not use Armor seal yet. but your moisture test should be the same no matter what expoy you use.


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## aaron61 (Apr 29, 2007)

You absolutely need to see it! The amount of prep needed depends on the existing surface and your coating can only be as good as the underlying surface. You do not want to deal with a failing floor.
That being said. Diamond grind,fill cracks and voids then go for it. 7100 is a waterborne??? Why are you using that?


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## philcav7 (Sep 12, 2013)

I don't have the luxury of a walk through, bidding closes today. I did get pictures, they don't show great detail but it looked sound overall. I guess I will account for basic crack repair and a full prep to be on the safe side. 

I would have liked to do a moisture test and certainly will if I get the job. I will have an excess moisture clause in the contract. I honestly don think it will be an issue. I've spent a lot of time in that mall and never saw any signs of moisture on the various floor surfaces, but there's always that chance. 


The plans specified the 7100. It wasn't my selection.


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

I would bid it really high.


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## ewingpainting.net (Jun 2, 2008)

I wont do a floor without grinding or blasting it. Im with Tommy I always double my rates for floors, never be competitive with floor coatings


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## kdpaint (Aug 14, 2010)

I've never seen a floor that gets traffic last if it was prepped with acid. Grind or blast, no substitutions.


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## philcav7 (Sep 12, 2013)

Bid is in. Not sure where I will land on pricing. I priced masking, setup, mobilization, cleanup, etc by the hour like I normally would. I used estimating guides for production and pricing rates to determine cost for the coatings...divided that number by my typical hourly rate for a two man crew. It came in higher than I would if I were to guestimate the job by hourly. I don't have much production rates for floor coatings and high walled spraying. I think my pricing is safe, if I get the job. The CM is from out of state and don't know who all the requested to bid. 

I didn't anticipate acid etching. I know that's not normally a preferred method. I can't find a reliable blaster in this area. I've had to turn away a few jobs this past year because I couldn't find anyone that wanted to work despite my continue efforts to get them jobs. Grinding I can handle on my own and not rely upon anyone except the rental shop. 


Per chance, any of you have typical production rates for grinding with a dual drum grinder with a 22" path??? Including final prep, cleaning before laying down the coating? 18x51 floor area, no obstructions.


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## philcav7 (Sep 12, 2013)

ewingpainting.net said:


> I wont do a floor without grinding or blasting it. Im with Tommy I always double my rates for floors, never be competitive with floor coatings


Any particular reason or experiences that you can share? 

Coating difficulty? PITA factor of grinding? Callbacks? Material Waste? Slow Production?


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

philcav7 said:


> Per chance, any of you have typical production rates for grinding with a dual drum grinder with a 22" path??? Including final prep, cleaning before laying down the coating? 18x51 floor area, no obstructions.


This is hard to really give you a good answer on. Every one will have a different rate. Some of us work faster than others. There could be unseen issues which will slow down the grinding production rates. An average 2 bay garage floor grinding has varied with us from 2 hours to 4 hours. Concrete makes a difference, is it all level, stains, repairs and so on.


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

philcav7 said:


> Per chance, any of you have typical production rates for grinding with a dual drum grinder with a 22" path??? Including final prep, cleaning before laying down the coating? 18x51 floor area, no obstructions.


On Monday I used a dual head grinder with six blades on a 1000 sqft floor. Between grinding and clean up it took just about 8 man hours. Keep in mind the floor had no previous coatings and was relatively level.

Here I am at the helm..








I love the way these floors come out. :yes:








I'm going back today for a coat of Rexthane and a big fat check


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

Looks great man. Just typed up one for a garage right now on site.


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## ewingpainting.net (Jun 2, 2008)

philcav7 said:


> Any particular reason or experiences that you can share?
> 
> Coating difficulty? PITA factor of grinding? Callbacks? Material Waste? Slow Production?


there are too many variables involved for a failure to occur. This is the same reasoning why floor coating manufacturers do not have warranties. Although I have had success with many floor coatings, I have experienced failures as well. The fix is not cheap, this has to be in the cost. That is if you want to stand by your product!


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

straight_lines said:


> Looks great man. Just typed up one for a garage right now on site.


Thanks Tommy, from what I've seen on your FB page we use the same system. :thumbup:


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## philcav7 (Sep 12, 2013)

ewingpainting.net said:


> there are too many variables involved for a failure to occur. This is the same reasoning why floor coating manufacturers do not have warranties. Although I have had success with many floor coatings, I have experienced failures as well. The fix is not cheap, this has to be in the cost. That is if you want to stand by your product!


I figured as much. 

My standard warranty is 1 year for craftsmenship and materials are as provided by the vendor or manufacture. Never had a callback on my work, but I do factor a small warranty allowance on each job under my overhead.


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## kebok (23 d ago)

philcav7 said:


> I'm bidding a project that includes 1000sf of armor seal 7100. I haven't been able to do a walk through so it's tough to make a full decision on exactly what is needed. It's an existing interior space that's being renovated, not new concrete.
> 
> What is your typical prep protocol for concrete floors? Plans simply reference ASTM standards. What's the best "play it safe" approach without going overboard and pricing myself out of the job.
> 
> ...


For a 2 car, 400 sq ft garage with some cracks and oil stains and pitting, is there a rule of thumb as to how much I would save to DIY an epoxy floor install. Also I cannot find an average price for professional install - honmeadviser.com quotes 3-12 - too broad a range. I live in Central Valley of California. Thanks.


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

kebok said:


> For a 2 car, 400 sq ft garage with some cracks and oil stains and pitting, is there a rule of thumb as to how much I would save to DIY an epoxy floor install. Also I cannot find an average price for professional install - honmeadviser.com quotes 3-12 - too broad a range. I live in Central Valley of California. Thanks.


Rule of thumb would be, that you don't have to pay someone else to do it.🤷‍♀️


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

kebok said:


> For a 2 car, 400 sq ft garage with some cracks and oil stains and pitting, is there a rule of thumb as to how much I would save to DIY an epoxy floor install. Also I cannot find an average price for professional install - honmeadviser.com quotes 3-12 - too broad a range. I live in Central Valley of California. Thanks.


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