# Ceiling Paint or Ceiling Surface???



## salmangeri (Sep 13, 2008)

I did a job several years ago in a basement in which there were a series of 5 windows that went to within about 5" from the ceiling. The windows let in a lot of light that ran across the ceiling surface. The ceiling had flat paint already on it and I applied two coats of Muralo 200 ceiling paint. I had been using that brand of paint for over five years and hadn't had any problems with it. But after rolling out two coats I noticed the ceiling paint had flashed. 

Well several years later I am up against the same situation. There are six windows in a room that I am painting that stop to within about 5" of the ceiling and let a lot of light in

Yesterday I applied one coat of Benjamin Moore Murasco ceiling white and after drying I noticed the same type of flashing. I plan to apply another coat today as I did with the other job but I suspect it won't help. 

Is there a type of product out their for ceilings that will do a better job than the Muralo and the Ben Moore products? Or is it a matter of ceiling prep?


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## BrushJockey (Mar 15, 2009)

BM's waterborne ceiling paint ( yellow can) is even flatter than Muresco- that may help.
What kind of flashing? Roller laps or cut in?
In some cases once ( cut in ) it has happened it doesn't go away with more coats. If new- roll whole thing tight to wall and cut after for your first coat.
I have even done a 'reset" by repriming with USG First Coat- its kind of like a porous builders flat- no cut as above. Then repaint.
Light like that is hard..


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## salmangeri (Sep 13, 2008)

Brush Jockey the ceiling is about 14 years old and the flashing is where it's rolled
My friend suggested SW Master Hide.......I've also heard good things about ben moore in the yellow can.......thanks again for posting :thumbsup:


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

BrushJockey said:


> BM's waterborne ceiling paint ( yellow can) is even flatter than Muresco- that may help.
> What kind of flashing? Roller laps or cut in?
> In some cases once ( cut in ) it has happened it doesn't go away with more coats. If new- roll whole thing tight to wall and cut after for your first coat.
> I have even done a 'reset" by repriming with USG First Coat- its kind of like a porous builders flat- no cut as above. Then repaint.
> Light like that is hard..


Flattest ceiling paint I have ever used since oil flats.


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## ddemair (Nov 3, 2008)

I think the main problem with painting ceilings to prevent flashing is keeping a wet edge. Since it could be several minutes before returning to the previous course, the paint could already be setting up.

I try to lay paint on very heavy to reduce this problem. Somtimes, I will prime the ceiling with an "enamel" primer to slow drying. I happen to like Behr enamel undercoater for this purpose.


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## salmangeri (Sep 13, 2008)

DDemair......I will keep that in mind......thanks!


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## Lazerline (Mar 26, 2012)

You could try spraying it. I've Never had a flashing issue with a good spray coat.


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## ImagelinePainting (Jun 18, 2010)

We had the same problem with some ceilings where the light was coming in from oposite directions. Did pretty much all the steps mentioned above and used BM ceiling paint( good product) , but nothing made them look good... Spraying wasn't an option, too much furniture in that place.


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## Lazerline (Mar 26, 2012)

I always spray in furnished homes. It just takes a lot more masking. What I do is move all furnishings in to give me enough space to navigate the perimeter. Sometimes I need to make a center path as well. I lay down a 9" paper perimeter around at the base boards with my masker. Spray glue 1.5 mil plastic to paper just wide enough to reach furniture. Than I spray glue .5 mil plastic to the heavy floor plastic and cover furniture. Takes more time to mask but I can blow that room out then peel all that masking from the outside in into a nice neat ball. Clean up done! 

I realize at this point in the job it might not be practical for this set up, But next time you have a situation where Flashing may be a concern and you want to spray with furniture this method is fast and produces good results for me. :thumbsup:


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

Lazerline said:


> I always spray in furnished homes. It just takes a lot more masking. What I do is move all furnishings in to give me enough space to navigate the perimeter. Sometimes I need to make a center path as well. I lay down a 9" paper perimeter around at the base boards with my masker. Spray glue 1.5 mil plastic to paper just wide enough to reach furniture. Than I spray glue .5 mil plastic to the heavy floor plastic and cover furniture. Takes more time to mask but I can blow that room out then peel all that masking from the outside in into a nice neat ball. Clean up done!
> 
> I realize at this point in the job it might not be practical for this set up, But next time you have a situation where Flashing may be a concern and you want to spray with furniture this method is fast and produces good results for me. :thumbsup:


What is "spray glue"?


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## TheRogueBristle (Mar 19, 2010)

Why not put two coats a premium flat white wall paint, like Moore's Regal Select? A little more pricey, but you will save by getting the results you needin two coats, no muss, no fuss.


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## Lazerline (Mar 26, 2012)

TJ Paint said:


> What is "spray glue"?


3M makes a medium tack in a red can. You can find it in the the adhesives isle at hardware stores for about 10 bucks a can. Great for gluing plastics and paper together. A great tool to have when masking for spraying. Much easier than tape in some applications.


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## venetian designs (Nov 24, 2007)

Had that issue before, prime with CoverStain, roll first coat of SW CHB with the light, second coat perpendicular to the main light source. Using a 3/4" x 18" Colossus helps too, and apply heavy.


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## ImagelinePainting (Jun 18, 2010)

Lazerline said:


> I always spray in furnished homes. It just takes a lot more masking. What I do is move all furnishings in to give me enough space to navigate the perimeter. Sometimes I need to make a center path as well. I lay down a 9" paper perimeter around at the base boards with my masker. Spray glue 1.5 mil plastic to paper just wide enough to reach furniture. Than I spray glue .5 mil plastic to the heavy floor plastic and cover furniture. Takes more time to mask but I can blow that room out then peel all that masking from the outside in into a nice neat ball. Clean up done!
> 
> I realize at this point in the job it might not be practical for this set up, But next time you have a situation where Flashing may be a concern and you want to spray with furniture this method is fast and produces good results for me. :thumbsup:


We try to minimize the apraying in furnished houses , that's one of my rules because of the headache it can create when people miss covering areas and think the overspray won't go there...


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## ImagelinePainting (Jun 18, 2010)

Btw i assume we are talking about flat ceilings...


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## Lazerline (Mar 26, 2012)

ImagelinePainting said:


> We try to minimize the apraying in furnished houses , that's one of my rules because of the headache it can create when people miss covering areas and think the overspray won't go there...


Headache, more like Migraine! I know what you mean. I do pride myself in being thorough in my masking though. But I work solo. I suppose if that responsibility were left to an individual less vested in the job I would be more concerned as well.


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## Hanger in VT (Aug 5, 2008)

This past January I had exactly the same problem in an inn we were renovating. There were large windows on one side of a big room that went right up to the ceiling. We sprayed and back rolled BM waterbourne ceiling paint, as I was told it was dead flat. To me, it looked horrible. I ended up spraying and rolling it 3 times, and it never looked right. Kept a wet edge...did not seem to matter. No one said anything, but it did not look good. I think that with bright light coming from one direction, and windows up to the ceiling, it will look like crap no matter what.


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

I'm in the middle of a job that has huge vaulted ceilings with a ton of windows.i decided to try KILLZ proX 300 DEAD FLAT and i'm extremely impressed with the results.this is a $3M dollar house in the best part of town.my pole gun laid some serious tailing but the flat paint didn't show a thing!great stuff!!! I sprayed it very HEAVY and don't know how it rolls out.i didn't tint it.

edit: jack paul recommended the Killz pro-X 100 but i chickened out and went with the higher line 300.still a bargain at $99 a five.

it's definitely NOW my go-to ceiling paint when spraying.I love benj moore's flat ceiling paint when rolling.


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## Builtmany (Dec 5, 2009)

TheRogueBristle said:


> Why not put two coats a premium flat white wall paint, like Moore's Regal Select? A little more pricey, but you will save by getting the results you needin two coats, no muss, no fuss.


It's not really a DEAD flat and has some angular sheen when dry. Flashing ceilings should have the deadest flat known to man.


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## Hanger in VT (Aug 5, 2008)

I've never had a problem on vaulted ceilings, only flat ceilings, where the light is coming in at a right angle.


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

Builtmany said:


> It's not really a DEAD flat and has some angular sheen when dry. Flashing ceilings should have the deadest flat known to man.



Killz pro x 300 is the deadest flat known to man!:yes:


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## FFP (May 12, 2010)

SW CHB works for me in those situations.


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## Builtmany (Dec 5, 2009)

Xmark said:


> Killz pro x 300 is the deadest flat known to man!:yes:


Good to know. IMO Kilz makes some awful products including Kilz2 so I just have a tough time accepting their products in general

I did use their dead flat last summer on a ceiling where the lighting was not so good so I can't be a good judge. I guess I will try it again someday when I'm at Depot buying other items.


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

Builtmany said:


> Good to know. IMO Kilz makes some awful products including Kilz2 so I just have a tough time accepting their products in general
> 
> I did use their dead flat last summer on a ceiling where the lighting was not so good so I can't be a good judge. I guess I will try it again someday when I'm at Depot buying other items.


i'm always open to new products.things change so quick today.i'm happy that i took a chance on using a perceived cheap product.i won this round.:yes:


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## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

Xmark said:


> i'm always open to new products.things change so quick today.i'm happy that i took a chance on using a perceived cheap product.i won this round.:yes:


 Diddo!:thumbsup:


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## ReNt A PaInTeR (Dec 28, 2008)

Xmark said:


> Killz pro x 300 is the deadest flat known to man!:yes:


Kilz Pro-X 300 dead flat is a really great product. So far I have used all the products in the 300 lines and I'm very happy with the results. Great paint for ceilings, If my customer wants a bright white I usually go with SW Brilliance but that is around $30.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

I heard they are going to discontinue sw brilliance with another ceiling paint called "eminence" or something like that.

I've used promar zero flat for ceilings and that worked for me.

Sent from my MB508 using Paint Talk


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## ReNt A PaInTeR (Dec 28, 2008)

TJ Paint said:


> I heard they are going to discontinue sw brilliance with another ceiling paint called "eminence" or something like that.
> 
> I've used promar zero flat for ceilings and that worked for me.
> 
> Sent from my MB508 using Paint Talk


  Source??


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## ReNt A PaInTeR (Dec 28, 2008)

TJ Paint said:


> I've used promar zero flat for ceilings and that worked for me.
> 
> Sent from my MB508 using Paint Talk


I try to use an ultra flat for ceilings all the time.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

ReNt A PaInTeR said:


> http://www.mysmiley.net Source??


Sw manager last week.

Sent from my MB508 using Paint Talk


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## ReNt A PaInTeR (Dec 28, 2008)

TJ Paint said:


> Sw manager last week.
> 
> Sent from my MB508 using Paint Talk


I noticed this change today at the store


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