# Zachary Brushes--where did they go



## micdalg (Sep 13, 2014)

So I started using Zachary Brushes about 6 months ago and I'm addicted. All of a sudden they are out of stock on all brushes. Anyone know what's going on?


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

micdalg said:


> So I started using Zachary Brushes about 6 months ago and I'm addicted. All of a sudden they are out of stock on all brushes. Anyone know what's going on?


Probably troubles getting stuff from China.

Solution: Buy American.


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## Holland (Feb 18, 2011)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> Probably troubles getting stuff from China.
> 
> Solution: Buy American.


Harsh.

Should we discard everything not made in US?


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Holland said:


> Harsh.
> 
> Should we discard everything not made in US?



That's not what I said. Give me two products side by side American vs Chinese. Won't even need to 'phone a friend' because that's the easiest decision I'll ever make.


I once reached out to zachary brushes because they are supposedly canadian. My suspicions were proven correct when I got a call from some dude several time zones away in china. No thanks!


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## micdalg (Sep 13, 2014)

They are actually a Japanese company based in Canada. Very nice folks and the best brush I've found in 24 years of painting. I make more money with these brushes because they cut time off the job. This gives me more time and money to throw into the American economy. It's a win.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

micdalg said:


> *They are actually a Japanese company based in Canada. *Very nice folks and the best brush I've found in 24 years of painting. I make more money with these brushes because they cut time off the job. This gives me more time and money to throw into the American economy. It's a win.



Nope from HK and they're sourced and assembled in china, then 'finished' in canada. If you follow the news then you know why they're having trouble sourcing their brushes.



https://issuu.com/richmond-news/docs/profiles0fexcellence_richmond_web/15


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> micdalg said:
> 
> 
> > *They are actually a Japanese company based in Canada. *Very nice folks and the best brush I've found in 24 years of painting. I make more money with these brushes because they cut time off the job. This gives me more time and money to throw into the American economy. It's a win.
> ...


Who cares where they are made. The man said he loves these brushes. I may order some on Amazon. Thanks for
The tip cocomonkeyman!


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

HC-Raad said:


> Who cares where they are made. The man said he loves these brushes. I may order some on Amazon. Thanks for
> The tip cocomonkeyman!



Lots of people care to not buy made in china. Might as well buy your paint on amazon too I don't care.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

micdalg said:


> They are actually a Japanese company based in Canada. Very nice folks and the best brush I've found in 24 years of painting. I make more money with these brushes because they cut time off the job. This gives me more time and money to throw into the American economy. It's a win.


I understand liking some kind of brush, but you come on here with only two posts to your name saying they "cut time off your jobs"? 

First of all, no brush cuts time off of jobs, no matter how great they are, secondly, its obvious you are a rep for these brushes.:vs_laugh:


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

I buy whatever $20 brush is available. They all make me money. Why not just call the manufacturer to find out what's up? Instead of paint talk. lol.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

The fact it needs to be explained to anyone why Americans should buy American made products, when possible, is very troubling. To say the least.

Amazon currently is out of stock. It appears perhaps these brushes have become victim of the supply chain disruption caused by the latest trade war.

You can tell by the way the company avoids discussing their true roots and point of manufacture on their website they wish to convey a false image of a Canadian company making brushes in Canada. 

I guess they don't want to stamp their brushes "made with pride in China", so they hide the fact.


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> The fact it needs to be explained to anyone why Americans should buy American made products, when possible, is very troubling. To say the least.


A large % of cars on the road, in the USA are made in Japan. You think i am going to worry about a few paint brushes? This is paint talk, not political talk.

Where do you want to go next, vegan vs meat eaters? We shouldn't slaughter poor animals for our own gluttony?


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

HC-Raad said:


> A large % of cars on the road, in the USA are made in Japan. You think i am going to worry about a few paint brushes? This is paint talk, not political talk.
> 
> Where do you want to go next, vegan vs meat eaters? We shouldn't slaughter poor animals for our own gluttony?



By all means continue to buy Chinese paint and sundries on Amazon, pretty soon that's all that will be left.


Pretty funny to see the lust for cheap chinese products and then see threads like this:
https://www.painttalk.com/f4/how-do-you-compete-against-those-working-illegally-94411/


PS: maybe take notice other companies like Nour that actually their produce products in Canada.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> A large % of cars on the road, in the USA are made in Japan. You think i am going to worry about a few paint brushes? This is paint talk, not political talk.
> 
> Where do you want to go next, vegan vs meat eaters? We shouldn't slaughter poor animals for our own gluttony?


And for that very reason, I won't get into details. Although trade policy certainly effects all business.

My original comment stands....no further comment on my part is needed or will be made.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Always wonder how the painters who buy their products out of country, or even just online, feel when they see a company from a town a fair distance away (or out of state) doing a job in their own town - a job they might have liked to do themselves.


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

RH said:


> Always wonder how the painters who buy their products out of country, or even just online, feel when they see a company from a town a fair distance away (or out of state) doing a job in their own town - a job they might have liked to do themselves.


Strange comparison. Who buys stuff out of the country? I buy at target, walmart, kolhs. I buy Chinese made right at my local stores. And so do you. What make and model is your TV and clothing? American made? I don't think so. Made in Taiwan, China etc.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

keep buying from china and some day (very soon) you'll be painting for $5 an hour. Sound good?


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

RH said:


> Always wonder how the painters who buy their products out of country, or even just online, feel when they see a company from a town a fair distance away (or out of state) doing a job in their own town - a job they might have liked to do themselves.


I share the same sentiment. It's sad over the years so many Americans have developed the attitude that I'm buying solely on price, when usually the price difference is minimal and the American made product is of better quality. In reality making it a better value. And before you know it everything is coming from China and manufacturing suffers, which means less jobs for Americans.

Still some great American products out there if your willing to look for them, but it has gotten to the point many times there is no alternative...gotta buy China. To think we have grown so dependant on a country with whom we have a contentious trade relationship, let alone political relationship, is scary. To think the cause of being in this situation is due to the resistance of the US consumer to stick to a buy American first policy is reprehensible.

Makes me want to puke!


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

When we run into real problems with China, and sooner or later we will, it will be much more than paint brushes that are in short supply. Maybe then more Americans will realize what a mistake it has been to allow China to take over American manufacturing.


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## kmp (Jan 30, 2011)

We allowed China to make all our stuff because we want the cheapest everything. Everybody gives lip service to buy american but nobody really cares or walmart would be out of business.How many people on this forum rave about the cheap stuff they got at harbor freight. One opened here a couple months ago and I will never go in there because of the cheap crap they sell. Stuff you want is not made here and even if it was people wouldn't buy it because it is too expensive. Everybody wants to make more money and have a fair wage but is not willing to make sure everybody else will.


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

kmp said:


> We allowed China to make all our stuff.


 My Nike sneakers are made in Indonesia. Every winter coat i have is made over seas. Honduras, China, Korea, Pakistan etc. Even my Sherwin Williams and BM shirts are made over seas.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Well of course many things are made elsewhere and with some products you literally can’t find an item made here. But with respect to brushes, when good quality ones _are_ made in the USA, yet people still opt for cheaper foreign made ones, well, eventually that’s all we will be able to get - just like it is with most electronics.


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## Redux (Oct 27, 2018)

I suppose the patriotic thing to do would be to give up my China hog bristle brushes and go shave a wild boar..


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

New Balance still makes some of it's sneakers in the US. Redwing and stitched sole Danner boots, made in USA. Duluth Trading Co. clothing, USA. You can google made in USA clothing and find a lot of made in USA clothing. My wardrobe is at least 75% made in USA...because I make an effort to ensure it is.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> My Nike sneakers are made in Indonesia. Every winter coat i have is made over seas. Honduras, China, Korea, Pakistan etc. Even my Sherwin Williams and BM shirts are made over seas.


You could buy New Balance if looking to support American manufacturing ...they offer models assembled or made in the US.

In many cases you are buying imports because you choose to....not because you have to.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

Alchemy Redux said:


> I suppose the patriotic thing to do would be to give up my China hog bristle brushes and go shave a wild boar..


There's your retirement project...start up a brush factory making brushes using American hogs!:biggrin:

American bristle for American painters!


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> There's your retirement project...start up a brush factory making brushes using American hogs!:biggrin:
> 
> American bristle for American painters!





As I understand that's actually how chinex came about when there was a shortage of quality hog hair to make china bristle brushes.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> You could buy New Balance if looking to support American manufacturing ...they offer models assembled or made in the US.
> 
> In many cases you are buying imports because you choose to....not because you have to.



Just one list:
https://www.finder.com/made-in-usa-shoes


My run/hiking boots are keen. I have redwing when i need work boots.


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> You could buy New Balance if looking to support American manufacturing ...they offer models assembled or made in the US.
> 
> *In many cases you are buying imports because you choose to....not because you have to.*


No, not really. I just bought 2 biker jackets and 2 vests from https://www.leatherup.com. By complete surprise, when they arrived, I found out they were made from Pakistan. And they are made well. 

I also have 5 winter coats, not one made in the US but all sold by US companies. 

What about your television? Samsung, Toshiba, Sony, Hitatchi, Panasonic?
What do you have? And do you realize, even if it's made in the US, the parts may have been made in Japan.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> No, not really. I just bought 2 biker jackets and 2 vests from https://www.leatherup.com. By complete surprise, when they arrived, I found out they were made from Pakistan. And they are made well.
> 
> I also have 5 winter coats, not one made in the US but all sold by US companies.
> 
> ...


Philco Predicta...she's a beaut too, and made right here in USA, Philadelphia,PA. All American parts ,too. Great television, that Predicta.

Plenty of American companies selling made in USA winter coats and jackets....Carhartt, All American, Crescent Down Works, Freeride...just to name a few.

Leather....Reed leather and Fox Creek to name just two. Many fine leather goods made in USA. As for the jackets in the link you posted, you shouldn't have been surprised the jackets were imported. The prices are too low to expect much. Good luck with the leathers....

One of my favorite places to shop in WY, Casper's own Lou Taubert's, has plenty of fine American made duds.

Now, as you must know, because it's been stated several times in this thread, with some items, the consumer has little choice but to buy imports...i.e. electronics. 

But with many consumer items, the American made option is still a viable option. If you don't buy American, it is by choice or ignorance.

Ignorance is bliss...and it's also a poor choice.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

HC-Raad said:


> No, not really. I just bought 2 biker jackets and 2 vests from https://www.leatherup.com. By complete surprise, when they arrived, I found out they were made from Pakistan. And they are made well.
> 
> I also have 5 winter coats, not one made in the US but all sold by US companies.
> 
> ...



Yes we get it you shop at walmart and buy nike (rather famous brand for using child slave labor btw). Some electronics are still made in USA. Like my tritech pump 100% made in USA including the electronics. Fact is if you can be half arsed to buy American its rather easy most of the time.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> And do you realize, even if it's made in the US, the parts may have been made in Japan.


And do you realize Japan and China are two totally different countries. We have a much more stable political and trade relationship with Japan.:glasses:


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Lightningboy65 said:


> And do you realize Japan and China are two totally different countries. We have a much more stable political and trade relationship with Japan.:glasses:


When I was a kid (50s-60s) it was a term of derision to say something was made in Japan. Now, if something is made there, it’s generally considered to be high quality. China, not so much.


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## kmp (Jan 30, 2011)

I did buy a new pair of skis this year, so did my wife that were made about 70 miles from where I live. Lots of carhartt stuff is made in china.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

kmp said:


> I did buy a new pair of skis this year, so did my wife that were made about 70 miles from where I live. Lots of carhartt stuff is made in china.


True, but a lot of Carhartt is still made in USA. I'd rather see 100% American made , but sometimes ya' gotta' take what ya' can get. I just be sure to check the tag and only buy if printed "Made in USA".


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

Lightningboy65 said:


> You could buy New Balance if looking to support American manufacturing ...they offer models assembled or made in the US.
> 
> In many cases you are buying imports because you choose to....not because you have to.


What exactly does assembled in the USA mean, that they put the item in a box?


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## Delta Painting (Apr 27, 2010)

All this talk of buying goods off Amazon not one person mentions the fact they pay 0 taxes. This for me is a problem I have to pay my fair share so why not one of the richest people in the world?


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## Holland (Feb 18, 2011)

When you compare an American Painter next to a Canadian Painter, the quality difference is noticeable almost immediately. The American is taller and stronger, and much better looking. Granted the Canadians are nicer, but overall they lack a sense of humor.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

Brushman4 said:


> What exactly does assembled in the USA mean, that they put the item in a box?


The sewing and gluing is done in the US...which is a lot more that can be said for most sneakers.:biggrin:


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

Delta Painting said:


> All this talk of buying goods off Amazon not one person mentions the fact they pay 0 taxes. This for me is a problem I have to pay my fair share so why not one of the richest people in the world?


Well, I'm not a big fan of Amazon, though I do occasionally buy there. 


If Amazon is not paying any income taxes, its because the US tax code allows it. The government needs to fix that...not Amazon's fault.

Amazon definitely had good cause to not pay income tax until 2016....they made no profit until then.


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## Holland (Feb 18, 2011)

Delta Painting said:


> All this talk of buying goods off Amazon not one person mentions the fact they pay 0 taxes. This for me is a problem I have to pay my fair share so why not one of the richest people in the world?


This thread became political very quickly, and indirectly chided the OP for not buying American. 
Amazon payed over 1Billion in income taxes and also paid employee taxes, but did not pay federal taxes.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

I don't see where trying to persuade people to buy American products is a bad thing. From the OPs comments he wasn't aware the brushes were made in China. Understandable, as the company goes to lengths to hide the fact. Country of origin may or may not matter to OP, but to some it certainly does. And through discussions such as this, that information can be disbursed to members of PT. Again, some members of PT couldn't care less. Some members will appreciate the information and use it in making future purchasing decisions.

While political discussion in general may not pertain to painting and running a business, some aspects of politics do. Trade policy is one of those aspects of politics that impacts all business, and as such seems to me fair game as fodder for discussion on this site.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Broad discussions about trade and countries of origin for goods is not necessarily political, at least IMO. But when political parties, the names of specific politicians, or government policies, enter into it, then it has crossed over the line and it will get moved to The Outhouse sub-forum.

Political talk is like p-o-r-n, hard to define but you know it when you see it.


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> HC-Raad said:
> 
> 
> > And do you realize, even if it's made in the US, the parts may have been made in Japan.
> ...


Where did i say china and japan are the same County? We are talking buying made in the US - correct? It case you didn't realize it, japan is not the US.


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## Holland (Feb 18, 2011)

I thought there painters from all over the world on Painttalk?


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> Where did i say china and japan are the same County? We are talking buying made in the US - correct? It case you didn't realize it, japan is not the US.


The initial talk of buying American manufactured goods in the thread started in relation to products made in China. You are the one who brought other countries into the conversation. Just being certain you understand there is a huge difference between China and other countries whom the United States trades with. 

The list of underhanded trade practices includes intellectual property theft and forced transfer of US technology, Chinese government subsidizing China steel in order to "dump" it in the US at prices below cost.....the list goes on and on.

More than any other US trade partner, by far, China is ripping off the US.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

HC-Raad said:


> Where did i say china and japan are the same County? We are talking buying made in the US - correct? It case you didn't realize it, japan is not the US.





Holland said:


> I thought there painters from all over the world on Painttalk?



Its really simple concept. Doesn't matter if you are in USA, Canada, Mexico, UK etc... Buy *local *when possible and not the cheapest Chinese option you can find on amazon. And yes Zachary brush are a Chinese manufactured product even though they masquerade as Canadian.


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> HC-Raad said:
> 
> 
> > Where did i say china and japan are the same County? We are talking buying made in the US - correct? It case you didn't realize it, japan is not the US.
> ...


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

HC-Raad said:


> I buy local 24/7. Problem is, everything in the local shops are made overseas.



Can you really blame them when you are buying Chinese brushes off amazon?


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> HC-Raad said:
> 
> 
> > Where did i say china and japan are the same County? We are talking buying made in the US - correct? It case you didn't realize it, japan is not the US.
> ...


I broaded the conversation to included any product made in various country's. Not made in usa. You have plenty of clothing in your closet not made in the us. Practice what you preach. I could careless if its made in china, korea, Taiwan etc. It's not made in the usa. That's the point.


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## Holland (Feb 18, 2011)

I imagine @micdalg didn't know he would be held responsible for international trade wars when he started this thread.


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## Holland (Feb 18, 2011)

duplicate post


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> HC-Raad said:
> 
> 
> > I buy local 24/7. Problem is, everything in the local shops are made overseas.
> ...


I never bought paint brush 1 off of Amazon. I buy my made in china brushes from Ben Moore.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> You have plenty of clothing in your closet not made in the us.


I don't.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> Who cares where they are made. The man said he loves these brushes. I may order some on Amazon. Thanks for
> The tip cocomonkeyman!


Huh...so which is it? Do you buy your brushes on Amazon or at your local BM dealer????


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

HC-Raad said:


> I never bought paint brush 1 off of Amazon. I buy my made in china brushes from Ben Moore.



The discussion is ordering zachary brush and other chinese made goods off amazon...



Since we are on the topic, why buy made in china in the first place? Makes no sense unless your getting the $3 Lpro special with the intent to just throw it away. I'm sure your BM dealer has made in USA brushes...


I even buy the made in USA $0.50 foam brushes, vastly superior to the made in china garbage I used to get. Cost me 2 extra pennies and I sell way more of them.


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## Holland (Feb 18, 2011)

Irony: 

Getting on a soap box regarding Brushes made in China, while disregarding all the other supplies sold in local paint store that are made in China.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Holland said:


> Irony:
> 
> Getting on a soap box regarding Brushes made in China, while disregarding all the other supplies sold in local paint store that are made in China.



I would say something like 95% of goods in my store are made in USA with the notable exception being Hyde tools that have moved manufacturing to China recently, perhaps they will move back after steel tariffs make that unprofitable. I should probably switch back to warner tools...


The only irony is that people continue to buy chinese goods while complaining about american companies hiring foreigners and moving jobs overseas.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

Holland said:


> Irony:
> 
> Getting on a soap box regarding Brushes made in China, while disregarding all the other supplies sold in local paint store that are made in China.


x2 Irony:

England is noted for making the finest china in the world.

Most Japan drier isn't made in Japan.

:surprise::surprise::surprise:


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## Holland (Feb 18, 2011)

Lightningboy65 said:


> x2 Irony:
> 
> England is noted for making the finest china in the world.
> 
> ...



Maybe irony is not the best word choice, but I hate to use the word hypocrisy.


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> HC-Raad said:
> 
> 
> > Who cares where they are made. The man said he loves these brushes. I may order some on Amazon. Thanks for
> ...


I never said i bought brush 1 on Amazon. You are using your imagination. Champ!


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

Holland said:


> Maybe irony is not the best word choice, but I hate to use the word hypocrisy.


Hypocrisy is an ugly word. And try as I might, I never could understand the pedantic explanations in regard to the exact definition of irony.:wink:


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

Just ignore direct quotes of things you say...it makes it all go away. smh
:vs_lol:


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> HC-Raad said:
> 
> 
> > You have plenty of clothing in your closet not made in the us.
> ...


 go look at your tee shirts, underwear, socks. Than talk to me.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> go look at your tee shirts, underwear, socks. Than talk to me.


American made...quite easy to procure , just Google "Made in the USA" followed by type of garment you wish to purchase.

I just can't imagine one as intelligent as yourself has such a difficult time comprehending buying American made garments of all types is not a difficult task.:surprise:


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

In all the years I have been active on PT, especially as a moderator, I don’t think I can ever recall one person’s point of view being changed by another member whose perspective is different. But...


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

RH said:


> In all the years I have been active on PT, especially as a moderator, I don’t think I can ever recall one person’s point of view being changed by another member whose perspective is different. But...


I agree, RH. buy American, if possible. Problem is, a large degree of what is available in us stores is made overseas. Are your home appliances made in the US? Toaster, microwave, can opener, washer & dryer? My guess is, made overseas. What about Festool? Made in Germany!


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

HC-Raad said:


> I agree, RH. buy American, if possible. Problem is, a large degree of what is available in us stores is made overseas. Are your home appliances made in the US? Toaster, microwave, can opener, washer & dryer? My guess is, made overseas. What about Festool? Made in Germany!



There is a huge difference between buying quality german made festool and the chinese made 'worx' from amazon. That's the entire point of this thread...


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> HC-Raad said:
> 
> 
> > I agree, RH. buy American, if possible. Problem is, a large degree of what is available in us stores is made overseas. Are your home appliances made in the US? Toaster, microwave, can opener, washer & dryer? My guess is, made overseas. What about Festool? Made in Germany!
> ...


No, this thread is about how great Zacgary brushes are. Not Amazon or made in china. You threw china into the mix. And again, i never bought any brushes on Amazon or online. I buy all my brushes at BM. Btw - my Picasso brushes are sold at BM. Guess what - made in china. I like them better than Purdy and Wooster.


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

HC-Raad said:


> cocomonkeynuts said:
> 
> 
> > micdalg said:
> ...


Lightning, here is the quote, i may buy. Not i do buy. RH, you're a teacher, please explain the difference between may buy and i do buy. SMH - My head is ready to explode.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> I agree, RH. buy American, if possible. Problem is, a large degree of what is available in us stores is made overseas. Are your home appliances made in the US? Toaster, microwave, can opener, washer & dryer? My guess is, made overseas. What about Festool? Made in Germany!


Still a lot of major home appliances made in America...it's a shame your not aware. GE, Maytag, KitchenAid, Sub Zero, Whirlpool,Frigidaire, Amana, Jenn-Air...these companies and others still manufacture many of their models in the USA.

Easy enough to buy US appliances...verify before you buy. Made in the USA.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

HC-Raad said:


> *No, this thread is about how great Zacgary brushes are. Not Amazon or made in china.* *You threw china into the mix.* And again, i never bought any brushes on Amazon or online. I buy all my brushes at BM. Btw - my Picasso brushes are sold at BM. Guess what - made in china. I like them better than Purdy and Wooster.



Actually @micdalg threw china 'into the mix' by asking why the company is entirely out of stock of a chinese made item, which happens to be their entire product line.


Who was the first person to mention amazon?




HC-Raad said:


> ... I may order some on Amazon...





BTW Yes Picasso is made in china, that's why I chose long ago not to stock them, that and the bristle they use doesn't last 1/2 as long as wooster ultra.



Instead I stock made in USA (New Jersey) E&J products instead.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> Lightning, here is the quote, i may buy. Not i do buy. RH, you're a teacher, please explain the difference between may buy and i do buy. SMH - My head is ready to explode.


I was waiting for that...you're slipping. I thought that would be your first response. 

It really is an issue of semantics...but it would be odd for one not accustomed to buying on Amazon to state they "may go on Amazon and order an item". Any _rational_ person would assume the person making the statement makes it a habit to use the platform. 

But I've noticed rational thinking scarce in these parts lately.


----------



## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

HC-Raad said:


> Lightning, here is the quote, i may buy. Not i do buy. RH, you're a teacher, please explain the difference between may buy and i do buy. SMH - My head is ready to explode.


I’m a _retired_ teacher. These days I try not to correct anyone’s grammar or semantic errors.

I can remember when Picasso’s started being heralded here. Some thought they were going to revolutionize the industry. Not long after, the stories about mass bristle failures and the hoop-la died off. Not saying that is still an issue but have to say I’ve never ever had that problem with Wooster, Corona, or Purdy.


----------



## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> HC-Raad said:
> 
> 
> > Who cares where they are made. The man said he loves these brushes. I may order some on Amazon. Thanks for
> ...


Let me straighten out your assumptions. 
The OP said he can't find Zachary brushes and stated how great they are. I never tried them. So i did a Google search for "Zachary brushes" and i found they are sold on Amazon. So again, since i found them quickly on Amazon, "i may buy" a few to see for myself. Never said i purchased a brush on Amazon, you little devil's.

BTW - the last brush i bought was at a BM pro show. I bought a few cases of different brands. And was given some for free.

Hopefully some of you chaps understand now.


----------



## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

RH said:


> I’m a _retired_ teacher. These days I try not to correct anyone’s grammar or semantic errors.
> 
> I can remember when Picasso’s started being heralded here. Some thought they were going to revolutionize the industry. Not long after, the stories about mass bristle failures and the hoop-la died off. Not saying that is still an issue but have to say I’ve never ever had that problem with Wooster, Corona, or Purdy.


I've used Wooster, Corona, and Purdy for years. Hands down, Picasso's cut a straighter ceiling line. 

You are right, they don't last as long as Wooster, Corona, or Purdy (but they do a better job). They are made with beavers tail. 

If I was working on a job with you and you asked me to cut a ceiling line, and then you hand me a Wooster, Corona, or Purdy and not a Picasso, I would be disappointed. Not kidding. I absolutely prefer a Picasso over any brush I have ever tried. If they last a month, I toss it and buy a new. Sold at BM (made in China).


----------



## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

It appears that Zachery Brushes are made in Canada, not China. Someone on PT goofed, big time! :wink:

https://www.zacharybrushesusa.com/story 
ZACHARY BRUSHES has been serving the painting industry in CANADA since year 2000. We are proud that our brand has earned the respect and trust of professional painters, decorators and builders. Our extensive product range, while serving the needs of the professional market, also provides the DIY consumer an excellent choice of quality product for their painting projects.
​
All ZACHARY products are made to the most precise standards. State of the art production methods combined with the finest raw materials ensures that we remain ahead of the market for both product design and quality.
​
Ultimately, serving the needs of our customers is at the core of our business goals, and to that end we will continue to be innovative in our product development, quality guarantees, and delivery services.


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> It appears that Zachery Brushes are made in Canada, not China. Someone on PT goofed, big time! :wink:
> 
> https://www.zacharybrushesusa.com/story
> ZACHARY BRUSHES has been serving the painting industry in CANADA since year 2000. We are proud that our brand has earned the respect and trust of professional painters, decorators and builders. Our extensive product range, while serving the needs of the professional market, also provides the DIY consumer an excellent choice of quality product for their painting projects.
> ...


Nowhere in that statement does it say the brushes are manufactured in Canada....they are a Canadian based (Chinese owned?) company that sells brushes made in China...and go to great lengths to misrepresent that fact. As proudly advertised on the brush keeper, the brushes are "hand trimmed" in Canada.

If you read back in the thread, these issues have already been addressed.

I imagine Coco will be chiming in. He knows more about the company than I.


----------



## Wolfgang (Nov 16, 2008)

Lol. Two pages of bickering.

Now, how about everyone check to see where their computer, pad, cell phone that they're using to post is made.


----------



## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

HC-Raad said:


> Someone on PT goofed, big time!


Yeah it's the 'YouTube buissnessman' who goofed, I posted an article/interview with the owner in post #6
https://issuu.com/richmond-news/docs/profiles0fexcellence_richmond_web/15

You think I got a call from a nice french Canadian when I reached out to them looking to buy? Nope!

Unlike Canadian companies like Nour who manufacturer quality products in Canada and pay their workers livable wages, Zachary brush are a Canadian company, originally from Hong Kong, that outsources most of the materials and manufacturing to China then imports them, does a final QA 'trim' and puts the nice 'Proudly Canadian' logo on them and plasters it all over their website. It's intentionally deceptive.

Geopolitics the way the are in China & Hong Kong I'm not surprised to see any made in China products 'out of stock'.

Let me add: if these brushes were actually produced in Canada I would have a second look at having them in my store, they can't because then they wouldn't be able to undercut pricing of American/Canadian produced products by 1/2.


----------



## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Wolfgang said:


> Lol. Two pages of bickering.
> 
> Now, how about everyone check to see where their computer, pad, cell phone that they're using to post is made.
> 
> View attachment 105577


Hopefully that will change in the next 10 years with robotic manufacturering making made in USA electronics more competitive than government subsidized Chinese labor.


----------



## Redux (Oct 27, 2018)

Although I’ve always made a conscientious effort to purchase domestically manufactured goods when it came to trade related tools, equipment, and finishes, I’ve always purchased the best for my intended use regardless of where they were manufactured. Many of my finishes, raw materials, and heavy machinery/tooling originated from the EU, as well as a few sundries including brushes originating from China. The OP’s claim that the Zachary brushes are the best brushes he/she used in 24 years for his/her intended applications could very well hold true. Members offering criticism about a Chinese manufactured brush brand such as Zachary being inferior without having tried them, probably shouldn’t be so quick to criticize.

I’ve always used finish specific brushes, three brands being produced in China which I’ve often purchased in bulk quantities, the brushes producing better results than any domestically manufactured and/or assembled brushes for the intended applications. I never took price into consideration when purchasing sundries such as brushes. Purchasing decisions were always based on which brush would produce the best finished product, also taking into account productivity, some of the North American manufactured brushes falling short for the intended applications, others not. 

Sometimes I’d run a bill of lading search for imported raw materials and/or finished goods, particularly with lumber, in order to determine where the raw materials originated from and who was using them. Bills of lading pertaining to Zachary Imports Inc show shipments originating from Ningbo Universal Tools Co in China to the port of Seattle, the China based company appearing to manufacture brushes and adhesive tape products.


----------



## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Alchemy Redux said:


> Although I’ve always made a conscientious effort to purchase domestically manufactured goods when it came to trade related tools, equipment, and finishes, I’ve always purchased the best for my intended use regardless of where they were manufactured. Many of my finishes, raw materials, and heavy machinery/tooling originated from the EU, as well as a few sundries including brushes originating from China. The OP’s claim that the Zachary brushes are the best brushes he/she used in 24 years for his/her intended applications could very well hold true. Members offering criticism about a Chinese manufactured brush brand such as Zachary being inferior without having tried them, probably shouldn’t be so quick to criticize.
> 
> I’ve always used finish specific brushes, three brands being produced in China which I’ve often purchased in bulk quantities, the brushes producing better results than any domestically manufactured and/or assembled brushes for the intended applications. I never took price into consideration when purchasing sundries such as brushes. Purchasing decisions were always based on which brush would produce the best finished product, also taking into account productivity, some of the North American manufactured brushes falling short for the intended applications, others not.
> 
> Sometimes I’d run a bill of lading search for imported raw materials and/or finished goods, particularly with lumber, in order to determine where the raw materials originated from and who was using them. Bills of lading pertaining to Zachary Imports Inc show shipments originating from Ningbo Universal Tools Co in China to the port of Seattle, the China based company appearing to manufacture brushes and adhesive tape products.


Thanks for your post. You have my respect!


----------



## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Alchemy Redux said:


> Although I’ve always made a conscientious effort to purchase domestically manufactured goods when it came to trade related tools, equipment, and finishes, I’ve always purchased the best for my intended use regardless of where they were manufactured. Many of my finishes, raw materials, and heavy machinery/tooling originated from the EU, as well as a few sundries including brushes originating from China. The OP’s claim that the Zachary brushes are the best brushes he/she used in 24 years for his/her intended applications could very well hold true. *Members offering criticism about a Chinese manufactured brush brand such as Zachary being inferior without having tried them, probably shouldn’t be so quick to criticize.*
> 
> I’ve always used finish specific brushes, three brands being produced in China which I’ve often purchased in bulk quantities, the brushes producing better results than any domestically manufactured and/or assembled brushes for the intended applications. I never took price into consideration when purchasing sundries such as brushes. Purchasing decisions were always based on which brush would produce the best finished product, also taking into account productivity, some of the North American manufactured brushes falling short for the intended applications, others not.
> 
> Sometimes I’d run a bill of lading search for imported raw materials and/or finished goods, particularly with lumber, in order to determine where the raw materials originated from and who was using them. Bills of lading pertaining to Zachary Imports Inc show shipments originating from Ningbo Universal Tools Co in China to the port of Seattle, the China based company appearing to manufacture brushes and adhesive tape products.



I don't believe anyone claimed anything about zachary brush quality, other than op, just that they are made in china contrary to the company deceptively marketing them as a Canadian product. I'm sure they're a good quality brush and if they were actually manufactured in Canada for 1/2 the cost of domestically produced products I would consider looking at them.:vs_coffee:


----------



## Redux (Oct 27, 2018)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> I don't believe anyone claimed anything about zachary brush quality, other than op, just that they are made in china contrary to the company deceptively marketing them as a Canadian product. I'm sure they're a good quality brush and if they were actually manufactured in Canada for 1/2 the cost of domestically produced products I would consider looking at them.:vs_coffee:


Being on the topic, I wonder what SamaN’s affiliation is with the following Chinese company?
I also wonder if there’s deceptive marketing with them as well? (and don’t get me wrong, I always make an effort to purchase made in the USA.)

http://www.canlak.cn/en/about-us/


----------



## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> Alchemy Redux said:
> 
> 
> > Although I’ve always made a conscientious effort to purchase domestically manufactured goods when it came to trade related tools, equipment, and finishes, I’ve always purchased the best for my intended use regardless of where they were manufactured. Many of my finishes, raw materials, and heavy machinery/tooling originated from the EU, as well as a few sundries including brushes originating from China. The OP’s claim that the Zachary brushes are the best brushes he/she used in 24 years for his/her intended applications could very well hold true. *Members offering criticism about a Chinese manufactured brush brand such as Zachary being inferior without having tried them, probably shouldn’t be so quick to criticize.*
> ...


I love it when people make claims. 
Do us all a favor, back your claims with PROOF! Let us be the judge!


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> I love it when people make claims.
> Do us all a favor, back your claims with PROOF! Let us be the judge!


What are we proving? 

Nobody in the thread questioned the quality of Zachary brushes.

The article posted by Coco in post #6 and Alchemy's invoices pretty much prove the brushes are sourced from China.

Just what point needs to be proved?

Asking for a friend.


----------



## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> HC-Raad said:
> 
> 
> > I love it when people make claims.
> ...


Post the link and i will be the judge. We already know you listen to journalists. Show me proof of claims. Not some 3rd parties opinion.


----------



## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

HC-Raad said:


> I love it when people make claims.
> Do us all a favor, back your claims with PROOF! Let us be the judge!



https://www.painttalk.com/f2/zachary-brushes-where-did-they-go-95291/#post1672251


I posted the link twice already. Its an interview with the owner.




There is nothing to prove. Brushes are sourced and assembled in China then shipped to canada for QA and resell.


If I wanted to buy chinese brushes I would get them for $0.50 /1000 off alibaba.


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> Post the link and i will be the judge. We already know you listen to journalists. Show me proof of claims. Not some 3rd parties opinion.


I think most on PT would accept the article posted by Coco in post #6 and the information Alchemy was able to glean from his bills of lading as proof enough. Two respected members of PT. I know that's proof enough for me.

Any further proof would be difficult for me to obtain, as the company goes to great lengths to hide the fact they manufacture in China. 

Piaget studied and layed out four stages of cognitive development. He theorized many never made it past the third stage, concrete operations. Not to worry, while not able to utilize deductive reasoning, a person can function just fine at the concrete operational level.

Edit: I might point out, Alchemy's bill of lading is a first hand account. He is the actual holder of the information. It is not third party information.


----------



## Redux (Oct 27, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> Post the link and i will be the judge. We already know you listen to journalists. Show me proof of claims. Not some 3rd parties opinion.


Below is the link. 

https://www.importgenius.com/importers/zachary-import-inc


----------



## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Wolfgang said:


> Lol. Two pages of bickering.
> 
> Now, how about everyone check to see where their computer, pad, cell phone that they're using to post is made.
> 
> View attachment 105577


And what these proud American, purists allude from is the fact that they use oil everyday in their cars and homes.

And where does oil come from? Oh no, he didn't go there!! The hypocrisy is making me chuckle. Ha


----------



## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Alchemy Redux said:


> Below is the link.
> 
> https://www.importgenius.com/importers/zachary-import-inc



You can get more detailed bill of lading info, if you are willing to pay for it ~$200/month. Or file FOIA requests. Not worth the trouble for something the owner freely admits.


Don't know anything about Canlak other than their main office and labs are in Quebec.


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> And what these proud American, purists allude from is the fact that they use oil everyday in their cars and homes.
> 
> And where does oil come from? Oh no, he didn't go there!! The hypocrisy is making me chuckle. Ha


The United States imports less than 20% of its petroleum. Over 80% of the US demand is met through domestic production. Fracking has changed everything. We haven't been dependant on foreign oil to meet most our energy demands for quite some time .

Wyoming is a big oil producer, #8 in the country.


----------



## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Alchemy Redux said:


> HC-Raad said:
> 
> 
> > Post the link and i will be the judge. We already know you listen to journalists. Show me proof of claims. Not some 3rd parties opinion.
> ...


I need additional evidence. This is a vague claim. And i need to assess the credibility of the source.


----------



## Redux (Oct 27, 2018)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> You can get more detailed bill of lading info, if you are willing to pay for it ~$200/month. Or file FOIA requests. Not worth the trouble for something the owner freely admits.
> 
> 
> Don't know anything about Canlak other than their main office and labs are in Quebec.


I had an account a while ago when sourcing exotic hardwoods. It was helpful when trying to locate and procure hard to find raw materials which I’d otherwise be SOL after exhausting all means without having to go through the importation process myself.


----------



## Redux (Oct 27, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> I need additional evidence. This is a vague claim. And i need to assess the credibility of the source.


It’s a credible source. A full report requires a membership fee. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Import_Genius


----------



## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

I bought a bushel of 'Merican made boxer briefs once that were extremely comfortable, but they split at the rear and made me sad. I changed to Jockey and they're holding up well even though they're made in Cambodia, or somewhere other the Merica, I think.


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

CApainter said:


> I bought a bushel of 'Merican made boxer briefs once that were extremely comfortable, but they split at the rear and made me sad. I changed to Jockey and they're holding up well even though they're made in Cambodia, or somewhere other the Merica, I think.


Huh, I pay extra to get the ones that are pre-split in the rear. Made right here in PA.:euro:


----------



## Wolfgang (Nov 16, 2008)

Well, this thread has run out of bristle.

Word of advice if I may: Use the tools/equipment that work best for you:wink:


----------



## Wolfgang (Nov 16, 2008)

I have yet to see a brush thread that didn't go all over the place.

Painted for a lot of years. Dipping and loading the brush a couple more times for a cut didn't make or break me. Arms only reached so far anyway.


----------



## Holland (Feb 18, 2011)

Is this thread still going??

It appears to be dying a slow, agonizing death.


----------



## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Holland said:


> Is this thread still going??
> 
> It appears to be dying a slow, agonizing death.



It only took 6 pages this time too


----------



## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Buy Merican people.


----------



## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Alchemy Redux said:


> It’s a credible source. A full report requires a membership fee.
> 
> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Import_Genius


That's cool, Wikipedia. Even cooler - here's a link to *create you own Wikipedia page*. :vs_smirk: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:CreateAccount&returnto=Main+Page

And here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_creation :vs_whistle:


----------



## A+HomeWork (Dec 10, 2010)

Lightningboy65 said:


> x2 Irony:
> 
> England is noted for making the finest china in the world.
> 
> ...


Dang it! Got me wondering about English muffins, Canadian bacon, French fries...
Maybe that's why those muffins are so hard.

The OP will hold the record for the longest thread with the fewest ever posts.
Not even Ole 34 can match that.


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> That's cool, Wikipedia. Even cooler - here's a link to *create you own Wikipedia page*. :vs_smirk: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:CreateAccount&returnto=Main+Page
> 
> And here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_creation :vs_whistle:


Go to the article in post #6 that you either refuse to read or are unable to extract the pertinent information. Read everything within , it states in black and white, the brushes are manufactured in China. If you don't get that fact the first time you read it, read it until you come to the conclusion the brushes are made in China. At that point you will have comprehended what you have read.

That may be difficult for someone who thinks the US is dependant on foreign oil and that America no longer makes washing machines and refrigerators, but I have confidence in you. Just keep reading that article until the notion the brushes are made in China pops into your head. You can do it!!

It's an interview with the company owner...I don't know how much more proof you need.


----------



## Redux (Oct 27, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> That's cool, Wikipedia. Even cooler - here's a link to *create you own Wikipedia page*. :vs_smirk: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:CreateAccount&returnto=Main+Page
> 
> And here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_creation :vs_whistle:


I’ve used both Panjiva & Import Genius as well as listthe.com. Below is an article substantiating the credibility of IG.

https://www.thebalancesmb.com/the-top-three-global-business-intelligence-companies-1953544


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

This thread has long since played out...it's become a lesson on reading comprehension. Our public school system has failed.


----------



## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Lightningboy65 said:


> Go to the article in post #6 that you either refuse to read or are unable to extract the pertinent information. Read everything within , it states in black and white, the brushes are manufactured in China. If you don't get that fact the first time you read it, read it until you come to the conclusion the brushes are made in China. At that point you will have comprehended what you have read.
> 
> That may be difficult for someone who thinks the US is dependant on foreign oil and that America no longer makes washing machines and refrigerators, but I have confidence in you. Just keep reading that article until the notion the brushes are made in China pops into your head. You can do it!!
> 
> It's an interview with the company owner...I don't know how much more proof you need.


I believe it even says it twice.


----------



## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Alchemy Redux said:


> I’ve used both Panjiva & Import Genius as well as listthe.com. Below is an article substantiating the credibility of IG.
> 
> https://www.thebalancesmb.com/the-top-three-global-business-intelligence-companies-1953544



I'm afraid your going need to provide proof thebalacesmb is a legitimate source as well.:vs_coffee:


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> I'm afraid your going need to provide proof thebalacesmb is a legitimate source as well.:vs_coffee:


I've heard through a reliable source Paint Talk has been contacted for a Certificate of Legitimacy from one of its members???:biggrin:


----------



## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Lightningboy65 said:


> I've heard through a reliable source Paint Talk has been contacted for a Certificate of Legitimacy from one of its members???:biggrin:


Not sure about that - but I know for a fact each of it’s mods have been referred to as “illegitimate” more than once. :sad:


----------



## Eagle Cap Painter (Nov 14, 2016)

Dude's trolling you guys hard. Dunno how his avatar didn't give it away.


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

Eagle Cap Painter said:


> Dude's trolling you guys hard. Dunno how his avatar didn't give it away.


That's ok by me...keeps things interessante. I'm retired, and the winter months can get boring. I don't for one minute believe that could be 100% real.

He sure could brush up on his facts a bit. Not all trolls can be knowledgeable , I guess.

I guess the Paul Teutul Sr avatar is a bit odd...I just assumed he was down with OCC. After all, he's into Pakistani leathers.

Paul Sr. sure looks different without his mustache. :euro:


----------



## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Eagle Cap Painter said:


> Dude's trolling you guys hard. Dunno how his avatar didn't give it away.


There is a less PC version of this meme but here's a good take on trolls


----------



## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> Eagle Cap Painter said:
> 
> 
> > Dude's trolling you guys hard. Dunno how his avatar didn't give it away.
> ...


It appears to be some bizzare Photoshop with Donald Trump's head..


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> It appears to be some bizzare Photoshop with Donald Trump's head..


I say it's Paul Sr. The President only has his right arm sleeved.


----------



## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

Chinese drywall
Chinese baby formula 
Chinese pet food

I try not buy products made in China, but it’s more difficult than many of you think.


----------



## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

fauxlynn said:


> Chinese drywall
> Chinese baby formula
> Chinese pet food
> 
> I try not buy products made in China, but it’s more difficult than many of you think.


What about Chinese Checkers, Chinese fire drills, and all the tea in China?


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

fauxlynn said:


> Chinese drywall
> Chinese baby formula
> Chinese pet food
> 
> I try not buy products made in China, but it’s more difficult than many of you think.


A quick Google search will usually offer an American made option for many items. Not too difficult. I do agree it can be hard at times to find those options locally. If you need the item immediately , the China made option may be the only practical choice.


----------



## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

Lightningboy65 said:


> A quick Google search will usually offer an American made option for many items. Not too difficult. I do agree it can be hard at times to find those options locally. If you need the item immediately , the China made option may be the only practical choice.



Yeah, I halfway disagree with this. When I ‘google’ something, it usually takes me to Amazon or Walmart. I contend that it’s not a sure thing that what you see there is accurate. 

I’m old school. I need to hold it in my hand before I buy it.

PS- as for OP, hey if that brush works for them, great! Who am I to judge?
Also, thank Satan I live in a country where I can buy stuff from wherever the f**k I want.


----------



## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

Brushman4 said:


> What about Chinese Checkers, Chinese fire drills, and all the tea in China?


My son in law does business in China, best tea I’ve ever had.


----------



## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

fauxlynn said:


> Yeah, I halfway disagree with this. When I ‘google’ something, it usually takes me to Amazon or Walmart. I contend that it’s not a sure thing that what you see there is accurate.
> 
> I’m old school. I need to hold it in my hand before I buy it.
> 
> ...



Just put "made in usa" in front of all your searches, then you get websites like this at the top of your results:
https://www.geappliances.com/ge/usa/


----------



## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

fauxlynn said:


> PS- as for OP, hey if that brush works for them, great! Who am I to judge?
> Also, thank Satan I live in a country where I can buy stuff from wherever the f**k I want.


I'm happy we, as Americans , have that right. Many in other countries, including China, do not have that right.


----------



## Fman (Aug 20, 2011)

FULL DISCLOSURE: I didn't even listen to the Chinese Democracy album. 

Not a real Guns n' Roses fan.


----------



## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Don’t know if any of you saw the ABC Made in America segment this past Thursday(?) about Holiday Tree Farms (Christmas tree plantation) which is located in Corvallis, OR - my home town. Think they reported that HTF will harvest and ship out 1 million trees this year.

John Schudel, the owner who spoke in the segment, is an old high school buddy of mine. We both graduated from Corvallis High School the same year as Mike Riley, the former head coach of Oregon State and Nebraska.


----------



## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

Lightningboy65 said:


> I'm happy we, as Americans , have that right. Many in other countries, including China, do not have that right.


Yeah, that’s what I said.


----------



## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

RH said:


> Don’t know if any of you saw the ABC Made in America segment this past Thursday(?) about Holiday Tree Farms (Christmas tree plantation) which is located in Corvallis, OR - my home town. Think they reported that HTF will harvest and ship out 1 million trees this year.
> 
> John Schudel, the owner who spoke in the segment, is an old high school buddy of mine. We both graduated from Corvallis High School the same year as Mike Riley, the former head coach of Oregon State and Nebraska.


Cool! On Good Morning America they said that Edison created the first Christmas tree light bulb in 1888, or something, and the production of Christmas trees went into mass production in 1903


----------



## Fman (Aug 20, 2011)

CApainter said:


> Cool! On Good Morning America they said that Edison created the first Christmas tree light bulb in 1888, or something, and the production of Christmas trees went into mass production in 1903


They grew the Christmas trees before 1903. They were just know as "trees" before then.:vs_cool:


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

People were relieved when Edison invented the electric tree bulb. It was expensive and time consuming decorating the tree with phonographs.... and if you didn't distribute the phonographs just right, the tree was constantly toppling over.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Lightningboy65 said:


> People were relieved when Edison invented the electric tree bulb. It was expensive and time consuming decorating the tree with phonographs.... and if you didn't distribute the phonographs just right, the tree was constantly toppling over.


I thought it was the candles that were the problem.

"Oh cannon baum, Oh cannon baum..
how lovely are your branch....YIPES! 
GET THE FIRE BUCKET!!


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

CApainter said:


> I thought it was the candles that were the problem.
> 
> "Oh cannon baum, Oh cannon baum..
> how lovely are your branch....YIPES!
> GET THE FIRE BUCKET!!


And here I always thought it was "Oh Cannonball":surprise:

Thanks for the useful post!!!


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> New Balance still makes some of it's sneakers in the US. Redwing and stitched sole Danner boots, made in USA. Duluth Trading Co. clothing, USA. You can google made in USA clothing and find a lot of made in USA clothing. My wardrobe is at least 75% made in USA...because I make an effort to ensure it is.


So we have to find the style and size clothing we like, then we have to look at the tag and see where it's made? Na, no thanks. I buy for style and convenience. I don't plan on driving all over town just to buy US goods while limiting my choices.


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## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

Just a quick FYI- a search on the Duluth Trading Co. website this morning supports my claim that Made in USA is difficult to find. Most of their items are imported. 

I did find a list of 41 or 42 made in USA clothing manufacturers. I’d only heard of two of them, New Balance and Pendleton. 

It really is harder than what was suggested here.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

fauxlynn said:


> Just a quick FYI- a search on the Duluth Trading Co. website this morning supports my claim that Made in USA is difficult to find. Most of their items are imported.
> 
> I did find a list of 41 or 42 made in USA clothing manufacturers. I’d only heard of two of them, New Balance and Pendleton.
> 
> It really is harder than what was suggested here.


I never claimed all of Duluth's clothes were made in the USA...I did say they sell some made in USA. Sadly Pendleton manufactures most stuff overseas now.

I never find it hard at all. Many of the made in the USA manufactures are smaller companies, so yeah, they may be names you never heard of. If brand names are what you're looking for, you may be disappointed. But I've never been disappointed by the quality or design. Top notch.

And keep in mind that most other countries are not the underhanded trading partner China is. If you can't find American, at least make a conscious effort to not buy China! IMHO, of course.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

HC-Raad said:


> So we have to find the style and size clothing we like, then we have to look at the tag and see where it's made? Na, no thanks. I buy for style and convenience. I don't plan on driving all over town just to buy US goods while limiting my choices.


I couldn't care less about what you do or do not plan on doing.


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## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

Lightningboy65 said:


> I never claimed all of Duluth's clothes were made in the USA...I did say they sell some made in USA. Sadly Pendleton manufactures most stuff overseas now.
> 
> I never find it hard at all. Many of the made in the USA manufactures are smaller companies, so yeah, they may be names you never heard of. If brand names are what you're looking for, you may be disappointed. But I've never been disappointed by the quality or design. Top notch.
> 
> And keep in mind that most other countries are not the underhanded trading partner China is. If you can't find American, at least make a conscious effort to not buy China! IMHO, of course.


Interesting that post 121 has been edited to delete part of your post. 
You did not say some Duluth items we’re made in USA. But alas, that part is gone. 
Anyway, you miss my point about brands I’ve never heard of. I’m not wealthy, so I cannot buy small label clothing items made in LA.

EDIT- Well, I feel stupid. I’m going to leave what I said even though it’s wrong. In post #24 you don’t say that just some of Duluth’s products are USA made. 

Also, after reading your response I checked out the Pendleton Wool website and you are correct. Although all the wool is US made, some of the clothing is not. However, I think this goes to show that it isn’t that easy to get definitive answers to this question. But you are entitled to your opinion.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

People it ain't rocket science here. Put " ____ Brands made in USA" in google search. Very easy.


At least half of my socks I own are from here, plus a few other made in USA brands including point6 and darntugh:
https://www.smartwool.com/blog/socks-made-in-the-usa.html
https://darntough.com/pages/made-in-usa


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## Vinyl 54X (Mar 12, 2019)

I had lot's of GMC's, Zenith TV's and many gallons of Budweiser and upon further review they are poor quality products. The gun industry is dead. But our military weapons are still state of the art. For what that's worth.


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## Redux (Oct 27, 2018)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> People it ain't rocket science here. Put " ____ Brands made in USA" in google search. Very easy.
> 
> 
> At least half of my socks I own are from here, plus a few other made in USA brands including point6 and darntugh:
> ...


I only buy People Socks and Darn Tough, both are made darn tough in the USA just like me.

There are however periodic incidences of deceptive marketing when made in the USA is sometimes made in China. I noticed it periodically when using the IG manifest data tool.


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## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> People it ain't rocket science here. Put " ____ Brands made in USA" in google search. Very easy.[/url]


I did. That’s how I got a list of companies that turned out to be inaccurate. 

In my opinion, the bottom line is some people put the effort of time and money into buying made in the US goods because it’s important to them. Others don’t. Neither is wrong. 

Having run a household and raising three kids and being the main purchasing agent for said household puts me in the position of knowing how to shop. It isn’t as easy as a google search.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

fauxlynn said:


> I did. That’s how I got a list of companies that turned out to be inaccurate.
> 
> In my opinion, the bottom line is some people put the effort of time and money into buying made in the US goods because it’s important to them. Others don’t. Neither is wrong.
> 
> Having run a household and raising three kids and being the main purchasing agent for said household puts me in the position of knowing how to shop. It isn’t as easy as a google search.



Trust me on this one buying quality socks is the best purchase you will ever make. Quality Merino wool in particular will far outlast cheap cotton socks among other features. More expensive but you end up buying less of them.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

fauxlynn said:


> Although all the wool is US made, some of the clothing is not. However, I think this goes to show that it isn’t that easy to get definitive answers to this question. But you are entitled to your opinion.


The wool is made in the US and sent to Central America to be made into clothing. Non wool items are made in China. I have quite a few older Pendleton shirts, made before they moved manufacturing out of country. 
The American made ones last forever...I can't attest to the imports.


Sorry to disappoint you by not having edited my post. I'm not trying to deceive anybody, just trying to get people thinking about where what they buy comes from. My post was a bit ambiguous, my intention was to convey some Duluth stuff is USA, not all. I said neither _all_ nor _some_. I can see how you misinterpreted.


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> The wool is made in the US and sent to Central America to be made into clothing. Non wool items are made in China. I have quite a few older Pendleton shirts, made before they moved manufacturing out of country.
> 
> Sorry to disappoint you by not having edited my post. I'm not trying to deceive anybody, just trying to get people thinking about where what they buy comes from. My post was a bit ambiguous, my intention was to convey some Duluth stuff is USA, not all. I said neither _all_ nor _some_. I can see how you misinterpreted.



All that is besides the point. Taiwan, Vietnam, Morocco, Malaysia, CA etc... 

Of course I prefer American when possible but I would be content with anything that isn't Chinese.


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## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> Trust me on this one buying quality socks is the best purchase you will ever make. Quality Merino wool in particular will far outlast cheap cotton socks among other features. More expensive but you end up buying less of them.


Yeah....been buying smart wool for years. 
Anyway, years ago my mother in law told me to buy the very best I could afford. Less replacing over time. It’s why I have real linoleum in my home and Miele vac cleaner,etc. Miele isn’t made in the US, but it is, in my opinion, the best vac for me. My Birkenstock’s, Dr. Martens, Dyson heater, Pfaff sewing machine, Buderus furnace, etc aren’t made in the US, but I wouldn’t buy anything else. 

I get your point. The US is swamped with cheap goods. Consumers don’t have enough power to change that anytime soon. A lot of us do what we can.


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## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

Lightningboy65 said:


> The wool is made in the US and sent to Central America to be made into clothing. Non wool items are made in China. I have quite a few older Pendleton shirts, made before they moved manufacturing out of country.
> The American made ones last forever...I can't attest to the imports.
> 
> 
> Sorry to disappoint you by not having edited my post. I'm not trying to deceive anybody, just trying to get people thinking about where what they buy comes from. My post was a bit ambiguous, my intention was to convey some Duluth stuff is USA, not all. I said neither _all_ nor _some_. I can see how you misinterpreted.


I can’t misinterpret what was implied but not specified, lol. Also, I didn’t say you edited your post. As to the Pendleton site- can you see how it’s a bit confusing? I would’ve sworn it was all made in the US, after all, it was at one time.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> All that is besides the point. Taiwan, Vietnam, Morocco, Malaysia, CA etc...
> 
> Of course I prefer American when possible but I would be content with anything that isn't Chinese.


Yes, I said the exact same thing earlier today...post #136 :wink:


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

fauxlynn said:


> Interesting that post 121 has been edited to delete part of your post.
> You did not say some Duluth items we’re made in USA. But alas, that part is gone.
> Anyway, you miss my point about brands I’ve never heard of. I’m not wealthy, so I cannot buy small label clothing items made in LA.
> 
> ...


Well this sure looks like at one point you were under the impression I edited my post. And you were ready to pounce. :biggrin:

No need to feel stupid (your words, not mine). It happens.

I don't understand why you would deny, as you did in post #147, an easily proved point like accusing me of editing my post, tho???

EDIT:

Oh...I get it now. You were being sarcastic....and merely feeling stupid about the post #. Got it.

I stand corrected.:biggrin:


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## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

Lightningboy65 said:


> Well this sure looks like at one point you were under the impression I edited my post. And you were ready to pounce. :biggrin:
> 
> No need to feel stupid (your words, not mine). It happens.
> 
> I don't understand why you would deny, as you did in post #147, an easily proved point like accusing me of editing my post, tho???


It may have looked that way, but it was clear you didn’t edit your post. I’m not going to expound on my thinking here, it’ll get me banned. 
If I were going to pounce, I would have. You old geezers don’t scare me.

Edit- I just find it fascinating what people feel okay about ramming down others throats. Here- pretend this is a picture of a dead horse-&#55357;&#56372;


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

fauxlynn said:


> It may have looked that way, but it was clear you didn’t edit your post. I’m not going to expound on my thinking here, it’ll get me banned.
> If I were going to pounce, I would have. You old geezers don’t scare me.
> 
> Edit- I just find it fascinating what people feel okay about ramming down others throats. Here- pretend this is a picture of a dead horse-��


Boy, you really want to "OK Boomer " me so bad.:biggrin:

I'm going to just pretend you did, just so you get the satisfaction!

You get a day older every day, don't forget that. In the meantime, keep the flags of discontent flying high.:smile:

Edit: I just read your edit and my wife asked me what I was laughing at so hard....that funny.


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

Lightningboy65 said:


> People were relieved when Edison invented the electric tree bulb. It was expensive and time consuming decorating the tree with phonographs.... and if you didn't distribute the phonographs just right, the tree was constantly toppling over.


Likewise - Could care less. :wink:


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## Fman (Aug 20, 2011)

I believe it's pronounced

CHHYYYNNNAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## HC-Raad (Jan 26, 2017)

fauxlynn said:


> It may have looked that way, but it was clear you didn’t edit your post. I’m not going to expound on my thinking here, it’ll get me banned.
> If I were going to pounce, I would have. *You old geezers don’t scare me.*
> 
> Edit- I just find it fascinating what people feel okay about ramming down others throats. Here- pretend this is a picture of a dead horse-��


Classic!


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

Fman said:


> I believe it's pronounced
> 
> CHHYYYNNNAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


 Bigly:tank:


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## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

Lightningboy65 said:


> EDIT:
> 
> Oh...I get it now. You were being sarcastic....and merely feeling stupid about the post #. Got it.
> 
> I stand corrected.:biggrin:


Nah, no sarcasm. Truly. More like a paranoid Mrs MaGoo moment. I left the post as is because I figured it had already been viewed, so who cares? 



Lightningboy65 said:


> Boy, you really want to "OK Boomer " me so bad.:biggrin:


Nah, Im a Boomer,too. You just remind me of arguing in circles with my first husband. Good times. 



Fman said:


> I believe it's pronounced
> 
> CHHYYYNNNAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Believe me, nobody knows Chhynnnnaaa like I do! Hilarious.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

I think cheap imports are a gateway to hoarding. 

Whenever I buy anything, or throw anything away, I tell myself, "What would Greta Toomberg do?" And then I do the exact opposite.


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## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

CApainter said:


> I think cheap imports are a gateway to hoarding.
> 
> Whenever I buy anything, or throw anything away, I tell myself, "What would Greta Toomberg do?" And then I do the exact opposite.



Oh, you’re not going to pick on a young girl, are you?


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## Fman (Aug 20, 2011)

fauxlynn said:


> Oh, you’re not going to pick on a young girl, are you?


There's waaaaay too much of that going on these days.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

fauxlynn said:


> Oh, you’re not going to pick on a young girl, are you?


I'm sorry, but I have trouble elevating children to the level of experienced adults. I just don't get the tendency to mature these kids beyond their actual age and actual emotional development. As if we need a child to tell us how countries like China don't give a damn about the environment.

I also can't stand those children cooking shows. For example. Little William's presentation after a challenge. "Judges. I've prepared for you a foie gras with a lemon and herb arugula, rounded with a chocolate soufle dessert" And after he loses, he demonstrates real sportsmanship by shaking all his competitors hands while obviously holding back a temper tantrum ready to break.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

...and stay off my lawn!


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

CApainter said:


> ...and stay off my lawn!


Oh, yeah, well I'll stomp all over your lawn with the largest spike's you've ever seen!:biggrin:


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

CApainter said:


> I'm sorry, but I have trouble elevating children to the level of experienced adults. I just don't get the tendency to mature these kids beyond their actual age and actual emotional development. As if we need a child to tell us how countries like China don't give a damn about the environment.
> 
> I also can't stand those children cooking shows. For example. Little William's presentation after a challenge. "Judges. I've prepared for you a foie gras with a lemon and herb arugula, rounded with a chocolate soufle dessert" And after he loses, he demonstrates real sportsmanship by shaking all his competitors hands while obviously holding back a temper tantrum ready to break.


You'll be happy to hear little William is on lockdown on Rikers Island. As you probably know, foie gras is illegal in NYC now (for real, in case you missed it). William got caught trying to smuggle in a kilo of the stuff into P Diddy's Manhattan office and is now be held for trial.

I hear Greta is baking a cake with a file in it to send to William.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Lightningboy65 said:


> You'll be happy to hear little William is on lockdown on Rikers Island. As you probably know, foie gras is illegal in NYC now (for real, in case you missed it). William got caught trying to smuggle in a kilo of the stuff into P Diddy's Manhattan office and is now be held for trial.
> 
> I hear Greta is baking a cake with a file in it to send to William.


Actually it’s a no-bake cake; ovens use electricity and rising cakes off gas.:devil3:


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## Fman (Aug 20, 2011)

Brushman4 said:


> Oh, yeah, well I'll stomp all over your lawn with the largest spike's you've ever seen!:biggrin:


Aeration is good for the lawn! I think Jerry Baker(?) used to tout wearing golf shoes and meandering about your lawn. That really wasn't effective so, someone else had sandals with longer spikes (pointed down, I might add) to aerate the lawn while you strolled about. But, actual aerators actually work better.


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

Fman said:


> Aeration is good for the lawn! I think Jerry Baker(?) used to tout wearing golf shoes and meandering about your lawn. That really wasn't effective so, someone else had sandals with longer spikes (pointed down, I might add) to aerate the lawn while you strolled about. But, actual aerators actually work better.


It looks like a lot of people didn't think he was that knowledgeable about gardening. At any rate, it looks like he's been pushing up daises since March of 2017.


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## Lightningboy65 (Mar 12, 2018)

Brushman4 said:


> It looks like a lot of people didn't think he was that knowledgeable about gardening. At any rate, it looks like he's been pushing up daises since March of 2017.


I wondered why I haven't heard him on the Garden Line laely. Kinda hard to do in his present state....


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## Fman (Aug 20, 2011)

Brushman4 said:


> It looks like a lot of people didn't think he was that knowledgeable about gardening. At any rate, it looks like he's been pushing up daises since March of 2017.


I wonder how the grass is over his grave? 

He had a syndicated show and a few books, back in the 20th century but the golf spikes/sandals thing kinda soured me on him.


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## fauxlynn (Apr 28, 2011)

CApainter said:


> ...and stay off my lawn!


Okay, Boomer


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Lightningboy65 said:


> You'll be happy to hear little William is on lockdown on Rikers Island. As you probably know, foie gras is illegal in NYC now (for real, in case you missed it). William got caught trying to smuggle in a kilo of the stuff into P Diddy's Manhattan office and is now be held for trial.
> 
> I hear Greta is baking a cake with a file in it to send to William.


It figures. His dad hardly had time for the kid given the whole Frisbee circuit thing. Leonard was actually a true contender for the Nationals , but sadly cracked his meniscus on a barbeque pit while practicing at De las Pulgas Park. "You don't want to be chasing the disk down hill!" His coach would scream at him during practice. Some people just don't learn.

As I understand it, Willy became obsessed with cooking after watching Alton Brown boil a pot of panicked Crawdads shortly before sucking the juice out of their heads. His mom, Cheryl, really became dependent on Willy's home cooked meals. Especially after a long day at the firm. 

I saw a movie once where a heavy weight mob guy doing time in Rikers, recruited his lawyer to spring him by boat. Greta's quite the sailor I hear...


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

Fman said:


> I wonder how the grass is over his grave?
> 
> He had a syndicated show and a few books, back in the 20th century but the golf spikes/sandals thing kinda soured me on him.


I've heard they have to cut it three times a week!:surprise:


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## mv8710 (Jul 28, 2010)

cocomonkeynuts said:


> Probably troubles getting stuff from China.
> 
> Solution: Buy American.


I rang the office in China and they said Zachary what he said.


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## mv8710 (Jul 28, 2010)

micdalg said:


> They are actually a Japanese company based in Canada. Very nice folks and the best brush I've found in 24 years of painting. I make more money with these brushes because they cut time off the job. This gives me more time and money to throw into the American economy. It's a win.


 Vegas doesn't count as the american economy.


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## mv8710 (Jul 28, 2010)

"the most reliable thing in the universe is people's greed" - Painter Mike.
Any situation where people can make more money they will take it and not care about the flag.
I KNOW this manufactering in China will come back and bite us in the ass, but how?
Trump's trying to fix it but maybe the problem is too big for Superman.


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## Wolfgang (Nov 16, 2008)

It's run it's course.


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