# Arborcoat/Details Stain problems



## Tonyg (Dec 9, 2007)

Looking to see if anyone has had any issues with the Arborcoat/Details Stain? I did a deck at a beach house last year (http://www.painttalk.com/f2/sikkens-rubbol-dek-rubbol-dek-4647/#post71898) and decided to go with the Details stain. The deck was washed, sanded and prepped, washed, and two coats of stain applied. Job was completed the first week of May last year under ideal weather conditions - 70 degrees, moderate humidity, no wind, cloudy day, etc. Stain was applied out of direct sun to cool deck. 

Was called out today with the HO saying it was looking bad (2yr warranty). I was VERY disappointed that the deck was faded, oxidized, cracking, and slightly peeling. I will have the BM rep out next week but it looks as though I will be washing and recoating on my dime. 14 months and it looks like this is just unacceptable.


----------



## PatsPainting (Mar 4, 2010)

what was the condition of the wood prior to the work you did last year? did it have all those cracks in it? I'm guessing you used the solid stain. What is going on underneath the deck? is it sealed? any moisture issues?

Pat


----------



## Tonyg (Dec 9, 2007)

PatsPainting said:


> what was the condition of the wood prior to the work you did last year? did it have all those cracks in it? I'm guessing you used the solid stain. What is going on underneath the deck? is it sealed? any moisture issues?
> 
> Pat


Sand and anywhere between 4' and 8' off the ground with eith open or lattice. No moisture issues. Previous stain was 3.5yr -4yr Sikkens that was peeling. Solid substrate with 3x4 premium deck boards. This is definitely a coating issue as it was prepped and applied textbook or above manufacturer's requirements. I would like to know if this is what I should expect from this product or an isolated occurance.


----------



## PatsPainting (Mar 4, 2010)

I really don't know what you could have applied that would have giving you better results. Maybe the semi transparent with the clear on top. Or even just applying the clear on top of your solid stain you applied. That wood looks like its had better days. Not something I would want to give a warranty on. 

You can apply stuff by the textbook methods, but if the wood behind it is shot , I don't think it will make much of a difference. Just my 2 cents here.

Pat


----------



## Tonyg (Dec 9, 2007)

Two coats premium acrylic solid stain lasting 14 months before peeling and fading? I agree that the cracks may not be fillided but peeling, fading, and oxidizing in 14 months? I expect more.

I would normally have used the Sherwin Williams Deckscapes. Even if the BM rep pays for the materials I may just use the SW product out of my pocket so I don't have to come back in another 12 months.


----------



## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

I haven't had very good luck with solid acrylic deck stain holding up much longer than 18-24 mths, and I usually use deckscapes. 

With the direct sun, and water standing on cupped boards, and getting in those cracks I don't think any product is gonna last very long other than maybe oil stain. Issue is exposure to the elements.

Like you said that is unacceptable.


----------



## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

Tony - once you recoat a solid stain deck, doesn't matter if it's oil or not - it just won't last, especially beach front property. I did a deck last fall where I pressure washed an oil solid stained deck with percarbs - and then put a floor sander all over the deck - and then recoated with Ben Moore semitransparent decking stain, but highly pigmented to match a color. The next spring I asked the homeowner how is deck was doing - and he told me 3 boards were bubbling up - and that was two wet-on-wet coats. It's just the nature of the beast.


----------



## Wallnut (May 4, 2010)

Tonyg said:


> Two coats premium acrylic solid stain lasting 14 months before peeling and fading? I agree that the cracks may not be fillided but peeling, fading, and oxidizing in 14 months? I expect more.
> 
> I would normally have used the Sherwin Williams Deckscapes. Even if the BM rep pays for the materials I may just use the SW product out of my pocket so I don't have to come back in another 12 months.


 
You said it right there. 2 coats. stain is meant to soak in not stand up. you over-applied which WILL cause premature failure. Peeling and cracking is from a film laying on top and not soaking in...your second coat...even solid stain is meant to soak in.


----------



## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

Wallnut said:


> You said it right there. 2 coats. stain is meant to soak in not stand up. you over-applied which WILL cause premature failure. Peeling and cracking is from a film laying on top and not soaking in...your second coat...even solid stain is meant to soak in.


Yes and no. Silkens solid is a 2 coat system. The first coat penetrates, the second coat evens the finish. 

Those boards look cracked from expansion/contraction, I don't see any peeling at least in the photos. It also looks like the color is uneven? I think a rinse and heavy recoat should solve the problem, be sure to work product into the cracks.


----------



## PatsPainting (Mar 4, 2010)

I really think the clear will help on this. I know its considered a two part step if using the semi transparent stains and its optional for the semi solid and solids. But In this case it really could be the difference. This is also one of those maintenance type projects due to the condition of the wood. So every year just go out and give a quick wash and apply a clear and you should be good to go. Might not be what you want to hear or your customer, but that wood is in pretty rough shape.

Pat


----------



## Wallnut (May 4, 2010)

NCPaint1 said:


> Yes and no. Silkens solid is a 2 coat system. The first coat penetrates, the second coat evens the finish.
> 
> Those boards look cracked from expansion/contraction, I don't see any peeling at least in the photos. It also looks like the color is uneven? I think a rinse and heavy recoat should solve the problem, be sure to work product into the cracks.


Arborcoat however with semi-solid and solid is ONE coat with the option of a clear coat on top. 2 coats will build up to much and lead to premature failure.

Im pretty sure he meant he used arborcoat on this one... if you look at the last picture in between the boards it looks like its peeling...

did you test for moisture in the wood before you applied?


----------



## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

Wallnut said:


> Arborcoat however with semi-solid and solid is ONE coat with the option of a clear coat on top. 2 coats will build up to much and lead to premature failure.
> 
> Im pretty sure he meant he used arborcoat on this one... if you look at the last picture in between the boards it looks like its peeling...
> 
> did you test for moisture in the wood before you applied?


Right, but the OP said silkens was used the first time.


----------



## Wallnut (May 4, 2010)

NCPaint1 said:


> Right, but the OP said silkens was used the first time.


oh I must have misread maybe? Did he apply arborcoat over a failing sikkens? I thought it was bare wood... i Though he meant he used sikkens on one deck and decided to go with arborcoat on the next...


----------



## tntpainting (Apr 3, 2008)

yep swp all the way dont use any of benny moore stuff they snubbed years ago because i wasnt a 100 employee company and i relized im a helluva lot better off not using their stuff good luck !


----------



## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

tntpainting said:


> yep swp all the way dont use any of benny moore stuff they snubbed years ago because i wasnt a 100 employee company and i relized im a helluva lot better off not using their stuff good luck !


Interesting, its completely the opposite here with SW.


----------

