# Sealing odor with BIN Shellac primer



## joshwake (May 6, 2013)

From what I hear BIN Shellac primer is excellent for sealing in odor. I was just wondering if anyone has any recommendations for additives or even a different product. I plan on spraying with a .013-.015 tip and painting with water based paint after. I will spray floors and ceilings as well of course. I assume there are some out there that have done similar jobs and any advice would be helpful. Thanks


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## promax (Jan 30, 2011)

Well your right, Bin seals everything very well. My problem was always that it was difficult to work with, (smell,the way it brushes and rolls,clean up. ect). Its funny because just when I got it down pat as far as applying, I found that there is a new kilz product that has the same sealing effects but is water based. My home depot rep recommended it to me and even gave me a free gallon to try. Its called Kilz Max. Its in a black and silver can. The only difference between it and the bin, is that the bin drys much faster. Kilz Max dries like a latex. I really like the stuff if you can get your hands on it, Id give it a try.


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## Brian C (Oct 8, 2011)

you will destroy your spray equipment using this product. Any old acrylic paint residue in the machine will melt and turn to gum clogging it up. better for you to brush and roll the areas.


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## BreatheEasyHP (Apr 24, 2011)

I sprayed about 15 gallons of BIN Shellac to seal up a home that had been smoked in for 20 years, 2-3 packs per day. I washed the walls first, but GROSS.

Anyways, there are some important safety precautions:

1) Full face respirator. Your eyes can absorb the alcohol (the solvent is alcohol). It's really frickin poisonous. Use the chemical filters....activated charcoal. Change them as recommended on the instructions. When I first started spraying, I didn't have the mask on properly. I had a nasty headache within a couple minutes and got fairly dizzy. I went outside, adjusted the mask, came back in when my head cleared, and didn't have any problems doing that coat or the next. 

2) Explosion-proof fan, especially if ventilation is a problem. The alcohol can build up and be set off by a spark, like in the motor of your paint sprayer or when you plug something in. A fan can also cause an explosion. That said, if you can properly cross-ventilate and run fans constantly, you reasonably won't have enough of a build-up to require the explosion-proof fan.

Unlike a previous commentator, I didn't have any problems with my paint sprayer, though I did clean in thoroughly with krud kutter or some similar sprayer cleaner before switching over. And don't forget to clean your sprayer with denatured alcohol thoroughly.

The house I sprayed was lathe and plaster. The 2 coats of shellac primer put on an awesome base and the sprayed finish coats look amazing. It's the best looking job I've done - 2 bedrooms, a bathroom, kitchen, dining room, living room, hallway, 100% shellac coated and 100% sprayed, from the crown molding to the walls. Looks awesome. 

That said, working with alcohol-based paint sucks. It's dangerous and you have to wear a full-face respirator (at least, you SHOULD). SW redid their "Harmony" paint line. It's got a lot of clay in it, as I understand it, and clay absorbs smells. I worked on a natural clay plaster job and there was a house fire...a bunch of plastic burnt. The clay plaster absorbed all the smoke...no smell, no damage other than a skim coat of the plaster. It was cool. Could Harmony do the same? .... maybe. But Shellac is a sure bet - no bleed, no smell, easy to paint over. 

Good luck!


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## Bender (Aug 10, 2008)

promax said:


> My home depot rep recommended it to me and even gave me a free gallon to try.


*RED FLAG!*


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## joshwake (May 6, 2013)

promax said:


> Well your right, Bin seals everything very well. My problem was always that it was difficult to work with, (smell,the way it brushes and rolls,clean up. ect). Its funny because just when I got it down pat as far as applying, I found that there is a new kilz product that has the same sealing effects but is water based. My home depot rep recommended it to me and even gave me a free gallon to try. Its called Kilz Max. Its in a black and silver can. The only difference between it and the bin, is that the bin drys much faster. Kilz Max dries like a latex. I really like the stuff if you can get your hands on it, Id give it a try.


I would certainly prefer to go water based if I can, but I have heard that BIN is a sure bet and I just can't take any chances since I will be living in this home and I can't stand smoke smell. 

I suppose I can try the Kilz first and see if the smell starts to come back and then do BIN over it if it doesn't work? Is there any risk in using BIN with water based coat afterwards?


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## kdpaint (Aug 14, 2010)

Just BIN it. You do not want to "kinda" seal off the odor by priming w/ water based anything, and then finding out after you actually paint everything, that you have to redo it all with BIN. 

BIN is not difficult to work with; it is thin, that is all. It smells like alcohol, but the smell dissipates in 20 minutes or so with good ventilation, which is faster than almost any other coating. 

It is absolute crazy talk that the guy at the box store said that the water base sealer "has the same sealing effects" as BIN. There are NO water based products that will seal out smoke. MAYBE they seal a water stain, maybe 2 coats of it, maybe 2 coats to cover nicotine. That is a lot of maybe's when 1 coat of the proper product (BIN) will do it all. That is all.


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## BreatheEasyHP (Apr 24, 2011)

I find think stuff like BIN Shellac rolls better with a microfiber roller.

And yeah...trusting some dude at Home Depot on this? :blink:


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## joshwake (May 6, 2013)

I'm going with the BIN for sure. Just not sure if I want to roll or spray.


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

Spraying Bin is not that bad. It fans out great. You just can't let it sit in the pump at all. If you take an hr lunch, better flush it out with DN alcohol while your gone.


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## Dkon7 (Jan 23, 2013)

XIM now makes a shellac free alternative called Restore that cleans up with mineral spirits. Its a vapor varier as well as stain blocker and can be used in fire restoration. I've heard good things about it, and as bad as I hate to dote on the XIM company, they do make a good product.

If you wont settle for anything other than shellac, SW now has an in-house SW branded shellac primer as well. Get with your rep and have him tell you about it.


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## promax (Jan 30, 2011)

At any point in my comment did I sound like I dont know what im doing? Or did I sound like I don't know what BIN is, or shellac in general is. Bin shellac is extremely difficult to work with in comparison to latex. Fear is what keeps old timers plugging shellac as an easy to use cure all. Yes Shellac is a great sealer, this has been proven time and time again. It is not a one coat odor sealer, that is ridiculous. Perhaps if your spraying extra heavy it may seal odor in one pass, but in one coat never. Also bin is horrible for spraying in general ie it gunks up your gun if there is latex residue (as mentioned above) its difficult to protect your eyes while spraying because it coats goggles super quick, causing people to remove them and spray unprotected. Now let me say this. If you plan on a horrible one coat spray application that will almost certainly be messy and dangerous then by all means go bin. I use shellac from time to time still (for small applications). But for large applications its much more advantageous to use a latex product. Better clean up, safer on machines and people. I am by no means a rep of home depot or kilz for that matter. I simply have used the product and it exceeded my expectations for a latex sealer. I am not scared of recommending it if you use it correctly. And if the stains and odor are very heavy I would say it will probably take two coats. No disrespect to seniors but times change and there are better methods than the unsafe tried and trues of old. Ill never forget one day at the paint store a man came in too purchase more bin after spraying all day without a mask, he was literally turning blue because he had coated his lungs, and didnt even want to here my advice of going to the hospital asap. Thats old school for ya. Sorry about the rant just sick of that old school hurt yourself for pay attitude. Wear a mask if you go bin at least buddy. And if you need anymore info on the product Im suggesting just email me brotha. PS who the hell said I work for HD lol also this is a very new product that guaranteed no one else commenting has even heard about. I was skeptical at first of coarse, but I gave it a shot and it paid off big for me.


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## kdpaint (Aug 14, 2010)

Some of us are set up for spraying different types of products, and don't have to worry about "ruining" our one sprayer. To each his own on products, but I have done a ton of smoke restoration and other types of jobs where one coat of sprayed shellac has sealed in odors (especially after using an ozone machine...because they work, check it out.) as opposed to 2 coats of anything else. We use a variety of techniques to get stuff done.
As for protective equipment...of course! We use half mask, and full face equipment, with supplied air, with face shields with removable film. No one works without protection on my jobs. 
If you are set up correctly, you can spray anything, and get the job done in a short amount of time and not die. There are no "old school" painters on this site like you described, stumbling around the paint store after killing themselves by being dumb...because they're all dead already, or too cooked to use the interwebs......


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

Brian C said:


> you will destroy your spray equipment using this product. Any old acrylic paint residue in the machine will melt and turn to gum clogging it up. better for you to brush and roll the areas.


Lacquer thinner through the pump will clean out everything. If you would rather not use it then krud kutter works as well, just not as quickly. Before I had a pump just for bin I used a different hose and gun after cleaning.


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