# Prepping cracked paint over wallpaper paste.



## spinnor (Sep 4, 2012)

Want to bid on a job where the previous painter I think painted over wallpaper paste in two bathrooms. The surfaces are horribly cracked. Will try and post photos latter. 

My thoughts on the prep were to get the customer to let the bathroom dry out as much as possible, sand the worst of the cracked paint, clean, two coats of oil based primer, spackle, sand, prime, paint.



Would you attack the problem much different, walk away, rip out all the drywall and start over?

Thanks for your thoughts.


----------



## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

I'd probably hit it with a palm sander to knock most of the rough stuff off and skim (with mud) as needed. 
Oil is probably overkill, 123 should be fine unless the paint used on the walls or ceiling was oil. 1 coat of primer either way, there's no benefit to the 2nd coat that I can see from the info given. 2 coats of finish.


----------



## stelzerpaintinginc. (May 9, 2012)

Doesn't sound like a very favorable job to bid. No matter what you do to it, the fact that the paste wasn't removed in the first place makes it completely unpredictable, as far as the finished results. I'd have to be pretty hard up for money to assume a job where I could potentially lose my shirt even if I did everything right. The only guaranteed way is to either strip down far enough to get the paste off, tear-out, or re-sheet over-top.


----------



## spinnor (Sep 4, 2012)

My only concern with your method is that the water from the mud and then the water based primer will make the wallpaper paste do something bad. I don't know.

Thanks!


----------



## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

reading that people say to use a water-based paint or primer over wallpaper paste makes me want to put a craps table in my back room. If you want to roll the dice, I might as well make some money off of it!


----------



## spinnor (Sep 4, 2012)

So additional information, the person I might do this work for has already given me a significant amount of work and other work is probably down the road. Both bathrooms are small. I am trying to save her money without sticking out my neck too far. I guess I could do a test area and wait? If it were my bathroom I would gamble and seal it with oil just to be safe and then spackle.

Thanks for the advice.


----------



## PRC (Aug 28, 2014)

I see 2 choices here. 
First, only accept the work if they are willing to pay for removal or new rock. 
Second, lay out the good, better, best scopes of work and the associated cost of each. Explain that unless you completely remove all trace of paste that issues may arise that are beyond your control. Let them choose and then, if necessary, note in the contract that anything short of complete removal or re-rocking may lead to problems down the road and if so you will not be held responsible.


----------



## stelzerpaintinginc. (May 9, 2012)

Take all of this info and present it to your customer. Sounds like you want to try to do whatever possible to give her a good job without risking too much on your end. I understand. Might propose doing the work on a T & M basis then. That way, if all goes well, she'll get the very best price possible, and if the unexpected arises, you'll be covered.


----------



## loaded brush (Dec 27, 2007)

Go with your original plan. Hit it with oil (one coat), skim coat, prime, and paint. Any more is overthinking it and doing way too much unnecessary work.


----------



## spinnor (Sep 4, 2012)

Some photos of the walls. I will give her the two options and see if she is up for a gamble. Thank you for your advice.

https://photos.google.com/album/AF1.../AF1QipN6rjCbkpM-M_CGqatuXhnkgU-vfeswKrEV5UPb

https://photos.google.com/album/AF1.../AF1QipO0uqFZp-9Ov_jn3NCSUMz32ywLV74uWnk9TJQL

https://photos.google.com/album/AF1.../AF1QipPET0xwVmyx3aBuMyxkJfo1a1TN36R5mNwhVtOY

Should I be able to copy and paste photos here? If so can't figure it out?


----------



## AngieM (Apr 13, 2016)

I just did a similar job recently where the paint was cracked all over the wallpaper paste. I used a thick coat of SW Problock oil primer. The primer filled the crackle look in lots of places and where I could still see it, I skimmed it and retextured it. Came out looking great. 

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk


----------



## ProWallGuy (Apr 7, 2007)

lilpaintchic said:


> I'd probably hit it with a palm sander to knock most of the rough stuff off and skim (with mud) as needed.
> Oil is probably overkill, 123 should be fine unless the paint used on the walls or ceiling was oil. 1 coat of primer either way, there's no benefit to the 2nd coat that I can see from the info given. 2 coats of finish.


No, you already have a failure due to residual adhesive attacking latex/acrylic coating. I'd double coat it with oil for sure just to lock that stuff in before doing anything else to it. 

EDIT: Actually I'd sand/scrape as much of it off as possible, then apply the oil and proceed from there.


----------



## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

Feel free to do what you want but unless the glue that has already been painted is removed, it is what it is. The original paint is in the way. Oil does nothing for the existing conditions.
Maybe you saw the pics though...I didn't. Now, if ya get the paint off oil would be advantageous to do as you said essentially solidifying the surface. But again,eh..I'd be skimming a lot of it with good ole all purpose joint compound so 123 would be fine rather than priming twice.


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

lilpaintchic said:


> Feel free to do what you want but unless the glue that has already been painted is removed, it is what it is. The original paint is in the way. Oil does nothing for the existing conditions.
> Maybe you saw the pics though...I didn't. Now, if ya get the paint off oil would be advantageous to do as you said essentially solidifying the surface. But again,eh..I'd be skimming a lot of it with good ole all purpose joint compound so 123 would be fine rather than priming twice.


I am going to have to agree with Tim on this on.(although, I would use Gardz instead on oil) Why take the chance?


----------



## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

lilpaintchic said:


> Feel free to do what you want but unless the glue that has already been painted is removed, it is what it is. The original paint is in the way. Oil does nothing for the existing conditions.
> Maybe you saw the pics though...I didn't. Now, if ya get the paint off oil would be advantageous to do as you said essentially solidifying the surface. But again,eh..I'd be skimming a lot of it with good ole all purpose joint compound so 123 would be fine rather than priming twice.


I have to disagree. Another waterbased product would certainly loosen old problems. Sealing with oil primer is the only sure fire way..1 coat is fine.


----------



## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

How is 123 going to loosen something dried, cured, sanded and skimmed? It's not going to reactivate adhesive that's been painted over...I too would use gardz before or used oil on it....glue down the glue. (OK, paste, chris...lol)


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

lilpaintchic said:


> How is 123 going to loosen something dried, cured, sanded and skimmed? It's not going to reactivate adhesive that's been painted over...I too would use gardz before or used oil on it....glue down the glue. (OK, paste:thumbsup:, chris...lol)


Might work but then again

Thanks


----------



## ProWallGuy (Apr 7, 2007)

lilpaintchic said:


> How is 123 going to loosen something dried, cured, sanded and skimmed? It's not going to reactivate adhesive that's been painted over...I too would use gardz before or used oil on it....glue down the glue. (OK, paste, chris...lol)


Yes it will. Latex/acrylic paint is water based, and the moisture will migrate through other layers of water based paint, and reactivate that paste. Oil/alkyd products will not.


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

ProWallGuy said:


> Yes it will. Latex/acrylic paint is water based, and the moisture will migrate through other layers of water based paint, and reactivate that paste. Oil/alkyd products will not.


So, you would not trust Gardz and or Draw Tite?


----------



## ProWallGuy (Apr 7, 2007)

chrisn said:


> So, you would not trust Gardz and or Draw Tite?


Yes, I trust both of those, but only because they are different than water-based primers. They dry so fast they don't allow the time for the moisture to migrate through other layers and reactivate paste. Regular water-based primers take much longer to dry. Gardz and DT once dry are completely hydrophobic and won't allow anything to pass through them.


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

ProWallGuy said:


> Yes, I trust both of those, but only because they are different than water-based primers. They dry so fast they don't allow the time for the moisture to migrate through other layers and reactivate paste. Regular water-based primers take much longer to dry. Gardz and DT once dry are completely hydrophobic and won't allow anything to pass through them.


I knew(know) all that, but it was sounding like you would only use oil. I avoid oil for the most part. It kind of makes me sick.


----------



## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

chrisn said:


> I knew(know) all that, but it was sounding like you would only use oil. I avoid oil for the most part. It kind of makes me sick.


It does bring back the '70s tho. What a decade. Lysergic acid diethylamide. When it was the good stuff.

Not really. Can I haz my brain sellz bak?


----------



## SemiproJohn (Jul 29, 2013)

Wildbill7145 said:


> It does bring back the '70s tho. What a decade.* Lysergic acid diethylamide. When it was the good stuff*.
> 
> Not really. Can I haz my brain sellz bak?


LOL. Those were the days.


----------



## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

SemiproJohn said:


> LOL. Those were the days.


I could tell you stories. A friend of mine was gonna write a book called 'acid tales'. Thankfully they didn't, and I'm here posting on PT.


----------



## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

chrisn said:


> I knew(know) all that, but it was sounding like you would only use oil. I avoid oil for the most part. It kind of makes me sick.


Would you trust this gaurdz or draw tite over wallpaper itself? And trust it won't cause the paper to bubble.. I've have not used either product personally.
I have a fair size job coming up and would normally use coverstain, but hate using it in clients houses.. Nasty ol stuff..


----------



## ProWallGuy (Apr 7, 2007)

finishesbykevyn said:


> Would you trust this gaurdz or draw tite over wallpaper itself? And trust it won't cause the paper to bubble.. I've have not used either product personally.
> I have a fair size job coming up and would normally use coverstain, but hate using it in clients houses.. Nasty ol stuff..


No, I always remove the paper first.


----------



## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

finishesbykevyn said:


> Would you trust this gaurdz or draw tite over wallpaper itself? And trust it won't cause the paper to bubble.. I've have not used either product personally.
> 
> I have a fair size job coming up and would normally use coverstain, but hate using it in clients houses.. Nasty ol stuff..




I used it once over wallpaper in a kitchen. It worked fine, a few bubbles popped up but it wasn't bad. I just cut them out and patched. 

I used it for the same reason your contemplating. I hate to use oil in people's homes. 

If you do try it, let us know how it goes. My single anecdotal case isn't enough for me to speak confidently about it. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

ProWallGuy said:


> Yes it will. Latex/acrylic paint is water based, and the moisture will migrate through other layers of water based paint, and reactivate that paste. Oil/alkyd products will not.


We've had the water from latex/acrylic paint penetrate previous layers of water-based paint AND skim coat. Not taking that chance again.


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

Jmayspaint said:


> I used it once over wallpaper in a kitchen. It worked fine, a few bubbles popped up but it wasn't bad. I just cut them out and patched.
> 
> I used it for the same reason your contemplating. I hate to use oil in people's homes.
> 
> ...


I have a job coming up sometime later next month that I was going to use Gardz( she will not let me remove it). I will try and remember to post results.


----------



## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Jmayspaint said:


> I used it once over wallpaper in a kitchen. It worked fine, a few bubbles popped up but it wasn't bad. I just cut them out and patched.
> 
> I used it for the same reason your contemplating. I hate to use oil in people's homes.
> 
> ...


----------



## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

finishesbykevyn said:


> Jmayspaint said:
> 
> 
> > I used it once over wallpaper in a kitchen. It worked fine, a few bubbles popped up but it wasn't bad. I just cut them out and patched.
> ...


----------



## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Jmayspaint said:


> I used it once over wallpaper in a kitchen. It worked fine, a few bubbles popped up but it wasn't bad. I just cut them out and patched.
> 
> I used it for the same reason your contemplating. I hate to use oil in people's homes.
> 
> ...


 So I gave the gaurdz a go over the wallpaper. Worked like a hot damn. The stuff didn't budge. Skimmed all the seems and then seeled with a regular drywall primer. Got great milage out of the gaurdz too. Anyhow, that stuff is legit! FYI. :thumbup:


----------



## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Here's my take. The paste already has a coat of paint over it. The system has already been compromised. An Achilles's heals already exists. However, it's likely the cracking won't happen any further. Therefore, any primer with a skim coat and finish will work. If anything, two to three coat the finish rather than apply two coats of primer.

At the end of the day, this bathroom is a minor issue. Treat it as such.


----------

