# Geometric Wallpaper. Matching and inside corners.



## finishesbykevyn

So my local paint shop called me in to re-do a wallpaper job that apparently the "last guy" had troubles with. I'll try to get a picture. But it's one of the continual geometric designs with about 50 matching lines per sheet. Seems almost impossible to have every line match up by the time you get to the bottom of the sheet. Not to mention when you wrap the corner. I usually do my cuts in the corner, and you lose a bit of the pattern. Theres almost no way to get is to match on the next wall. I personally though it was totally acceptable, but she is super OCD. (Surgeon) and picked it apart. Faak. What would you do?


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## Masterwork

For one, you're not supposed to do cuts/seams in corners 

You basically have to pre-cut everything with a machine, so the edges are straight. Then, when it goes on the wall, it should line up, if you made the cuts in the right spots. There's no overlapping and double cutting.

Is there a gap between the white patterns? You could make the cuts in the blue areas only, which will waste a lot of material, but then you don't have to worry as much about it lining up perfectly.


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## finishesbykevyn

Masterwork said:


> For one, you're not supposed to do cuts/seams in corners
> 
> You basically have to pre-cut everything with a machine, so the edges are straight. Then, when it goes on the wall, it should line up, if you made the cuts in the right spots. There's no overlapping and double cutting.
> 
> Is there a gap between the white patterns? You could make the cuts in the blue areas only, which will waste a lot of material, but then you don't have to worry as much about it lining up perfectly.


Do you even hang wallpaper? What is this machine you speak of? Corners are never straight and I'm pretty sure most people do their cuts in the corners..don't they!?


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## finishesbykevyn

If you zoom in on the first corner, you can see the issue.But, Over all though I thought it turned out well. Definitely not an easy hang! 😂


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## finishesbykevyn

I just realized that @Woodco had this same issue/question a couple years back. Did you ever have an epiphany about this.? Besides talk client out of hanging geometric paper in a whole room...


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## Masterwork

I've only ever seen one guy use it, but it's like a big paper cutter that lets you trim the edge of the paper, to change the width. And a lot of specs forbid you from seams within 3-6 inches of any corners (inside, or outside).


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## Gwarel

I use 2 pieces to match the corner. Whatever amount of pattern is lost in the first piece is added back in the second piece. I have found that sometimes a little extra in the second is needed, especially if the corner is out. In that case a slight overlap may be needed to get the pattern matched from top to bottom, and then carefully trimmed out in the corner where the overlap is needed. To my eye, extra pattern is less detectable than missing pattern, and sometimes (a lot of times) it is impossible to get a perfect match from top to bottom and still be plumb coming out of the corner. Of course, if you can't get a perfect match, whether in the corner or on the seam, eye level is the most important area of the match.


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## Woodco

What Gwarel said. Thats the best way to match a pattern in a corner. I only do it on certain occasions though. You have to have plenty of paper. Sometimes I get creative cutting the second piece to dull out some sharp patterns. I have even appliqued piece of patterns in the corner to give the illusion that it matches. Even a few marker swipes can make it look a little better sometimes. 

But sometimes, the corners are out of whack, and the pattern is too angular and geometric and theres only so much that can be done. 

A couple few pages into this article here, is some good explanations, and videos on making inside corners the best way possible. 





The soon to be musings of a grumpy old paperhanger | Painters Pit Stop - Decorators Forum (The Forum for Paint Trade Professionals)


Folks, I beg your indulgence until tomorrow to post up the pics and info relating to returning internal corners clean without tape. As I offered to...




www.painterspitstop.com





I dont know what the heck Masterwork is even talking about...


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## finishesbykevyn

Gwarel said:


> I use 2 pieces to match the corner. Whatever amount of pattern is lost in the first piece is added back in the second piece. I have found that sometimes a little extra in the second is needed, especially if the corner is out. In that case a slight overlap may be needed to get the pattern matched from top to bottom, and then carefully trimmed out in the corner where the overlap is needed. To my eye, extra pattern is less detectable than missing pattern, and sometimes (a lot of times) it is impossible to get a perfect match from top to bottom and still be plumb coming out of the corner. Of course, if you can't get a perfect match, whether in the corner or on the seam, eye level is the most important area of the match.


This makes sense and had considered that after the paste had dried of course..Although, I guess then you have to deal with a bit of over lap, but yes better than a total mismatch I suppose.. Thx Gwarel.


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## Masterwork

Woodco said:


> I dont know what the heck Masterwork is even talking about...


I find this interesting. It must be a commercial thing. Dental offices, banks, etc.... No seams in corners! I've come across this in job specs as well as vinyl wall covering data sheets.


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## finishesbykevyn

Masterwork said:


> I find this interesting. It must be a commercial thing. Dental offices, banks, etc.... No seams in corners! I've come across this in job specs as well as vinyl wall covering data sheets.


Ya, vinyls are a different animal. Especially when there is no pattern to match. You can just wrap the corners and then double cut all your seams. With these finicky designer papers, you have to be dead on. Even a 16th of an inch off can be noticeable when it's a stupid geometric pattern like this one..


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## DennisNYS

I do not hang paper, and I am not interested in doing so.
But from the pics, it looks great to me.


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## finishesbykevyn

DennisNYS said:


> I do not hang paper, and I am not interested in doing so.
> But from the pics, it looks great to me.


Thx. Ya,it turned out quite well. But Some people just can't be pleased..🙄


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## fauxlynn

I don’t hang paper but I’ve done a bazillion wall stencils that had to line up. What I’m seeing on this bathroom is unacceptable. The drop from left to right under that window is probably an inch and a half. That area should’ve been perfect based on how noticeable that are is. 
Good luck if you decide to take it on . Surgeon or no surgeon, she has every reason to find it unacceptable.


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## slinger58

fauxlynn said:


> I don’t hang paper but I’ve done a bazillion wall stencils that had to line up. What I’m seeing on this bathroom is unacceptable. The drop from left to right under that window is probably an inch and a half. That area should’ve been perfect based on how noticeable that are is.
> Good luck if you decide to take it on . Surgeon or no surgeon, she has every reason to find it unacceptable.


Damn! You’ve got good eyes. I won’t be posting any of my work. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## finishesbykevyn

fauxlynn said:


> I don’t hang paper but I’ve done a bazillion wall stencils that had to line up. What I’m seeing on this bathroom is unacceptable. The drop from left to right under that window is probably an inch and a half. That area should’ve been perfect based on how noticeable that are is.
> Good luck if you decide to take it on . Surgeon or no surgeon, she has every reason to find it unacceptable.


Damn you. I just noticed that. She does have a good eye.! To be fair, I only hang a few job per year. I was sweating bullets on this one. Tough crowd.


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## fauxlynn

Yeah, tough crowd! I’ve been damned twice today.

Anyway,I think I said that backwards. It goes up from left to right, not down. Don’t you guys ever sit on the toilet to check the walls?

Kevyn, you already fixed it? I thought those were pics of the other guy’s work. Sorry!

Slinger, you’re old school so I’m sure you can paint with your eyes closed.


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## Woodco

fauxlynn said:


> Yeah, tough crowd! I’ve been damned twice today.
> 
> Anyway,I think I said that backwards. It goes up from left to right, not down. Don’t you guys ever sit on the toilet to check the walls?
> 
> Kevyn, you already fixed it? I thought those were pics of the other guy’s work. Sorry!
> 
> Slinger, you’re old school so I’m sure you can paint with your eyes closed.


I'll chime in again. Yes, that is unacceptable, but sometimes, its unavoidable. If there wasnt enough paper to properly do it, for example. Just today, I had a problem because the corners were out of whack. All I could do, is overlap the paper at eye level and make it look good there, but above and below, the pattern went out.. If the room is out of whack, we can only do what we can do... But yes, that could have been done way better, but hes asking for our help, just like I used to do.


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## Woodco

Masterwork said:


> I find this interesting. It must be a commercial thing. Dental offices, banks, etc.... No seams in corners! I've come across this in job specs as well as vinyl wall covering data sheets.


 because commercial generally doesnt have patterns to deal with. Patterned wallpaper usually cannot be wrapped in inside or outside corners. . It is cut in the inside corner, and slightly overlapped and cut on an outside corner. You cant take a torch to paper to make it flex like vinyl, and even if you could, it would screw the pattern up big time.


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## finishesbykevyn

fauxlynn said:


> Yeah, tough crowd! I’ve been damned twice today.
> 
> Anyway,I think I said that backwards. It goes up from left to right, not down. Don’t you guys ever sit on the toilet to check the walls?
> 
> Kevyn, you already fixed it? I thought those were pics of the other guy’s work. Sorry!
> 
> Slinger, you’re old school so I’m sure you can paint with your eyes closed.


Haha. All good. Under that window was probably one of the last pieces and had to be overlapped to match the pattern. I'm pretty sure I was at the end of my patience by this time. I was so focused on keeping the pattern "in tact", that keeping it level under that window never even crossed my mind. It was however very level across the ceiling line and the rest of the wainscot. So cut me a little slack! 😅 🙏. I am glad you pointed that out though.


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## Masterwork

finishesbykevyn said:


> Haha. All good. Under that window was probably one of the last pieces and had to be overlapped to match the pattern. I'm pretty sure I was at the end of my patience by this time. I was so focused on keeping the pattern "in tact", that keeping it level under that window never even crossed my mind. It was however very level across the ceiling line and the rest of the wainscot. So cut me a little slack! 😅 🙏. I am glad you pointed that out though.


That's a pain. So you can start on one wall, and by the time you circle around the room, the pattern is off? It doesn't seem like there is actually a way to make that work, if the walls/room aren't perfectly square.


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## fauxlynn

Woodco said:


> I'll chime in again. Yes, that is unacceptable, but sometimes, its unavoidable. If there wasnt enough paper to properly do it, for example. Just today, I had a problem because the corners were out of whack. All I could do, is overlap the paper at eye level and make it look good there, but above and below, the pattern went out.. If the room is out of whack, we can only do what we can do... But yes, that could have been done way better, but hes asking for our help, just like I used to do.



Yeah, he asked what would you do. It wasn’t clear to me from the first post that he already did the job. I thought he was trying to gain info based on the original job to not repeat the first guy’s errors. My bad.

Honestly, don’t you guys check those areas to see if it’s going to present a problem? If not, why? I realize it’s different from stenciling entire walls but, how do you determine what wall to start on? For us it was always about site lines. What area might be in your site line from entering the room? Or sitting on the toilet? 

If there’s not enough paper to properly do the job, why ruin more paper? Wouldn’t that become something you alert the homeowner about?

I know it might not seem so but my comment was intended to be helpful. Unhappy customers are not good for business.


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## Gwarel

You want to paper a bathroom with a geometric pattern. What are the odds that:
1) The ceiling is level all the way around.
2) The tile is level all the way around.
3) The corners are plumb.
4) The window ledge is parallel to the tile.
5) The pattern itself is perfectly aligned on the paper.
Answer: The odds are zero. You're the paperhanger, make it look perfect......


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## Masterwork

And people wonder why I refuse to take on jobs like this...


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## Woodco

fauxlynn said:


> Yeah, he asked what would you do. It wasn’t clear to me from the first post that he already did the job. I thought he was trying to gain info based on the original job to not repeat the first guy’s errors. My bad.
> 
> Honestly, don’t you guys check those areas to see if it’s going to present a problem? If not, why? I realize it’s different from stenciling entire walls but, how do you determine what wall to start on? For us it was always about site lines. What area might be in your site line from entering the room? Or sitting on the toilet?
> 
> If there’s not enough paper to properly do the job, why ruin more paper? Wouldn’t that become something you alert the homeowner about?
> 
> I know it might not seem so but my comment was intended to be helpful. Unhappy customers are not good for business.


Sometimes people call and want an installation and have already bought the paper, and are a little on the short side... You cant just go to the store and get more paper. Also, with somethign like a mural, thats just not gonna work. The best thing to do there, is to not split the sheet, get it into he corner, then cut one side of the corner, so it minimizes pattern loss.

It also depends on the paper. Some patterns HAVE to be plumb, even if the walls and ceiling arent. If we cock it to try to match the off plumb corners, then when artwork is hung, it will look like its crooked. And we also cant think of everything. Sometimes we get caught up just trying to make the ceiling look right, that we miss that the corners are out. Theres a LOT of variables, and its easy to overlook something due to being focused on something else, then we finish up, and see where we screwed up, and then its too late...

With this particular pattern, it repeats horizontally, so it could have easily been slid over to the next pattern to overlap the corner the best way possible, so yeah, thats a rookie mistake. Learn from it. Then do a combination of creative cutting, and markers to blend in anything that doesnt quite match right. Its really time consuming. Another thing todo is pick the most visible corner and start the paper there. If your paper were overlapped you can cut out tiny notches on the top layer to expose the color beneath, so it at least doesnt look like a sharp cut off. Get creative. Do this with your kill point too. I've even cut pieces out of a scrap, and glued it on top of the paper to make it look right. 

Some advanced techniques involve widening or narrowing the pattern with creative cutting to make the pattern land in the corner in a better spot. If it was being hung left to right, over the door would be a great place to do this. IT can be done on a full wall though, but its tedious. If one were hanging vertical stripes, and you have a stripe in a corner thats off by a 1/2" in the corner, you can double cut the strip in one or more places where that 1/2" is either spread out to several stripes that are 1/8" a piece or whatever will not show as much. I'll see if I can download some pics of some tricky stuff I've done.


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## Woodco

Here is a room I got REALLY creative with. I widened and narrowed stripes all over the place to make everything land in good spots. and make the stripes meet each other on the other side of the room See if you can spot where I did it, besides the obvious diagonal parts. This was actually pretty fun making everything line up in a good way. It was like a puzzle. Log in to Facebook


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## Woodco

here is an example of a very bad out of whack corner situation with pattern that showed it really bad. Some places I creatively cut into the overlaps, and some places, I cut out fish bodies out of scraps and glued them onto the paper. It doesnt look great, but it looks WAY better than what it would have been with headless or tailless fish.


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## Woodco

Hers a minor "tent" effect I did on a ceiling. It was no accident that both sides landed the way they did. I did the diagonals on one side, and went out a little ways, then I went to the other side, and did the same, Where there was about 6 feet in the middle, I cut some guide strips to see how they would meet up. I had to overlap three or four pieces and widened a few of the light colored stripes about 1/2" You have to look REALLY hard to see them. Log into Facebook


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## Woodco

Heres a 'queen of spain' I did in a powder room. This stuff is 52" wide, so overlapping two strips in the corner is out of the question. I dont quite remember how I got this corner. I think I just had to measure it absolutely perfect, and got lucky with the straightness of the corner. If there were any wierd cut off spots, I would probably have cut out some tear drops from a scrap and glued them to the paper. The black version of this is a lot easier, as you can use a marker to to round out any cut offs a little


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## Woodco

This one, I believe I just got incredibly lucky with and everything landed perfectly. If it didnt, I would have cut an even amount off of two strips in a corner to cut an even amount off both sides so they line up in the corner. If needed I could have trimmed an equal amount off the butt sides of the strips to shrink the pattern a touch to make it fit better


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## Woodco

This one, I balanced the pattern so all four walls had equal corners, and the pattern was centered on each one, so I did the back wall first, then when I got to the left corner, I had about 2"overlapping. I did my best to cut an equal amount off the strip on the next wall so the pattern is essentially mirrored, and cut off equally on both walls Of course it wasnt perfect, so I used a black sharpy to fill some white to make all the little white arrowhead looking things mirror each other. I also could have cut matching pieces and glued them to the paper as well, but I didnt want to spend the time.


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## Woodco

One more. This ones a video, so hopefully the link works. Its a damask pattern in an entryway. The patterns fit perfectly in the two narrow walls, so I made each corner perfect, and met them in the middle about the door, and archway, and creatively spliced them together up high. It took a long time to pull this off right, but I think it was worth the effort, as it looks a lot better to have the corners perfect. See if you can spot where I joined them. The part over the door is a little more obvious, but the part over the arch, you can barely tell. 

EDIT...I cant post the video, but I'll leave the story here to give an idea of what to do in a situation like that.


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## Woodco

Also, heres the post I made about a horrible looking corner. The paper was already ordered, when I got the job, so I didnt have enough to overlap two strips. It still would have looked bad, but I could have at least made it match at eye level. Is there any way to avoid this?

straight Diagonal geometrics in corners are the WORST.


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## finishesbykevyn

Wow. Super impressive Woodco. I can hardly wrap my head around how you did the diagonal ceiling stripes to match up. That rounded wall looks super cool also. I assume paper goes on a curved wall no problem? Or does it wrinkle? Yes, there are soo many things to consider and think about when doing a room that it spins your head in circles. Like I said, I only do a few hangs per year so have slowly been learning over the years and every paper is different which makes it like learning all over again each time you do it. It funny how you can be so focused on one concern and then totally blow something so obvious like my under the window conundrum. You actually would't notice that sitting on the toilet and in fact didn't notice until that picture was taken.. Thanks for all the tips guys.


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## Masterwork

finishesbykevyn said:


> You actually would't notice that sitting on the toilet


Aha! Finally, another person who straddles the toilet, facing the tank. You like to hug the back for emotional support while you push, too, eh?


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## Holland

Excellent work @Woodco !! I imagine that ceiling was fun to hang!

@finishesbykevyn- i thought your work looked good. I’m not sure I would minded (or noticed) the slight discrepancy near the window.

I don’t know how to hang paper, can appreciate a skill I don’t have.


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## Woodco

finishesbykevyn said:


> Wow. Super impressive Woodco. I can hardly wrap my head around how you did the diagonal ceiling stripes to match up. That rounded wall looks super cool also. I assume paper goes on a curved wall no problem? Or does it wrinkle? Yes, there are soo many things to consider and think about when doing a room that it spins your head in circles. Like I said, I only do a few hangs per year so have slowly been learning over the years and every paper is different which makes it like learning all over again each time you do it. It funny how you can be so focused on one concern and then totally blow something so obvious like my under the window conundrum. You actually would't notice that sitting on the toilet and in fact didn't notice until that picture was taken.. Thanks for all the tips guys.


Thanks. That curved wall didnt give a problem.


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## Gwarel

Woodco said:


> here is an example of a very bad out of whack corner situation with pattern that showed it really bad. Some places I creatively cut into the overlaps, and some places, I cut out fish bodies out of scraps and glued them onto the paper. It doesnt look great, but it looks WAY better than what it would have been with headless or tailless fish.
> View attachment 112223


A trick I learned from Da Arch on here years ago is to de-laminate the pattern from the backing, making the overlay much thinner and less detectable.


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## Holland

Woodco said:


> Here is a room I got REALLY creative with. I widened and narrowed stripes all over the place to make everything land in good spots. and make the stripes meet each other on the other side of the room See if you can spot where I did it, besides the obvious diagonal parts. This was actually pretty fun making everything line up in a good way. It was like a puzzle. Log in to Facebook
> View attachment 112229
> View attachment 112230


My OCD is satisfied by how the paper lines up with the vent. 👍🏻


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## Woodco

How I handled a kill point yesterday... I could have done much better, but I was in a time crunch... Clear elmers glue on the paper over paper, btw. Its up high, and the purpose is really to keep peoples eyes from drawing there.


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## finishesbykevyn

Woodco said:


> How I handled a kill point yesterday... I could have done much better, but I was in a time crunch... Clear elmers glue on the paper over paper, btw. Its up high, and the purpose is really to keep peoples eyes from drawing there.
> View attachment 112247
> View attachment 112248
> View attachment 112249


Yes man. Fantastic. I totally get it now. Why Elmer's glue. Sticks a little better I guess..?


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## fauxlynn

Woodco said:


> Sometimes people call and want an installation and have already bought the paper, and are a little on the short side... You cant just go to the store and get more paper. Also, with somethign like a mural, thats just not gonna work. The best thing to do there, is to not split the sheet, get it into he corner, then cut one side of the corner, so it minimizes pattern loss.
> 
> It also depends on the paper. Some patterns HAVE to be plumb, even if the walls and ceiling arent. If we cock it to try to match the off plumb corners, then when artwork is hung, it will look like its crooked. And we also cant think of everything. Sometimes we get caught up just trying to make the ceiling look right, that we miss that the corners are out. Theres a LOT of variables, and its easy to overlook something due to being focused on something else, then we finish up, and see where we screwed up, and then its too late...
> 
> With this particular pattern, it repeats horizontally, so it could have easily been slid over to the next pattern to overlap the corner the best way possible, so yeah, thats a rookie mistake. Learn from it. Then do a combination of creative cutting, and markers to blend in anything that doesnt quite match right. Its really time consuming. Another thing todo is pick the most visible corner and start the paper there. If your paper were overlapped you can cut out tiny notches on the top layer to expose the color beneath, so it at least doesnt look like a sharp cut off. Get creative. Do this with your kill point too. I've even cut pieces out of a scrap, and glued it on top of the paper to make it look right.
> 
> Some advanced techniques involve widening or narrowing the pattern with creative cutting to make the pattern land in the corner in a better spot. If it was being hung left to right, over the door would be a great place to do this. IT can be done on a full wall though, but its tedious. If one were hanging vertical stripes, and you have a stripe in a corner thats off by a 1/2" in the corner, you can double cut the strip in one or more places where that 1/2" is either spread out to several stripes that are 1/8" a piece or whatever will not show as much. I'll see if I can download some pics of some tricky stuff I've done.


I appreciate you taking the time to educate some of us. Your work looks great. I’ve done similar tricks when stenciling or doing stripes. It’s time consuming, all right.


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## Redux

fauxlynn said:


> I appreciate you taking the time to educate some of us. Your work looks great. I’ve done similar tricks when stenciling or doing stripes. It’s time consuming, all right.


My father who was a painter/faux artist had me and my sibling(s) planning the layouts, adjusting widths, and installing glazed stippled stripes when we were just kids back in junior high-school...maybe even back in elementary school...same applied with adjusting stripe widths with wall-coverings


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## fauxlynn

Look at that pristine white shirt!


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