# Smoke Odor Removal?



## ElTacoPaco (Dec 11, 2015)

Is BIN the best product to remove the smell of smoke out of a house? If not what. Do I need to do or what do I need to apply?


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

ElTacoPaco said:


> Is BIN the best product to remove the smell of smoke out of a house? If not what. Do I need to do or what do I need to apply?


Long time no see.

BIN or Killz. I don't think you can spray kills though.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

It's been my experience that it is the best for that job. I recently tried BIN's synthetic shellac primer and it just didn't perform as well. Actually had to go over the synthetic with regular BIN just to complete the job. But, to be fair, the condition of the house I was working on was pretty terrible; twenty plus years with a chain smoker confined to a wheelchair who rarely left the place.


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

We used to use a lot of kilz on burnouts. Works well. Bin is favored by many though for a variety of reasons. One of which is that the smell dissapates faster.


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

journeymanPainter said:


> Long time no see.
> 
> BIN or Killz. I don't think you can spray kills though.


And yes, you can spray kilz. Suit up, you'll need it.


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

lilpaintchic said:


> We used to use a lot of kilz on burnouts. Works well. Bin is favored by many though for a variety of reasons. One of which is that the smell dissapates faster.


And dries in 15 mins


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## tnw322 (Jun 6, 2016)

XIM restores and SW synthetic shellac are great products with the same sealing performance as BIN but better hide at a better price. Only down side is the insane solvent oder, def need ventilation. Maybe even a respirator!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

tnw322 said:


> XIM restores and SW synthetic shellac are great products with the same sealing performance as BIN but better hide at a better price. Only down side is the insane solvent oder, def need ventilation. Maybe even a respirator!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Maybe?:what:


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

tnw322 said:


> XIM restores and SW synthetic shellac are great products with the same sealing performance as BIN but better hide at a better price. Only down side is the insane solvent oder, def need ventilation. Maybe even a respirator!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You need a respirator with BIN, and BIN 2 as well


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Smoke smell abatement*



ElTacoPaco said:


> Is BIN the best product to remove the smell of smoke out of a house? If not what. Do I need to do or what do I need to apply?


I don't believe any primer will remove the smell of smoke, just cover it over. The less permeable the primer is to gas molecules, the better it will cover or mask the odor. BIN appears to have one of the lowest premeablity ratings according to Erik at Rustoleum (Zinsser is owned by Rustoleum). I will reprint Erik's 2 emails to me below:

*The Gardz will not do well on odors because its permeability rating is actually considerably higher than most of our other products. To be a true vapor barrier, the permeability rating of a product must be 0. Our BIN primer, which is our best stain and odor blocking product ranges from .8-1.4 depending on the shellac crop. This product is designed to block odors and is one of the best in the industry. The Gardz product has a perm rating of 26. If there is any sort of odor, it will bleed right through. 
*

*Cover stain has a perm rating of 3 to 4 depending on the version used. There are multiple versions depending on the area of the country and the clean air laws in that area. Unfortunately the perm rating isn't listed on most consumer products since we do not advertise them as a vapor barrier product and the average consumer would not take that type of information into consideration. The BIN primer is going to be the best when it comes to odor, the Cover Stain will block them to some degree, the Gardz more than likely will not show a significant difference at all. *

IMO, if you want to cut down on the odor, I would clean the smoke affected areas with chemicals designed to do that, then prime over it. I just did a job where I cleaned first, using such chemicals, then primed 2 coats with Kilz Max, which is touted as being able to cover and seal in odors. 

Everyone who was familiar with the cigarette smell in the house made comments that they could no longer smell any cigarette smoke. I really wanted to be sure the smell was gone because the house was being sold and a lot of the work I do is getting homes ready for sale.

Others here have far more experience than I in this area and many recommend either BIN or Cover Stain. I would think that the more smoke odor chemicals you can remove by cleaning before priming, the less smoke odor gas molecules there will be to sneak past the primer. And sneaky gas molecules can stink!

futtyos


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## driftweed (May 26, 2013)

We are painters, NOT cleaners.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

I would choose BIN.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

When the OP wrote "remove the smell of smoke ", I took that to mean "make it not stink" rather than literally remove it. I think everything we use just covers it over or seals it in.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Multi-tasking*



driftweed said:


> We are painters, NOT cleaners.


Driftweed, are you not able to clean when it is called for? Most primers, sealers, paints, and other waterborne or oil based finishes that painters commonly apply call for a clean surface to apply the product to. Would that not make cleaning a part of painting, at least when it is called for? Would you just slap any old primer or paint over candle wax spilled against a wall? 

On the cigarette smoke odor job I just did, several areas were not to be painted. One bedroom and the kitchen were wallpapered and the owner did not want the paper removed. I had no choice but to clean the wallpaper with something that would get the most cigarette odor out. I was also able to clean the kitchen ceiling without priming over it as it was a semi-gloss finish and cleaned up without any odor left.

I am sure that some jobs have to be bid without any cleaning, otherwise the work will go to someone who will do it that way. Perhaps I will get a job like that in the future. When I sold the job I did I explained to the owners that cleaning first would go a long way to getting rid of the cigarette odor and it did. They wanted to be able to sell the house without any cigarette odor in it and I was able to give them what they wanted.

The last few days I have been on my hands and knees scraping old dirty caulk out of 2 bathrooms and recaulking them. No painting involved at all, but I am getting paid nonetheless. And getting some practice on caulking.

There is a lot of money out there to be made if you know how to do the work. The more types of work you know how to do, the more you can help your customers.

If you are good enough at just painting to keep busy all the time with just that, great! You did a very nice job on your nicotine unit, so I do listen to what you say.

futtyos


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

futtyos said:


> Driftweed, are you not able to clean when it is called for? Most primers, sealers, paints, and other waterborne or oil based finishes that painters commonly apply call for a clean surface to apply the product to. Would that not make cleaning a part of painting, at least when it is called for? Would you just slap any old primer or paint over candle wax spilled against a wall?
> 
> On the cigarette smoke odor job I just did, several areas were not to be painted. One bedroom and the kitchen were wallpapered and the owner did not want the paper removed. I had no choice but to clean the wallpaper with something that would get the most cigarette odor out. I was also able to clean the kitchen ceiling without priming over it as it was a semi-gloss finish and cleaned up without any odor left.
> 
> ...


Do you need it? I know I don't.


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## driftweed (May 26, 2013)

I only clean when absolutely necessary. If there is a primer available that will adhere to the surface without cleaning, I will not clean.

With nicotine, shellac is the solution there. Crayola or ink pens or sharpies, oil primer does the trick. Blood, fecal matter, human waste (boogers, vomit, etc...) gets oil primed. At best I will give a quick scrape with a disposable mudd knife to knock down the texture, but no way in the world am I putting my health at risk scrubbing human waste, it's getting primed.

IF a job calls for more than a brief, minor cleaning I sub it out to cleaners. For alot of stuff though, primer is available to skip that step.


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## driftweed (May 26, 2013)

When I started out 5 years ago, I was a handyman. The best advice I ever got was to specialize. So I narrowed it down to drywall repairs, power washing, and painting. In the last 3 years, I have narrowed it down further by dropping drywall work, then dropping power washing.

If my customers need that stuff, I either refer or sub it. I am still the man in my customers eyes.

Ask yourself this: can someone do it better, faster than me?

If yes, stop doing that service. Specialize.


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

futtyos said:


> Driftweed, are you not able to clean when it is called for? Most primers, sealers, paints, and other waterborne or oil based finishes that painters commonly apply call for a clean surface to apply the product to. Would that not make cleaning a part of painting, at least when it is called for? Would you just slap any old primer or paint over candle wax spilled against a wall?
> 
> On the cigarette smoke odor job I just did, several areas were not to be painted. One bedroom and the kitchen were wallpapered and the owner did not want the paper removed. I had no choice but to clean the wallpaper with something that would get the most cigarette odor out. I was also able to clean the kitchen ceiling without priming over it as it was a semi-gloss finish and cleaned up without any odor left.
> 
> ...


In fire restoration we call "cleaning" demo. All the framework, rafters and flooring that remains needs to be sealed thoroughly prior to any other trades moving forward. Kilz, Coverstain or Bin will work. State farm spec'd kilz for our work. But this was 10 year ago, too.
Any of those products works very well over. Cigarette smoke also without using chemical means to "clean". Sure you can smear it around if ya want but it's a waste of time in my opinion. Crack the bucket and seal that crap up.


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## journeymanPainter (Feb 26, 2014)

lilpaintchic said:


> In fire restoration we call "cleaning" demo. All the framework, rafters and flooring that remains needs to be sealed thoroughly prior to any other trades moving forward. Kilz, Coverstain or Bin will work. State farm spec'd kilz for our work. But this was 10 year ago, too.
> Any of those products works very well over. Cigarette smoke also without using chemical means to "clean". Sure you can smear it around if ya want but it's a waste of time in my opinion. Crack the bucket and seal that crap up.


Service master specs any BIN product, and Belfor specs a bright white with Coverstain


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Caulking ceramic tile with grout caulk*



chrisn said:


> Do you need it? I know I don't.


chrisn, you are the best! :notworthy:

futtyos


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Cleaning vs smearing*



lilpaintchic said:


> In fire restoration we call "cleaning" demo. All the framework, rafters and flooring that remains needs to be sealed thoroughly prior to any other trades moving forward. Kilz, Coverstain or Bin will work. State farm spec'd kilz for our work. But this was 10 year ago, too.
> Any of those products works very well over. Cigarette smoke also without using chemical means to "clean". Sure you can smear it around if ya want but it's a waste of time in my opinion. Crack the bucket and seal that crap up.


Lilpaintchic, I don't know how you do cleaning, but when I clean something I normally use some sort of cleaning solution that will dissolve whatever I am trying to clean, then I wet vac it off, rinse with water and vac it off again. On trim and other surfaces that I can't vacuum, I use a sponge to rinse the dissolved dirt/grease off, rinse with a clean sponge afterwards. I certainly don't just "smear" the dirt around. That would not really be cleaning, would it?

I have not done cigarette smoke and nicotine remediation all that much, so I do pay close attention to what you and the other longtime experts here have to say. 

I have a friend who is an old painting contractor who told me NOT to wash any of the surfaces prior to priming because he said that doing so will only drive the smoke chemicals further into the surfaces it is on. My 40 plus years of cleaning experience tells me that this might not be correct. After I cleaned all the ceilings, walls and trim on my recent cig smoke job, the odor was almost all gone, and that was before the priming was done.

My common sense tells me that if some kind of residue (like nicotine and cigarette smoke) is outgassing from the surface it is on and that the best primer/sealer to cover that odor does so because it has a high permeability rating that prevents that outgassing, then getting rid of as much odor producing residue BEFORE sealing the surfaces with BIN or the like will leave that much less of the odor-producing chemicals to continue outgassing and help to make sure that the odor is removed as much as possible. Sometimes that is not practical, like when treating areas in an attic and such, where spraying a sealer is the only cost effective way to deal with the problem.

My common sense aside, I do continue to read all the is said here about getting rid of the cigarette smoke and smell in as efficient a way as possible. And who knows, I may end up doing things differently down the road and look back at my old posts and go "what was I thinking?"

futtyos

P.S. I hope I end up being wrong about cleaning cigarette smoke before priming/sealing because it is definitely a PITA and physically harder to do than painting!


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## driftweed (May 26, 2013)

Do this on your next cig smoke job: don't clean, just prime with shellac. Give it an overnight dry and do an adhesion test, you will be surprised.

My first nicotine job I cleaned as well, very labor intensive. Then I had another a few months later, where either way I could do no wrong by the clients standards. Total freedom to experiment, and so I did.

I was so surprised, I never cleaned those walls again ha!

If it fails adhesion, scrape skim and do it again. Pad your bid as if your cleaning, and that should cover the cost if a straight prime goes south.

I would definitely not use property solutions as a topcoat as I demonstrated on my last nicotine unit. At a minimum use promar 200 or better.

At first, not cleaning defies logic but until you try it you will never know. It's kinda like how spraying/back rolling SHOULDN'T BE much faster than brush/rolling, but somehow it is, ha


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*No sealer/primer used*



ElTacoPaco said:


> Is BIN the best product to remove the smell of smoke out of a house? If not what. Do I need to do or what do I need to apply?


ElTacoPaco, I forgot to mention that the smoke odor can be gotten rid of without priming or sealing if no painting is to be done. In the thread "Cigarette smoke" on post #51 I describe the chemicals I used to clean a whole house before priming with 2 coats of Kilz Max. What I forgot to say is that before I used any of these chemicals on this little 3 bedroom home, I cleaned a bedroom and bathroom at another house to sort of see how these chemicals would work.

The bed and bath in question are at a large 2 story I am doing work at. The bed and bath are in the basement with no real ventilation from open windows. The daughter who used this bed/bath was a cigarette smoker and always stayed in her bedroom or bathroom when smoking with the entrance door closed. When I first went down there I almost gagged because of the smell. The odor did go down noticeably after all the contents (furniture and such) were removed, but it still smelled strongly of cigarettes. The walls of the bedroom are blood red, but the owner did not want to prime or paint it, so I decided to try out my chemicals.

I cleaned the ceiling (acoustical tile painted flat white), walls, trim, floors and any other surface that was reachable with my smoke remediation chemicals. After this was done and the rooms aired out, no one could smell any cigarette odors anymore. For good measure, I ran a small ozone generator for a few days, but the smell had already gone after the cleaning was done.

I am not saying that every cig smoke odor job should be washed with the right chemicals. I am saying that it may be possible to do. This is nice to know as if you have a job where not all the surfaces can be primed/sealed to get rid of the cigarette odors, you might have an option to get rid of them anyway. This might be a good thing as if you do a job where odors are still clinging to areas you cannot seal, the cigarette odors might still be present and the customer will probably not be happy about that and, more importantly, might withhold some or all payment becasue of that.

If you only have a hammer, every job might look like a nail sticking up that needs to be pounded down and with the result not exactly being what the customer was looking for. Just some thoughts.

futtyos


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

There is no denying that cleaning a surface prior to priming, or painting, is considered a painting best practice. Anything less is cutting a corner in the interest of time and labor. With that said, primers like BIN and alkyds, do adhere well to these surfaces, without the need to first clean. And, they still provide odor control while performing well enough to be considered an adequate component of a coating system for the budget minded homeowner, and lazy painting contractor.

I always use the "I don't want to introduce moisture" BS in order to get out of scrubbing walls. I guess I'm considered one of the lazy painters.


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## driftweed (May 26, 2013)

Ffutyos, you do have a good point on the cleaning aspect. In an occupied setting, I can very well see that as a viable option.

I am curious if you could do the cleaning, then use a latex primer such as problock to avoid exposing the occupants to the chemical smell of shellac or oil based paints.

Do the chemicals stink?


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

Uhhh...in my experience, clean or no clean the smell and nicotine will bleed back through a latex product. Be that primer or paint. You have to use solvents to seal any "organic" stains. Tannin, tar, water, grease,etc. 
I don't care what cleaning solutions you use. I cleaned professionally (that's how I got into the biz, pm turns)for years before I finally figured out that cleaning a painted surface prior to priming is pointless and in some cases creates adhesion issues with the primer (ask cd about that one) Let the primer do it's job. If that makes me "lazy" I'm ok with being lazy. I say "work smarter, not harder".There's just no real advantage to cleaning it. Those substances permeate the painted surface (usually) and though the surface may be clean, what lies below it is not and needs to be sealed. Given enough time and in a kitchen or bath or other humid environnent,or homes with single paned windows it will come back as streaks and bring a musty odor with it. Of course there are some things that actually require cleaning, but usually it's just a formality and a "feel good" to the ho, not a required part of an odor elimination system.
That's nicotine. Fire damage is very similar, minus the orange streaks.
Ask yourself why you're cleaning it. Adhesion? Odor elimination? Because it "looks bad"? Primer, primer, primer. Make your $$ and don't work so hard for it. and it SUCKS being covered in wet, nasty musty nicotine stained clothes after a long day making brown walls and ceilings white with a bucket and a rag. Been there done that, bought the primer to prove it! Lol


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

Cleaning tools


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

driftweed said:


> Ffutyos, you do have a good point on the cleaning aspect. In an occupied setting, I can very well see that as a viable option.
> 
> I am curious if you could do the cleaning, then use a latex primer such as problock to avoid exposing the occupants to the chemical smell of shellac or oil based paints.
> 
> Do the chemicals stink?


Driftwood, my partner and I used Kilx Max white primer for odor blocking after we did the cleaning. The house was vacant. We used the water based Kilx instead of Cover Stain or BIN because neither of us wanted to be breathing either of those and we did not want to wear masks. Also, a painting contractor friend of mine said he swears by Kilx Max, so I was wanting to try it anyway.

When you ask if the chemicals stink, I am assuming you are talking about the cleaning chemicals. I wouldn'say that they stank, but they sure have a strong smell, enough to have some windows cracked. The smell, while being strong, is actually pleasant. I would think that there are some essential oils in there somewhere.

The Kilx Max does not have a nice odor, by the way, but it is tolerable.

futtyos


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Help with leap of faith*



driftweed said:


> Do this on your next cig smoke job: don't clean, just prime with shellac. Give it an overnight dry and do an adhesion test, you will be surprised.
> 
> My first nicotine job I cleaned as well, very labor intensive. Then I had another a few months later, where either way I could do no wrong by the clients standards. Total freedom to experiment, and so I did.
> 
> ...


Driftwood, I appreciate your back story on this, that you started out by cleaning, then found out that you really didn't have to clean. I must say that cleaning everything is way more labor intensive than just priming and painting. I am glad I went through the experience of cleaning so I now know what the results can be. I know I can use it where I cannot prime, but I am looking forward to the next nicotine job and BIN. I will most likely have to do it myself as my partner will probably not be interested in using BIN.

Thanks for your input and encouragement.

futtyos


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*I want to be lazy*



lilpaintchic said:


> Uhhh...in my experience, clean or no clean the smell and nicotine will bleed back through a latex product. Be that primer or paint. You have to use solvents to seal any "organic" stains. Tannin, tar, water, grease,etc.
> I don't care what cleaning solutions you use. I cleaned professionally (that's how I got into the biz, pm turns)for years before I finally figured out that cleaning a painted surface prior to priming is pointless and in some cases creates adhesion issues with the primer (ask cd about that one) Let the primer do it's job. If that makes me "lazy" I'm ok with being lazy. I say "work smarter, not harder".There's just no real advantage to cleaning it. Those substances permeate the painted surface (usually) and though the surface may be clean, what lies below it is not and needs to be sealed. Given enough time and in a kitchen or bath or other humid environnent,or homes with single paned windows it will come back as streaks and bring a musty odor with it. Of course there are some things that actually require cleaning, but usually it's just a formality and a "feel good" to the ho, not a required part of an odor elimination system.
> That's nicotine. Fire damage is very similar, minus the orange streaks.
> Ask yourself why you're cleaning it. Adhesion? Odor elimination? Because it "looks bad"? Primer, primer, primer. Make your $$ and don't work so hard for it. and it SUCKS being covered in wet, nasty musty nicotine stained clothes after a long day making brown walls and ceilings white with a bucket and a rag. Been there done that, bought the primer to prove it! Lol


Lilpaintchic, thanks for this input. I will keep your advice close in mind as the cleaning I did on that job must rank along with the 12 labors of Hercules! I don't look forward to using BIN, but if it will do away with the cleaning and still work, that would be very good.

On the job I just did, the people did not want to have any painting done, just cleaning and priming. I figure if I do the BIN next time, customers won't mind the price of painting if they don't already have to pay for cleaning.

I would have to say that the cleaning easily took more time than putting on the first coat of Kilz Max. I would much rather roll and cut than clean. I appreciate hearing you (as well as Driftwood) expand your experiences with nicotine jobs, that you have done all this and don't do it anymore.

futtyos


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## tnw322 (Jun 6, 2016)

lilpaintchic said:


> Maybe?:what:




The region I am from most painters never wear respirators. Made the assumption that is the norm elsewhere... Explains why all my customers are a few short of a six pack!


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

tnw322 said:


> The region I am from most painters never wear respirators. Made the assumption that is the norm elsewhere... Explains why all my customers are a few short of a six pack!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's just a little drain bramage...no,no,no,big- big deal.. (twitch, twitch) lol


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

futtyos said:


> Driftwood, my partner and I used Kilx Max white primer for odor blocking after we did the cleaning. The house was vacant. We used the water based Kilx instead of Cover Stain or BIN because neither of us wanted to be breathing either of those and we did not want to wear masks. Also, a painting contractor friend of mine said he swears by Kilx Max, so I was wanting to try it anyway.
> 
> When you ask if the chemicals stink, I am assuming you are talking about the cleaning chemicals. I wouldn'say that they stank, but they sure have a strong smell, enough to have some windows cracked. The smell, while being strong, is actually pleasant. I would think that there are some essential oils in there somewhere.
> 
> ...


I'd still be inclined to wear a respirator even when using the cleaning chemicals. I mean, if they are really strong enough to take care of the staining and odor of nicotine and other nasties, then they have to be pretty potent. Heck, anything other than brushing and rolling acrylic latex these days and I wear a respirator - and I probably should then as well.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

driftweed said:


> When I started out 5 years ago, I was a handyman. The best advice I ever got was to specialize. So I narrowed it down to drywall repairs, power washing, and painting. In the last 3 years, I have narrowed it down further by dropping drywall work, then dropping power washing.
> 
> If my customers need that stuff, I either refer or sub it. I am still the man in my customers eyes.
> 
> ...


I am totally with DW on this one. 

These days we have somebody for cleaning, somebody for paper removal, someone for drywall and texture work, etc. Not talking about the little stuff you may run into on most jobs, but when there is any of those things that might take more than half a day total. We have so much painting work we can't take care of it all so I much prefer to turn those duties over to others that can do it better, faster, and cheaper, and strictly focus on the painting or cabinet work. I can understand how others might feel an "offer it all" approach is better, but for us, specializing in what we feel we do best has proven to work extremely well.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

RH said:


> I am totally with DW on this one.
> 
> These days we have somebody for cleaning, somebody for paper removal, someone for drywall and texture work, etc. Not talking about the little stuff you may run into on most jobs, but when there is any of those things that might take more than half a day total. We have so much painting work we can't take care of it all so I much prefer to turn those duties over to others that can do it better, faster, and cheaper, and strictly focus on the painting or cabinet work. I can understand how others might feel an "offer it all" approach is better, but for us, specializing in what we feel we do best has proven to work extremely well.


I've just recently come around to allowing contractors to perform various jobs I would take on myself, like drywall installation, taping, and even painting. I don't know if I really wanted to do those jobs because I liked to do them, or if I couldn't trust someone else to do them as well as I "thought " I could do them. I think it was the latter.

What I discovered, is that jobs are performed faster and I don't have to do any clean up. Just the time savings alone is a huge value. I think using my limitations to my advantage has matured me to another level.


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## driftweed (May 26, 2013)

3m 6000 series half mask respirator from Sherwin williams for $30 will suffice for the odor of bin shellac. 

Nowadays I have a gerson 900? Series full face with removable lense protector. That thing spoils me, ha but @$300 it better!


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

driftweed said:


> 3m 6000 series half mask respirator from Sherwin williams for $30 will suffice for the odor of bin shellac.
> 
> Nowadays I have a gerson 900? Series full face with removable lense protector. That thing spoils me, ha but @$300 it better!


Damn thing's so stylish, you could practically wear it out on the town!


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## driftweed (May 26, 2013)

That's the one


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

So, how do you keep it clean enough to see out of while spraying? I've bought so many different versions of eye protection....same problem. Start spraying and can't see after about a hour...


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## tnw322 (Jun 6, 2016)

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## tnw322 (Jun 6, 2016)

Safety america's advanz goggles. 


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## driftweed (May 26, 2013)

lilpaintchic said:


> So, how do you keep it clean enough to see out of while spraying? I've bought so many different versions of eye protection....same problem. Start spraying and can't see after about a hour...


I buy 40 pack at a time, takes about 60 seconds to change film. So if it gets to the point where visibility is an issue, I step outside real quick and do the deed.

The cartidges last MUCH longer than 3m. That set has 16 hours in epoxy exposure and still going strong.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

driftweed said:


> I buy 40 pack at a time, takes about 60 seconds to change film. So if it gets to the point where visibility is an issue, I step outside real quick and do the deed.
> 
> The cartidges last MUCH longer than 3m. That set has 16 hours in epoxy exposure and still going strong.


I usually stack at least four lenses so I can change out in about five seconds. However, you have to have a system of releasing one at a time, or you'll end up pulling the whole stack off.

I typically tape the first lens on the shield so it can't be removed. The subsequent film stack is individually taped so that only one can be removed at a time. I never have problems seeing anymore. 

For abrasive blasting, I use glass lenses in a similar manner. But instaead of tape, the glass stack is firmly held in place with a hinged flange.


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## driftweed (May 26, 2013)

Can you show me your system? 

With the gerson, you only have 2 small stickers and they line up exactly in only 1 position. So stacking doesn't seem feasible


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

I'll draw it out since I just tossed my 6700 3M fullface in not so favor of an MSA canister full face. Now my old lenses don't quite fit. *angry face*


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Here's a rough drawing of my lens removal system. I know, pretty Machovalian.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

I always heard to burn incense. Oh, wrong smoke odor.


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

tnw322 said:


> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


But they won't go with my shoes...! they need to be bedazzled.lol


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

LOL! I remember those things from the 80's!


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

BTW, my drawing should read "un anchored" for the lens tab (handle)


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