# Anybody know of a situation like this?



## propainterJ

My wifes Nephew was working as a laborer for a guy who does all kinds of things mostly that simulated rock they attach to walls and chimneys.

Anyway this guy,he's 40,was in a scissor lift trimmimg trees at the bosses house when he fell out,landed on his feet,shattered one heel,broke a couple vertabre and is in the hospital.

The kicker is that he was working for this guy under the table,the guy apparently lets him stay on his property and pays him in cash when he works him

And the Nephew,is a meth head,been in and out of prison,mostly in,for the last 15 years or so,and we're sure he's been using again,hell for all I know the guy jumped out of the lift to get some time off.

Isnt the contractor responsible to pay all medical bills and workers comp benefits ?

But when they draw blood from Rob and test it for drugs does that make the worker negligent and in effect negate any liability from the employer?

All I know is this is a mess I'll never be in,wont work someone under the table,ever


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## RCP

Wow, so many ways this could go. Sad story. 
Is the "boss" a licensed contractor?
Does he even have a workman's comp policy?
Was the lift a rental or his own?

It may fall under his homeowners insurance.
The hospitals and lawyers are going to want the money from someone, and they can go after anyone.

And you are exactly right, imagine if that was at a customer's home, and they ended up on the hook!


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## straight_lines

If he wasn't an employee then no way he was covered even if the guy has WC. I think Chris is correct it will fall under the homeowners policy even if he is dirty.


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## aaron61

Ditto.You said he was working illegally.Therefore no recod of him being an employee.This is the cost of doing shady business deals.I warn potential customers all the time of how easy an accident can happen.They like to play the odds in hopes of saving a few bucks.When it goes against them they cry foul and oh how they were taken by another shady contractor.In actuality it was their own greed.
My father,a retired union man,does this all the time.Pisses me off to no end!!!
It was ok for him to make big bucks but God how he won't pay it to anyone else.
That's a whole nother thread in itself.


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## NCPaint1

Most likely as stated above, under the HO's. Then the HO will have to sue the contractor ( or their respective insurance providers will handle the law suits ). Either way it sucks, and all the more reason to hire contractors that are on the up and up.


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## RCP

I bet the lift company will be part of it too. There was a random shooting in my state last year, the store that sold the gun is now being sued for selling the gun to an 18 year old.

If the contractor has wc, and rented the lift under his company name, wc could get involved. There have been cases where illegal immigrants were able to collect.


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## BreatheEasyHP

In Washington state, workers are considered employees even if you don't "hire" them officially.


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## straight_lines

If someone is paid cash under the table they aren't even a worker. Technically you have no relationship what so ever with them.


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## sagebrush123

how do you fall out of a scissor lift? 

You would have to be standing on the rails and really be leaning over.

I dislike stories such as these.

it makes it hard to "love thy neighbor" in a way.

the lift company just rents it -I can't imagine that it would be like renting a car-where only the renter can drive it.....

I want this guys boss to pay for the injury. that would be fair-but then again I could see this guy dumb for not insisting on a legite situation.


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## One Coat Coverage

The guy should have been wearing a harness in the lift.


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## Softy

In Calif you can get WC to pay for it, providing the boss has WC. The trick of getting it cover is different matter that I won't go into detail here and wont tell ever. As for falling off the lift, OSHA will most likely stiff his boss with major fine for failure to provide "employee" with proper working safety harness. It varies from state to state but here in CA, paying cash is same as check therefore he's consider as employed. Again, there's some trick of getting by this issue but it's too late to do anything.


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## chrisn

RCP said:


> I bet the lift company will be part of it too. There was a random shooting in my state last year, the store that sold the gun is now being sued for selling the gun to an 18 year old.
> 
> If the contractor has wc, and rented the lift under his company name, wc could get involved. There have been cases where illegal immigrants were able to collect.[/QUOTE]
> 
> 
> 
> Really? Now thats just wrong.:blink:


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## RCP

chrisn said:


> RCP said:
> 
> 
> 
> I bet the lift company will be part of it too. There was a random shooting in my state last year, the store that sold the gun is now being sued for selling the gun to an 18 year old.
> 
> If the contractor has wc, and rented the lift under his company name, wc could get involved. There have been cases where illegal immigrants were able to collect.[/QUOTE]
> 
> 
> 
> Really? Now thats just wrong.:blink:
> 
> 
> 
> Yep, check this out
Click to expand...


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## CApainter

According to this article http://www.articlepros.com/home_care/Construction-And-Equipment/article-420610.html a training program is required before operating a scissor lift. You can rent it, but you can't legally operate it. Could this hurt the victims case if the contractor can prove that he did not authorize the use of the scissor lift?


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## Softy

CApainter said:


> According to this article http://www.articlepros.com/home_care/Construction-And-Equipment/article-420610.html a training program is required before operating a scissor lift. You can rent it, but you can't legally operate it. Could this hurt the victims case if the contractor can prove that he did not authorize the use of the scissor lift?


Kind of hard to proof that since he was cutting the trees for his boss. I think in case like this just simply supply the kid with drugs and alcohol until statue of limitation run out.


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## chrisn

RCP said:


> chrisn said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yep, check this out
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, it's still just wrong.:yes:
Click to expand...


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## Blakelpd5

I'm doubting the GC is carrying WC coverage. Isn't that the reason GC's hire people under the table, is so they DON'T have to deal with WC, and the extra insurance costs?

I rented a lift to do some tree trimming on my property a few years ago. Ended up dropping a 12" diameter branch on the tounge of the lift I was using while 35' up in the air. ONE HELL OF A RIDE... You'll never catch me up that high again. Did over 4k in damage to the lift, and since it was my own home, HomeOwners paid for 1k, of the damage, I paid personally for the rest.

Like stated, everyone will put the blame on someone else. I think in the end, the Homeowner is going to be F-ed...

Will the boss be off the hook if there is meth in his system? Probably not. Especially if they can prove the boss knew he was a meth-head, and continuted to let him work.


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## cdaniels

it would be a damn shame if this costs the HO anything.....he hired a man to do some work.....not his fault the guy had a meth head working for him.


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## playedout6

I think if it had happened around here the guy that rented the lift would be libel for all damages . They told us that if you dig a hole and put up warning signs and somebody jumps in it then you are still responsible . We had overspray on a dozen cars once and I even had asked them all to move and nobody did . We caught a shift of wind and boom that made me libel according to my insurance company . They dropped our spray policy after that .


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## Workaholic

I think an update is due.


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