# going over poly/varnishes.



## StripandCaulk (Dec 30, 2011)

Originally, i used to sand the surface scuff it up create surface tension and apply BIN as a bonding primer/stainblocker. Every now and then i used cover stain..usually on walls coated in poly. this was the way i was taught, but about a year ago i tried latex/acryllic bonders. XIM uma, ben moore fresh start latex works pretty well. I've switched over because they're low odor, i work in an area where people do not want their kids around paint fumes and i dont have to sand it down(so the label says). Just curious to get some other opinions. What do you do for prep/primer in this situation


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## Last Craftsman (Dec 5, 2008)

StripandCaulk said:


> latex/acryllic bonders. XIM uma, ben moore fresh start latex works pretty well. I've switched over because they're low odor


That is ballsy.

I would use shellac.

I never had the nerve to try an acrylic bonder over a poly finish, but would like to for the reasons you stated.

I am going to try some small areas to see.

I still think it is a good idea to scuff the surface thoroughly. Are you saying you no longer scuff sand either?


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## epretot (Dec 17, 2011)

I agree...scuff sand and shellac.


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## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

l know the back of the can states on most bonding peerimers that claims sticks to glossy surfaces without sanding but im still leary and scuff sand anyway for added insurance zinsser newest primer called Bondz for maximum adhesion with the benifit of a very low oder and voc.its a Urethane Modified Acrylic. great stuff!


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## StripandCaulk (Dec 30, 2011)

Last Craftsman said:


> That is ballsy.
> 
> I still think it is a good idea to scuff the surface thoroughly. Are you saying you no longer scuff sand either?


I used to have the same thoughts as you do, i would never have tried it unless i walked into a job where it was already being used. that being said ive switched over. I still scuff sand, but ive also used it without scuff sand no problems. gave it the thumnail test, even took a scraper blade to it, nice bond. look for the products that are labeled urethane modified acryllic. I like XIM's product. I was really surprised when we tried out ben moore fresh start latex interior..i would never have used it. its marketed as an all purpose primer. My GC at the time said thats what we were going to use..worked pretty well.


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## StripandCaulk (Dec 30, 2011)

mudbone said:


> l know the back of the can states on most bonding peerimers that claims sticks to glossy surfaces without sanding but im still leary and scuff sand anyway for added insurance zinsser newest primer called Bondz for maximum adhesion with the benifit of a very low oder and voc.its a Urethane Modified Acrylic. great stuff!


huh i havent tried the stuff yet, ill have to check it out. Whats the price on a gallon?


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## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

StripandCaulk said:


> huh i havent tried the stuff yet, ill have to check it out. Whats the price on a gallon?


 In the lower forties.I guess it really depends where you're getting it.I purchase mine at Menards. they carry a whole line of Zinsser at reasonable prices. use to be able to get it from True Value also, but they shut the door in our hometown. sutherlands has some zinsser in stock.


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## goldenwest (Aug 11, 2011)

Here in Holland I use a product called Claessens Classidur Universal. It a water-based bonding primer that works extremely well. I first used it when I had to paint hundreds of square feet of baked-enamel office wall partitions. I did a test and brushed some on a high-gloss ceramic tile. After a day or two I couldn't scrape the primer off with a knife.

There are many different products here in Europe. Sometimes they are fantastic; other times I wonder "why can't I just get my old favorite USA products here?"


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## oldschool (Oct 18, 2009)

epretot said:


> I agree...scuff sand and shellac.


right on. shellac after the scuff sand. The water base will fail in about six months.


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## StripandCaulk (Dec 30, 2011)

oldschool said:


> right on. shellac after the scuff sand. The water base will fail in about six months.


its been over a year since the first time i used a waterbased bonding primer. I used XIM UMA, has not failed nor does it show signs of failure in the future. went right over polyurethene on windows, crown mould, casings, base, doors..etc. Muralo Ultra semi 2 coats on top. what product did you use?


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