# Need help bidding on a big hotel



## barang (Jun 20, 2012)

Hi everyone.
Im a young painting contractor trying to move up in the world. I just got offered the biggest job of my life. whats the going rate per square foot for commercial interior painting? this job is 2-coat prime 2 coats paint (ceilings, wall, trim, doors). I honestly have no clue what to price. I really dont want to throw a stupid figure with my price off by 30k because this is a huge job. I have the total sq ft so i can come up with a good number if i know the average going rate per sq ft wall suface


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## ReNt A PaInTeR (Dec 28, 2008)




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## ReNt A PaInTeR (Dec 28, 2008)

....


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## scottjr (Jan 14, 2012)

Here is some free advice. If you don't know how to bid the job, you are not qualified to tackle it.

Since you are young, I would start on something much smaller so if you are way off on your bid, you won't lose your shirt on the job.


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## Paradigmzz (May 5, 2010)

.40-1.00 a foot.


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## Paradigmzz (May 5, 2010)

Where's the job?


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## barang (Jun 20, 2012)

can someone please help I've been painting for years and never got a job this big i really need help pricing


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

barang said:


> Hi everyone.
> Im a young painting contractor trying to move up in the world. I just got offered the biggest job of my life. whats the going rate per square foot for commercial interior painting? this job is 2-coat prime 2 coats paint (ceilings, wall, trim, doors). I honestly have no clue what to price. I really dont want to throw a stupid figure with my price off by 30k because this is a huge job. I have the total sq ft so i can come up with a good number if i know the average going rate per sq ft wall suface


 
why???:blink:


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## PhillysFinest (Jun 9, 2012)

barang said:


> Hi everyone.
> Im a young painting contractor trying to move up in the world. I just got offered the biggest job of my life. whats the going rate per square foot for commercial interior painting? this job is 2-coat prime 2 coats paint (ceilings, wall, trim, doors). I honestly have no clue what to price. I really dont want to throw a stupid figure with my price off by 30k because this is a huge job. I have the total sq ft so i can come up with a good number if i know the average going rate per sq ft wall suface


 

You are asking for a price based on wall sq ft, but then you say you are including: ceilings, wall, trim, doors.
Is it new construction?
Are you planing on spraying or brush & roll?
How high are the ceilings?
You need to give more detail!


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## Schmidt & Co. (Nov 6, 2008)

barang said:


> can someone please help I've been painting for years and never got a job this big i really need help pricing


Ignore the term "going rate" and just price it how you would any other job. The "going rate" might just be below your cost of doing business, and could be a fast track to going out of business. Break it down into sections, and add it all up. 

*BUT*, if its really out of your league I'd pass on the job. Think long and hard about if you can handle the job. Can you finance it for 30-90 days while waiting to get paid?


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## PhillysFinest (Jun 9, 2012)

scottjr said:


> Here is some free advice. If you don't know how to bid the job, you are not qualified to tackle it.
> 
> Since you are young, I would start on something much smaller so if you are way off on your bid, you won't lose your shirt on the job.


Knowing how to 'do the job' and 'pricing the job' are 2 different animals...


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## ReNt A PaInTeR (Dec 28, 2008)

PhillysFinest said:


> Knowing how to 'do the job' and 'pricing the job' are 2 different animals...


I just logged in to thank you for that post.


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## TheRogueBristle (Mar 19, 2010)

Schmidt & Co. said:


> *BUT*, if its really out of your league I'd pass on the job. Think long and hard about if you can handle the job. Can you finance it for 30-90 days while waiting to get paid?


Sage advice. It's not easy and usually takes a while to have a business with the liquidity to handle longer term jobs. This job could end up sinking you or at the very least have you pulling your hair out for weeks.


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## robladd (Nov 22, 2010)

Paradigmzz said:


> .40-1.00 a foot.


.33-.39 I'm a Lowballer


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Wow! There's another guy on PT who's posted almost the same question. What are the odds?

Don't hog all the popcorn Edgar.


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## ReNt A PaInTeR (Dec 28, 2008)

researchhound said:


> Wow! There's another guy on PT who's posted almost the same question. What are the odds?
> 
> Don't hog all the popcorn Edgar.


I wonder how they got here. Did you know that if you google panda logo or if you should sue a client for $700 this site comes up first with flashing lights. :jester:


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

^^^:lol::lol::lol:


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## gabe (Apr 20, 2012)

Here is my two cents, compute your own production rate. Start with one hotel room. Set up, prep, spray, finishes, doors and jams. How many hours will it take you, how much paint? If the job is big and you need help, know that your production rate will change. Add in a fudge factor and triple check your numbers. You will get better replies from this group if you asked" I figured to paint 250 sq feet of drywall in one hr, how long does it take you?"give pics , measurements and methods. Good luck


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## lmcgrew79 (Jan 6, 2010)

My advice for you is not to bid the job hard dollar. If you dont know how to price it you could end up bankrupt. Let just say you finish the 8th floor im guessing you will be working from the top down, and you figure you are in the hole $5000.00 it may be a good time to jump because it isnt going to get any better. 

If you have already been offered the job, figure out your hourly rate per man and see if they will let you do the job t&m, or cost plus. May be the safest way for you to do a job that size and keep the data on it for future reference. 

Paint jobs are usually between 2-4% total price of a job. DO NOT USE THIS FOR ESTIMATING. Just a rough idea to figure how big the job could be. But a 8 story hotel has to be in the range of 10-15 million maybe more.


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## barang (Jun 20, 2012)

*Help Im very close to becoming rich or bankrupt (HUGE COMMERCIAL JOB)*

Hi , I just got offered a big painting job this job its worth about 120000 8 floors. but i have a big problem, the bid due date is tomorrow 8am and I cant figure out how to send in my proposal. here are the things they are looking for:
"All pricing should be per a 4 month schedule .Break out all pricing per the BID FORM 

Bid Form:
Base Bid#1 -groundfloor
Base Bid #2- rooms
Base bid #3 -corridors
General conditions
Performance and payment cost
Fee costs

This is my fist job im bidding on in this type of magnitude, the project manager is pretty busy with calls its hard to even get him on the line so i really need help. if someone has a sample that would be cool, if not i need to identify what is "General Conditions" which i think may mean total price. and i need to know what is "Performance and Payment cost" I think thats my labor expense, and do i get this upfront? 
I also need to know what is "Fee Costs" im thinking its cost for permits and insurance 
im really not sure im sure u guys that have more experience with this type of stuff and also do i put my tools and material under "Fee Costs" or "Performance & Payment Costs"
i really need help and also if i get a signed contract for a huge figure could i use it to get a small business loan


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## South-FL-Painter (Jan 17, 2012)

For real? ))))


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

Oh boy.


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## Schmidt & Co. (Nov 6, 2008)

If its due tomorrow, I think your out of luck to figure it all out. Your questions are rather important, get any of them wrong and it WILL put you out of business. 

Just let this one go.


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## barang (Jun 20, 2012)

Yes for REAL!


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## caulktheline (Feb 10, 2011)

try our glowing paint


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Do you start figuring your taxes on April 15th also?

I gotta opine, it's a little late to be trying to put a professional proposal together.

I advise you pass on this one and work on getting your bidding process better organized.


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## Gwarel (May 8, 2012)

I vote bankrupt


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## Schmidt & Co. (Nov 6, 2008)

By the way, you only need to start ONE thread on the same topic. You got great advise in the other ones. I'd heed it if I were you.


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## South-FL-Painter (Jan 17, 2012)

You wan't to learn to estimate 8 floor hotel over one day?I don't think,thank you have a chance on this dream.Its either,let it go or eyeball,but my suggestion would be,put on extra its better not to get that job,than to lowball it and go bankrupt because those people will eat you down to dirt soonest they will smell the mess.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Schmidt & Co. said:


> By the way, you only need to start ONE thread on the same topic. You got great advise in the other ones. I'd heed it if I were you.



i fixed it. I merged them


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## Schmidt & Co. (Nov 6, 2008)

daArch said:


> i fixed it. I merged them


Thanks Bill. Still on my phone.


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## StripandCaulk (Dec 30, 2011)

IF you wear whites, YOU CAN DO IT!

Barang-you have opened up this thread on multiple forums now, most of them have been shut down. Bigger jobs mean bigger face figures, but not neccesarily bigger profit. If you are off, the duration for which you are screwing yourself is just that much longer and painful. My .02 would be to walk away if you cant bid it


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## ReNt A PaInTeR (Dec 28, 2008)

Schmidt & Co. said:


> Still on my phone.


No wonder


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## lmcgrew79 (Jan 6, 2010)

Some questions i have ill help if i can

1 How many sqft of wall
2 how many sqft of ceilings
3 how many doors or door frames to paint
4 how many bulkheads
5 any wood trim to be painted if so how much
6 how many rooms are there
7 any exterior work
8 any caulking door frames or anything else cabinets, windows etc.
9 why 2 coats of paint and 2 coats of finish?
10 How many men do you have
11 I would imagine there are also 2 stairwells. If prepping and painting 8 floors worth steel risers, girders, railings, and walls you will have at least 640 man hours in the stairwells.


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## Schmidt & Co. (Nov 6, 2008)

lmcgrew79 said:


> Some questions i have ill help if i can
> 
> 1 How many sqft of wall
> 2 how many sqft of ceilings
> ...


The bid is due at 8:00AM tomorrow. There's no way he can put a well thought out proposal without missing something, or just plain guessing. Theres just no way.

My guess is that he will STILL submit a lowball bid, thinking he's going to make a killing. Half way through the job he's going to "learn" estimating.


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## lmcgrew79 (Jan 6, 2010)

Schmidt & Co. said:


> The bid is due at 8:00AM tomorrow. There's no way he can put a well thought out proposal without missing something, or just plain guessing. Theres just no way.
> 
> My guess is that he will STILL submit a lowball bid, thinking he's going to make a killing. Half way through the job he's going to "learn" estimating.


I agree but im sure 120,000 wont touch it. Well though out no way, but some advice i can give if this is a real post. I hate to see someone go bankrupt. 8 stories is a pretty big hotel possibly 400-500 rooms. 120,000 is about 250 to 300 per room, not including corridors, stairwells and the ground floor conference or bar whatever.

Average hotel room walls and ceiling is 1000 sq ft off wall space or more x 4 coats of paint / by 350 sq ft per gallon = 170 dollar per room worth of materials. Just rough math. @120,000 he can sell them the paint


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## TexPro Painters (Jun 21, 2012)

*Do you research*



barang said:


> Hi everyone.
> Im a young painting contractor trying to move up in the world. I just got offered the biggest job of my life. whats the going rate per square foot for commercial interior painting? this job is 2-coat prime 2 coats paint (ceilings, wall, trim, doors). I honestly have no clue what to price. I really dont want to throw a stupid figure with my price off by 30k because this is a huge job. I have the total sq ft so i can come up with a good number if i know the average going rate per sq ft wall suface


If you are indeed looking to get that right, you must first do your research. Go and ask for price quotations from well established professional painters. You can't just quote your own price without a good basis for it. That will help you in doing your business well.


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## robladd (Nov 22, 2010)

I was going to tell a Hell A story here about bidding hotels. This thread is not boring but it could use a little juice.

I will try and simplify, do you OWN a paint store.

Do you know a couple commercial estimators that could help you with this bid about 4 weeks ago.

If you say NO to any of these questions.

MOVE ON


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

barang said:


> Hi , I just got offered a big painting job this job its worth about 120000 8 floors. but i have a big problem, the bid due date is tomorrow 8am and I cant figure out how to send in my proposal. here are the things they are looking for:
> "All pricing should be per a 4 month schedule .Break out all pricing per the BID FORM
> 
> Bid Form:
> ...


say what?:blink:


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## painterguy07 (Dec 20, 2011)

If you're just gong off of what you should charge per square foot then go buy the National Construction Estimator, or download the program. It has in there the way to bid out your doors, windows, trim, ect. Sounds like you're in way over your head. I'd bail while you still can.


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## Lambrecht (Feb 8, 2010)

Please tell us that you did not submit a bid this morning.


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## kdpaint (Aug 14, 2010)

Please send us a copy of the bid...please please please please please:thumbup: 
I kid, because I love...


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

The likelihood of him getting this job are slim to none and Slim just left town. He's not gonna bid it correctly. His contract is going to be hokey and amateur and his bid is not going to be in the right realm, either too high or too low. Couple those with being young and inexperienced in commercial jargon and I doubt this will be nothing more than an effort towards futility. 

My old business mentor used to say to me, "Some of the best deals I've made have been the ones I didn't do." So true in all business.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

PressurePros said:


> The likelihood of him getting this job are slim to none and Slim just left town. He's not gonna bid it correctly. His contract is going to be hokey and amateur and his bid is not going to be in the right realm, either too high or too low. Couple those with being young and inexperienced in commercial jargon and I doubt this will be nothing more than an effort towards futility.
> 
> My old business mentor used to say to me, "Some of the best deals I've made have been the ones I didn't do." So true in all business.


This is why I was curious to see how he even got the chance to bid on a project this large without apparently having any basic structure to his estimating process.

Do contractors even vet their subs before tasking them with significant responsibilities, or do they just want the lowest bid? In this instance it doesn't seem like the contractor, or owner is too concerned about the painting. It appears they just want a body, a low price, and results. I can see how an ambitious young contractor can get in over his head with these standards.


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

ReNt A PaInTeR said:


> I wonder how they got here. Did you know that if you google panda logo or if you should sue a client for $700 this site comes up first with flashing lights. :jester:


Ive seen the "$700" thread, but never bothered to click it. My question is WTF is a "Panda logo"? :blink: I saw that memntioned the other day but had no idea what ya'll were talkin about.


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## ReNt A PaInTeR (Dec 28, 2008)

Woodland said:


> Ive seen the "$700" thread, but never bothered to click it. My question is WTF is a "Panda logo"? :blink: I saw that memntioned the other day but had no idea what ya'll were talkin about.


Some guy that thought that this logo was the bomb.


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## gliddenprofessional (May 24, 2012)

Why don't you figure out your cost to do it, add your markup and bid that number?


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Woodland said:


> Ive seen the "$700" thread, but never bothered to click it. My question is WTF is a "Panda logo"? :blink: I saw that memntioned the other day but had no idea what ya'll were talkin about.


http://www.painttalk.com/f2/my-logo-19401/


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## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

PressurePros said:


> The likelihood of him getting this job are slim to none and Slim just left town. He's not gonna bid it correctly. His contract is going to be hokey and amateur and his bid is not going to be in the right realm, either too high or too low. Couple those with being young and inexperienced in commercial jargon and I doubt this will be nothing more than an effort towards futility.
> 
> My old business mentor used to say to me, "Some of the best deals I've made have been the ones I didn't do." So true in all business.


I wouldn't be so sure. We don't know what hotel he is bidding on. I'm willing to bet it's not a four star or a chain. This guy isn't getting an invitation to bid on them for sure. A lot of these run down hotels got bought and are operated by immigrants. I've seen people start up by getting repaints off of these people with the mechanical skills to paint them but very little business savvy. I know of two cases. I've seen it happen.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

I willing to bet this guy was a troll.


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

ReNt A PaInTeR said:


> Some guy that thought that this logo was the bomb.


 LMFAO Thats some funny chit there :thumbup: I almost choked on my dinner. First I only saw the Panda and kinda chuckled, then I scrolled down a bit more...and... Lol Good one Edgar :thumbsup:


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## StripandCaulk (Dec 30, 2011)

ReNt A PaInTeR said:


> Some guy that thought that this logo was the bomb.


Mike should really consider rebranding. I still dont get the panda. I would have gone with a walrus personally


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

StripandCaulk said:


> Mike should really consider rebranding. I still dont get the panda. I would have gone with a walrus personally


Lol Yeah, Im considering it, the walrus was already taken plus I already have the Panda graphics on my truck and trailer, business cards, website, and yes.....T Shirts too :thumbup: Now, heres another clue for you all....the walrus was Paul :whistling2:


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## ReNt A PaInTeR (Dec 28, 2008)

I can add your phone number for $20 if you want Licensed and Insured those are $10 more.


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

researchhound said:


> http://www.painttalk.com/f2/my-logo-19401/


Lol Yeah, I missed that thread. Looked like it was doomed from the beginning. However, I do think Patrick is onto something with the Kitty Cat logo :thumbsup:


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

ReNt A PaInTeR said:


> I can add your phone number for $20 if you want Licensed and Insured those are $10 more.


Sounds good lol :thumbup:


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

I've been using the same logo for years


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

ReNt A PaInTeR said:


> Some guy that thought that this logo was the bomb.


I posted it on my facebook and told everyone its my new logo. :whistling2:


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Woodland said:


> heres another clue for you all....the walrus was Paul :whistling2:


you must be psychic, that was on my iPod yesterday.

I laughed at how we all thought it was a clue back then, now that Paul just celebrated his 70th last Monday.


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

daArch said:


> you must be psychic, that was on my iPod yesterday.
> 
> I laughed at how we all thought it was a clue back then, now that Paul just celebrated his 70th last Monday.


 I was wondering who would get that one. :thumbsup: The younger ones here probably have no idea what Im talking about


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Woodland said:


> Lol Yeah, Im considering it, the walrus was already taken plus I already have the Panda graphics on my truck and trailer, business cards, website, and yes.....T Shirts too :thumbup: Now, heres another clue for you all....the walrus was Paul :whistling2:





Woodland said:


> I was wondering who would get that one. :thumbsup: The younger ones here probably have no idea what Im talking about




"Goo goo g'joob goo"


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