# Sprayer for apartments



## Dirtyrash (Jul 16, 2010)

Hi. Like I said in my intro, I am startin a new company focusing on apartment repaints. Nice steady work here where I live. We are starting off on a small budget , me and my partners are getting par-time night jobs for awhile. My question is will a graco 190 do the trick for a couple years of apartments? I can pick up a refurb for $495, and will be putting almost only interior flat through it. I want a light tall boy as I will hopefully be moving it lot.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

sounds like a plan!


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

I would save up the extra $400 and go with a Graco 395.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Woodland said:


> I would save up the extra $400 and go with a Graco 395.


I agree. 

I just acquired an air assisted 395 that I've yet to use. I will report on it after some spray time.


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## StefanC (Apr 29, 2009)

Graco 395 is a great choice for apartments. It's portable, powerful enough and will last for quite a while shooting 8 gallons at a time. Try to buy a spare fluid section in case you need to repack with no downtime. 
Fwiw I just grabbed one brand new for $750 the other day. My local SW had it sitting on the shelf for a year and I got it for around cost + 7 free tips.


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## Dirtyrash (Jul 16, 2010)

As I said we are on a shoestring budget. I don't want to buy a toy, but need to go as inexpensive as possible. I plan on upgrading in a couple years but just need a starter pump for now.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

just brush and roll then.


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## StefanC (Apr 29, 2009)

Dirtyrash said:


> As I said we are on a shoestring budget. I don't want to buy a toy, but need to go as inexpensive as possible. I plan on upgrading in a couple years but just need a starter pump for now.


Ask SW to give you a 12 month payment plan.


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## AztecPainting (Jan 28, 2010)

I have one of those that I bought for doing side jobs while working for other companies, so make sure you clean it properly after using it and it will last you more than couple of years, I still have it since 2006.


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

An XR-7 Graco or ASM 1700 will work for you, and wont break the bank. They run around $500 +/- Rated for 300 gal before a rebuild give or take. A rebuild kit costs about $60, and you can do it yourself ( first times a little tricky but after that it takes less than 10 minutes ) For what you are doing that would be my recommendation, you can always upgrade from there as your needs change.


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## ewingpainting.net (Jun 2, 2008)

StefanC said:


> Ask SW to give you a 12 month payment plan.


That's a plan, go in business with what you can't afford.  
.
I'm with TJ brush and roll untill you can pay cash to upgrade. If you have to spray, rent it.


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

Sometimes brush and roll is a death sentence for apartments. It is often all about production. If you can not produce fast desirable results they will drop you for the next guy on the list. 

My first sprayer was a 190. It will work for a short while for what you want it to do but chances are you will be upgrading as soon as possible to a bigger unit. The problem with the 190 is it just is not meant to crank out the production like you will be wanting. It will still work though but as Luis said take care of it. 
For What you the OP is wanting a 395 or 490 would be more ideal. Anything bigger of course will work great but will be over kill and will be more cumbersome to pack around and move from one to the next. Otherwise I would try and sell you on a 695 which is a very versatile sprayer.

Also consider buying used. You will get a lot more bang for your buck and that used 395 will be similar in price to the refurb 190. 

Good luck with that.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

Workaholic said:


> Brush and roll is a death sentence for apartments. It is all about production. If you can not produce fast desirable results they will drop you for the next guy on the list.


well, I made good money on brush/roll on the apartments I've done. I guess it all depends.


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

TJ Paint said:


> well, I made good money on brush/roll on the apartments I've done. I guess it all depends.


Yeah true, depends on whats going on there. All one color walls/ceilings in flat...bump and roll with an 18" Sometimes it is easier, depends on the variables.


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

TJ Paint said:


> well, I made good money on brush/roll on the apartments I've done. I guess it all depends.


True there are variables. I edited my statement to reflect that.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

Workaholic said:


> True there are variables. I edited my statement to reflect that.


Its all good!


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## StefanC (Apr 29, 2009)

ewingpainting.net said:


> That's a plan, go in business with what you can't afford.
> .
> I'm with TJ brush and roll untill you can pay cash to upgrade. If you have to spray, rent it.


If he can't afford $85 per month (maybe $50 if he puts the $ down that he would have spent on a 190) then he's got bigger problems. 

He asked if a 190 would last him a couple years, I think we all know that it wouldn't. As for cutting and rolling apartments, I've done it also and it's not even close to efficient. Even shooting ceilings and rolling (or spraying, using a shield) different color walls would be a huge time saver over rolling. 

For 1 color apartments, I can shoot a 2 bedroom apartment in about 25-30 minutes not including masking some ceiling lights and outlets. If he had even 3 apartments per week that 395 would pay for itself in 2 months.


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## Dirtyrash (Jul 16, 2010)

Thanks for all the input. I have to agree with the spray guys. I painted apartments in my early twenties and spray is the best way to make money. All you are realy doing is covering up the dirt.
As far as used pumps go, what kind of luck has everyone had? I've been avoiding that route just because you never know what has been put through them or how they have been treated. I know of one company that switched theirs between oil and latex at least once a day.


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## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

Dirtyrash said:


> As far as used pumps go, what kind of luck has everyone had? I've been avoiding that route just because you never know what has been put through them or how they have been treated. I know of one company that switched theirs between oil and latex at least once a day.


I myself have bought and sold plenty of used sprayers. Look for one that has been well taken care of and plan on adding a repack kit. The last used rig I bought was in 07 a 695 ultramax2 I paid 700 hundred for it and it has been a real good pump. I have another 695 I bought new for just under 2 grand and it is no better than the other pump.
New is great and nothing like taking care of the pump and keeping it clean. For a budget though used is dollar saver.
If you buy used ask questions before you purchase. 

I am sure others have horror stories on used pumps but for me I have had good luck with them.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

Switching between oil and latex does not worry me so much adding lacquer to the mix. Mineral Spirits is not a hot solvent. Also, the switching for me is more of a contaminate the finish concern, not necessarily a damage the pump concern.


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## StefanC (Apr 29, 2009)

New pumps have a 1 year warranty. No idea if that covers the packings though. The reason I like new pumps is because all the hard parts on the inside are new with no wear. Almost all used pumps have worn hard parts to some degree, reducing their life and increasing the chances of unrepairable failure.

The last used 395 I bought, I smoked the motor in about 6 months. I've bought 5-6 used pumps and that's the first time I had that happen.


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

StefanC said:


> New pumps have a 1 year warranty. No idea if that covers the packings though. The reason I like new pumps is because all the hard parts on the inside are new with no wear. Almost all used pumps have worn hard parts to some degree, reducing their life and increasing the chances of unrepairable failure.
> 
> The last used 395 I bought, I smoked the motor in about 6 months. I've bought 5-6 used pumps and that's the first time I had that happen.


You can replace any part you want on a pump. Is it worth it? Not always. 

Most warranties do not cover packing replacement, it is considered a wear part. I think airlessco actually had a packing warranty (don't know if they still do) limited to a one time replacement within the first year. An airlessco LP 460 is the perfect pump IMO. I've sold them for the last 14 years and never had one complaint, and every one I've sold is still running and being used. They aren't the cheapest units out there, but I firmly believe they're the best. A 460 runs around $1300 give or take.


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## StefanC (Apr 29, 2009)

NCPaint1 said:


> You can replace any part you want on a pump. Is it worth it? Not always.


Obviously that's what I meant.



NCPaint1 said:


> Most warranties do not cover packing replacement, it is considered a wear part. I think airlessco actually had a packing warranty (don't know if they still do) limited to a one time replacement within the first year. An airlessco LP 460 is the perfect pump IMO. I've sold them for the last 14 years and never had one complaint, and every one I've sold is still running and being used. They aren't the cheapest units out there, but I firmly believe they're the best. A 460 runs around $1300 give or take.



Really? do they last that long? I might have to look into them


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

StefanC said:


> Really? do they last that long? I might have to look into them


http://www.airlessco.com/airlessco/lp460.htm

This model replaced the 460. New name, same output. The pressure control is fantastic on their pumps. You can really dial down the pressure and not see any fluctuations in the spray pattern. The dead band is also very small, usually within 50psi. That's the point between the pressure drop and rebuild. 

As far as longevity, the packings tend to have a longer life because you adjust them as they wear. The internal mechanical parts are also bigger compared to similar pumps. The pump doesn't have to work as hard as other units. It runs at lower RPM's so its much more quiet, also producing less wear on the motor ( lifetime warranty on motor and gearbox).


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## PatsPainting (Mar 4, 2010)

NCPaint1 said:


> http://www.airlessco.com/airlessco/lp460.htm
> 
> This model replaced the 460. New name, same output. The pressure control is fantastic on their pumps. You can really dial down the pressure and not see any fluctuations in the spray pattern. The dead band is also very small, usually within 50psi. That's the point between the pressure drop and rebuild.
> 
> As far as longevity, the packings tend to have a longer life because you adjust them as they wear. The internal mechanical parts are also bigger compared to similar pumps. The pump doesn't have to work as hard as other units. It runs at lower RPM's so its much more quiet, also producing less wear on the motor ( lifetime warranty on motor and gearbox).



I freakin love my 450, This thing never breaks, Have had it for over 5 years with no issues what so ever.

Pat


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## painting247 (Mar 18, 2009)

StefanC said:


> Ask SW to give you a 12 month payment plan.


IMO,
The last thing you want to do is start out in debt. Brush n roll until you can afford the big boy toys.


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## Ranger72 (Jul 3, 2010)

I must be the odd man out. I love my Titan 440xc. The thing has never let me down.

We are not a huge outfit, but we do tackle some large homes/ buildings with it.


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## ewingpainting.net (Jun 2, 2008)

I love my speeflo 8900. Getting it repacked now, changing the fluids :thumbsup: 
Got another I'm rebuilding. I posted it here about year and half ago. I'm gonna bump it back up after I'm finally done with it. 
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Ohh ya, I got a 440 too.


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## AztecPainting (Jan 28, 2010)

I still think (Well... who cares what I think, lol) If you really need a sprayer, buy that 190, clean it properly after use, if after some jobs you make money you can be ready to buy a better one but if you ever fail with your company at least you didn't spend more cash on a nicer one, I'm pretty sure if you aren't making any money to buy a nicer sprayer after a year, it's not worth it having a company then. I started with a graco 190 that I used for subcontracts and side jobs for a year, then after a year I bought a used titan 440ix, year and a half ago I got a graco 495 and 2 weeks ago I got a ultra 395, I am not being cheeky, I just think that you should get what you need and can afford now get to work and get more jobs and then see how are you doing later...


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## Dirtyrash (Jul 16, 2010)

AztecPainting said:


> I still think (Well... who cares what I think, lol) If you really need a sprayer, buy that 190, clean it properly after use, if after some jobs you make money you can be ready to buy a better one but if you ever fail with your company at least you didn't spend more cash on a nicer one, I'm pretty sure if you aren't making any money to buy a nicer sprayer after a year, it's not worth it having a company then. I started with a graco 190 that I used for subcontracts and side jobs for a year, then after a year I bought a used titan 440ix, year and a half ago I got a graco 495 and 2 weeks ago I got a ultra 395, I am not being cheeky, I just think that you should get what you need and can afford now get to work and get more jobs and then see how are you doing later...


 
thanks. It's like you read my mind. Buy something I can afford right now that will get me painting, have to spray apartments to make $. If things go well we plan on buying a second sprayer so my partner and I can split up, hire a couple helpers and cover more ground. Right now we just need to get started.


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

What ever it takes man, but as others said starting out in debt is something I would avoid as well.


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## VanDamme (Feb 13, 2010)

Dirtyrash said:


> thanks. It's like you read my mind. Buy something I can afford right now that will get me painting, have to spray apartments to make $. If things go well we plan on buying a second sprayer so my partner and I can split up, hire a couple helpers and cover more ground. Right now we just need to get started.


This method gets my vote. :thumbup:


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## StefanC (Apr 29, 2009)

I'd just hate to see you burn out that 190 in a month.


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## VanDamme (Feb 13, 2010)

Dirtyrash said:


> thanks. It's like you read my mind. Buy something I can afford right now that will get me painting, have to spray apartments to make $. If things go well we plan on buying a second sprayer so my partner and I can split up, hire a couple helpers and cover more ground. Right now we just need to get started.


What's your budget for a pump?

I've purchased used and new pumps and never have had any issues with the used pumps. The last one being an Ultra395 for $400 that appeared to only have 30/40 gallons ran through it.


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

True check the local pawn shops, and make sure the manager will take it back if its beyond a simple repack. There are plenty of them in the shops here.


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## Dirtyrash (Jul 16, 2010)

StefanC said:


> I'd just hate to see you burn out that 190 in a month.


That's my biggest fear..... 
...I might go check out a couple pawn shops tonight, If you guys have had decent luck with used i might try that route.


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## completespray (Jul 14, 2010)

If you buy a used sprayer from a paint sprayer sales and repair shop in your area, chances are they look at them first and make sure the hard parts are good and the packings are good etc. Better than buying from a pawn shop IMO. Also, I vote buy a "commercial" grade sprayer _used_ rather than the "consumer" models. The consumer models are only rated for occasional use and usually require more repairs. Good luck either way! I am sure it will work out!


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## 1donos (Sep 5, 2010)

I have had my graco 495 for a about 10 years. A great little pump!! I bought it new (aprox $1000) but have bought several other used pumps along the way. keep the packings oiled and most of the commercial grade pumps will last a long time. I bought a used 695 Ultra at the pawn shop for $500. Make sure they hold pressure and look for one with hose and gun. A good hose gun kit will run aprox $200 if its not on the pump!!


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## mr.fixit (Aug 16, 2009)

the fluid section in the 190es is the same one that graco used in the 395 st pro and 495 st pro until a couple of years ago. when Graco switched from the 395 and 495 st pro to the Ultra 395 and 495. they just created the 190es for Home Depot when they began selling Graco units there, it is a good pump and should last just as well as any 395. cleaning is a premium on any machine and especially when switching between oil and water based paints


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