# Groupon for painters..ours is starting



## Seattlepainting (Jun 8, 2010)

Our deatils page is here http://www.shearerpainting.com/groupon.php


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

I like the Super Mario Bro's music.


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## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

try this music for your next video .............maybe you can incorporate a ''Fushigi'' ball next time???


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## Seattlepainting (Jun 8, 2010)

Ole34 said:


> try this for your next video .............maybe you can incorporate a ''Fushigi'' ball next time???
> 
> 
> YouTube - Buck Rogers - Future Dancing


How Hot was Erin G.?


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## RCP (Apr 18, 2007)

So how does Groupon work?


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## SDpaint (Aug 5, 2009)

I don't know about having the homeowners supply paint and all the materials. I would be worried about showing up and they forgot to get the paint, bought paint you hate using (this will probably happen 67% of the time) the complications are going to pile up. Other than that the groupon idea is a good one, I was talking about doing it, I just don't have the man power to take on 500 lowprofit jobs.


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## George Z (Apr 15, 2007)

Keep us updated on how it goes please.


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## Dunbar Painting (Mar 19, 2010)

What happens if they want ceilings, doors & trim done? do you just do that as an addon?


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

Very interesting time of the year to run this. Why?


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## ewingpainting.net (Jun 2, 2008)

The trap has been set, now the bait^^^


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

I think I leveled up :thumbsup:


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## KLaw (May 8, 2009)

I like it. Good thinking. I tried it too but was unable to get a mass mailing out or deal of the day. I always got beat out by a mexican place or steakhouse or etc... I did not put too much effort into understanding the "ins and outs" of groupon. But, like z says - please share your results. Thanks.


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

We had a guy use Groupon in our industry. He sold something like 200 house washes in a single day. Sounds good until you do the math...

Groupon wants you to cut your prices in half. This guy charged $150 for a washing (down south somewhere). So his ad ran for $75. In steps Groupon who now takes half of that. So he is left with $37.50 to wash a house. He is a one man show with no sales force to upsell. Something like that can bankrupt a company or at the very least make you miserable. 

On the plus side and harder to measure is increasing your customer database. My only concern would be the type of person you are bringing onboard. I would think the recision rate would be through the roof.


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## KLaw (May 8, 2009)

PressurePros said:


> We had a guy use Groupon in our industry. He sold something like 200 house washes in a single day. Sounds good until you do the math...
> 
> Groupon wants you to cut your prices in half. This guy charged $150 for a washing (down south somewhere). So his ad ran for $75. In steps Groupon who now takes half of that. So he is left with $37.50 to wash a house. He is a one man show with no sales force to upsell. Something like that can bankrupt a company or at the very least make you miserable.
> 
> On the plus side and harder to measure is increasing your customer database. My only concern would be the type of person you are bringing onboard. I would think the recision rate would be through the roof.


Zam - I did not realize that. Thanks for the feedback. Can you think of a scenario where it might be worth the risk? Thanks.


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## Andyman (Feb 21, 2009)

I believe the video showed a price of $249. So are you saying Groupon would take half of that leaving $124.50 to the contractor?


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## KLaw (May 8, 2009)

Andyman said:


> I believe the video showed a price of $249. So are you saying Groupon would take half of that leaving $124.50 to the contractor?


That is the same question I am asking. Maybe that's why it works better for the food biz?


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

Yes, Groupon will take 50% of the advertised/selling price.


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

KLaw said:


> Zam - I did not realize that. Thanks for the feedback. Can you think of a scenario where it might be worth the risk? Thanks.


Its a long shot and takes brass ones. I think if you are high priced in your market (and can make their marketing department believe it) and you have an organized selling process to increase ticket price and a good follow up along with constant contact, you can make it work. This is just my opinion, but for businesses like mine where I am the sole salesperson, it would be a big hit and a money loser. I think it has to be looked at as a long term strategy. I'm not willing to sell out for gross customer count. My company is not big enough to absorb that kind of move.


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## George Z (Apr 15, 2007)

PressurePros said:


> Yes, Groupon will take 50% of the advertised/selling price.


I hope someone read the fine print


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

Wow, 50% sounds like a bad deal to me. Other places to advertise effectively at a lower cost.


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## KLaw (May 8, 2009)

Very interesting replies.


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## SterlingPainting (Jan 3, 2010)

Just Curious how many of these rooms a 2 man crew can pump out in a day Shearer? Or do you send out one man crews? The driving (not to mention gas) would eat up alot of profits I would imagine. For example in Calgary you would have to alot at least 1/2 hour in between jobs. I could only imagine 1 guy pumping out 3 per day..so that would be $450 a day gross. 

And then I wonder how far out in advance someone would book a 1 room paint job? 30-60 days at the most I would think. Looks like a tough grind, but for a large company could be worth it.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

Just like with any other marketing ventures you have to realize to what clientel you are offering your services to. For those that think that this system helps to build your client base I would be very careful. Most people looking for the best deal they can find are usually not looking for high quality or looking to build a long lasting relationship.


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## KLaw (May 8, 2009)

NEPS.US said:


> Just like with any other marketing ventures you have to realize to what clientel you are offering your services to. For those that think that this system helps to build your client base I would be very careful. Most people looking for the best deal they can find are usually not looking for high quality or looking to build a long lasting relationship.


Good point - dude. Initially, we landed a lot of leads. Closed on very few. Again - we are talking initially...


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

NEPS.US said:


> Just like with any other marketing ventures you have to realize to what clientel you are offering your services to. For those that think that this system helps to build your client base I would be very careful. Most people looking for the best deal they can find are usually not looking for high quality or looking to build a long lasting relationship.



agreed. Bargain hunters will shop you for a dime. I think Groupon works best for high repeat bricks-and-mortar retail.. restaurants, specialty foods etc. I am curious to see how these service companies using it make out in the long run.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

PressurePros said:


> agreed. Bargain hunters will shop you for a dime. I think Groupon works best for high repeat bricks-and-mortar retail.. restaurants, specialty foods etc. I am curious to see how these service companies using it make out in the long run.


 
It's very difficult to sell labor like selling widgets.


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## RCP (Apr 18, 2007)

I agree, I was looking at the closest area to me, Las Vegas, and it was all helicopter rides, rooms, tickets, stuff that is really the same no matter where you buy it from. I think restaurants would do well also, especially BOGO offers.


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## AztecPainting (Jan 28, 2010)

Hmmm... My wife and me were thinking about it but, we couldn't figure out what to offer without hurting us, cause really you gotta bring down prices and that hurts, then I thought that this would probably sound good for the $99.00 a room guy from here, as they already have that niche of cheap people... I don't think a service other than nails, spas, hairstylist will be worth it, specially painting, our services can be way too complex and we have to say that there is no identical house or room. Just my 2 cents but please, let us know how this work for you I might be wrong.


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## y.painting (Jul 19, 2009)

Groupon can be a killer, literally a profit killer if one isn't careful with the math. If I know anything about John, I'm sure he did the numbers so I'm sure it will work out. But still, one should be very careful with these group-buying things. 

If you search online, you can find multiple stories of businesses that almost went bankrupt because their groupon deal just proved too big a hit with the customers.

There's also a survey I saw a few months back somewhere online of restaurant owners that have used Groupon for their businesses (I can't find it now but will look more tomorrow) that showed that a large portion of the redemptions of groupons was done by already existing customers (ie people that would have probably bought anyways) and that most of the new customers tipped way less than average and bought only the minimum required by the groupon fine print. Not exactly the clientel I'd want to drive as a restaurant owner. Not sure if the same would apply to our business.


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## Wood511 (Dec 13, 2010)

Groupon is great if you are buying the deal, but typically not so much if you are on the offering side. 

I've done vineyard/wine consulting over the years and one of my clients was approached about a Groupon deal. The price reductions were the same as mentioned earlier, so you wound up receiving about 25% of your normal retail price. We didn't bite and I actually laughed at the guy when he said they take 50% after we had already cut our price in half. I told him we could talk if they ever wanted to take 25%, but he never budged from his number.

There are similar sites out there, but not as large or prominent. I think one of these sites could probably do quite well if they took a smaller cut. The model is good, but Groupon is too greedy for most biz owners to bite.


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## y.painting (Jul 19, 2009)

Hope this don't offend too many folks...I just thought it was funny...how excited people get about coupons.


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## kdpaint (Aug 14, 2010)

Thats awesome. I am interested to see how groupon could work, right now its tough to see it. Maybe if I double my price(or jack it some amount) then do the groupon thing....:whistling2:


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

kdpaint said:


> Thats awesome. I am interested to see how groupon could work, right now its tough to see it. Maybe if I double my price(or jack it some amount) then do the groupon thing....:whistling2:


I've been told they research that extensively. You may have to provide past invoices and they may well determine what is "fair market value" for your area. IMO, they are out of their minds asking people to accept 25% of their usual rates. Maybe on clothing with a 300% markup, but on a service? No thanks.

Another benefit that a friend told me about (that used them). He told me he received 1500 unique visitors to his website in two days (his usual was 60 for the same period). If you could make a landing page and entice others to maybe give you an email address or offer alternative services, that would be an added benefit of utilizing the potential customer count.


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## Goode Painters (Jan 1, 2011)

Hey guys maybe thats why shearer never responds after the original post, he is just so busy tryin to keep up with all the groupon work :whistling2:


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## LocalPaintPros (Mar 14, 2011)

We've had a couple of painters in my area do "one room, walls only, customer supplies paint" offers for $79. One sold 132 of them (I think that was his limit). Personally, I can't see having to do 132 jobs for $40 each as being worthwhile. At 3 per day tops, and working 6 days a week, that's 7 weeks of time! Clearly he was betting on upsells/follow-ons/referrals. But as has already been pointed out, is the bargain basement shopper who is really going to bring a lot more good business?

I agree that Groupon makes the most sense for high-margin businesses, anyone who is almost guaranteed a *lot* of repeat busness (hair stylists, for example), businesses who will almost certainly upsell or add-on (food service), or overstock/clearance items (saw someone oce do a clearance on last year's designer handbags).

For my business we have *toyed* with the idea (read that as "we haven't convinced ourselves it will work yet) of teaming up with a number of Interior Designers that we work with and offering Color/Design Consultations. For example, if the Designer charges $80, we guarantee them X number of consults at $50 each. Then we go through Groupon to sell 100 consults at $40, we get $20 of that and therefore effectively pay $30 per "lead". 

Looking at this purely as "Advertising", we would spend $3,000 net, but we'd have the exposure to all of Groupons subscribers, plus we'd have a foot in the door (through the Designers who would talk us up) with 100 potential customers -- people who are for sure thinking of painting. Since we would set the appointments for the Designers, we could also offer to set up a painting estimate appointment (but not at the same time as the Designer's appointment -- no "three-legged sales calls"). The Designers would help sell us as the paint company of choice. 

If the conversion rate was 10% and the average job was $2,500), we would have spend $3K to get $25K of business, or about 12%. Not great, but maybe acceptable. But downside risk is limited to just the $3K and upside potential could be far greater. Plus we're strengthening our relationship with our Designers.

What do you all think?


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

LocalPaintPros said:


> We've had a couple of painters in my area do "one room, walls only, customer supplies paint" offers for $79. One sold 132 of them (I think that was his limit). Personally, I can't see having to do 132 jobs for $40 each as being worthwhile. At 3 per day tops, and working 6 days a week, that's 7 weeks of time! Clearly he was betting on upsells/follow-ons/referrals. But as has already been pointed out, is the bargain basement shopper who is really going to bring a lot more good business?
> 
> I agree that Groupon makes the most sense for high-margin businesses, anyone who is almost guaranteed a *lot* of repeat busness (hair stylists, for example), businesses who will almost certainly upsell or add-on (food service), or overstock/clearance items (saw someone oce do a clearance on last year's designer handbags).
> 
> ...


To me, too much downside possibility for a mediocre return on a successful campaign. My feeling is that as these services such as Groupon become more popular (there are 4 major ones in my area advertising aggressively), people are going to put together a la carte services from them. One body shop offers 50% off any body work in hopes of selling the paint job. I pick up my unpainted car and take advantage of the next body shop offering 50% paint jobs off hoping to upsell me premium paint or bodywork. Then I keep finding car washes running their 50% specials. There is no reason for customer loyalty as there is always another deal waiting in the wings.

There is one word becoming prevalent in my mind.. cancer. I think these sites are going to exploit starry eyed and hungry vendors. I admire the business model from a pure capitalist standpoint. Its ingenious and its a winner. Kinda like a bookie... win or lose, they make money.


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## George Z (Apr 15, 2007)

LocalPaintPros said:


> We've had a couple of painters in my area do "one room, walls only, customer supplies paint" offers for $79. One sold 132 of them (I think that was his limit). Personally, I can't see having to do 132 jobs for $40 each as being worthwhile. At 3 per day tops, and working 6 days a week, that's 7 weeks of time! Clearly he was betting on upsells/follow-ons/referrals. But as has already been pointed out, is the bargain basement shopper who is really going to bring a lot more good business?
> 
> I agree that Groupon makes the most sense for high-margin businesses, anyone who is almost guaranteed a *lot* of repeat busness (hair stylists, for example), businesses who will almost certainly upsell or add-on (food service), or overstock/clearance items (saw someone oce do a clearance on last year's designer handbags).
> 
> ...


What do you mean by Designers? At $40.00?
Professionals (we like that type) would not touch anything for a minimum of $300-$400.00 a consult.
Not allowed to use the term "Designer" here unless you have University Education and plenty of certification. 
$40.00 you are using Penelope (your neighbours wife) that has nothing better to do.
See the trend here? 
Let's see how we can make the cheapest of the cheap work.
Lose some money and then make it up on volume.:no:


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

George Z said:


> Let's see how we can make the cheapest of the cheap work.
> Lose some money and then make it up on volume.:no:


Bingo! Welcome to Groupon.


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## LocalPaintPros (Mar 14, 2011)

George Z said:


> What do you mean by Designers? At $40.00?
> Professionals (we like that type) would not touch anything for a minimum of $300-$400.00 a consult.
> Not allowed to use the term "Designer" here unless you have University Education and plenty of certification.
> $40.00 you are using Penelope (your neighbours wife) that has nothing better to do.
> ...


I can never remember which needs to be accredited to ues the title, "Designers" or "Decorators", but I'm neither. I just connect with a few who are in that business and are good at what they do, whether or not they have the letters after their name. 

Markets will vary, but the going rate for a "professional" (let's define that as someone who knows what they are doing and has a good reputation) color consultations in my neck of the woods is about $80/hour. A "spendy" one runs $125/hour. If the going rate in your market is $300 -$400 per consult and people pay it, great. But why are you bagging on me with the "Let's see how we can make the cheapest of the cheap work" comment? If someone with the skills to do the job in my market where the going rate is $80 is willing to do 20 consults for $50 each, what's it to you? Remember, even though we'd be selling it 1/2 off for $40, I'd be subsidizing this out of advertising budget and paying whoever does it $50. And I'm not sure how "Lose some money and then make it up on volume" applies in this case. My whole point was to limit downside risk and *not* get caught holding the bag on 100 loss-leader one room jobs that only bring $40, that are a pain in the butt to deliver, and need an upsell to make sense. Now *that* is a "lose a little on every one but make it up on volume" strategy!

So, finding something that limits your downside risk and has upside potential is the whole point of my floating the color consult idea. When we started talking about doing this, several of the, uh, let's just call them "Consultants" that I know were willing to offer a discounted rate in return for a guaranteed number of appointments. They also saw the potential for follow-up work and sales of other things they are involved with (fabric, window treatments, etc).

Our downside risk is limited to the (in my example) $3K ($5K paid out offset by the $2K from "sale"). And that totally neglects the value of the advertising exposure Groupon creates. Even if they don't act on it, several thousand Groupon subscribers would see the add, so that exposure is worth something. More importantly, we don't take painters away from profitable work, we don't create a logistics nightmare, and we don't run the risk of bad press if people think we're cutting corners because we sold below cost.

But the upside potential is what makes this idea even worth considering. I assumed only 10% conversion and got an ROI of about 8X (which I consider mediocre). But what if the conversion rate is 25% (remember, the people that buy a consult are thinking of painting)? The ROI would then be about 21X -- pretty nice. Spend $3K to get $63K. What if the conversion rate is even higher? *That* is why we're thinking about experimenting with this.


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## LocalPaintPros (Mar 14, 2011)

Also, we just got something from Angie's List saying that they are starting their own "group coupon" type of system for their members. They're not as greedy as Groupon, though. If I remember right, I think they only keep 1/4 or maybe 1/3 of the selling price (they still recommend the asking price be a deep discount from "list").


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## George Z (Apr 15, 2007)

My point is:
who is setting up the agenda here?

Groupon, and a few other copycats.

It doesn't matter how you work it. If your price was double what you are
(hopefuly) getting out of this, I wouldn't change a thing.
Either your margins were so unreal, 
or you will try to deceive everything and everyone and for what?
Now, I never heard of marketing budgets of being 50-75% of gross sales.
Even during campaigns these numbers make no sense.
So I would not call this adventure marketing expense.
What bugs me (in the concept) is that now we have another wave of $99 rooms, $40 "designers" to compete with.
Bring back the Students Painters, at least they knew their numbers.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

Maybe I value my company success a little differently than others but if I had to cut my rates by 75% to obtain work and to gain an audience to possibly bid future (most likely heavily discounted) work then I would be bankrupt.

It is comical to read how painting contractors are looking for ways to gain new business and lose money. The guys that think that they are "out of the box" thinkers can spin this idea in any direction they want. They believe that they need to get out in front of a large audience for branding and to build a client list and will choose to write off the loss as a advertising. This isnt even a loss leader. This is a loser. 

Perhaps instead of wasting time trying to rationalize a useless system for a service driven industry more time should be dedicated on sharpening sales skill and increasing rates.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

NEPS.US said:


> Maybe I value my company success a little differently than others but if I had to cut my rates by 75% to obtain work and to gain an audience to possibly bid future (most likely heavily discounted) work then I would be bankrupt.
> 
> It is comical to read how painting contractors are looking for ways to gain new business and lose money. The guys that think that they are "out of the box" thinkers can spin this idea in any direction they want. They believe that they need to get out in front of a large audience for branding and to build a client list and will choose to write off the loss as a advertising. This isnt even a loss leader. This is a loser.
> 
> Perhaps instead of wasting time trying to rationalize a useless system for a service driven industry more time should be dedicated on sharpening sales skill and increasing rates.


Are there enough paint contractors that fall into the category you describe, to make these ridiculous platforms viable?


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## Seattlepainting (Jun 8, 2010)

*Shearer is Back*

Hey guys...been busy..I have started alot of threads but they usually die out..I am out a few days and BAM it has grown like a ponzi scheme...

My groupon is part of a new home launch..home services..features are que...my launch is delayed for two weeks.

Groupon contacted me about a feature. Most of their deals are in the $50-100 range; I drew up the deal I have and they accepted it; although they did not like the higher price.

Here is the Math I get about $122 for the $249 special. Groupon sends the money in 3 installments (end of special, after x days, after 30 days) purchaser call to schedule. Every job will be different but the results can be classified into these categories:

1. We paint walls we loose some money..make an impression
2.We paint walls at cost,,make an impression
3. We paint walls, make an impression, customer adds to scope
4. purchaser misunderstood the feature and Groupon returns their money.

I do not believe anybody will buy this offer for $249 without some research...they will click the DOFOLLOW link to my home page and navigate to the Groupon page we made. They will probably call also..we will be very clear about what they get for $249: labor to paint walls in one room; they provide paint and sundries.

I think George Z, Yaros, and P Pros may appreciate what I am trying to do. It has nothing to do with how much can I squeeze out of $122. It is marketing; and maybe providing samples of our service. I am not focused on the customers that don't fit us...I am focused on the Market of People that are a good fit for us.

Thanks for all your input and private emails. I will let you know how it goes.


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## PatsPainting (Mar 4, 2010)

The whole things sounds like a nightmare to me..

Pat


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

vermontpainter said:


> Are there enough paint contractors that fall into the category you describe, to make these ridiculous platforms viable?


 
There's a ass for every seat. 

You would think that if a company has been around since 1990 they would of built up a client, referral and networking list that they would laugh at the very idea of marketing scheme like this. 

It looks like even a best case scenario would be a break even with the wrong customer. Who really wants a customer that is clipping coupons for our trade? How do you possible differentiate your services on upgrades or a future estimate on anything else but price?


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## LocalPaintPros (Mar 14, 2011)

vermontpainter said:


> Are there enough paint contractors that fall into the category you describe, to make these ridiculous platforms viable?


Putting aside the discussion of whether this is a good model for painters until Seattle reports back (and I will too, if I decide to go forward with the color consult idea), here is some background that addresses Groupon's viability.

Groupon launched in 2008, and since then they claim to have sold almost 39 MILLION Groupons and saved their subscribers over $1.5 BILLION. Presumably, most of this was last year when their revenues grew from $33 Million in 2009 to $760 Million in 2010 (as reported in the Wall Street Journal). The platform itself is independent of any particular product or service, just like eBay is used for selling just about anything now. The other major player in this arena is LivingSocial.com, and now it appears that Angie's List will be entering the market.

Groupon was rumored to have had a buyout offer from Yahoo for $3 Billion last fall, and supposedly, Google offered $5.3 Billion + $700 Million in performance based bonuses after that and Groupon turned them both down. It appears they are headed for an Initial Public Offering of stock and the numbers I have seen is they will be valued at around $26 BILLION. So they clearly have a lot of businesses using their platform, and they have the interest of "big money". But are they just part of a new "dotcom bubble"? That remains to be seen.

The bottom line is that they have a platform and service that is, at least for now, very viable and is making them money hand over fist, because it seems to work for certain types of businesses. It's not right for everyone, but that's one of the great things about living in America -- we have choices.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

Well thats nice and all but means nothing to my bottom line.


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## Seattlepainting (Jun 8, 2010)

1234


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)




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## y.painting (Jul 19, 2009)

This is timely...and a bit funny...http://www.screenwerk.com/2011/04/04/anti-groupon-sign-in-french-salon-window/



> *After a dispute with Groupon, we are no longer accepting their coupons. Thank you for your understanding.*


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## valuepro (Mar 21, 2010)

you don't use Groupon to make money, you do it to get repeats, referrals, upsales and business branding. Think of it as putting your sign on 100,000+ lawns. Obviously it was effective for this company or they wouldn't be offering in a bigger market in the fall.


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## valuepro (Mar 21, 2010)

LocalPaintPros said:


> Putting aside the discussion of whether this is a good model for painters until Seattle reports back (and I will too, if I decide to go forward with the color consult idea), here is some background that addresses Groupon's viability.
> 
> Groupon launched in 2008, and since then they claim to have sold almost 39 MILLION Groupons and saved their subscribers over $1.5 BILLION. Presumably, most of this was last year when their revenues grew from $33 Million in 2009 to $760 Million in 2010 (as reported in the Wall Street Journal). The platform itself is independent of any particular product or service, just like eBay is used for selling just about anything now. The other major player in this arena is LivingSocial.com, and now it appears that Angie's List will be entering the market.
> 
> ...


Unless there are some class action lawsuits or a hostile takeover I see Groupon sticking around, at least until Google comes out with Gpon or something simular of a clone. Kijiji Deals is now in Canada which is the same concept as Groupon.

Groupon is expanding it's enterprise though, as they partnered with Expedia in June for travel deals: http://techcrunch.com/2011/06/01/groupon-to-partner-with-expedia-for-groupon-travel/

My only concern is their weird little CEO being able to continue handling their success, expecially with them going public.

Anyway for joe blow painter like me, if I can bring in 10 new customers this year at full price from doing a dozen or so Groupon deals then it's a great ROI.

Or I could just chuck my advertising budget into the Yellow Pages....LOL, not...


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## user12499 (Dec 28, 2011)

Groupon only takes 40% to start and it is negotiable. We negotiated to a 80/20%. 
We sold over 200+ in 2 ads. Every job added something on. The mark up on the addon made up for the low price of the coupon. We also had several whole house repaints. And we gained some nice office jobs out of the deal.


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## aaron61 (Apr 29, 2007)

no thank you...i'm good


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## user12499 (Dec 28, 2011)

aaron61 said:


> no thank you...i'm good


Good? Or too good? Lil
Old fashioned?


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## ewingpainting.net (Jun 2, 2008)

Millerspropainting said:


> Groupon only takes 40% to start and it is negotiable. We negotiated to a 80/20%.
> We sold over 200+ in 2 ads. Every job added something on. The mark up on the addon made up for the low price of the coupon. We also had several whole house repaints. And we gained some nice office jobs out of the deal.


Hand and hand, low paint prices means volume, volume in this market means little to none profit. Groupon the life form of low balling.


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## aaron61 (Apr 29, 2007)

Back to the original topic...After projections of grandeur.

Seattle???? Did this work well for you? Was this a loser or a winner?
Miller?? How is this working for you.
I just can't see how this can be good.This is only something that those looking for deals will use.Not very likely that the customer who is a couponer will be looking for an upsell.Just not their nature. 

And as far as marketing.I'm not marketing to tight a$$e$


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

Bringing this up, as I would like to hear some feedback on how it went.


I also found a Groupon for a $70 interior room painting. 12x12x10, within a certain distance from the main city, two coats and that included baseboards.

So far they have sold 400. 

They are a member here and if they feel like chiming in, that would be great. 

Thanks


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

Sweet at 5 hrs per room math works out to be $1.40/ hr. So after overhead they should only loose around $2000. lol 

Maybe it works with up-selling more work at your normal rates, but I am skeptical.


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

straight_lines said:


> Sweet at 5 hrs per room math works out to be $1.40/ hr. So after overhead they should only loose around $2000. lol
> 
> Maybe it works with up-selling more work at your normal rates, but I am skeptical.


 

I'm with you, however thats 400 chances to land additional work (big or small), I am curious how much they were able add.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

The problem is, you would have to add on far above your normal rate to break even. I realize this is done all the time, but I consider that dishonest and a form of "bait and switch."

It is frustrating in business when everyone seems to want a slice of your pie, without realizing just how small your pie really is.


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

ligboozer said:


> I'm with you, however thats 400 chances to land additional work (big or small), I am curious how much they were able add.


Same way for me, I am wondering how it really works out overall. I am not a great salesmen, and don't like that I would have to push for more as hard as I would have to. I have always been able to let my portfolio, and refferals sell for me, and I get to charge what I am worth.



DeanV said:


> The problem is, you would have to add on far above your normal rate to break even. I realize this is done all the time, but I consider that dishonest and a form of "bait and switch."
> 
> It is frustrating in business when everyone seems to want a slice of your pie, without realizing just how small your pie really is.


Everyone thinks because you own a business that you are making tons of cash, which isn't always true.


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

DeanV said:


> The problem is, you would have to add on far above your normal rate to break even. I realize this is done all the time, but I consider that dishonest and a form of "bait and switch."
> 
> It is frustrating in business when everyone seems to want a slice of your pie, without realizing just how small your pie really is.


 

Bait and switch is a little harsh, no? Maybe playing the odds?

I agree about the pie being sliced thin, its amazing there's enough to go round.



My big concern is the price expectations the Groupon sets. The ad clearly states the actual value is $600, thats over 80% off.


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## Ramsden Painting (Jul 17, 2011)

This is very interesting thread. I also would be interested on the overall outcome as I have thought about groupon also.

Sent from my iPad using PaintTalk


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

Spill the beans. Who is it?


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

NEPS.US said:


> Spill the beans. Who is it?


 

They aren't a regular poster, but they have been here for a while. 


Groupon is a touchy subject so I didn't want to just throw their name out there unless they were okay with it.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

Whats the first letter in their name?


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## PressurePros (May 6, 2007)

:hang:


_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

Uhh, gimme an M


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

I'll take a "V".


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## Bender (Aug 10, 2008)




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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

Gotta start with the vowels first. 

I was going to start with F or S (but they are no longer with us


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

ligboozer said:


> They are a member here and if they feel like chiming in, that would be great.


Are they in your local area?


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

No they are not local to me (CA). In fact, I happened across their ad while looking at something on slick deals. 

They are in KY.

If the mods think it's no biggie I will just post up their name. Didn't want this to be the great mystery of our time. :jester:


EDIT - I have pm'd the person. They haven't been on in over a month, so not sure how quickly they will respond.


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## premierpainter (Apr 17, 2007)

ligboozer said:


> No they are not local to me (CA). In fact, I happened across their ad while looking at something on slick deals.
> 
> They are in KY.
> 
> ...


It's no problem, you can share the name.


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

premierpainter said:


> It's no problem, you can share the name.


 
:whistling2:


Honestly, I really hope they chime in, but I don't want to blindside someone. I contacted them via PM. Lets see where it goes.


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

I also emailed them, maybe that will do the trick.


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## Scotiadawg (Dec 5, 2011)

ligboozer said:


> :whistling2:
> 
> 
> Honestly, I really hope they chime in, but I don't want to blindside someone. I contacted them via PM. Lets see where it goes.


That's classy, well played sir !:thumbsup:


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

ligboozer said:


> :whistling2:
> 
> 
> Honestly, I really hope they chime in, but I don't want to blindside someone. I contacted them via PM. Lets see where it goes.


It must be working for them so it would be interesting to hear their take on the service. 

I agree though if they are not logging in often it would be a shame to see the thread possibly turn against them without their knowledge especially when they never made a post in the thread. 


Myself I don't think I would ever give such a % to the service. I mean you essentially are building a bargain hunter clientele even if the referrals are flying you are being referred by the thrifty to the thrifty. 

One of those cases where what may work for one is not necessarily going to work for another.


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

Workaholic said:


> It must be working for them so it would be interesting to hear their take on the service.
> 
> I agree though if they are not logging in often it would be a shame to see the thread possibly turn against them without their knowledge especially when they never made a post in the thread.
> 
> ...


I wonder if they are looking at it as more of an advertising expense? 

Groupon is getting their name out there, and they are getting work (albeit at a steep discount). 

They have a guaranteed 400 leads, it's just up to them to make them into something more?


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

ligboozer said:


> I wonder if they are looking at it as more of an advertising expense?
> 
> Groupon is getting their name out there, and they are getting work (albeit at a steep discount).
> 
> They have a guaranteed 400 leads, it's just up to them to make them into something more?


They have to follow through by accepting the deal though otherwise it is a breach right? If they continue to breach then they will be kicked off the service? So if they do 400 rooms for 70 then for me I just don't see the value unless you can do the room in an hour or so, which two coats on a 12x room with proper set up will take longer than that. Hopefully people with more experience will elaborate.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

I know who it is. Ha! :detective::detective::detective:


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

NEPS.US said:


> I know who it is. Ha! :detective::detective::detective:


I figured you knew a couple hours ago lol.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

I was trying not have to enter my email on groupon to find out. 

Hope he contributes or starts a thread on the subject. He was either very successful or a utter failure with it.


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

NEPS.US said:


> I was trying not have to enter my email on groupon to find out.
> 
> Hope he contributes or starts a thread on the subject. He was either very successful or a utter failure with it.


I did not enter my email just found it through google. 

Doing it so many times is either insanity or success.


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## PatsPainting (Mar 4, 2010)

Workaholic said:


> I did not enter my email just found it through google.
> 
> Doing it so many times is either insanity or success.


yep - his last visit was 12-26-2011

Pat


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

PatsPainting said:


> yep - his last visit was 12-26-2011
> 
> Pat


It's all Lig's fault. :jester:


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

PatsPainting said:


> yep - his last visit was 12-26-2011
> 
> Pat


Poor SOB's been painting room for $35 bucks around the clock. Has no time for us.


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## PatsPainting (Mar 4, 2010)

Yea, most likely he just does not have the confidence to charge what a painter should really make.

Pat


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

PatsPainting said:


> Yea, most likely he just does not have the confidence to charge what a painter should really make.
> 
> Pat


No kidding. He should like charge $85 bucks and then hand the HO a sawbuck when he is done. That would be so passionate, honest and cool.


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## jmda (Nov 14, 2007)

I sold my company to ex-wife in divorce and she just did a Group On with over 460 bought at 70 each. No idea why she thinks it was a good idea. Hope it works out for her we do have kids.


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

jmda said:


> I sold my company to ex-wife in divorce and she just did a Group On with over 460 bought at 70 each. No idea why she thinks it was a good idea. Hope it works out for her we do have kids.


Sorry to hear about the divorce.


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## jmda (Nov 14, 2007)

Honestly I am not sorry. Though I do have a few regrets 

When I find out how the Group On thing turns out I'll post.


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

jmda said:


> Honestly I am not sorry. Though I do have a few regrets
> 
> When I find out how the Group On thing turns out I'll post.


Gotcha.

Sounds good. 



What are you doing now, if you don't mind my asking?


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## jmda (Nov 14, 2007)

I'm starting over. So I'm Joe Shmoe with a rolling poll again 

Had a brush in my hand today.

Actually been very blessed with work and a lot of other things.

I will try and visit the forum more. But I have purposely kept myself extremely busy trying to do the next right thing.


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

jmda said:


> Honestly I am not sorry. Though I do have a few regrets
> 
> When I find out how the Group On thing turns out I'll post.


 

jdma- I was the one who emailed and pm'd you. 

Thanks for taking the time to post up. 

It was really random chance I found your ad. I was looking for laptops on slick deals and somewhere I saw the ad. When I saw you had 400 takers (460 now) it piqued my curiosity. Your company sounded familiar so I figured I had seen it on here and sure enough........


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

TTT.

Wanted to see how it is going/went.


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