# Covering Oak Grain When Repainting Cabinets.



## RH

I know this has been covered before but the search function… well you know.

Wondering if a few of you would share your start to finish process, including primer used, when painting previously stained oak cabinets in which you want to cover all or most of the grain. Personally, I'm not a fan of trying to eliminate all grain but that isn't necessarily the view of some potential customers.

Thanks,
Dan


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## straight_lines

Oil or white shellac most of the time. Bondo for heavy repairs and glazing and spot putty to fill open grain. You can actually buff it in with a rag. Dries fast and sands really smooth without loading paper.


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## stelzerpaintinginc.

RH said:


> I know this has been covered before but the search function… well you know.
> 
> Wondering if a few of you would share your start to finish process, including primer used, when painting previously stained oak cabinets in which you want to cover all or most of the grain. Personally, I'm not a fan of trying to eliminate all grain but that isn't necessarily the view of some potential customers.
> 
> Thanks,
> Dan


So many variables to give a one-size-fits-all process, even with the info you provided. Much of it first depends upon how well the cabinets were initially sealed. I've tried to get away from these jobs, since the cost of filling nearly all of the grain is rarely justifiable in comparison to just getting new doors. I've also given the option to just fill door faces & boxes. 

Jasco No-Rinse TSP for starters...let's get that out of the way...

FILLING GRAIN:
-If you're applying by brush, hard to beat FPOE Swedish Putty.
-If you can spray it, (my preferred method), ML Campbell Natural Paste Wood Filler, thinned to approx 50/50, is awesome. 

PRIMER:
-BIN, (Shellac or Bin Advanced, depending upon preference, conditions & logistics)
-Stix & Seal Grip are also good. Some like Coverstain, but I'd rather deal with the short-term smell of Shellac if I'm using a solvent-based primer.
-MLC Level Primer if you want one of the heaviest-build primers .

-TOPCOAT
-Breakthrough is becoming a fav of mine, but there's a ton of good products IMO, (Cabinet Coat, Kem Aqua, and one of your favs, Durapoxy), to name a few.

I know this wasn't the format you wanted, but my choice of any of the above products would depend upon a number of variables. I've resorted to making sample boards of options for them, along with their respective price, just so we can be clear about expectations from the start.


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## RH

stelzerpaintinginc. said:


> So many variables to give a one-size-fits-all process, even with the info you provided. Much of it first depends upon how well the cabinets were initially sealed. I've tried to get away from these jobs, since the cost of filling nearly all of the grain is rarely justifiable in comparison to just getting new doors. I've also given the option to just fill door faces & boxes.
> 
> Jasco No-Rinse TSP for starters...let's get that out of the way...
> 
> FILLING GRAIN:
> -If you're applying by brush, hard to beat FPOE Swedish Putty.
> -If you can spray it, (my preferred method), ML Campbell Natural Paste Wood Filler, thinned to approx 50/50, is awesome.
> 
> PRIMER:
> -BIN, (Shellac or Bin Advanced, depending upon preference, conditions & logistics)
> -Stix & Seal Grip are also good. Some like Coverstain, but I'd rather deal with the short-term smell of Shellac if I'm using a solvent-based primer.
> -MLC Level Primer if you want one of the heaviest-build primers .
> 
> -TOPCOAT
> -Breakthrough is becoming a fav of mine, but there's a ton of good products IMO, (Cabinet Coat, Kem Aqua, and one of your favs, Durapoxy), to name a few.
> 
> I know this wasn't the format you wanted, but my choice of any of the above products would depend upon a number of variables. I've resorted to making sample boards of options for them, along with their respective price, just so we can be clear about expectations from the start.


No, this is just fine Troy. I've done some of this in the past but it's been awhile and just wanted to get an idea of any newer processes and products. Your feedback is appreciated.

The HO and I have already talked about the option of new door and drawer fronts versus the cost of doing a repaint. The kicker is, this is being considered on a house that's going on the market. Seems a bit silly IMO to spend all of this money just to turn around and sell it. As important as kitchens are, most of the time aged cabinets are just put on the list of things to replace by the buyers. But, it's not my dime so...


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## Epoxy Pro

Fine paints of Europe brushing putty.


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## MIZZOU

I tell them on the phone that we don't fill oak grain lol. The plus side to painting oak cabinets for me is that they can pretty much be rolled/brushed and look just about as good as sprayed.


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## The Cutting Edge

MIZZOU said:


> I tell them on the phone that we don't fill oak grain lol. The plus side to painting oak cabinets for me is that they can pretty much be rolled/brushed and look just about as good as sprayed.


I'm the same. I'll tell them upfront the grains gonna show. Ive never lost a job by telling them that. I have a cabinet door already painted that I show them. By the time I price to them my labor to fill all the grain they could have bought all new doors. I'm still interested in how you guys do it though.
Scuff the Polly if they've got it, tsp, shellac, and Breakthrough.


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## Jmayspaint

What I've been doing lately with oak is selling grain reduction rather than grain filling. In other words, they will still see grain, and be able to tell its wood but the deep grain and pin holes common in oak are filled. 

The process I've used on the last few sets is;

1. Prime with Bin synthetic shellac. 
2. Spray grain reducer, two coats on boxes and fronts of doors/drawers, one on door backs and sand. 
3. Spray finish coats, Breakthrough most recently. 
(Necessary initial and between coat prep assumed) 


I've had good success using this product as a grain reducer;

http://fauxcenter.com/faux-effects-...finishing-medium/master-finishing-medium.html

Two coats un thinned, sprayed at around 5mil does a great job of filling the pin holes and reducing the grain overall. 

Here's a pic of a sample door illustrating the reduction process;










As opposed to a sample of painting with Breakthrough and no grain reduction. 










Being able to spray all steps, including the reduction step, is what makes it economically feasible as opposed to new doors. 

Here's an example pic of the most recent oak set I did. Same color as my sample doors; 









Have an oak set set coming up next week where the client elected to go with painting only and no grain reduction. Either way can be fine depending on expectations.


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## PressurePros

I used FPOE brushing putty on mine. I diluted and did two thinner coats (still had to brush apply). Sanded between coats. Primed with Bin oil, then spray topcoated with 2 coats of Muralo. Surface is hard as nails. I ran a fork over a door to test the durability pushing down very hard. Didn't even scratch it. 

And I will NEVER do that type of project again. The time and labor input are ridiculous. Of course you pros already know that ;-)


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## straight_lines

PressurePros said:


> I used FPOE brushing putty on mine. I diluted and did two thinner coats (still had to brush apply). Sanded between coats. Primed with Bin oil, then spray topcoated with 2 coats of Muralo. Surface is hard as nails. I ran a fork over a door to test the durability pushing down very hard. Didn't even scratch it.
> 
> And I will NEVER do that type of project again. The time and labor input are ridiculous. Of course you pros already know that ;-)


That's why we get paid the big bucks. :jester:


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## PressurePros

straight_lines said:


> That's why we get paid the big bucks. :jester:


As you should!


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## PNW Painter

Jmayspaint, do sand the grain reducer before you spray the finish coats?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Jmayspaint

PNW Painter said:


> Jmayspaint, do sand the grain reducer before you spray the finish coats?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Yes. The finishing medium sands really well. Spraying it on reduces the need for sanding. If it's brushed or rolled on, obviously it takes more to smooth it out.


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## beedoola

Is BIN preferable to Zinsser Oil-based Cover Stain for this application?


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## Jmayspaint

beedoola said:


> Is BIN preferable to Zinsser Oil-based Cover Stain for this application?



I prefer it, especially the new WB synthetic. There has been a few times though where Bin (the original) shellac has failed to block bleeding on oak. One set I remember I primed twice with Bin and some bleed was still coming through the top coat. I ended up having to prime again with Coverstain. Most of the time when that's happened, it's been small isolated spots and I just spot prime them with a Coverstain spray can. I don't think it's tannins that it's failing to block, but rather kitchen oils/contaminates that have soaked deeply into the open oak grain. 

Some say Bin shellac isn't a great primer for cabinets because it's brittle. That's another advantage of the synthetic, it forms a flexible film.


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