# Help on sq.ft. price commercial



## paintermiah (Dec 29, 2011)

Hello. I am new to the site, and so far, it seems quite helpful. I run a small painting company and I have the opportunity to bid on a large commercial project. It is a car dealership. Three large garage interiors, two ceilings, and exterior of two garages. Total sq. ft. for interior garages is (17,940 FLOOR) (21,433 WALL). Ceilings are 13,090 sq. foot. Walls are 23 ft. high. I know it is a vague question, but if anyone had some ideas as to price per sq. ft., it would be much appreciated. I have some ideas, but would love some input. Additionally, if anyone had any reference to materials or procedure, it would fall on grateful ears. Walls are in pretty good shape, minimal caulking or scraping. Probably going to wash interior with degreaser, and use housewash on exterior. The ceilings seem a little daunting... the rafters seem very time consuming. Using three colors on walls.. white upper, small horizontal stripe, grey lowers. One color for exterior. Interior and exterior walls are block, interior is painted previously, exterior is bare block.
Thanks in advance.


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## user12499 (Dec 28, 2011)

I'd just barter the job for 5 new company trucks. Lol


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

There is no reason to make multiple threads on the same topic, answers to your question can take a bit to get replies, be patient. If you need this question answered by your meeting tomorrow you played it wrong. 

Take some time and read this. 
http://www.painttalk.com/f3/new-painttalk-please-read-15406/


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## paintermiah (Dec 29, 2011)

Sorry, workaholic. I posted the first one from a mobile phone and had problems doing it. Wanted to post it right, and thought this forum would have the most traffic. Didn't intend on double-dipping. Don't have to have the bid until next week, and I am meeting with my S.W. rep on monday cause he is on vaca. Just been plugging some figures into the sq. footage and coming up with some big no.s. Thought I might be able to snag on some wisdom around here.


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

paintermiah said:


> Sorry, workaholic. I posted the first one from a mobile phone and had problems doing it. Wanted to post it right, and thought this forum would have the most traffic. Didn't intend on double-dipping. Don't have to have the bid until next week, and I am meeting with my S.W. rep on monday cause he is on vaca. Just been plugging some figures into the sq. footage and coming up with some big no.s. Thought I might be able to snag on some wisdom around here.


I understand. Many members are still at work and it can take a minute for a thread to pick up.


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## aaron61 (Apr 29, 2007)

http://www.painttalk.com/f4/pricing-estimating-success-2779/

Please read the stickies in the business section


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## Bender (Aug 10, 2008)

This thread is _Not _what I expected


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

I doubt no one here will just give you the magic numbers you seek, because it is impossible without knowing your numbers. Maybe you need to hire a professional to help you to learn how to bid commercial work of this nature.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

Call five subs to bid the project, take the highest number and add 60%.


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## kingsebi (Jan 27, 2009)

23 ft ceilings. That almost triples your surface compared to typical 8-9 ft ceilings. I'm in Virginia Beach area. Around here the going rate for such a project would start at $2.25 sq and go up from there. Sounds like a lot of crazy trim and colors. I don't think I would touch it for less than $8 sq. ($2.25 x 3) because of wall space. So your looking Close to 140k. Sounds like a lot. But it's a lot of work.

Get at least 25% up front for materials too. Hope you get it and make some money!


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## RaleighPainter (Jun 13, 2011)

On commercial work, there is a 'going rate'.. I can assure you it is substantially lower than high end residential rates you are used to... It seems production is key in commercial either your company's dynamics fit the bill for the going rates and you're still able to profit, or they dont. Unless you have a phenomenal relationship with the GC or owner, lowest bid wins in most cases. Some company's can produce and still profit in these conditions, others can't. That's my experience with commercial work around here anyhow.


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## RaleighPainter (Jun 13, 2011)

kingsebi said:


> 23 ft ceilings. That almost triples your surface compared to typical 8-9 ft ceilings. I'm in Virginia Beach area. Around here the going rate for such a project would start at $2.25 sq and go up from there. Sounds like a lot of crazy trim and colors. I don't think I would touch it for less than $8 sq. ($2.25 x 3) because of wall space. So your looking Close to 140k. Sounds like a lot. But it's a lot of work.
> 
> Get at least 25% up front for materials too. Hope you get it and make some money!


Your base is on the floor square footage? I doubt this is 140k job, I haven't seen it but.... its not a HUGE commercial job. Whole walmarts are going on the 70 - 80k range on repaints. Walmarts are a whole lot bigger than 17k square feet. We did an aquatic center 48k square feet (floor). Steel roof deck and beams, block walls 36 foot walls and columns in an accent color that went about 44 feet, it didn't pay 140 k. There were 11 colums, 4 foot wide by 44 feet high. In comparison I'm pretty sure most walmarts (super centers) are some where around 100,000 to 130,000 sq ft maybe bigger.


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## RaleighPainter (Jun 13, 2011)

paintermiah said:


> Hello. I am new to the site, and so far, it seems quite helpful. I run a small painting company and I have the opportunity to bid on a large commercial project. It is a car dealership. Three large garage interiors, two ceilings, and exterior of two garages. Total sq. ft. for interior garages is (17,940 FLOOR) (21,433 WALL). Ceilings are 13,090 sq. foot. Walls are 23 ft. high. I know it is a vague question, but if anyone had some ideas as to price per sq. ft., it would be much appreciated. I have some ideas, but would love some input. Additionally, if anyone had any reference to materials or procedure, it would fall on grateful ears. Walls are in pretty good shape, minimal caulking or scraping. Probably going to wash interior with degreaser, and use housewash on exterior. The ceilings seem a little daunting... the rafters seem very time consuming. Using three colors on walls.. white upper, small horizontal stripe, grey lowers. One color for exterior. Interior and exterior walls are block, interior is painted previously, exterior is bare block.
> Thanks in advance.


When you say rafters, are they steel? Steel roof deck?


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## kingsebi (Jan 27, 2009)

Sorry but it IS a huge commercial job. I you paint to be the lowest bidder and make minimal profits bid accordingly. If you have been in business 10 years and operate a legit business with over head, vans, ins, etc. bid it what it's worth. Materials aren't cheap.

It may not be a 140k job. It may be 80k. It may be 150k. Hard to know without seeing the place. Just trying to help the guy. We have done plenty of commercial work and know the game.


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## kingsebi (Jan 27, 2009)

It also depends what part of the country you live. Around here $400-$500 a day is normal. I know a painter in Tenn who says $200-$300 a day is normal. Cost of living, materials, ins etc. all vary across the country.


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## RaleighPainter (Jun 13, 2011)

17k square ft is huge? I have heard enough.


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## paintermiah (Dec 29, 2011)

The rafters are steel. About two foot tall, with zig-zag members. I just imagine them wasting a lot of paint in overspray. Also, I know they have to add a fair amount of sq. footage beyond the flat ceiling. I was coming to the $45-55k range. It amazes me. I Haven't been in business for that long, but I am a top competitor in my area. I excel mostly because I do the bulk of every job myself and mostly just have helpers. I am young and can cover a lot of ground. That cuts down on wasted time, and everything comes out like I want it, with no compromises. It is hard to find any one who cares about the job as much as you do. Sometimes I can make an amazing amount of money and still do the job cheaper than others. I could make four or five grand a week, but if my bid is too low, it might not be taken as seriously. I just want to know that I am in the ballpark. My totals are:
21,433 total sq. ft. Interior wall space. One coat, three colors
13,090 total sq. ft. Flat ceiling surface area (not including rafters) two coats, one color
11,500 total sq. ft. Exterior wall space. Two coats, one color

Considering I have to paint ceiling and exterior twice, that leaves me with over seventy thousand square feet of paint to apply, minus a few bay doors. Plus washing/degreasing and a little scraping and caulking. And some kilz type product in two corners. Between the concrete and the extra waste on ceiling, I might average 250 sq. ft. coverage. Maybe better, maybe worse. That works out to about 300 gallons of paint. Tack that down when I meet with s.w. monday. I think $50k is a reasonable price, but want to make sure that others aren't coming in at seventy and above.


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## RaleighPainter (Jun 13, 2011)

All I was saying initially is commercial work is generally very very competitive. And most cases you don't have the opportunity to set yourself apart from the competition like you may while dealing with a homeowner... its USUALLY all about the lowest bid.


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## kingsebi (Jan 27, 2009)

This is getting off track. But yes it's a huge job. IMHO any job over 40-50k is huge.


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## kingsebi (Jan 27, 2009)

You are right and I hate that. It is all about who you know. Lowest bid, sad but true.


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## RaleighPainter (Jun 13, 2011)

You won't get much coverage on that ceiling, somewhere between 60 to 85 ish sq ft a gallon maybe 90. Cover the floors, even if u end up using a Dryfall product!


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## NaplesPainter (Aug 3, 2011)

paintermiah said:


> The rafters are steel. About two foot tall, with zig-zag members. I just imagine them wasting a lot of paint in overspray. Also, I know they have to add a fair amount of sq. footage beyond the flat ceiling. I was coming to the $45-55k range. It amazes me. I Haven't been in business for that long, but I am a top competitor in my area. I excel mostly because I do the bulk of every job myself and mostly just have helpers. I am young and can cover a lot of ground. That cuts down on wasted time, and everything comes out like I want it, with no compromises. It is hard to find any one who cares about the job as much as you do. Sometimes I can make an amazing amount of money and still do the job cheaper than others. I could make four or five grand a week, but if my bid is too low, it might not be taken as seriously. I just want to know that I am in the ballpark. My totals are:
> 21,433 total sq. ft. Interior wall space. One coat, three colors
> 13,090 total sq. ft. Flat ceiling surface area (not including rafters) two coats, one color
> 11,500 total sq. ft. Exterior wall space. Two coats, one color
> ...


21333 @ .50 = $10,700 (Could get burned with color selection but you said one coat)

13090 @ 1.50 = $19,645 (I always wipe down the rafters)

11500 @ .80 = $9,200.00

Scissor Lifts = $1,900.00


Total Cost = $41,445.00 


I would add around thirty cents more to ensure two coats on the wall so that way you don't get burned. That would put you around 47K. So you're right on the money. Some lunatic could do it for 40K if everything goes perfect.


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## paintermiah (Dec 29, 2011)

Thanks a lot : Naples, Julian, and King! Your information was useful, and I really appreciate the break down. Looks like my profit margin will be $20-25k, and I should make more with what I have set aside for labor and paint and incidentals. I worked at the dealership, it was my first job when I was 15. My sister works there, my stepdad is a manager and his father works there. I have a standing relationship with owner. I have also done work for other employees of the dealership, so if my bid is in the mix, I shouldn't have any problem landing it. Thanks again to the useful, thoughtful replies. 
Internet forums are always scattered with people that just like to be heard, regardless of what is dribbling out of there mouth.


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## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

paintermiah said:


> Internet forums are always scattered with people that just like to be heard, regardless of what is dribbling out of there mouth.


+1

*slightly disgusted by them*


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

Julian&co said:


> On commercial work, there is a 'going rate'.. I can assure you it is substantially lower than high end residential rates you are used to... It seems production is key in commercial either your company's dynamics fit the bill for the going rates and you're still able to profit, or they dont. Unless you have a phenomenal relationship with the GC or owner, lowest bid wins in most cases. Some company's can produce and still profit in these conditions, others can't. That's my experience with commercial work around here anyhow.


Yea the going rate is the lowest number unless you and the GC have a great relationship.


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## prototype66 (Mar 13, 2008)

It is good to have connections and a good relationship with the clients! Sounds like you have both, good luck dude! Some very good advice in this thread too, thanks guys! The rafters, we always used a compressor (or theirs cause its better) an a wand . Blow down the crud and used dry fall.... Still be sure to cover the floor!!!!!


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## RaleighPainter (Jun 13, 2011)

Just bid 140k.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

Julian&co said:


> Just bid 140k.


I'd be pretty stoked about submitting a six figure bid using information found on a painting forum.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

NEPS.US said:


> I'd be pretty stoked about submitting a six figure bid using information found on a painting forum.


I have a feeling it be either way high or way low. :whistling2:


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## RaleighPainter (Jun 13, 2011)

And the conclusion is........ somewhere between 40k and 140k.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

:thumbup:


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## Pauly the painter (Dec 29, 2011)

You should of said you had an "in" from the beginning. That changes everything, especially if your not gonna have "a problem landing it". Just ask them then what the lowest bid was and be right in line with that or slightly higher.


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## aaron61 (Apr 29, 2007)

Pauly the painter said:


> You should of said you had an "in" from the beginning. That changes everything, especially if your not gonna have "a problem landing it". Just ask them then what the lowest bid was and be right in line with that or slightly higher.


Cheater.Whats next,kick backs?


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## Bender (Aug 10, 2008)

Well shucks, just do it on a T&M then


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## WisePainter (Dec 27, 2008)

hey guys!

what's going on in here?


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## RaleighPainter (Jun 13, 2011)

WisePainter said:


> hey guys!
> 
> what's going on in here?


A 17k square foot room we are painting for 140k


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

aaron61 said:


> Cheater.Whats next,kick backs?


Why I said good relationship. :whistling2:


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