# Thumbs Up PPG Break Through



## jmda

This product is awesome. Supposedly sticks to ceramic tile. I can say it sticks to finished wood after sanding without any priming. Two coats with the black and everyone was happy. Covers well and lays down well.

We used it in a restaurant refinish and will use it again.


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## PatsPainting

are you talking about the product Breakthrough by Vanix?

Pat


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## jmda

maybe - PPG bought the company that makes this product at least according to my PPG/Porter rep. It is some pretty good stuff, we were very impressed.


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## PatsPainting

First I have heard about them being bought out. What is PPG? Also is this what your talking about?

Pat


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## ewingpainting.net

PatsPainting said:


> What is PPG?
> Pat





> *PPG Industries* (NYSE: PPG) is a global supplier of paints, coatings, optical products, specialty materials, chemicals, glass and fiber glass. With headquarters in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, PPG operates in more than 60 countries around the globe. Sales in 2009 were $12.2 billion. PPG is also the world's third largest producer of chlorine and caustic soda (used in a wide variety of industrial applications), vinyl chloride (for use in polyvinyl chloride resins), and chlorinated solvents.[1] It is headquartered in PPG Place, a popular office and retail complex in downtown Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, and is known for its glass facade designed by Philip Johnson. Founded in 1883 by Captain John Baptiste Ford and John Pitcairn as the *Pittsburgh Plate Glass Company* at Creighton, Pennsylvania; the company changed its name to *PPG Industries, Inc.* on 19 December 1968 to show its diverse offerings. On 2 January 2008, PPG acquired the SigmaKalon Group of companies from private investment firm Bain Capital, strongly increasing its paint and specialty coatings business.[2]
> Wikipedia


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## jmda

Yes and the label looks almost the same. That is a pretty good product, so far I am impressed.


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## Kirbyworks

*Breakthough: hard & flexible at the same time*

We've used it on 3 sets of kitchen cabinets and like it. Breakthrough has seemed to achieved the holy grail of hardness and flexibility which is great for cabinet doors that aren't always glued together well. My PPG rep said someone he knows paints his shoes with it!


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## Damon T

Kirbyworks said:


> We've used it on 3 sets of kitchen cabinets and like it. Breakthrough has seemed to achieved the holy grail of hardness and flexibility which is great for cabinet doors that aren't always glued together well. My PPG rep said someone he knows paints his shoes with it!


At our WSC PDCA convention the ppg guys (miller actually) brought a basketball painted in it. Super flexible.


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## kmp

I used it to do the basket ball layout on a resiliant gym floor at my daughter's middle school.Sticks to anything.Vanex, the orginal company before the ppg buyout,made a real good oil base bonding primer as well.Don't know about it currently.


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## Damon T

So I have no idea when Vanex came out with breakthrough, and when Ppg bought them out, and I have no idea when insl-x came out with cabinet coat, but again I think it's been quite a while. So why are these still taking a lot of the limelight when it comes to coatings that perform well and are on the top of a lot of the lists? Shouldn't we be seeing the kinds of progress that the IT field shows and get coatings which double in performance every year? At least every 5 years?!


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## kmp

I don't know when Breakthrough came out exactly but I painted some potato storage buildings with it back in the late 80's.PPG bought them four years or so ago I think.


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## GrantsPainting

Damon T said:


> So I have no idea when Vanex came out with breakthrough, and when Ppg bought them out, and I have no idea when insl-x came out with cabinet coat, but again I think it's been quite a while. So why are these still taking a lot of the limelight when it comes to coatings that perform well and are on the top of a lot of the lists? Shouldn't we be seeing the kinds of progress that the IT field shows and get coatings which double in performance every year? At least every 5 years?!


LOL. Yea it seems we only get advancements when people start developing tics or trees shrivel up. From lead to latex with mercury to high VOC to low VOC to NO VOC. Im certainly a fan of the no lead and mercury. but...

I cant wait to use this. Im picking up a gallon tomorrow and using it on my front door just to test it out. Maybe my rep will demo the gallon. I feel like a kid with a new toy!

PS The PPG tech guy told me that Breakthrough was using some of the same solvents that 409 uses to clean. He said nothing will clean my brushes like 409 after using Breakthrough.


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## jhudson

Great product, used it a number of times and am impressed. Painted the interior cabinets at a dentist office in white last summer and they still look in great shape.:thumbup:


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## 6126

Im considering this product for exterior front doors.


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## Xmark

I wish they sold it in a semi-gloss. It get's expensive having to box a satin and a gloss together. Satin is not enough sheen for kitchen cabinets in my opinion. (and gloss is too much)


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## Damon T

Xmark said:


> I wish they sold it in a semi-gloss. It get's expensive having to box a satin and a gloss together. Satin is not enough sheen for kitchen cabinets in my opinion. (and gloss is too much)


Is the satin not washable enough or you just don't like the low sheen? I


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## Xmark

Damon T said:


> Is the satin not washable enough or you just don't like the low sheen? I


Most of my clients prefer semi-gloss.

I'd love to use satin because it's easier to work with...The imperfections don't show up as much as when using SG...S Gloss does hold up better as well.


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## Paradigmzz

Just used 8 gallons recently. Mixed bag for me. Talk about an ultra thin product. Prone to micro spatter with brush work. Amazing blocking ability. Could shoot doors and by the time I was on the 6th door standing vertically on 90º door straps, I could come back and carry the first door and not leave finger imprints. Also, direcly over lacquer work with no adhesion primer this product performed beautifully. I love the ability to skip a step. 

Downside. Super thin. Hide was imperfect with brushwork. 
Second downside, making a semigloss is less than perfect science with combining gallons. I only boxed one to one versus batching all eight. In hind sight, i am glad i did. The satin and gloss do not stay blended well for that long. I caught a lot of dull door jambs that had already recieved two full coats. Most guys don't consider constantly restirring paint pots every so often. I walked the job and cringed at some of the later door frames from some paint pots that had not been stirred a half hour into applications. 

As far as hardness is concerned, its a tough, tight product. I covered a high gloss oil door without sanding as a lithmus test. Stuck like white on rice on a cross hatched tape test. Also wanted to try after wiping another oil door with mineral spirits (improper prep but that's what I wanted to try intentionally) and it failed miserably. Cannot handle the petroleum solvent residue. Granted this is an area of sheer operator error and misprep, but i wanted to mirror oil and grease contamination found in typical kitchen cabinets. Still need to clean correctly for proper adhesion.

Results, its a mixed bag. In the right setting it is pretty phenomenal stuff. It also has some serious downsides. My personal pet peeve was how thin it was. The builders paper had so many fine dropplets on it it was frustrating, what if with a brush stroke you flupped it onto a red wall and didn't notice? Not cool. As long as you understand its characteristics it is not a deal killer for me. I liked how it sprayed, but it dries FAST, I don't know how that would translate to dry spray in confined areas. 


Just felt like sharing my experiences so that hopefully others can have a benchmark to go off of. I'm definitely no expert with this product but hopefully this review will be somewhat helpful.


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## ReNt A PaInTeR

Airless with fine finish tip or AA?


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## Paradigmzz

ReNt A PaInTeR said:


> Airless with fine finish tip or AA?


The doors airless with ff410. I was going to use a 411 but my tip was holed out and I was 45 miles out in the country. I anticipated dry spray but it stayed wet enough to flow.


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## Xmark

Paradigmzz said:


> Just used 8 gallons recently. Mixed bag for me. Talk about an ultra thin product. Prone to micro spatter with brush work. Amazing blocking ability. Could shoot doors and by the time I was on the 6th door standing vertically on 90º door straps, I could come back and carry the first door and not leave finger imprints. Also, direcly over lacquer work with no adhesion primer this product performed beautifully. I love the ability to skip a step.
> 
> Downside. Super thin. Hide was imperfect with brushwork.
> Second downside, making a semigloss is less than perfect science with combining gallons. I only boxed one to one versus batching all eight. In hind sight, i am glad i did. The satin and gloss do not stay blended well for that long. I caught a lot of dull door jambs that had already recieved two full coats. Most guys don't consider constantly restirring paint pots every so often. I walked the job and cringed at some of the later door frames from some paint pots that had not been stirred a half hour into applications.
> 
> As far as hardness is concerned, its a tough, tight product. I covered a high gloss oil door without sanding as a lithmus test. Stuck like white on rice on a cross hatched tape test. Also wanted to try after wiping another oil door with mineral spirits (improper prep but that's what I wanted to try intentionally) and it failed miserably. Cannot handle the petroleum solvent residue. Granted this is an area of sheer operator error and misprep, but i wanted to mirror oil and grease contamination found in typical kitchen cabinets. Still need to clean correctly for proper adhesion.
> 
> Results, its a mixed bag. In the right setting it is pretty phenomenal stuff. It also has some serious downsides. My personal pet peeve was how thin it was. The builders paper had so many fine dropplets on it it was frustrating, what if with a brush stroke you flupped it onto a red wall and didn't notice? Not cool. As long as you understand its characteristics it is not a deal killer for me. I liked how it sprayed, but it dries FAST, I don't know how that would translate to dry spray in confined areas.
> 
> 
> Just felt like sharing my experiences so that hopefully others can have a benchmark to go off of. I'm definitely no expert with this product but hopefully this review will be somewhat helpful.


Good info...Do you think mixing it with a drill for about 4-5 minutes would help?...I don't know why they don't make a semi-gloss...Cabinet coat is the same way...I've read that this product is not good to spray a bunch of doors in the same room because it dries so fast and the dust will mess up the other doors...That said, it sounds perfect for kitchen cabinets.


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## Paradigmzz

Xmark said:


> Good info...Do you think mixing it with a drill for about 4-5 minutes would help?...I don't know why they don't make a semi-gloss...Cabinet coat is the same way...I've read that this product is not good to spray a bunch of doors in the same room because it dries so fast and the dust will mess up the other doors...That said, it sounds perfect for kitchen cabinets.


Maybe. All my paddles were mixing drywall mud for different textures we were applying in other areas of the house. I boxedin a fiver and shook and stirred. Maybe a long term blend would have been better. I didn't catch it till I was doing some tail end work and stopped and rebrushed out 5 casings. I never used the satin or gloss by themselves. I tell you what though, the areas that I saw that were incosistent reminded me more of the flat sheen of primer than satin. If this is representative of the satin by itself, the sheen is too low for my comfort.

I can see air born dry spray being an issue. But man you could shoot out cab doors single side and dry style (erecta rack, etc) and by the time you completed stacking them, you could reshoot oposite side of first and stack again. Crazy quick dry and no blocking time. Absolutely insane to be honest.


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## Damon T

Great feedback, thanks guys. 

I don't think I would risk boxing sheens based on the feedback. I like the satin finish. It's a low sheen for sure, but reminds me of cured out satin impervo. Low luster. The cabinet coat satin is higher sheen. I think it's rated 27-32 on the gloss spectrum, and I believe breakthrough is 20-25. Something like that. I don't know why they come in a range. Perhaps that depends on the smoothness of the substrate.
We did a whole house interior millpack and the dry spray was a hassle. I'm either gonna use this or Sw Kem aqua for our next cabinet job. Of course I seem to take way too long on cabinet jobs. Maybe I should just stick to rolling walls.


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## GrantsPainting

I used a 410 and it seemed to atomize so much that it would develop fingers because it was drying at the edge right out to the tip.

I LOVE the satin for cabinets!! It a VERY low gloss for that much pencil hardness. Totally looks like a factory finish. Plus not cheese factor at all!

I used the gloss on an entire house trim package that was replacing carpets (sprayed out)... It took some learning curve (many,many tack coats) but for changing from natural trim to white trim WITHOUT A PRIMER!!!! It bonded better than an oil with just a light sanding. There was an edge on the windows that we could not spray and that took at least three or four coats and was very difficult to brush out(not a fan of that at all!)


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## Xmark

GrantsPainting said:


> I used a 410 and it seemed to atomize so much that it would develop fingers because it was drying at the edge right out to the tip.
> 
> I LOVE the satin for cabinets!! It a VERY low gloss for that much pencil hardness. Totally looks like a factory finish. Plus not cheese factor at all!
> 
> I used the gloss on an entire house trim package that was replacing carpets (sprayed out)... It took some learning curve (many,many tack coats) but for changing from natural trim to white trim WITHOUT A PRIMER!!!! It bonded better than an oil with just a light sanding. There was an edge on the windows that we could not spray and that took at least three or four coats and was very difficult to brush out(not a fan of that at all!)


Not having to prime over oil and old lacquer is huge! Does it sand to a powder or is it difficult to sand? It almost seems too good to be true. Skipping the primer step makes this product a money maker.

Is the gloss really glossy if you know what I mean? If the satin is very low sheen (close to eggshell) perhaps the gloss is close to semi-gloss?


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## CASEY4599

*I live in UK - wondering what specs I should ask for*

to find equivalent. (Am painting lino floor )


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