# Painters Helper Wages?



## 4ThGeneration (Apr 17, 2007)

Just curious what painting contractors pay their entry level painter helper from day 1. Give a state with the rate. Just been curious on this since a guy who has no experience called for a job, told me that painters get $25 per hour so he should get at least $15. No experience though remember. Starting from scratch.


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## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

Phila PA/ Main Line PA ............helper= $80-$100, painter= $125-$200


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

First hire, hey? Exciting. I think you need to educate them on the value that your business offers. Type of work, consistent work, benefits, comp, ui, and the Sutton experience. You also need to determine the value that an employee will have for you as you establish your pay scale. It has to be win win.


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## 4ThGeneration (Apr 17, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> First hire, hey? Exciting. I think you need to educate them on the value that your business offers. Type of work, consistent work, benefits, comp, ui, and the Sutton experience. You also need to determine the value that an employee will have for you as you establish your pay scale. It has to be win win.


Not first hire, but what has happened is that people seem to be smoking Mexicano tobacco if they think they are hiring out at $15 and hour with no experience except that which they obtained while painting their own house once a year.

One person asked if I could write receipts to show a lower wage and to give him cash on the side to make up the rest. I said let me get in touch with my Paychex people and they will get back with you on that.


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## pinchegordo (Jul 3, 2011)

Helpers who know NOTHING get $8-9 an hour. Journeymen here get $13-18 depending on who they work for and what they know. In my mind a helper tops out at about $2 an hour less than an entry level painter. When they are ready to start actually painting they get a two dollar bump say from $10 to $12 or whatever.that's in Arizona


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## 4ThGeneration (Apr 17, 2007)

pinchegordo said:


> Helpers who know NOTHING get $8-9 an hour. Journeymen here get $13-18 depending on who they work for and what they know. In my mind a helper tops out at about $2 an hour less than an entry level painter. When they are ready to start actually painting they get a two dollar bump say from $10 to $12 or whatever.that's in Arizona



I got a few guys to send your way lol.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

What does your pay scale look like currently? 

What do you pay your least experienced guy?

What do you pay your most experienced guy?

Pay scale within your company is much more important than other business models in other states I would think.


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## pinchegordo (Jul 3, 2011)

4ThGeneration said:


> I got a few guys to send your way lol.


It has alot to do with the people though... We are a rural area so payscale is lower . Before I started working for myself I was making $18 hrly if I was in a metro area and did the same work $22-24 would probably be about normal


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## 4ThGeneration (Apr 17, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> What does your pay scale look like currently?
> 
> What do you pay your least experienced guy?
> 
> ...


From my initial post I am just curious of pay scales and see how diff they are across the board and the reactions they give to people who try to come in with a chip on their shoulder. Everyone who comes to me looking for work must fill out a app, have a back ground check as well as a drug screening. If they are hired, they have to read our handbook of duties they must perform and sign it. No surprises when they state they can not perform a duty and all I have to do is point to the booklet and their signature.:Just curious what painting contractors pay their entry level painter helper from day 1.


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## aaron61 (Apr 29, 2007)

What do you pay?? I start all painters at $12.Till I see what they can do. Don't really hire helpers.


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## 4ThGeneration (Apr 17, 2007)

aaron61 said:


> What do you pay?? I start all painters at $12.Till I see what they can do. Don't really hire helpers.



I base all of it on actual application. I always audition people for about 3 hours to see what they can actually do. I never take someone's word for what they say they can do. They have to prove their experience. So in essence it is a sliding scale. I will start off someone who says they are a painter at *$13* and hour. If after 3 hours they seem to know whats going on I will bump them to the *$15* per hour. I will also *bump them up $1 per hour after 90 days*. *Painters helpers all start at $8 per hour if they have no experience.*

I also have an incentive for certain established amounts of money if they complete a project on time with no go backs. I extend this to all employees.

Painters helpers have a place in the industry because I always liked the idea of taking a clean slate with no bad habits and shaping them into what I want. the best way in my opinion to do this is when your doing new construction. No home owners to deal with, no landscaping in most stages, time is more forgiving for a helper in many ways when on new construction.


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## alan (Feb 17, 2010)

I pay women 10$ and men 8$.women have a softer touch with a brush and men are like a bull in china shop.:thumbup: rolling the walls and hittin the ceiling Gosh! I hate that..


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## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

alan said:


> I pay women 10$ and men 8$.women have a softer touch with a brush and men are like a bull in china shop.:thumbup: rolling the walls and hittin the ceiling Gosh! I hate that..


 

Wife nearby huh??


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## phildvr (May 24, 2011)

new 10. my crew ranges 13-22 right now.
Mississippi


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## Wolfgang (Nov 16, 2008)

Ole34 said:


> Wife nearby huh??


:lol::lol::lol:

Usually started them at $10-12/hr. Had a good crew of experienced guys who could determine talent and had the patience to train. After deductions, it's tough on anybody to live on whats left of anything less than $10/hr.


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## [email protected] (Feb 24, 2008)

aaron61 said:


> What do you pay?? I start all painters at $12.Till I see what they can do. Don't really hire helpers.


Same here but my rate starts at $13.


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## aaron61 (Apr 29, 2007)

Wolfgang said:


> :lol::lol::lol:
> 
> Usually started them at $10-12/hr. Had a good crew of experienced guys who could determine talent and had the patience to train. After deductions, it's tough on anybody to live on whats left of anything less than $10/hr.


It's not meant to be a living wage.It's a starting wage. 
I have never understood why they raise the minimum wage.That just increases everything across the board and again it's a starting wage.Prove yourself and be of value to your employer and you will make more.If you don't like it don't work there. IMHO


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## jmda (Nov 14, 2007)

Our painters make from 13 to 19.

Start painters out at 12, if they are good and fit in well then they almost instantly get a raise.

When we bring on a helper 10.


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## Dunbar Painting (Mar 19, 2010)

I started my main painters at $20 and they are at $25 now due to performance and trustworthiness.

I started my helpers at $12 this summer and they are at $15 now.


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## y.painting (Jul 19, 2009)

Just curious what painting contractors charge to paint a house.
Give a state with the rate. 
Just been curious on this since a new customer called with a job, told me that his neighbor's house was painted for 5K so he should get at most a 3K estimate. 
New customer though remember. 
Starting our relationship from scratch.


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## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

y.painting said:


> Just curious what painting contractors charge to paint a house.
> Give a state with the rate.
> Just been curious on this since a new customer called with a job, told me that his neighbor's house was painted for 5K so he should get at most a 3K estimate.
> New customer though remember.
> Starting our relationship from scratch.


 
good question........i think you should take your post an start a new thread an maybe this for a topic ......''how much to paint a house???"...............Viral baby !!!


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## 4ThGeneration (Apr 17, 2007)

y.painting said:


> Just curious what painting contractors charge to paint a house.
> Give a state with the rate.
> Just been curious on this since a new customer called with a job, told me that his neighbor's house was painted for 5K so he should get at most a 3K estimate.
> New customer though remember.
> Starting our relationship from scratch.


 
Just curious as to how people come on boards in their related fields and make multiple thousand posts quota on each board yet have time to run a business? Wait..thats right. They are able to do so because they have multiple employees, 10 trucks, 3 full time bookeepers, a cpa, supers ect ect and thats why they have the free time....yeahhhhhh Thats the formula guys. I must have been ignorant all these years. This guy has it all figured out. Studio painters...gotta love em :jester:


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## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

your just hatin cause you dont have a lot of posts .......an not many ''thank you's'' either .............:blink:


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## 4ThGeneration (Apr 17, 2007)

Thanks all who "ACTUALLY" participated on exchanging info. Its pretty close in spite of everyone always saying it depends on the area. I know it varies everywhere, but I know contractors will pay what they know their guys are worth no matter where they are located and thats actually the best business practice anyhow. Having an employee who has transporation, his own tools, the ability to be a self starter, problem solver and leader of others who is respectful is worth their weight in gold.

If anyone on here ever takes what I say as personal they should check their ovaries at the door before they enter PaintTalk. I do not have anything to say about the gals as they seem more level headed than most of the men anyhow. Actually I find it that the homeowner ladies like painting and perform those duties more than the husband so much respect for the lady contractors...:thumbup:


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## PatsPainting (Mar 4, 2010)

So overall was this thread productive for you? if so what did you learn? Do you have new information that you did not before? If so are you going to implement it in your business routine from here on forward?

Another one of those pricing/cost threads that produce nothing for anyone.

Pat


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

I think Jimmies old lady finally asked for a raise and he needed some backup. Being straight up would have been much more effective! :jester:


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## BreatheEasyHP (Apr 24, 2011)

4ThGeneration said:


> Having an employee who has transporation, his own tools, the ability to be a self starter, problem solver and leader of others who is respectful is worth their weight in gold.


Right on.

I'm a big fan of "any worksite experience." I generally don't take on even a "helper" who doesn't have at least an intuitive feel for worksites...too many questions to answer, preventable delays, not too mention safety concerns.

$9-$10/hr for the completely inexperienced.

$12/hr for new hires with some experience or anyone doing work above 10'. Raises as they progress.

$15/hr for solid painters

I hire a person to do glazing at $25/hr. 

Also, I give $2 an hour more for lead work. That's going to go up soon. I'm sending one employee to the RRP class and he'll get $20-25.


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## 4ThGeneration (Apr 17, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> I think Jimmies old lady finally asked for a raise and he needed some backup. Being straight up would have been much more effective! :jester:


 
Actually she is my wife, so show some respect ok. Now before you actually go back with the goon squad and and think of a way to pat yourself on the back and devise a plan to give me a long distance whoopin, give me a call. Its 484-334-3999. This way we can all be men and then if that does not satisfy your questions we can see what we can do to make things right. 

Again, only go down the road your hind parts can back up. Seriousely....Old Lady?


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## 4ThGeneration (Apr 17, 2007)

BreatheEasyHP said:


> Right on.
> 
> I'm a big fan of "any worksite experience." I generally don't take on even a "helper" who doesn't have at least an intuitive feel for worksites...too many questions to answer, preventable delays, not too mention safety concerns.
> 
> ...


 
Thats really a good way to go. I have not glazed in years and have not came across the projects for that yet. I can imagine trying to find someone for that who can actually perform it correctly. I like the app process and other things i mentioned, but as you agreed. I do not want a studio painter who has simply read a book, been at a class or better yet, been on a forum and think they can paint. It may seem laughable, but it happens.


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## 4ThGeneration (Apr 17, 2007)

PatsPainting said:


> So overall was this thread productive for you? if so what did you learn? Do you have new information that you did not before? If so are you going to implement it in your business routine from here on forward?
> 
> Another one of those pricing/cost threads that produce nothing for anyone.
> 
> Pat


Thanks Captain Obvious for your response. Its pretty plain that you do not understand that some posts on here are for info to help boost a company in the right direction and that some are just for curiousity to know how things are across the country. Hmmmm ASctually there may be..wait...wait newer contractors or hopefuls that this info would be helpful for?


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## PatsPainting (Mar 4, 2010)

Relax keyboard cowboy, everything will be ok..

Pat


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

BreatheEasyHP said:


> Right on.
> 
> I'm a big fan of "any worksite experience." I generally don't take on even a "helper" who doesn't have at least an intuitive feel for worksites...too many questions to answer, preventable delays, not too mention safety concerns.
> 
> ...


Sums it up for me too.


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## 4ThGeneration (Apr 17, 2007)

PatsPainting said:


> Relax keyboard cowboy, everything will be ok..
> 
> Pat


Of coarse cause most on here has the John Wayne walk with the Mickey Mouse butt behind the screen when they are safe at home.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

All we are is dust in the wind...

:jester:


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## y.painting (Jul 19, 2009)

4th, as hard as it might be to believe, my reply was not meant to be a snide remark in your direction. It was meant to demonstrate the specific-for-you nature of a payscale for someone you might employ.

To figure out what you can afford to pay an employee in general, here's a general formula: you must first figure out, based on your own profit margins, how much extra revenue you have to generate just to break even after you pay this person a certain amount $X. Then you have to ask yourself if this new hire can at least generate that much additional revenue for you so that you may break even after you pay them $X. And that's just to break even; if you want to actually make money, then that new hire must generate enough revenue where (at your profit margins), you can both pay them and make a profit after all else.

Say it costs $30,000 a year to pay an employee. To _obtain_ that $30,000 in order to let it go on payroll, most companies would have to generate revenues between $75,000 and $150,000 (assuming a profit margin of 20-40%) just to break even. 

Always ask yourself, will this hire at an $X wage enable us to generate additional income such that after I factor in my profit margins and pay them out of that additional income, I will make money. That is the only way to figure out how much you can afford to pay an employee.


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## DavefromManchester (Apr 30, 2014)

*Need help to see if my employer is giving me adequate hourly wage.*

Good evening,

I am a painter from southern new hampshire with about 2 solid years experience. A Season and a half exterior and a little over a season interior. 

My current employer pays me at a rate of 10 under the table.

we do high end painting on commercial and residential. Most of the residential properties range in value from 200k all the way up to 6 million-ish. I mention that to stress the ammount of detail and percision and neatness required on a daily basis 

I have own transportation, Clean cut, my own painters whites, i can throw around any ladder up to 40-foot (is the largest we have). I am very passionate about the craftsmanship of my work. I work circles around the other painters in the crew in terms speed, quality, and attendance.

I am a college student currently taking night courses, working about 25-35 hours a week. 

My problem is that I feel i am getting underpaid by a large margin. I understand my perspective could be wrong but looking around at other posts it would seem i am getting horriblely underpaid... Its getting to the point where I keep bringing it up to my employer and no change yet. Its starting to offend me personally. Obviously someone who ownes a business might think differently, so i want to hear your guys perspectives. 

I just want to see how other painters and buisiness owners would compensate someone for my quality and experience of work.

thank you for your time and potential feedback
Dave-


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

DavefromManchester said:


> Good evening,
> 
> I am a painter from southern new hampshire with about 2 solid years experience. A Season and a half exterior and a little over a season interior.
> 
> ...


Well when I've had 'helpers' they start at minimum wage (10.25). Those that work out slowly progress in pay increases when they're work reflex it. I don't know what the job market is in New Hampshire but A) if something happens to you on the job site, your both screwed. B) you might wanna start looking elsewere if he refuses to pay more (2 years and no raise could mean several things).

Good luck

Sent from my SGH-T989D using Tapatalk


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

DavefromManchester said:


> Good evening,
> 
> I am a painter from southern new hampshire with about 2 solid years experience. A Season and a half exterior and a little over a season interior.
> 
> ...





journeymanPainter said:


> Well when I've had 'helpers' they start at minimum wage (10.25). Those that work out slowly progress in pay increases when they're work reflex it. I don't know what the job market is in New Hampshire but A) if something happens to you on the job site, your both screwed. B) you might wanna start looking elsewere if he refuses to pay more (2 years and no raise could mean several things).
> 
> Good luck
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T989D using Tapatalk


We start non experienced at 10 and some one who claims experience at 12. If they prove themselves we give raises, if not we show them the door. We usually only have summer help. We don't pay cash. If you lived closer or wouldn't mind traveling to Newburyport we would give you a shot. Manchester is not really far from us.


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## mblosik (Jan 3, 2009)

Dave from Manchester.....wanna move to wisconsin?


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## Rcon (Nov 19, 2009)

We start helpers/first year at $17. 

We like our guys to be happy and to want to work for us - we compensate accordingly. 

I'd never offer a guy $10, $12 or whatever to start. I'd find it insulting to him/her and if that's truly all they think they're worth then they don't belong with our company. 

AB, Canada


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

Rcon said:


> We start helpers/first year at $17.
> 
> We like our guys to be happy and to want to work for us - we compensate accordingly.
> 
> ...


The problem we run into and I'm sure other as well is every one is a painter. Once they start working you realize real fast they don't know chit. No way would I waste the kind of starting pay you give guys. Sorry they need to prove they can do all aspects of painting before they will make $17 an hour from us. We do have 2 guys we pay 15 and I'm sure if they work like they have in the past they will get a raise.


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

Entertaining thread. Hey 4th, you still in business? I see your websites are down?


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

$10 is about as low as it goes here. A total green horn would start around 10. Top helper is 12-14. A painter can get 15-22, and a good spray person maybe 25.

2 years exp is not really very much though, especially working part time.


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## SprayCutAndRoll (Oct 12, 2013)

Man seeing the wages in the US makes me cringe, good thing I live in Canada.


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## Bender (Aug 10, 2008)

SprayCutAndRoll said:


> Man seeing the wages in the US makes me cringe, good thing I live in Canada.


But think of all the debt we have!


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

SprayCutAndRoll said:


> Man seeing the wages in the US makes me cringe, good thing I live in Canada.


It's relative. Average price of a home in the US is $170K. Average in Canada $400K. Our food prices are also about half to three quarters yours and gas is approximately 30% less expensive.


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## SprayCutAndRoll (Oct 12, 2013)

PressurePros said:


> It's relative. Average price of a home in the US is $170K. Average in Canada $400K. Our food prices are also about half to three quarters yours and gas is approximately 30% less expensive.


You had me at gas is 30% less expensive. $1.50/lt is damn ridiculous...


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

SprayCutAndRoll said:


> You had me at gas is 30% less expensive. $1.50/lt is damn ridiculous...


That _is_ a lot. That would equate to gas being almost $6/gallon here. In my area, which is Philly/NY/DC and expensive, we pay about $3.70 gallon average.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

PressurePros said:


> That _is_ a lot. That would equate to gas being almost $6/gallon here. In my area, which is Philly/NY/DC and expensive, we pay about $3.70 gallon average.


Not quite. The current average across Canada is about 1.40 CDN/litre. That means 5.32 CDN/US gallon. With the current rate if exchange (.91), that comes out $4.85. Still, that's not trivial.

OTOH, we pay about 50% more for paint for projects when we're in Canada.


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

Gough said:


> Not quite. The current average across Canada is about 1.40 CDN/litre. That means 5.32 CDN/US gallon. With the current rate if exchange (.91), that comes out $4.85. Still, that's not trivial.
> 
> OTOH, we pay about 50% more for paint for projects when we're in Canada.


I forgot to check the exchange rate. So it is actually about 30% or so higher which is what I heard recently.


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## SprayCutAndRoll (Oct 12, 2013)

Gough said:


> Not quite. The current average across Canada is about 1.40 CDN/litre. That means 5.32 CDN/US gallon. With the current rate if exchange (.91), that comes out $4.85. Still, that's not trivial.
> 
> OTOH, we pay about 50% more for paint for projects when we're in Canada.


I wish I was paying $1.40/lt..  stupid province of Quebec.. 

Also I didn't know there was such a discrepancy in paint. 50% is a whole lot when you think about it.


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## bklynboy1970 (Oct 8, 2013)

Wow...is everybody on this site from fl: jester...those are some seriously cheap wages, I'm offended...I think a journeymen painter should start at 18 nothing less...helper 12 to 13. When I was in the bucket was 165 to 200 a day even in cheapskate fl...my wife is painting a mansion for new coach ...guess who...she's a journeymen starting 15hr drives 4 hrs a day to job and back home no gas money and child care....the illegals that are painting coaches house can't even paint a straight line...companies. ..are treating painters like slaves and want quality, speed prep to be perfect...spray, and your sprayer truck tools ...but know compensation? ? 

I know the pricing on high end homes...Rome repeats itself...lmao
Painters are the last in and most make it look like a million bucks...oh but anybody can paint...rolleyes:


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

bklynboy1970 said:


> Wow...is everybody on this site from fl: jester...those are some seriously cheap wages, I'm offended...I think a journeymen painter should start at 18 nothing less..




And you don't think $18/hr is seriously cheap for a journeyman???


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## bklynboy1970 (Oct 8, 2013)

I do think it's cheap....move to fl...and work for some of these painting contractors. ..very much slave wages, I was very lucky and mad like I said 165 to 200 a day....and you can call me a hack but I also did side jobs and that's where I made my money. See I was a block Mason with a passion to paint since I was 18...but I knew painters in fl always got the short end of the stick!! It wasn't frowned upon back in the day to do side work....my dream was to be a painting contractor...but had a fall...yes 15hr sucks as well...I started as an apprenticeship at 18 as a block mason.....nobody taught me how to paint it was in bedded in me crazy ...I was a free handed painter ....never heard of tape


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## PRECISIONVANCOUVER (Apr 15, 2013)

Rcon said:


> We start helpers/first year at $17.
> 
> We like our guys to be happy and to want to work for us - we compensate accordingly.
> 
> ...


The thing is Canada has higher inflation so the wages for skilled trades is higher.

To us $10 an hour for a labor job seems like a joke. $15 to $25 is more reasonable in Canada and especially in Alberta.


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## PRECISIONVANCOUVER (Apr 15, 2013)

bklynboy1970 said:


> I do think it's cheap....move to fl...and work for some of these painting contractors. ..very much slave wages, I was very lucky and mad like I said 165 to 200 a day....and you can call me a hack but I also did side jobs and that's where I made my money. See I was a block Mason with a passion to paint since I was 18...but I knew painters in fl always got the short end of the stick!! It wasn't frowned upon back in the day to do side work....my dream was to be a painting contractor...but had a fall...yes 15hr sucks as well...I started as an apprenticeship at 18 as a block mason.....nobody taught me how to paint it was in bedded in me crazy ...I was a free handed painter ....never heard of tape


Painters tape is for phony's. I only use it to wrap my plastic around my brushes so they don't dry out.


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## bklynboy1970 (Oct 8, 2013)

PRECISIONVANCOUVER said:


> The thing is Canada has higher inflation so the wages for skilled trades is higher.
> 
> To us $10 an hour for a labor job seems like a joke. $15 to $25 is more reasonable in Canada and especially in Alberta.


I think 25 is cheap wage for Canada should be 28 to 30


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## bklynboy1970 (Oct 8, 2013)

Gough said:


> And you don't think $18/hr is seriously cheap for a journeyman???


I see painters on bicycles. ..all the time here in sunny Pinellas county....my wify and I just shake are heads...and there probably painting high end homes on the beach. It's sad


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## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

I need a gauge. Anyone in Canada. What does a pack of Marlboro lights cost?
A gallon of gas?
A 2000 sq ft newer house?
Shoot some prices


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## Paradigmzz (May 5, 2010)

PRECISIONVANCOUVER said:


> Painters tape is for phony's. I only use it to wrap my plastic around my brushes so they don't dry out.


I get done, clean my brush and move to the next color. 

You dont tape off baseboards when you roll? You dont cover up stuff when you spray? Tape is just another tool. And if you ever had to deal with extreme color changes on knockdown textured bullnoses, you would see a definite use for tape. 

We go through a few cases of tape a week. Guess I'm just a phony.


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## SemiproJohn (Jul 29, 2013)

Paradigmzz said:


> I get done, clean my brush and move to the next color.
> 
> You dont tape off baseboards when you roll? You dont cover up stuff when you spray? Tape is just another tool. And if you ever had to deal with extreme color changes on knockdown textured bullnoses, you would see a definite use for tape.
> 
> We go through a few cases of tape a week. Guess I'm just a phony.


In my opinion, those who don't use tape are the phonies. Like you say, tape is a tool...sometimes the best tool.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

PRECISIONVANCOUVER said:


> The thing is Canada has higher inflation so the wages for skilled trades is higher.
> 
> To us $10 an hour for a labor job seems like a joke. $15 to $25 is more reasonable in Canada and especially in Alberta.


There are some explanations for the disparity...inflation rate isn't one of them

http://www.economics.utoronto.ca/jfloyd/modules/infl.html

It seems like most of the Canadian painters on PT are from the metro areas,or areas affected by economic fallout from the Tar Sands. The US contingent seems to be a little more diverse. Because of that, you may be comparing apples to oranges.

I know the rate I pay (self-employed) painters in N Ontario is well below $15-25 hour.


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## MSJ Painting (Jan 27, 2013)

Paradigmzz said:


> I get done, clean my brush and move to the next color.
> 
> You dont tape off baseboards when you roll? You dont cover up stuff when you spray? Tape is just another tool. And if you ever had to deal with extreme color changes on knockdown textured bullnoses, you would see a definite use for tape.
> 
> We go through a few cases of tape a week. Guess I'm just a phony.


I'm as phony as they come too...I dont care who you are, my taped and backfilled lines on base are laser sharp and will beat the most steady freehand out there. Plus, how else would you protect base from roller overspray?...or get perfect corners where base meets casing?...or fill gaps between stained trim and painted walls?

I'm proud to be a phony too!

Sent from my SCH-I535 using PaintTalk.com mobile app


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## paintball head (Mar 3, 2012)

I agree with the use of tape being discussed, it is a must. Maybe what PrecisionVancouver meant was he doesn't have to use tape to cut a straight line as some painters do for their straight lines. I'm just guessing though, kind of like assuming and we know what happens when someone assumes.


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

MSJ Painting said:


> I'm as phony as they come too...I dont care who you are, my taped and backfilled lines on base are laser sharp and will beat the most steady freehand out there. Plus, how else would you protect base from roller overspray?...or get perfect corners where base meets casing?...or fill gaps between stained trim and painted walls?
> 
> I'm proud to be a phony too!
> 
> Sent from my SCH-I535 using PaintTalk.com mobile app


 

I get perfect corners with my brush, NOT tape!! 

Free Hand Only!

Tape is for floors. Or sissies.


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

Kidding! Or am I?

Actually, I'm not, but please- no one be offended


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## midwestpainter88 (Mar 14, 2014)

I wish I was making what some of your guys helpers are making. I use my own sprayer and bust my ass for $17 an hr and about 6 yrs in the trade... Some people don't know what they got till it's gone.


Sent from my iPhone using PaintTalk.com


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## paintball head (Mar 3, 2012)

Pretty Handy Mandi said:


> I get perfect corners with my brush, NOT tape!!
> 
> Free Hand Only!
> 
> Tape is for floors. Or sissies.


You are the self appointed Highly Exalted Grand Puba of Official Brush Masters.:notworthy::notworthy::thumbup: CONGRATULATIONS!!


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## PRECISIONVANCOUVER (Apr 15, 2013)

Oden said:


> I need a gauge. Anyone in Canada. What does a pack of Marlboro lights cost?
> A gallon of gas?
> A 2000 sq ft newer house?
> Shoot some prices


Vancouver, B.C, Canada

Marlboro lights= $10
A litre of gas= $150.1 ($1.50)
2000 sq ft house= approx $800k


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## PRECISIONVANCOUVER (Apr 15, 2013)

Pretty Handy Mandi said:


> I get perfect corners with my brush, NOT tape!!
> 
> Free Hand Only!
> 
> Tape is for floors. Or sissies.


Yes exactly Pretty Handy Mandi, 

It's all in the eye to hand coordination, baby!

Don't let anybody tell you otherwise. Your doing great I bet.


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## PRECISIONVANCOUVER (Apr 15, 2013)

paintball head said:


> You are the self appointed Highly Exalted Grand Puba of Official Brush Masters.:notworthy::notworthy::thumbup: CONGRATULATIONS!!


LOL!


Haters gonna hate keep up the good work, Mandi!


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## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

PRECISIONVANCOUVER said:


> Vancouver, B.C, Canada Marlboro lights= $10 A litre of gas= $150.1 ($1.50) 2000 sq ft house= approx $800k


Whoa. Way high for my area.
For the cigs and digs at least.

I don't know what is a liter. We speak English here.


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## paintball head (Mar 3, 2012)

PRECISIONVANCOUVER said:


> LOL!
> 
> 
> Haters gonna hate keep up the good work, Mandi!


I don't hate ! She just comes across as one who thinks she is the only painter capable of cutting a straight line without tape. Big deal. I don't use tape to cut lines, nor do any of the many painters I know.


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

I can cut a nice straight line but still use tape. Cutting a straight line doesn't prevent roller splatter from hitting the baseboards.


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

One of the first things I train a helper to do is tape. I used to be a hand cutting snob too, but now i'm more of a pragmatist. Some situations its simply more efficient/effective. Plus, I spray a lot. 

IMO taping, much like sanding, is as much a skill as anything else we do.


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## paintball head (Mar 3, 2012)

cdpainting said:


> I can cut a nice straight line but still use tape. Cutting a straight line* doesn't prevent roller splatter from hitting the baseboards.*


That is a given, taping a surface to protect from roller splatter.


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

paintball head said:


> That is a given, taping a surface to protect from roller splatter.



Idk, you can always use the ole 'wipe it off' method :no:


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## paintball head (Mar 3, 2012)

To be clear, I tape base before rolling a wall. You roll a wall and then wipe the splatter off the base?


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## slinger58 (Feb 11, 2013)

PRECISIONVANCOUVER;489282 said:


> Painters tape is for phony's. I only use it to wrap my plastic around my brushes so they don't dry out.


Have you read the book "How to Win Friends and Influence People" ?

No?


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

This thread has morphed so many times, I don't even remember the original topic. So, did anybody get any rain today?


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## Rcon (Nov 19, 2009)

Oden said:


> I need a gauge. Anyone in Canada. What does a pack of Marlboro lights cost?
> A gallon of gas?
> A 2000 sq ft newer house?
> Shoot some prices


As is usually the case - it depends where in Canada you are. It _is _a big Country. 

If you're in Vancouver, BC, a 20 pack of premium smokes will cost you about $11.00. A gallon of gas about $6.00 (that's estimating, we use litres here and on the coast right now they're around $1.50/ltr). 

A 2000 square foot house could cost you a million bucks. 

In Edmonton, AB (where I am), houses are substantially less expensive. That same 2000 sq ft house will cost you around $300K. 25 pack of smokes (we don't have 20 packs here) is $11.50. Gas is also cheaper at $1.18/ltr. But if you're in Ft. Mac in Northern AB, your house will cost you upwards of $800K and everything else is more expensive as well. 

So, like I said, it depends.


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

PressurePros said:


> This thread has morphed so many times, I don't even remember the original topic. So, did anybody get any rain today?


Not only is it raining out it's also raining in my house. The dang roof leaks. I guess that roofer who did a cold call (stopped and knocked) was right.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

I have a basic 3 bed 1.5 bath home , 2,300 sq ft, 2 stall garage attached, plus 1.5 stall detached garage. Value is 160,000-170,000. Built in the 1960's. Suburban area outside Michigan's second largest city. Grand Rapids. So, Canada home values sound more like California and Chicago, east coast to me. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## bklynboy1970 (Oct 8, 2013)

paintball head said:


> You are the self appointed Highly Exalted Grand Puba of Official Brush Masters.:notworthy::notworthy::thumbup: CONGRATULATIONS!!


Yes she is ;-) 
Cheers...


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

Kudos to all that give their guys respectable wages. 

Turns out the coach's house is grossly underpaid for the size of the project.

It's a 10,000 square foot home. 

Why is it that I have to come behind the other painters and tighten everything up? Oh, and where some of those areas are... that is where TAPE was used. But that's not the point... how about, someone already "cut in" the bottom.. but left 1/8- 1/4" 

IM GOING TO SAY THIS... SO LET IT BE CLEAR-----> NOT anyone CAN PAINT!!

The fragging painters can't even PAINT!

Sigh, making $15/hr. Include my gas I spend to get there and childcare, I make 7/hr.

Include the 4 hours a day drive time and it's 5.25/hr. 

Ra.ra.ra. 




At least I'm getting self gratification from the results of my work.


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## SemiproJohn (Jul 29, 2013)

Pretty Handy Mandi said:


> Kudos to all that give their guys respectable wages.
> 
> Turns out the coach's house is grossly underpaid for the size of the project.
> 
> ...


I had some self-gratifying feelings at work earlier today as I removed some painter's tape from some intricate wood panels and saw the nice...dare I say... perfect lines...


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

Feast your eyes! Get ready, grab some popcorn, and prepare yourself for disgusting sights of gore! Here is what the other "painters" do: (see, I know I can paint better than most, 20 years experience blah blah blah)


And thank you, I gladly accept the title of

Highly Exalted Grand Pumba


Back to the regular scheduled programming: Disgusting sights of gore.
Please, for goodness sake, shield the eyes of children. 

And lastly: one I decided to correct. .









P.s. The automatic orientation changer is messing up the photos. But I am doing a thumbs down at all the shotty work


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

SemiproJohn said:


> I had some self-gratifying feelings at work earlier today as I removed some painter's tape from some intricate wood panels and saw the nice...dare I say... perfect lines...


Tape takes away from the trade, making people think anyone can paint. The real skill is in the free hand


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

Pretty Handy Mandi said:


> Tape takes away from the trade, making people think anyone can paint. The real skill is in the free hand



I a little surprised you are so anti tape considering you like the mini rollers. The two often complement each other.

For instance, painting a door with a mini and a foamie if you tape the hinges, knob (assuming its not taken off), and other hardware you can then roll right up to everything leaving a consistent texture. 
Sure, any painter ought to be able to cut around hinges or a knob, but then you have brush strokes next to these areas. You can roll up close to them, but they are still there. With a concave foam roller and tape there need be no hint of a brush stroke on a door anywhere. 

A bad tape job looks like crap, but its not the tapes fault


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

I just had a painter who has painted for 14 years call. He has been being paid $17/hr and being 1099'd.


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## SemiproJohn (Jul 29, 2013)

Pretty Handy Mandi said:


> Tape takes away from the trade, making people think anyone can paint. The real skill is in the free hand


I can only agree with you to an extent. I never tape when I don't have to. And I never fail to tape if that is the more efficient and effective technique. 

And you obviously never use a sprayer. 

Bottom line for me: Taping, when necessary, is a time saver and outcome enhancer. I'm not going to fiddle around free-handing something that is difficult if taping is going to be faster and give me the desired result.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

DeanV said:


> I have a basic 3 bed 1.5 bath home , 2,300 sq ft, 2 stall garage attached, plus 1.5 stall detached garage. Value is 160,000-170,000. Built in the 1960's. Suburban area outside Michigan's second largest city. Grand Rapids. So, Canada home values sound more like California and Chicago, east coast to me.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


As several people have mentioned, it varies a lot. OTOH, I came across an article in the last day or so that lists housing prices in Vancouver, BC as the second highest in the WORLD!


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

Jmayspaint said:


> I a little surprised you are so anti tape considering you like the mini rollers. The two often complement each other.
> 
> For instance, painting a door with a mini and a foamie if you tape the hinges, knob (assuming its not taken off), and other hardware you can then roll right up to everything leaving a consistent texture.
> Sure, any painter ought to be able to cut around hinges or a knob, but then you have brush strokes next to these areas. You can roll up close to them, but they are still there. With a concave foam roller and tape there need be no hint of a brush stroke on a door anywhere.
> ...


True. I'm referring to tape used for the formation of lines along trim. Not for utility purposes

:thumbsup:


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## bklynboy1970 (Oct 8, 2013)

SemiproJohn said:


> I had some self-gratifying feelings at work earlier today as I removed some painter's tape from some intricate wood panels and saw the nice...dare I say... perfect lines...


I could have free handed it with no problem....I'm old shool raised by craftsman...Italian uncle
Anybody can tape caulk ...whipe caulk run paint...I'm not saying I'm the best by no means ...look back in history of painters....tape is for people who don't know how to paint!! That's why they hire pros....


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

SemiproJohn said:


> And you obviously never use a sprayer.
> 
> __________________________________________


Woah, yer nilly.

You. Obviously. Nothing.

I use a sprayer for ceilings, soffit fascia & gutters, wood shelving/furniture. 

In general, I appreciate the milage of a roller vs. spraying.

.... next time you can try not to asSume anything else about me.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

So back to the wage thing Handi Mandi. You earn $15.00 an hour while your significant other is out of the pot? What gives? He's got to be bringing home the bacon by some other means. A person can starve to death on those wages. At least in California you can.


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

Just THIS particular job. I'm usually self employed.

And please refrain from wondering about my man's bacon, he has plenty meat.


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

It's Pretty Handy Mandi

Handy with a y

Mandi with an i


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Pretty Handy Mandi said:


> Just THIS particular job. I'm usually self employed.
> 
> And please refrain from wondering about my man's bacon, he has plenty meat.


So he's unemployed. Whatever. Still, You should be raising your wages for the talent that you are. Don't sell yourself short.


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

CApainter said:


> So he's unemployed. Whatever. Still, You should be raising your wages for the talent that you are. Don't sell yourself short.


Your insensitivity is harsh. My husband is disabled. Things will be plenty good in a short amount of time. Ty


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Pretty Handy Mandi said:


> Your insensitivity is harsh. My husband is disabled. Things will be plenty good in a short amount of time. Ty


Sorry to hear that. I must have overlooked that in another thread. I was under the impression that your husband was a painting contractor that employed you. My sincere apologies.


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

Thank you. Bklynboy, my husband fell through a floor at a job site in NY.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Pretty Handy Mandi said:


> Thank you. Bklynboy, my husband fell through a floor at a job site in NY.


That really sucks. I've been in the industrial painting trade for many years, and I understand the hazards that can instantly befall a man.

I sense you are a very enthusiastic and hard working person Pretty Handy Mandi. Your husband is a very lucky man to have you as a partner. 

Good luck to you both!


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## bklynboy1970 (Oct 8, 2013)

This is my friend in south dakota...my other friend is in North Dakota making 21 hr....


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## bklynboy1970 (Oct 8, 2013)

bklynboy1970 said:


> This is my friend in south dakota...my other friend is in North Dakota making 21 hr....


Just have to keep looking till you find the right contractor....
Pack of cigs in Boston and ny 15$ a pack...gas is the same all over couple cents diff...$3.65 in fl...my boy says cost of living is cheap...they same about fl...oh and some idiot contractor on here from fl says recession. ..my ass prices didn't change nor did work flow ....my brother stayed forman at his company and they did the same numbers as before so called recession as did in it in the millions ...food is the same across the board expensive ... painters just get treated like ****....
Little story I ran into a painter in grocery store...just moved from p.a I asked hey bro any thing good he said naw 14 hr...year later...granted he's a good painter...I was on a job different trade and was working seen this painter dude and asked hey bro is the company treating you good he said I'm the same dude you asked that 1 year ago....he remembered I didn't and he said same chit different year.. solid guy....too its always been a ruff life as a painter ...working for the man....


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## Damon T (Nov 22, 2008)

Gough said:


> As several people have mentioned, it varies a lot. OTOH, I came across an article in the last day or so that lists housing prices in Vancouver, BC as the second highest in the WORLD!



Those are Canadian dollars so they don't count.


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## Damon T (Nov 22, 2008)

Pretty Handy Mandi said:


> Kudos to all that give their guys respectable wages.
> 
> Turns out the coach's house is grossly underpaid for the size of the project.
> 
> ...



How's that working for you?


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

I think that's cool you got the owner of the house, you're painting, to pose with you Pretty Handy Mandi. Not many HO's will have the confidence in their painters to do that.


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## paintball head (Mar 3, 2012)

Thats Lovie Smith present coach of the Tampa Bay Bucaneers and former coach of the Chicago Bears. Multi millionaire.


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

Seattle just raised their minimum wage to $15 per hour. Now from what I understand this only applies to companies with 250 or more employees, but the smaller companies are going to get phased in over the next 3 years. Now luckily I don't live in Seattle, because I cannot pay a helper or an apprentice $15 per hour.


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

bklynboy1970 said:


> View attachment 23672
> 
> 
> This is my friend in south dakota...my other friend is in North Dakota making 21 hr....


Man, they would have to pay me a lot more than that to live there. :no: When I was working in Newark NJ I was offered $38 + full benifits and I passed. No desire to live there :no:


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## Damon T (Nov 22, 2008)

bklynboy1970 said:


> View attachment 23673
> 
> 
> My portfolio....slick mouth



I was referring to PHM talking about making $5.25 an hour after all was said and done, but enjoying the gratification of a job well done. I've had plenty of bids go south and not make peanuts, and it takes the enjoyment out of it for me when I realize I'm practically paying for the "opportunity" to paint their house. No thanks. 


Sent from my blah blah blah


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## Pretty Handy Mandi (Oct 6, 2013)

I entirely love to paint houses. There is nothing I'd rather be doing and I just try and keep a good attitude.


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## paintball head (Mar 3, 2012)

His players in Chicago loved him and when the Bears fired him a couple of them threatened to retire. He is a very good defensive coach but the thing that got him fired in Chicago was a mediocre offense. So I wouldn't advise that you ask him if TBs offense will be better than what he had in Chicago.:no:


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

Woodland said:


> Man, they would have to pay me a lot more than that to live there. :no: When I was working in Newark NJ I was offered $38 + full benifits and I passed. No desire to live there :no:


What!? How could you pass up an opportunity to live in the best city on Earth?


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

paintball head said:


> To be clear, I tape base before rolling a wall. You roll a wall and then wipe the splatter off the base?



Um, no. That was a poor attempt at sarcasm. I do know some old timers around here that never tape base. They would tell you that if your roller is splattering, your just rolling too fast

There is an alternative to taping base though, on occasion when it has made more sense to cut in the base rather than tape, a long bent piece of cardboard can be used as a shield. Take a long piece of cardboard about two feet wide and bend one edge so that it goes up on the wall just enough to cover the base. It then becomes your drop cloth and base shield.


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

Rbriggs82 said:


> What!? How could you pass up an opportunity to live in the best city on Earth?
> 
> The Best Empire State of Mind Parody - Newark State of Mind - Jay-Z Alicia Keys - YouTube


Lol Thanks Ryan  Thats was some funny **** :thumbup:


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## paintball head (Mar 3, 2012)

Jmayspaint said:


> Um, no. That was a poor attempt at sarcasm. I do know some old timers around here that never tape base. They would tell you that if your roller is splattering, your just rolling too fast
> 
> There is an alternative to taping base though, on occasion when it has made more sense to cut in the base rather than tape, a long bent piece of cardboard can be used as a shield.* Take a long piece of cardboard about two feet wide and bend one edge so that it goes up on the wall just enough to cover* the base. It then becomes your drop cloth and base shield.


I've done it:thumbsup:


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## BuckeyePainter (Feb 14, 2014)

Honesty nobody should make less than $9/hr in painting. Not even helpers because they do have to move around a lot and painting is not something everybody can do. Unfortunately in my neck of the woods, helpers generally get like $8-10 max/hr solid painters usually around $12-15 max/hr, your commercial/hardcore sprayers will get maybe $25 max/hr.


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## bklynboy1970 (Oct 8, 2013)

Rbriggs82 said:


> What!? How could you pass up an opportunity to live in the best city on Earth?
> 
> Video Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4U7kuqow3gg


Lol...I used to work over in that area...boss man would pay cash. ..and always Friday morning. ..not at night ...arm pit of the world


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## PRECISIONVANCOUVER (Apr 15, 2013)

PressurePros said:


> It's relative. Average price of a home in the US is $170K. Average in Canada $400K. Our food prices are also about half to three quarters yours and gas is approximately 30% less expensive.



Yeah exactly, our wages pay higher in Canada but also we have higher inflated cost's.


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## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

PRECISIONVANCOUVER said:


> Yeah exactly, our wages pay higher in Canada but also we have higher inflated cost's.


Property tax? It is a big nut in some places. Mine for example. What is ur property tax like?
Half my mortgage is property tax. I could afford a 500k house, and that'd be a really nice crib here, but no way could I afford the property tax on that crib.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

Oden said:


> Property tax? It is a big nut in some places. Mine for example. What is ur property tax like?
> Half my mortgage is property tax. I could afford a 500k house, and that'd be a really nice crib here, but no way could I afford the property tax on that crib.


The property taxes on our Canadian place are about 50% higher than in the states.


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## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

Gough said:


> The property taxes on our Canadian place are about 50% higher than in the states.


OMG!
But the states vary we know. My house worth about 250k I pay 7k a year. Property tax.


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## paintball head (Mar 3, 2012)

Oden said:


> OMG!
> But the states vary we know. My house worth about 250k I pay 7k a year. Property tax.


I'm in the Chicago burbs and pretty much the exact same property tax on the same valued home.


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## Damon T (Nov 22, 2008)

That seems huge tax. I think mine are about half ($3500) for a house of similar value. It recently appraised at $350 but I think our tax assessment had it around $250. However our sales tax is 9.5% so that adds up fast. 


Sent from my blah blah blah


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