# flat ceiling showing roller marks



## cfehr44

I'm painting a very large flat ceiling in the main living area of a home that reflect tons of natural light. I'm in my first year as an independent paint contractor and this is my first time with a flat ceiling this large and reflective. The drywal was finished well and i sprayed it with a coat of pva primer and now 2 coats of glidden flat ceiling paint but I cant get a flat finish to save my life. I've sanded, sprayed, and back rolled with a 1/4 inch nap but I'm getting tons of roller marks everywhere. How can I fix this?


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## Rbriggs82

cfehr44 said:


> I'm painting a very large flat ceiling in the main living area of a home that reflect tons of natural light. I'm in my first year as an independent paint contractor and this is my first time with a flat ceiling this large and reflective. The drywal was finished well and i sprayed it with a coat of pva primer and now 2 coats of glidden flat ceiling paint but I cant get a flat finish to save my life. I've sanded, sprayed, and back rolled with a 1/4 inch nap but I'm getting tons of roller marks everywhere. How can I fix this?


I haven't run into that problem in a while but have in the past. I had a monster ceiling that would stripe no matter what I did then I tried using a 1/2 SW Sher-Fab roller sleeve and that solved it. 

I also like to roll the ceiling parallel with the wall that has the most windows. Don't know if that makes a big difference but I do it anyway. 

One other thing you can try is using a cheaper more dead flat paint.


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## andy1015

i've never had any luck using glidden paint...


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## jacob33

BM Superhide flat white will solve a lot of your problems. If there is a lot of natural light you need a dead flat paint and that is the flattest I have found.


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## cfehr44

I've tried rolling in either direction and that hasn't helped. Also, the glidden paint is pretty cheap but flat as well. I think it's technique over paint quality that's giving me trouble. I've thought about sanding again and using a foam roller?


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## jacob33

Just give it a try and use BM super hide flat white. You can sand what you got but you will not regret it. It is only about 13 a gallon so it is cheap. 

The other thing you can do if your having trouble keeping a wet edge is priming with guardz and than you got one chance to use a dead flat paint but it will stay wet longer because the ceiling will be sealed tight.


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## KD PAINTING

Try using a quality ceiling paint like SW Masterhide and apply two coats on the ceiling..and yes roll parallel with the wall with the most windows. 
Good Luck!


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## Jmayspaint

cfehr44 said:


> I've tried rolling in either direction and that hasn't helped. Also, the glidden paint is pretty cheap but flat as well. I think it's technique over paint quality that's giving me trouble. I've thought about sanding again and using a foam roller?



I think a foam roller would be going in the wrong direction. Like Brigs said, use a 1/2. Put more paint on the surface. 

Even flat paint can flash and look crappy if the paint is applied too thinly in an effort to "really smooth it out" 

Try spraying a heavy coat and back rolling in one direction with a wet roller.


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## TJ Paint

Don't use a 1/4 in roller. That will cause more issues.


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## andy1015

I dont think i've ever used a foam roller...my mom seems to like them tho...


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## cdaniels

I have had the same problem in the past with Glidden ceiling paint.It is not a dead flat even tho the rep told me it was.


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## Schmidt & Co.

Use a different paint. Use a thicker sleeve. If you can't keep a wet edge, put another guy on a roller. Although if your using a 1/4 in sleeve, sounds like your dry rolling it.


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## MikeCalifornia

spray it. Run 99" masking film around the peremiter and drop the floors. Stack two coats crosshatched, done. Why didn't you spray to begin with? You sprayed the PVA? I would have just shot two coats of flat and been done with it, no primer.


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## cfehr44

A lot of great suggestions here guys I really appreciate it. It makes sense that the short nap would be causing the streaks and yes, the roller has been pretty dry while back rolling. This is also my first time using a sprayer indoors as most of my indoor jobs are repaints and not large remodels. I'm out of the glidden stuff so Monday I'll pick up a few gallons of the BM super hide, do a light sand, and spray and back roll with a 1/2" cover.


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## RH

Track down and shoot the guy who did a smooth ceiling which gets flooded with natural light.


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## Damon T

Dead flat is what you need. SW builders solution matte is SW deadest flat. BM ceiling paint or ultra spec flat. Someone else mentioned another BM paint but I've never tried it. Shouldn't need to sand. The roller marks are the sheen showing. Should be fine with a dead flat, but feel free to lightly pole sand if you like


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## Hines Painting

Are you sure its not the drywall finish?


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## squid

Angular sheen issues seem to arise when rolling flat over flat. Many times I've rolled one coat over a sealed surface, I look at- it's perfect, I go and roll another coat because that's whats on the contract and I f it up no matter how hard I try.

I suggest rolling 1 coat of gardz and 1 coat of BM super hide flat with a 1/2" roller. I've yet to use ultra spec for this situation but I like how it performs.


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## mudbone

cfehr44 said:


> A lot of great suggestions here guys I really appreciate it. It makes sense that the short nap would be causing the streaks and yes, the roller has been pretty dry while back rolling. This is also my first time using a sprayer indoors as most of my indoor jobs are repaints and not large remodels. I'm out of the glidden stuff so Monday I'll pick up a few gallons of the BM super hide, do a light sand, and spray and back roll with a 1/2" cover.


 With a 1/2 nap it wont be smooth anymore!


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## mudbone

Damon T said:


> Dead flat is what you need. SW builders solution matte is SW deadest flat. BM ceiling paint or ultra spec flat. Someone else mentioned another BM paint but I've never tried it. Shouldn't need to sand. The roller marks are the sheen showing. Should be fine with a dead flat, but feel free to lightly pole sand if you like


 Kilz pro-x 310 is flatter even yet with excellent hide and color retention.Good call though.


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## Lazerline

mudbone said:


> Kilz pro-x 310 is flatter even yet with excellent hide and color retention.Good call though.


I'd agree that paint is good and flat and good on white ceilings but good gawd it takes alot to cover any color but white!


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## mudbone

Lazerline said:


> I'd agree that paint is good and flat and good on white ceilings but good gawd it takes alot to cover any color but white!


Thanks for the warning.


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## bbair

Yes, quit sanding it. The smoother it is the more reflective some areas will appear, hence your problem. Also, using a thicker roller leaves more stipple and creates a better hide. Roll one even, wet coat and you're done! And one last note: don't obsess about the ceiling too much. Many people don't notices what painters do. Sometimes you just gotta move the job along.

Sent from my iPhone using PaintTalk


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## Wood511

For the big, well-lit ceilings I use BM ben flat white with a 3/8 masterweave sleeve. The effect is cloudlike no matter what I do...and I'm not very good.


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## jenni

jacob33 said:


> Just give it a try and use BM super hide flat white. You can sand what you got but you will not regret it. It is only about 13 a gallon so it is cheap.
> 
> The other thing you can do if your having trouble keeping a wet edge is priming with guardz and than you got one chance to use a dead flat paint but it will stay wet longer because the ceiling will be sealed tight.


agreed. the ceiling in my own house is 12' high, gets lots of sunlight and had so much mud on it. i used bm super hide in flat white. sanded lightly between coats. can't see any lap marks at all now. i painted it all myself but in hindsight it would've been a lot easier if i had someone else painting the other half and/or backrolling behind me, the way we normally do for a regular job.


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## cfehr44

Here's kind of a crummy picture of what I'm dealing with (hopefully it uploads). The roller marks you see at the top can be seen all over the ceiling when the lights are on or it's sunny outside plus the finish isn't very flat at all. Also the ceiling is very low there at the door so if I use a 1/2" nap the texture from it is very noticeable (as are the small spatter marks from the sprayer, hence the further need to back roll).My theory with the foam roller was that it would hold lots of paint while leaving a very smooth finish. I'm getting bogged down with this and I've still gotta paint the rest of the house this week so I might still say to hell with it and use the 1/2" cuz I know it will cover well. Thanks again for all the great suggestions!


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## Gwarel

I use Glidden Ultra-Hide 150 on ceilings with a good 1/2" cover. It has good wet time and dries flat. Not saying that other paints recommended here aren't as good, just giving you info in case the Glidden is what you have to use.


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## matt19422

From the looks of that picture, it appears your not rolling out the ceiling correctly. Why would you have start/stoppage in the middle?


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## TERRY365PAINTER

run a 14 inch or 18inch with some kilz pro 110 dead flat. if you screwd it up the first time . sand guards repeat with kilz.pro .
big roller with the full circle pole..makes it easy work..


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## Jasonthep8nter

cfehr44 said:


> Here's kind of a crummy picture of what I'm dealing with (hopefully it uploads). The roller marks you see at the top can be seen all over the ceiling when the lights are on or it's sunny outside plus the finish isn't very flat at all. Also the ceiling is very low there at the door so if I use a 1/2" nap the texture from it is very noticeable (as are the small spatter marks from the sprayer, hence the further need to back roll).My theory with the foam roller was that it would hold lots of paint while leaving a very smooth finish. I'm getting bogged down with this and I've still gotta paint the rest of the house this week so I might still say to hell with it and use the 1/2" cuz I know it will cover well. Thanks again for all the great suggestions!


Well from the look of that picture that paint does not look flat it looks like low sheen or eggshell that is way to reflective for flat, use Kelly Moore 550 premium flat or Sherwin Williams super paint flat either of those will work great for even coverage an great hide. Now about that technique one thing you should never ever do is stop halfway when rolling a ceiling, that is probably the worst thing you could do once started you gotta commit an roll that shiz, 1/2 nap will work fine it will lay down for you especially using a good paint. Last thing when rolling ceilings you should roll a coat one way than roll a coat the other way, I have rolled a ton of ceilings that are monsters an they have come out looking good, yours will to, good paint an technique make all the difference good luck!


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## Rbriggs82

Jasonthep8nter said:


> Well from the look of that picture that paint does not look flat it looks like low sheen or eggshell that is way to reflective for flat, use Kelly Moore 550 premium flat or Sherwin Williams super paint flat either of those will work great for even coverage an great hide. Now about that technique one thing you should never ever do is stop halfway when rolling a ceiling, that is probably the worst thing you could do once started you gotta commit an roll that shiz, 1/2 nap will work fine it will lay down for you especially using a good paint. Last thing when rolling ceilings you should roll a coat one way than roll a coat the other way, I have rolled a ton of ceilings that are monsters an they have come out looking good, yours will to, good paint an technique make all the difference good luck!


Don't use superpaint, I've made that mistake before. The walls and ceiling were the same color so instead of getting into two different paints for the ceilings and the walls I use super paint on both and it striped on me. Switched to master hide and it was all good.


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## David's Painting

I use SW CHB. Sometimes with a shot o black. I also started using a 14in roller.


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## Jtpaintalot

Mike California is right. Cross hatch with spray gun after you give a light sand with a dead flat like bm suggested. Otherwise spray and have guy back roll .. Split ceiling in four spray sections or 2 if smaller ceilings. I would use 14 inch long -and thicker sleeve to roll out. And helps to add tint like cloud white. Finito!


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## Sir Mixalot

cfehr44 said:


> View attachment 18603
> 
> 
> Here's kind of a crummy picture of what I'm dealing with (hopefully it uploads). The roller marks you see at the top can be seen all over the ceiling when the lights are on or it's sunny outside plus the finish isn't very flat at all. Also the ceiling is very low there at the door so if I use a 1/2" nap the texture from it is very noticeable (as are the small spatter marks from the sprayer, hence the further need to back roll).My theory with the foam roller was that it would hold lots of paint while leaving a very smooth finish. I'm getting bogged down with this and I've still gotta paint the rest of the house this week so I might still say to hell with it and use the 1/2" cuz I know it will cover well. Thanks again for all the great suggestions!


I'd go with an 1/2" nap and a 18" frame.:thumbsup:

It almost looks like the ceiling is flashing. :blink:



David's Painting said:


> I use SW CHB. Sometimes with a shot o black. I also started using a 14in roller.


I'm with David. I always get my whites tinted. 
Straight out of the can whites can be translucent at times. Especially in a high light situation.


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## TJ Paint

I wonder if he ever got this job wrapped up?


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## BhamPainter

Looks like an application issue to me. I would load it up with even strokes going in the direction of the light, with a 50% overlap on each pass. If you are doing two coats, do the first against the light (as it looks like you did here), then do the second with the light. 18" naps are where it's at, too.

Out of curiosity, is this a "drop ceiling?" I did a kitchen ceiling once that just made me feel like an amateur--no matter what we did, it showed roller marks. What we eventually figured out was that there weren't studs behind the drywall--drop ceiling--so it was flexing with the pressure of our rollers. The best solution was spraying with no backroll. That might be one to try in the future.

Also, I love the Benjamin Moore Premium Ceiling Paint--it's priced just above Ultra Spec, is really dead flat, and gets great coverage.


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## Epoxy Pro

We always cross roll/spray large ceilings, we use BM Superhide Flat White and have never had an issue. We did a 2,500 sqft ceiling ni breaks at all one large ceiling, cross sprayed and rolled came out beautiful, lots of natural light coming in, I was worried at first about lap marks/lines but none showed up.


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## bskerley

Spray only, Builders Solutions Matte.


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