# behr part 2



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

Well, I had to use the dreaded Behr today. Premium Plus Ultra( at least) semi gloss.

Old WHITE oil paint. Primed with WHITE 123.

Applied coat of said premium WHITE Behr

Applied SECOND coat of same product.

Applied THIRD coat of said product.

I have said it before and I will say it agin

BEHR SUCKS, no matter what the good jp says


----------



## cardwizzard (Sep 13, 2010)

Behr defense team will be along to tell you what you did wrong. Don't worry bout it.


----------



## CliffK (Dec 21, 2010)

chrisn;417670 said:


> Well, I had to use the dreaded Behr today. Premium Plus Ultra( at least) semi gloss.
> 
> Old WHITE oil paint. Primed with WHITE 123.
> 
> ...


----------



## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

One interesting thing I've noticed when looking into this Behr phenomenon is that the PP ultra is specced to go on up to 6.2 mil. That's a little over 50% thicker than most paints. 

I know, a collective  when I talk about this stuff, but what else could it be? 
JP and others post pics of how awesome and smooth 2 coats of it looks, and others have a hard time with it covering at all. 

Ant two different people who pick up a brush and start painting are going to get different somewhat different results because nothing about hand application is standardized really, unless you work to make it standardized. 

I don't mean to imply that Chrisn can't paint good or anything like that. Just that there is a major factor being overlooked in these brand/style comparisons. 

Still have yet to test it myself. I'm looking forward to seeing first hand what all the fuss is about.


----------



## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

Chrisn I do have to say this. I completely 100% agree with you, Behr SUCKS. Bacon grease is much better.


----------



## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

I agree with Cliff. Four coats to cover white is whack. I have used behr and have never had that experience.


----------



## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

Sorry to hear that, Nelly. But...like you didn't know what the outcome would be?

:jester:


----------



## Carl (Jun 18, 2011)

Yea, but white covers like crap in any brand. Anyhow, seems like Behr haters have the same mindset as those that hate the Iphones. If you hate it, you are going to use it with the worst possible attitude. In other words, if you expect it to take 4 coats, it probably will!


----------



## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

Carl said:


> Yea, but white covers like crap in any brand. Anyhow, seems like Behr haters have the same mindset as those that hate the Iphones. If you hate it, you are going to use it with the worst possible attitude. In other words, if you expect it to take 4 coats, it probably will!


White over primer though?

For the record I am not a behr hater, nor am i a behr lover. If it was sold out of a paint store I think it would be much more accepted than it is but I dislike waiting for paint in the box stores so I tend to stay away from that.


----------



## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

GC primed a kitchen ceiling with PVA an then had me use Behr... Took 2 coats an still looked goofy so I ran out an got a gallon of MAB wall shield to finish it off ....... Normally I would have just applied 2 finish coats an been done with it that was a far from normal day


----------



## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

Carl said:


> Yea, but white covers like crap in any brand. Anyhow, seems like Behr haters have the same mindset as those that hate the Iphones. If you hate it, you are going to use it with the worst possible attitude. In other words, if you expect it to take 4 coats, it probably will!


Really?... 2 coats semi over **** brown


----------



## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

Coronado "rust scat" semi gloss ......pic above was takin during a test to see my options. Didn't take long to figure out what option I was going with lol..... Edit: probably could use a very quick touch here an there on certain spots but definitely passable for most jobs


----------



## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

Carl said:


> . If you hate it, you are going to use it with the worst possible attitude. In other words, if you expect it to take 4 coats, it probably will!


 More often than not the culprit ....... Half of a guys painting issues are his own mental problems


----------



## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

Carl said:


> Yea, but white covers like crap in any brand. Anyhow, seems like Behr haters have the same mindset as those that hate the Iphones. If you hate it, you are going to use it with the worst possible attitude. In other words, if you expect it to take 4 coats, it probably will!


Well said Carl. All brands suck when it comes to white over white with sheen. The same test with sw, bm, or ppg would give similar results. Not a lot of titanium oxide solids in whites. Yet with any other color besides white, behr covers quite well. 
Today we tested color 0057 by sw. It is a chicago bulls red looking color. 
One quart of each sw duration satin, bm regal select satin and behr ultra satin. 3 small soffits in 3 different bedrooms. All the same size, all with low sheen off white on knockdown textured walls. Results? Regal and Behr covered in two coats. Duration 3 coats. All reds were cut and rolled with 3/4" nap purdy collusus and 3" wooster chinex brushes. 
Imo behr in colors covers every bit as well as anything else out there.


----------



## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

Carl said:


> if you expect it to take 4 coats, it probably will!


The mind is powerful but I do not agree with this statement.


----------



## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

Workaholic said:


> The mind is powerful but I do not agree with this statement.


Yeah go work for another painter an I bet he picks your work apart ..... All in his head trust me


----------



## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

Ole34 said:


> Yeah go work for another painter an I bet he picks your work apart ..... All in his head trust me


I think I am unemployable in this trade.


----------



## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

Zoomer said:


> Imo behr in colors covers every bit as well as anything else out there.


I don't think anyone here will debate the hiding powers. It does have good film build and color hide. It doesn't do magical things that other good paints can't do.


----------



## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

I remember using eclipse ..my boss bitched an moaned the HO'er had us using it....I saw the ceiling, it was done in one but he insisted it wasn't an freaked .... Ended up going out for his own gallon claiming afterwards "see? Now it's done that other paint is crap"....... In reality the eclipse worked as advertised on that particular job it was his head that was fuked


----------



## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

Ole34 said:


> Really?... 2 coats semi over **** brown


Omg you're painting over a semigloss that you didn't sand first?! Smh...wow dude, just wow....


----------



## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

NCPaint1 said:


> Omg you're painting over a semigloss that you didn't sand first?! Smh...wow dude, just wow....


I sanded it with my mind saying stuff like " you will not jump off you will stay put"


----------



## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

Try covering over dark green with light yellow in 3 or less coats. We succeded by using a first coat of light yellow in glidden premium flat/matte from home depot. Then two coats of behr ulra eggshell. Same results with glidden and then bm ultra spec eggshell on a different house. Many years ago we made the mistake of doing 3 coats of zinnser 123 and then 2 coats of sw super paint satin with still transparency. Ancient chinese secret is glidden flat matte as first coat.


----------



## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

straight_lines said:


> I don't think anyone here will debate the hiding powers. It does have good film build and color hide. It doesn't do magical things that other good paints can't do.


True


----------



## PatsPainting (Mar 4, 2010)

I don't care what anyone says. I would have no problem using this stuff over any other brands. Including 024. However not sure about 0100 though. But this stuff is great. Used it all the time for exteriors. Sucks though as it's been pulled too just like all the other oils here in socal.

Pat


----------



## caulktheline (Feb 10, 2011)

The main problem here is jp has something to sell. The chit has its ups and downs like anything else. It's paint ya'll, I can make Depot's run of Olympic work for me but I'm gonna be pissed about it. The number 24 bs is just that, jp. BS. You're full of it. This is coming from someone who stands behind your opinion on the tradeworks sprayer.


----------



## Painter-Aaron (Jan 17, 2013)

I find after you prime with zinnser 123, it leaves a blueish/grey tinge to it. When you paint white over it, it takes at least three coats almost every time. I haven't tested that theory out with too many brands though


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> Sorry to hear that, Nelly. But...like you didn't know what the outcome would be?
> 
> :jester:


 
Why, yes, I did, and explained it all to the ho, but she had it and wanted to use it and was willing to pay me:blink:


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

Ole34 said:


> More often than not the culprit ....... Half of a guys painting issues are his own mental problems


 
half? I believe ALL of us have some mental problems, for sure:yes:


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

caulktheline said:


> The main problem here is jp has something to sell. The chit has its ups and downs like anything else. It's paint ya'll, I can make Depot's run of Olympic work for me but I'm gonna be pissed about it. The number 24 bs is just that, jp. BS. You're full of it. This is coming from someone who stands behind your opinion on the tradeworks sprayer.


 
start your own damn thread


----------



## CliffK (Dec 21, 2010)

Workaholic said:


> White over primer though?
> 
> For the record I am not a behr hater, nor am i a behr lover. If it was sold out of a paint store I think it would be much more accepted than it is but I dislike waiting for paint in the box stores so I tend to stay away from that.


 I couldn't agree more... Many times I think these "Behr debates" are really _Home Depot vs. Traditional Paint Store debates_. It's the big box store business model and mentality vs. your local paint store business model and mentality.

I can count on one hand the number of times I have used the Behr products. Some favorable and some not so much. I have bought and used plenty of Benjamin Moore products and such that turned out to be crap in my opinion as well. It's there job to sell it. It's our job to sort it all out and figure out what works best for us in a given situation.

To make a blanket statement that Benjamin Moore is great or Behr is awful I think is just silly & shows a lack of experience. I will say, I do dislike the whole Home Depot experience however, but a few times a year they can come in handy(now that all the hardware stores are gone!).....


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

NCPaint1 said:


> Omg you're painting over a semigloss that you didn't sand first?! Smh...wow dude, just wow....


I also believe that applies to Chris N's original post as well. Chris goes over top of an oil base, without any sanding, or sanding in between coats, then he blames it on the behr. Lol. I blame it on his lack of skill and/or experience.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

chrisn said:


> Well, I had to use the dreaded Behr today. Premium Plus Ultra( at least) semi gloss.
> 
> Old WHITE oil paint. Primed with WHITE 123.
> 
> ...


Sand, first and then sand between coats next time. Then let us know what the outcome is thank you.


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

Yeah chrisn, stop being a GD hack.


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

last year, when I repainted my own living room and because I could look at the results day to day, I decided to use Behr Ultra Premium Semi-gloss sand/prime/fill/finish everything in one except the bank deposit.

I was doing just trim - walls were papered.

It was NOT a value priced paint - only a few dollars cheaper than other brands.



It did spread well. It leveled "OK, but not as well as something like waterborne satin Impervo. 

It could NOT cover itself

If put on just a little too thick, it ran and sagged, but it needs to be laid on thick to cover.

And the longevity of the looks of the finish is not the same as other top quality coatings.

Acceptable? Yes, "acceptable". Top quality? by no means.

After my little test, I came away realizing those who can apply Behr with TOP QUALITY results are painting gods. That's the only explanation I could come up with. If they can make that stuff cover, finish, and hold, they are to be revered. :thumbup:


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

MuraCoat said:


> Sand, first and then sand between coats next time. Then let us know what the outcome is thank you.


Mura, 

I think that is SOP for most quality painters.


----------



## Carl (Jun 18, 2011)

MuraCoat said:


> Sand, first and then sand between coats next time. Then let us know what the outcome is thank you.


No offense, but this comment makes me wonder if you are even a painter? His complaint about the Behr is coverage. How is sanding before applying primer and sanding in between coats going to help with coverage? Also, I think since this is a painters forum, most of us just assumed he did the proper prep, even though it is irrelevant to his complaint about the product.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

daArch said:


> last year, when I repainted my own living room and because I could look at the results day to day, I decided to use Behr Ultra Premium Semi-gloss sand/prime/fill/finish everything in one except the bank deposit.
> 
> I was doing just trim - walls were papered.
> 
> ...


Arch, I believe the equal comparison to behr according to paint talk was Promar 200. I believe Benjamin Moore Impervo is in the 50 dollar a gallon range? Vs behr which I can get for $31 per gallon. I have used dozens and dozens of gallons of Behr Ultra in the past several years ( a wide variation of colors bases and Sheen's ), and I find it to be exceptional paint, especially for the price tag. And I am a paint God.

Did you use behr ultra or Behr Premium. It seems like the specific behr product is never mentioned.


----------



## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

Mura,

Are you a member here to antagonize, insult, and brow beat people of different opinions, or is it to learn, help, and build camaraderie with fellow painters? Just wondering...


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

Rbriggs82 said:


> Mura,
> 
> Are you a member here to antagonize, insult, and brow beat people of different opinions, or is it to learn, help, and build camaraderie with fellow painters? Just wondering...


Let's not get personal Ryan and make nothing into something. I've been to your website, you're a college kid with half the painting experience I have.

If you, are not a fan of my posting style, kindly ignore me.

I have not posted or commented on any of your posts in a long time. So please stop targeting me. 

I think what you're trying to do is get thanks from other paint talk members. It's a numbers game to you.


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

No..if Briggs was just trying for "thanks", he'd have called you an ass.

..but I could be wrong.


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

Don't make me put you on my SL, Mura.

cuz I'll do it. Ask anybody.


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

MuraCoat said:


> Arch, I believe the equal comparison to behr according to paint talk was Promar 200. I believe Benjamin Moore Impervo is in the 50 dollar a gallon range? Vs behr which I can get for $31 per gallon. I have used dozens and dozens of gallons of Behr Ultra in the past several years ( a wide variation of colors bases and Sheen's ), and I find it to be exceptional paint, especially for the price tag. And I am a paint God.
> 
> Did you use behr ultra or Behr Premium. It seems like the specific behr product is never mentioned.


Behr - Premium Plus - Ultra, is what the can says.

$35 before sales tax

Compared to paints that are easier to apply, level better, and cover better, Behr, IMO, cost more for a final result of equal quality.

As I said, it is a paint that gives an ACCEPTABLE appearance. And as we know the REAL test of an architectural coating is it's longevity. Passing by the surfaces that I coated last year, I am aware of the day by day appearance. There are slowly appearing streaks of flashing running along the directing of my brush strokes - as if someone had tried to dry brush partially set up paint. 

Have you revisited many of your jobs after a year and closely inspected how the Behr has held up ?

BTW, the Satin Impervo WB I put in this room, my office, what? four, five, six ? years ago still looks like it was applied a month ago. A few MINOR dings on the window stool were the A/C unit has hit - and I mean MINOR, size of a BB. 

And as far as comparison to Promar 200, I'm sorry, I did not see the mention of that product in the OP.


You can call it exceptional if you wish, more power to you. I'm just relating my experience with it from a totally neutral standpoint. I have no pony in this race.


----------



## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

daArch said:


> Mura,
> 
> I think that is SOP for most quality painters.


 Its an sob story.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

daArch said:


> Behr - Premium Plus - Ultra, is what the can says.
> 
> $35 before sales tax
> 
> ...


I just called my Benjamin Moore store, I was quoted a price of $49 per gallon for egg shell Impervo.

Let me just clear the air, I have never stated ever on this website, that behr was superior to all top manufacturers as a whole. I specifically named products, such as Promar 200.

I don't doubt for a minute, that the paints priced at $50 per gallon at Sherwin Williams and Benjamin Moore are better than Behr paints at 31 dollars per gallon. But I don't have the answer to that question because I refuse to spend $50 per gallon.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

Carl said:


> No offense, but this comment makes me wonder if you are even a painter? His complaint about the Behr is coverage. How is sanding before applying primer and sanding in between coats going to help with coverage? Also, I think since this is a painters forum, most of us just assumed he did the proper prep, even though it is irrelevant to his complaint about the product.


Sanding in between coats gives each coat a better surface to adhear to and giving it more bonding power. Painting over semi gloss without sanding, the paint won't grip properly and has a sliding affect.

I learned to never assume anything.


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Mura,

can you do us (and hopefully yourself) a favor?

For ONE job spend the extra $18 for a gallon of the BM and give it an honest chance and see if the application of it doesn't save you $18 worth of labor and the results are $18 worth of appearance and longevity.

If you do see the better value of it, and build a relationship with your BM dealer, the price per gallon may even go down.

I am a firm believer that different folks find different results for the same product. I am also a firm believer when I hear different perceptions than I hold, to TEST a product or technique. As a paperhanging buddy is wont to say, "try it for thirty days before you make up your mind"

I will advise those who condemn Behr without ever trying it to do the same.

I tried Behr and have formed an opinion from knowledge.

Back in the day, I knew what products suited my needs for an application. I grew to hate BM sani-flat, even though it was an industry staple. It flashed too readily for me. I found a flat oil ceil paint from a local manufacturer and that product gave me a flawless, depthless finish. I also did not like satin impervo, although it too was an industry standard. The comparable paint from that same local company was better for me. 

However, I used BM exterior paints. 

And stain from a completely different manufacturer.


----------



## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

MuraCoat said:


> I just called my Benjamin Moore store, I was quoted a price of $49 per gallon for egg shell Impervo


They don't make eggshell Impervo.

I don't compare anything that we sell to anything that they sell. Its two different ball games. The customers that are purchasing their products are not our customers, and that's fine. Every product has a market, just as PC's have a market for their customers. Fit the product for the customer, just like you guys tailor your products and services for your customers.


----------



## wje (Apr 11, 2009)

We need a Behr part 3 thread.....


----------



## ewingpainting.net (Jun 2, 2008)

MuraCoat said:


> ........................................ I refuse to spend $50 per gallon.


Findeth thy customer with unhesitating willingness to payeth $50 per thy gallon. Life shalt become a drinking well of prosperity.

....


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

Steve Richards said:


> No..if Briggs was just trying for "thanks", he'd have called you an ass.
> 
> ..but I could be wrong.


You're on fire Steve! 

I'll admit, I'm an azz that knows my chit.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

NCPaint1 said:


> They don't make eggshell Impervo.


I just called my BM rep, he said they make a low luster Impervo. His words to me were - low luster and eggshell are the same thing.


----------



## Painter-Aaron (Jan 17, 2013)

MuraCoat said:


> I just called my BM rep, he said they make a low luster Impervo. His words to me were - low luster and eggshell are the same thing.


More like a high hide or low sheen eggshell. A bit different than a true eggshell


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

ewingpainting.net said:


> Findeth thy customer with unhesitating willingness to payeth $50 per thy gallon. Life shalt become a drinking well of prosperity.
> 
> ....


I just used 5 gallons of regal semi gloss, it was a newly built home, re painting trim and doors, going over builders off white, with a slightly grayish off white finish. I was hoping for one coat coverage, unfortunately it needed two. Keep in mind, it was a very slight color change. But overall, I wasn't blown away by Regal.


----------



## aaron61 (Apr 29, 2007)

A couple of drops of black will help ANY white cover


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

Painter-Aaron said:


> More like a high hide or low sheen eggshell. A bit different than a true eggshell


Every manufacturers eggs shell finish differs from one another. Sherwin Williams may have more Sheen than Ben Benjamin Moore. Now I have found that Valspar for instance, their egg shell has very low shine compare to behrs eggshell finish.


----------



## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

MuraCoat said:


> Every manufacturers eggs shell finish differs from one another. Sherwin Williams may have more Sheen than Ben Benjamin Moore. Now I have found that Valspar for instance, their egg shell has very low shine compare to behrs eggshell finish.


You sure got a lot of time on your hands. What else could explain your incessant need to show us how much you love to argue about nothing.


----------



## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

TJ Paint said:


> You sure got a lot of time on your hands.






Must be raining in Texas too.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

TJ Paint said:


> You sure got a lot of time on your hands. What else could explain your incessant need to show us how much you love to argue about nothing.


And you sure seem to love to comment on my posts. If I post something controversial, TJ will be there sooner or later to put me in my place. Thank you for your two cents.


----------



## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

I've always found painters to balk at price as not being able to see the forest for the trees. I have these customers I am quoting right now, and they've been bitch, bitch, bitch about the price of paint like $60 for a can of Ben Moore - because they insist upon buying the paint themselves. Well you know what, what's the price of a few gallons of paint going to be compared to my labor and company overhead? Nada. People who bitch about materials cost are going to bitch about what you charge in general. I applaud companies like Ben Moore for raising their prices, because people are going to be dragged kicking and screaming into paying more money for paint work.


----------



## ewingpainting.net (Jun 2, 2008)

.....


----------



## ewingpainting.net (Jun 2, 2008)

MuraCoat said:


> You're on fire Steve!
> 
> I'll admit, I'm an azz that knows my chit.


Some would suggest those are character traits of a narcissist or arrogance

....


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

You know come to think of it, I did a job in the spring, where I used Behr premium for $28 a gallon semi gloss. 2 windows, base trim and one door. I apply one coat of latex kilz to all surfaces, and then one coat of $28 a gallon Behr semi gloss. It looked sweet. So I can't understand the OP's complaint.


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

MuraCoat said:


> You know come to think of it, I did a job in the spring, where I used Behr premium for $28 a gallon semi gloss. 2 windows, base trim and one door. I apply one coat of latex kilz to all surfaces, and then one coat of $28 a gallon Behr semi gloss. It looked sweet. So I can't understand the OP's complaint.


I'd love to see examples of where Behr looked comparable to a top quality finish. Unfortunately an internet picture can not truly represent a valid comparison, IMO.

Next time I'm in your neighborhood, I'll have to look you up.


----------



## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

daArch said:


> I'd love to see examples of where Behr looked comparable to a top quality finish. Unfortunately an internet picture can not truly represent a valid comparison, IMO.
> 
> Next time I'm in your neighborhood, I'll have to look you up.


Bill

This reminds me of one of my favorite old crusty locals who, in situations like this, would say:

"Ya need a GD fool like that around"

For how long, who knows.


----------



## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

I don't think this guy likes Behr. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLdwlZa0d1Y


----------



## oldpaintdoc (Apr 11, 2010)

ewingpainting.net said:


> Some would suggest those are character traits of a narcissist or arrogance
> 
> ....


I don't care what his character traits are I just wish I was a good as he is.


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

MuraCoat said:


> Sand, first and then sand between coats next time. Then let us know what the outcome is thank you.


 
Look here angry man, I did not post all the freeking details, only the important parts, so back the f off.


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

MuraCoat said:


> I also believe that applies to Chris N's original post as well. Chris goes over top of an oil base, without any sanding, or sanding in between coats, then he blames it on the behr. Lol. I blame it on his lack of skill and/or experience.[/QUOTE]
> 
> 
> Not so , oh angry one.
> ...


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

NCPaint1 said:


> They don't make eggshell Impervo.
> 
> I don't compare anything that we sell to anything that they sell. Its two different ball games. The customers that are purchasing their products are not our customers, and that's fine. Every product has a market, just as PC's have a market for their customers. Fit the product for the customer, just like you guys tailor your products and services for your customers.


 
exacty, the self proclaimed painting god has failed:thumbsup:


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

MuraCoat said:


> You're on fire Steve!
> 
> I'll admit, I'm an azz that knows my chit.[/QUOTE]
> 
> ...


----------



## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

Raising blood pressure of Steve and Chris is legendary.

Not sure if that's allowed.


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

oldpaintdoc said:


> I don't care what his character traits are I just wish I was a good as he is.


 
you and me both:whistling2:


----------



## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

plainpainter said:


> I don't think this guy likes Behr. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLdwlZa0d1Y


He keeps calling it junk. And he does not appear to be from the painttalk tribe.


----------



## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

Whoa if a Binks Superbee won't pump something nice, eek. Like lets get outta here Scoob.


----------



## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> Raising blood pressure of Steve and Chris is legendary.
> 
> Not sure if that's allowed.


An epic adventure.


----------



## johnpaint (Sep 20, 2008)

daArch said:


> I'd love to see examples of where Behr looked comparable to a top quality finish. Unfortunately an internet picture can not truly represent a valid comparison, IMO.
> 
> Next time I'm in your neighborhood, I'll have to look you up.


Seems like the last time I was here you all were talking about this Behr Paint stuff, I know its fun.lol


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

John,

PT is like one big learning center

If you ever have the opportunity to stop by your old first grade classroom, the teacher (maybe even YOURS) will be teaching the same lessons you were taught decades ago.


----------



## johnpaint (Sep 20, 2008)

I think you r right bro.


----------



## johnpaint (Sep 20, 2008)

The older I get the more I can see some things.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

daArch said:


> I'd love to see examples of where Behr looked comparable to a top quality finish. Unfortunately an internet picture can not truly represent a valid comparison, IMO.
> 
> Next time I'm in your neighborhood, I'll have to look you up.


I never used the words top quality finish. I reiterate, I put one coat of kilz, and 1 finish coat of Behr. It looked very acceptable to the customer.

So again, I don't understand the OP's complaint. I understand that us as professionals, have different skill and ability levels. And I, have no problem working with behr and making it look presentable. Very presentable.

And here's a side note to Vermont painter, Scott, you and Steve Burnett should form an LLC. Yourself being the apprentice trainer, and Steve can do all your infomercials while driving his car with no hands. Haha


----------



## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

Why such a scare over the Behr?


----------



## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

mudbone said:


> Why such a scare over the Behr?


...and is it a crime to prime?


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

MuraCoat said:


> I never used the words top quality finish. I reiterate, I put one coat of kilz, and 1 finish coat of Behr. It looked very acceptable to the customer.
> 
> So again, I don't understand the OP's complaint. I understand that us as professionals, have different skill and ability levels. And I, have no problem working with behr and making it look presentable. Very presentable.
> 
> And here's a side note to Vermont painter, Scott, you and Steve Burnett should form an LLC. Yourself being the apprentice trainer, and Steve can do all your infomercials while driving his car with no hands. Haha


Mura, 

If you notice, I have been trying to have a mature and respectful discussion with you and any other promoter of Behr. 

many of your evaluations of Behr include:

"It looked sweet."
"I find it to be exceptional paint"

To me that indicates you are exceptionally satisfied with the results it gives you. Now, if in this last post you are flatly saying that it CAN NOT rank with a top quality paint and that it only gives an "acceptable" finish, then we have reached a point of agreement.

And trying to remain respectful, (as per the Terms of Service we all agreed to), may I point out that you have not exactly stayed within those guidelines. I understand that a lot of people are calling you argumentative, angry, and the like. And I wish they wouldn't HOWEVER, I can fully understand their perceptions. 

Could you do PT a favor and back down a bit and try to be respectful of the other members here and of different opinions?

And if you feel someone is dissing you, PLEASE report the post. Let the referees earn their 6 figure salaries :whistling2:

thanks


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

daArch said:


> Mura,
> 
> If you notice, I have been trying to have a mature and respectful discussion with you and any other promoter of Behr.
> 
> ...


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
That, people... is why daArch is (and should remain) a mod.


----------



## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> Whoa if a Binks Superbee won't pump something nice, eek. Like lets get outta here Scoob.


I'm not a sprayer, only owned a spraytech once in my life, so I don't know if this is sarcasm or not.


----------



## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

plainpainter said:


> I'm not a sprayer, only owned a spraytech once in my life, so I don't know if this is sarcasm or not.


Scott can be a mystery wrapped in a enema sometimes.


----------



## slinger58 (Feb 11, 2013)

plainpainter said:


> I'm not a sprayer, only owned a spraytech once in my life, so I don't know if this is sarcasm or not.


Don't think he was being sarcastic. The SuperBee was good in it's day.
I didn't know of any still around these days. Kinda like the old Graco 333
and 433, haven't seen one in a long time.


----------



## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

It is a legendary pump, no sarcasm intended.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

daArch said:


> Mura,
> 
> If you notice, I have been trying to have a mature and respectful discussion with you and any other promoter of Behr.
> 
> ...


In Red: No, that is not exactly what I am saying. I have stated, that I don't use the expensive paints often enough to make that claim. I used 5 gallons of Regal the month of June. Honestly, it didn't blow me away. I used Duration a few months ago and it had tons of chunks in it, (remember that thread)?

For the price, Behr works well. And I have worked side by side (using Behr) with 25 year experienced painters, and they all said something like this, "this stuff works well", I have no problem with (Behr) this paint. 

I even had a Behr hater work for me a few months ago. 31 y/o / 10 years exp.. He walked in with a Behr sucks attitude. I put him on a 3 day exterior, he did the complete job his self, using Behr Ultra. When he finished, I asked him, "so what do you think of Behr now?" His answers was; "not bad, how much is it per gallon"?

As far as being angry? Point out an angry post I made (I am not angry - people are reading into my posts incorrectly). To me, it looks like Chrisn is the angry person.

But listen guys, sorry if I offended anyone here... I am a ball breaker and a smart ass... 

Have a great 4th guys!


----------



## slinger58 (Feb 11, 2013)

Just a word of caution to all the adamant defenders of behr on this forum.

Don't forget the Timothy Treadwell story. He spent many years of his life defending behrs against the advice of behr experts and authorities.

And he ended up being " chunks of behr chit " ! :jester:


----------



## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

Not for nothing but these guys that are getting jacked for these high prices at the paint stores some real advice. Stop jumpin aroumd trying out this and that at this store and that store. Decide on a line of material you can work with, and a store you can live with and get that line of material at that store and your pricing will come down. That's how that works and it seems elementary but some may not know it.


----------



## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

Oden said:


> Not for nothing but these guys that are getting jacked for these high prices at the paint stores some real advice. Stop jumpin aroumd trying out this and that at this store and that store. Decide on a line of material you can work with, and a store you can live with and get that line of material at that store and your pricing will come down. That's how that works and it seems elementary but some may not know it.


just wanted to add to what Oden said.....i cant stress it enough how important it is to get to know a single product an stick with it...I recently switched to BM but prior I was using MAB an knew their lines like the back of my hand ..knew how they covered...knew how they adhered...knew how much water they could drink ...I knew it all an that helped me immensely when it came time to bid jobs ....


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

MuraCoat said:


> In Red: No, that is not exactly what I am saying. I have stated, that I don't use the expensive paints often enough to make that claim. I used 5 gallons of Regal the month of June. Honestly, it didn't blow me away. I used Duration a few months ago and it had tons of chunks in it, (remember that thread)?
> 
> For the price, Behr works well. And I have worked side by side (using Behr) with 25 year experienced painters, and they all said something like this, "this stuff works well", I have no problem with (Behr) this paint.
> 
> ...


 
me?, angry? I am the most mellow person you have ever come across:yes:


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Mura,


your last post was well put and well tempered, thank you. I am sure some will disagree, but that's cool, as long as the rhetoric stays cool. 

I've described my experience with Behr, so I will not belabor it . I've read and contemplated yours, no need to keep defending what you find works good enough for your uses.

As I oft say about wallpaper hangers, and it is true about painters, hell it's true about ALL trades, ask any three paperhangers the same question, and you will receive FOUR different answers.

And each answer is correct, let us not forget. 

It's wretchedly hot out, let us *ALL* be cool. Sometimes how we talk in person doesn't translate well to internet forums.


----------



## sully9er (Jan 24, 2011)

CApainter said:


> ...and is it a crime to prime?


No, just to rhyme.


----------



## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

Ole34 said:


> just wanted to add to what Oden said.....i cant stress it enough how important it is to get to know a single product an stick with it...I recently switched to BM but prior I was using MAB an knew their lines like the back of my hand ..knew how they covered...knew how they adhered...knew how much water they could drink ...I knew it all an that helped me immensely when it came time to bid jobs ....


I'd like to add that cheap materials leads to very competitive pricing in this industry. So many guys act like expensive materials will sink their profit margins. Evidently, you never knew a bathroom tiling guy that specialized in installing expensive italian tile. You want to talk expensive materials - holy smokes - this guy could build into his estimates $100 labor rates and nobody ever balked, because it gets hidden against materials costs.

Here is a Gedanken experiment {i.e. thought experiment} Imagine you give an estimate to paint a couple of rooms at $1,000 using cheap paint.

Now imagine that you are using super duper expensive paint that will cost $10,000 all by itself. Are you seriously going to use the same labor charge as in the $1,000 estimate? So the total bill is $10,700? Or are you going to realize that atrociously expensive materials costs enables you to put 'hide' a comfortable amount of money for labor so now you end up charging $16,000-$17,000 for the job?


----------



## Westview (Jul 23, 2011)

I used premium plus ultra on an interior and it had great coverage. Itès a very thick paint.


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

plainpainter said:


> Now imagine that you are using super duper expensive paint that will cost $10,000 all by itself. Are you seriously going to use the same labor charge as in the $1,000 estimate? So the total bill is $10,700? Or are you going to realize that atrociously expensive materials costs enables you to put 'hide' a comfortable amount of money for labor so now you end up charging $16,000-$17,000 for the job?



I have NO idea what you are talking about :whistling2:  


:jester:


----------



## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

daArch said:


> I have NO idea what you are talking about :whistling2:
> 
> 
> :jester:


Sure you don't, Bill. How much do some of those tweed papers cost per yard?


----------



## Painter-Aaron (Jan 17, 2013)

plainpainter said:


> Sure you don't, Bill. How much do some of those tweed papers cost per yard?


He cuts down the trees himself to save on the material costs :whistling:


----------



## Carl (Jun 18, 2011)

plainpainter said:


> I'd like to add that cheap materials leads to very competitive pricing in this industry. So many guys act like expensive materials will sink their profit margins. Evidently, you never knew a bathroom tiling guy that specialized in installing expensive italian tile. You want to talk expensive materials - holy smokes - this guy could build into his estimates $100 labor rates and nobody ever balked, because it gets hidden against materials costs.
> 
> Here is a Gedanken experiment {i.e. thought experiment} Imagine you give an estimate to paint a couple of rooms at $1,000 using cheap paint.
> 
> Now imagine that you are using super duper expensive paint that will cost $10,000 all by itself. Are you seriously going to use the same labor charge as in the $1,000 estimate? So the total bill is $10,700? Or are you going to realize that atrociously expensive materials costs enables you to put 'hide' a comfortable amount of money for labor so now you end up charging $16,000-$17,000 for the job?


Ripping off the customer for an extra 6-7K just because you know they have money is unethical IMO. I realize this is how American business operates and that some of us get on board and some don't. Often, behavior like this can separate you from being successful and living a life of mediocrity. I could probably never do it, and I'll be poor forever because of it. Oh well, at least I can still afford TV.


----------



## ExcelPaintingCo (Apr 16, 2011)

Carl said:


> Ripping off the customer for an extra 6-7K just because you know they have money is unethical IMO. I realize this is how American business operates and that some of us get on board and some don't. Often, behavior like this can separate you from being successful and living a life of mediocrity. I could probably never do it, and I'll be poor forever because of it. Oh well, at least I can still afford TV.


Some people want to pay more, go with the highest bidder, ware the best cloths, shoes, cars, etc, etc......that is a point a lot of painters seem to miss. There is nothing unethical about being more expensive. You don't have to be the lowest bid to be awarded work.


----------



## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

Carl said:


> Ripping off the customer for an extra 6-7K just because you know they have money is unethical IMO. I realize this is how American business operates and that some of us get on board and some don't. Often, behavior like this can separate you from being successful and living a life of mediocrity. I could probably never do it, and I'll be poor forever because of it. Oh well, at least I can still afford TV.


Ethical Schmethical - what's the difference between a new Jeep SUV and a mercedes SUV? About 40k and that's it! 

All I am saying, would you install $10,000 worth of materials for $500 - because you only charge $40/hr for labor? That's only 5% tacked on, your net profit margin on the sale is something like 0.5% - that's ridiculous. You're programmed to be poor. Not to mention when you handle more expensive materials you should build a higher profit margin in order to afford accidents and ruined product. If one broken Italian tile in a bathroom remodel is the difference between making money and going broke - then you should suck it up and learn to charge more money - god forbid you make good money.


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

I once heard that one should charge for installation at LEAST what the product costs. Reasoning being: so if it goes south, all you are losing is time.

not that I do that, but I do understand the logic. 

AND, many times, the high priced spreads DO take more experience, care, skill, and time. The high price of installation is part of making sure it is done right.


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

daArch said:


> Mura,
> 
> 
> your last post was well put and well tempered, thank you. I am sure some will disagree, but that's cool, as long as the rhetoric stays cool.
> ...


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

chrisn said:


> daArch said:
> 
> 
> > Mura,
> ...


----------



## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

plainpainter said:


> Ethical Schmethical - what's the difference between a new Jeep SUV and a mercedes SUV? About 40k and that's it!
> 
> All I am saying, would you install $10,000 worth of materials for $500 - because you only charge $40/hr for labor? That's only 5% tacked on, your net profit margin on the sale is something like 0.5% - that's ridiculous. You're programmed to be poor. Not to mention when you handle more expensive materials you should build a higher profit margin in order to afford accidents and ruined product. If one broken Italian tile in a bathroom remodel is the difference between making money and going broke - then you should suck it up and learn to charge more money - god forbid you make good money.


Dan sometimes you post things that are really profound. :thumbsup:


----------



## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

straight_lines said:


> Dan sometimes you post things that are really profound. :thumbsup:


 Agree! Sometimes I think this forum should be called plainpainttalk!


----------



## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

mudbone said:


> Agree! Sometimes I think this forum should be called plainpainttalk!


Stop it -now I'm blushing. I'm not trying to step on toes, just want to get word out to guys that they're worth more than they're charging. Take guys like Brian professing two coats of finish paint direct to raw substrate. Many of my favorite products are now considered paint and prime in the can, P&L, Ben Moore, Muralo, California, Clark+Kensington - all of them advertise this, and perhaps they do a good job at this thus negating the need for primer.

But come on, we all know if we were really making great money - I mean really good money, would you skip the primer just because it's possible - or would ya go ahead and give a good coat of primer because you felt quality was attached your company name? I know I'd still prime.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

daArch said:


> last year, when I repainted my own living room and because I could look at the results day to day, I decided to use Behr Ultra Premium Semi-gloss sand/prime/fill/finish everything in one except the bank deposit.
> 
> I was doing just trim - walls were papered.
> 
> ...


So you are having application issues? It's like driving someone elses car, it will feel awkward until you get used to it. Maybe you need more time to get familiar with the Behr products.

Please explain the longevity issue? 

I painted my girlfriends bathroom (walls, ceiling & trim) with Behr Premium - (not the Ultra - Paint & Primer in 1). I did it in September 2012. Honestly, today it still looks as good - as the day I painted it. Keep in mind, the bathroom has no exhaust fan and (2) women live there, so the shower is running morning and night. Not a spec of mold in sight either... 

A living room is not exposed to a fraction of the conditions as a bathroom, so I CAN NOT relate to your claim.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

Oden said:


> Not for nothing but these guys that are getting jacked for these high prices at the paint stores some real advice. Stop jumpin aroumd trying out this and that at this store and that store. Decide on a line of material you can work with, and a store you can live with and get that line of material at that store and your pricing will come down. *That's how that works and it seems elementary but some may not know it*.


Yes, I realize that. I get Regal for under $40.
But I actually like Behr. :yes:


----------



## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

MuraCoat said:


> Yes, I realize that. I get Regal for under $40.
> But I actually like Behr. :yes:


I prefer the behr as well.


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

MuraCoat said:


> So you are having application issues? It's like driving someone elses car, it will feel awkward until you get used to it. Maybe you need more time to get familiar with the Behr products.
> 
> Please explain the longevity issue?


I agree that most any coating has a learning curve. I discovered that with Satin Impervo WB. I have one hollow core flat door that was a bitch to get right. But by the time I was done with only 43 lin ft of bed molding, 37 lin ft of base, one 6/6 wiindow, that hollow core and one 6 panel door, I had the application down.

With the Behr, I fought with it in the Liv Room through four-five times as much trim and still could not make it look as good. I felt I gave the paint a good honest "college try". My motive was to prove wrong the naysayers that said Behr was pure crap. It's not pure crap, it's mediocre paint at a higher than mediocre price. 

And I believe I did describe my dissatisfaction with the looks after one year (actually, one year this coming August). I'll copy and paste it for you:



daArch said:


> As I said, it is a paint that gives an ACCEPTABLE appearance. And as we know the REAL test of an architectural coating is it's longevity. Passing by the surfaces that I coated last year, I am aware of the day by day appearance. There are slowly appearing streaks of flashing running along the directing of my brush strokes - as if someone had tried to dry brush partially set up paint.
> 
> 
> BTW, the Satin Impervo WB I put in this room, my office, what? four, five, six ? years ago still looks like it was applied a month ago. A few MINOR dings on the window stool were the A/C unit has hit - and I mean MINOR, size of a BB.


Mura, I do love discussing differing opinions until a point of agreement and or understanding can be obtained. I thought we had reached that point of agreement in that we both understand Behr is NOT a top quality paint and gives only an "acceptable" result. I've kinda shot my wad on this one and would rather not nit pick further.


----------



## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

I respectfully disagree with you both. Having painted my entry, living room, kitchen and 2nd floor hallway with behr pp over 10 years ago. It is still holding up well, touches up with no flashing and has withstood 3 kids and all of their friends as well as dozens of parties with several people. Behr is not bullet proof but it is just as good if not better at their price points. Again it comes down to what a person likes and is use to. Some prefer Bud, others Coors, some like Miller. Sometimes its the prestige in using a certain brand with any tangible product. I like behr. It has a good amount of titanium oxide and convienient for our system of painting.


----------



## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

Zoomer said:


> I prefer the behr as well.


 Me three!:thumbsup:


----------



## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

daArch said:


> I agree that most any coating has a learning curve. I discovered that with Satin Impervo WB. I have one hollow core flat door that was a bitch to get right. But by the time I was done with only 43 lin ft of bed molding, 37 lin ft of base, one 6/6 wiindow, that hollow core and one 6 panel door, I had the application down.
> 
> With the Behr, I fought with it in the Liv Room through four-five times as much trim and still could not make it look as good. I felt I gave the paint a good honest "college try". My motive was to prove wrong the naysayers that said Behr was pure crap. It's not pure crap, it's mediocre paint at a higher than mediocre price.
> 
> ...


Bill you cant fight the behr and win!


----------



## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

I just purchased 750.00 of Behr premium plus ultra for my stash.I love behr walls!


----------



## wje (Apr 11, 2009)

mudbone said:


> Me three!:thumbsup:


BehrBone


----------



## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

mudbone said:


> I just purchased 750.00 of Behr premium plus ultra for my stash.I love behr walls!


Mudbone Behrs all! I can Behrly stand it any longer.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

daArch said:


> With the Behr, I fought with it in the Liv Room through four-five times as much trim and still could not make it look as good. I felt I gave the paint a good honest "college try". My motive was to prove wrong the naysayers that said Behr was pure crap. It's not pure crap, it's mediocre paint at a higher than mediocre price.
> 
> And I believe I did describe my dissatisfaction with the looks after one year (actually, one year this coming August). I'll copy and paste it for you:
> 
> ...


I don't agree with that.
I never said Behr does not perform like a top quality paint. 

I believe, to really see the difference in paint qualities, you have to paint (1) room with (4) different paints, on (4) different walls, on the same primed surface, applied on the same day (under the same exact conditions), to equally compare products. 

Remember the Pepsi Challenge? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepsi_Challenge
The comparison was done on the same day. Not months or years apart.

Have you ever painted with Ralph Lauren (sand finish)? I did a few years back, it looked so uneven, the HO had a Ralph Laruen rep come to their house... Was it crap paint or just hard to handle? 

*Thanks for your patience!*


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Zoomer said:


> I respectfully disagree with you both. Having painted my entry, living room, kitchen and 2nd floor hallway with behr pp over 10 years ago. It is still holding up well, touches up with no flashing and has withstood 3 kids and all of their friends as well as dozens of parties with several people. Behr is not bullet proof but it is just as good if not better at their price points. Again it comes down to what a person likes and is use to. Some prefer Bud, others Coors, some like Miller. Sometimes its the prestige in using a certain brand with any tangible product. I like behr. It has a good amount of titanium oxide and convienient for our system of painting.


and MANY folks like premium crafted beers. 

Rougue
Sam
McEwan's 
Smutty Nose
Shipyard
Magic Hat
Berkshire
Burning River


I'll stop there while the night is still young.


----------



## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

Steve Richards said:


> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> That, people... is why daArch is (and should remain) a mod.






mudbone said:


> Agree! Sometimes I think this forum should be called plainpainttalk!


Nobody likes a leg humper.


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

I like daArch just fine, and I'm not ashamed of it.

(I liked you too, then you lost your green letters..so now I don't)


----------



## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

Steve Richards said:


> I like daArch just fine, and I'm not ashamed of it.
> 
> (I liked you too, then you lost your green letters..so now I don't)


lol if the green was all that made you like me then good riddance.


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

Workaholic said:


> lol if the green was all that made you like me then good riddance.


I was kidding Work.

I'm a little high.

I think you're fine...or regular...or whatever.

Please don't start writing poems though.


----------



## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

Workaholic said:


> Nobody likes a leg humper.


How about behr hugger?


----------



## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

Steve Richards said:


> I was kidding Work.
> 
> I'm a little high.
> 
> ...


Everything I say has a hint of a joke to it so no reason to take offense. 

Poems are my new hobby the problem with them it is hard to rhyme stuff with Nantucket.


----------



## Workaholic (Apr 17, 2007)

mudbone said:


> How about behr hugger?


If I made the bulk of my annual income off behr I would be a hugger too.


----------



## caulktheline (Feb 10, 2011)

Workaholic said:


> Everything I say has a hint of a joke to it so no reason to take offense.
> 
> Poems are my new hobby the problem with them it is hard to rhyme stuff with Nantucket.


I thought I might spend a good friday night
Looking for a rhyme with Nantucket.
Then when it spawned a saturday's dawn,
I thought to myself... nah phuck it.


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

To be honest, I haven't used any Behr for a long time. Maybe it's better now.
Seem to be a few here that swear by it.
Next time I have a reason, I'll try it again.
But I am NOT going into a HD in my whites.

Could someone please make a note that I put this thread back on track?


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

caulktheline said:


> I thought I might spend a good friday night
> Looking for a rhyme with Nantucket.
> Then when it spawned a saturday's dawn,
> I thought to myself... nah phuck it.


There once was a painter from Natucket,
always so drunk he mucked it
he said with a grin
as he spat out his gin
"If this is Behr, just chuck it."


----------



## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

daArch said:


> and MANY folks like premium crafted beers.
> 
> Rougue
> Sam
> ...


Im partial to 
Blue moon
Sam adams cherry wheat
Shocktop
Leinenkugel canoe paddler
Amstel light


----------



## caulktheline (Feb 10, 2011)

daArch said:


> There once was a painter from Natucket,
> always so drunk he mucked it
> he said with a grin
> as he spat out his gin
> "If this is Behr, just chuck it."


I'm trying to behave myself, now. (but a covert thanks your direction :thumbup


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

Steve Richards said:


> To be honest, I haven't used any Behr for a long time. Maybe it's better now.
> Seem to be a few here that swear by it.
> Next time I have a reason, I'll try it again.
> But I am NOT going into a HD in my whites.
> ...


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

I don't know, chrisn.
I kinda decided last night to stop coming here medicated..too weird. I'm gonna join Pot Talk.com.
..if they'll have me.


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

Sure as hell, there'll be some guy there bitchin' "Hey, nice Stone Zone thread Steve"


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

Of course over there I'll probably use my real name, but a fake address.

I don't want a buncha dope-smokin' hippies flying in from all over the country to meet me and my stash.


----------



## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

Zoomer said:


> Im partial to
> Blue moon
> Sam adams cherry wheat
> Shocktop
> ...


And what does your designer purse doggie like?


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Steve Richards said:


> Of course over there I'll probably use my real name, but a fake address.
> 
> I don't want a buncha dope-smokin' hippies flying in from all over the country to meet me and my stash.


I gotta say, Steve, you are perfecting your personna. Some people come on here and try to pass for a viable painting business owner, but YOU, you have done an excellent rendition of the Colorado aging hippie stoner painter. Now I REALLY want to see who really is that man behind the curtain:


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

You guys need to quit wanting to meet me and my drugs.

(I have quite a bit, thanks to being a viable painting business owner)

But you know what? Remember in the 70's when you'd complain about your lid being full of seeds? No seeds nowadays...and I mean none. You gotta buy those separately!


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

daArch said:


> Some people come on here and try to pass for a viable painting business owner


 That got me thinking, daArch.

I'm sure a lot of people here wouldn't consider my business "viable".
I tried to grow it twice, then gave up and settled in.
I've been a 1 man show for about 15 years now. 

33 years later, I'm still here. I didn't get rich. My house still isn't paid for.
My wife had to work some of those years, but a big part of that was because my youngest son had some problems, and no one (except the state) would give him medical insurance...but he could ride on my wife's policy.

My business is probably worth about what I can sell a bunch of used painting equipment for.
But we never went hungry, always paid our bills (and now buy drugs)...thanks to my un-viable painting business...that I own, and that's let me live almost my entire life without any "bosses", except my wife.

Sorry for the derail chrisn....(blame daArch)


----------



## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Steve Richards said:


> I don't know, chrisn.
> I kinda decided last night to stop coming here medicated..too weird. I'm gonna join Pot Talk.com.
> ..if they'll have me.


At least over there you'll never catch any crap for derailing threads. No one will ever realize it or care. :wacko:


----------



## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

NCPaint1 said:


> And what does your designer purse doggie like?


A vanillla porter from Buckin good out of Montana. With a large plate of shrimp n grits


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

Steve Richards said:


> That got me thinking, daArch.
> 
> I'm sure a lot of people here wouldn't consider my business "viable".
> I tried to grow it twice, then gave up and settled in.
> ...




hell, he already went off on a stupid BEER tangent
not at all what I want to read about
he should know better


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

chrisn said:


> [/COLOR]
> 
> hell, he already went off on a stupid BEER tangent
> not at all what I want to read about
> he should know better


sorry, you know how insensitive I can be. 

I blame Steve Richards (only because I know if I mention the words "Steve Richards" I will get at least one THANKS, and *unlike* anyone else on this forum, I keep track of my THANKS :thumbsup: )

I bet if I also mention "RH" there's a good chance of at least another THANKS

I wonder if GOUGH, Slinger, Squid, & GreenGuy, are also so shallow ? NTTAWWT


(oooops I think I just forfeited all future THANKS) :whistling2:


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

daArch said:


> sorry, you know how insensitive I can be.
> 
> I blame Steve Richards (only because I know if I mention the words "Steve Richards" I will get at least one THANKS, and *unlike* anyone else on this forum, I keep track of my THANKS :thumbsup: )
> 
> ...


all that and you didn't get a damn one,
serves you right for being( at the very least) insensitive:yes:


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

Steve Richards said:


> *To be honest, I haven't used any Behr for a long time. Maybe it's better now.*
> Seem to be a few here that swear by it.
> Next time I have a reason, I'll try it again.
> But I am NOT going into a HD in my whites.
> ...


Most Behr naysayers I believe are like you (yea, I tried it 10 years ago, yea, I did the trim in one of the rooms in my house 8 years ago with Behr - yea, yea, yea). Formulas change and products become "new and improved". But what do I know, I only use Behr on a regular basis? And I am a picky painter. Most guys that work for me, learn that I am a picky MF'er on day one (those poor SOB's).


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

chrisn said:


> all that and you didn't get a damn one,
> serves you right for being( at the very least) insensitive:yes:


LOL
Don't mods have to go through sensitivety training?
Guess what... I haven't used any alcohol since I found my new *bud*dy.




MuraCoat said:


> Most Behr naysayers I believe are like you (yea, I tried it 10 years ago, yea, I did the trim in one of the rooms in my house 8 years ago with Behr - yea, yea, yea). Formulas change and products become "new and improved". But what do I know, I only use Behr on a regular basis? And I am a picky painter. Most guys that work for me, learn that I am a picky MF'er on day one (those poor SOB's).


I think it's a "fool me once...." or "once bitten, twice shy" thing.

The day's coming, and when it arrives, I hope you're still here so I'll at least have someone to bitch at, if need be.


----------



## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

MuraCoat said:


> Most Behr naysayers I believe are like you (yea, I tried it 10 years ago, yea, I did the trim in one of the rooms in my house 8 years ago with Behr - yea, yea, yea). Formulas change and products become "new and improved". But what do I know, I only use Behr on a regular basis? And I am a picky painter. Most guys that work for me, learn that I am a picky MF'er on day one (those poor SOB's).


With how evangelic you are about behr I am starting to think you are in fact a suit and not a painter.


----------



## slinger58 (Feb 11, 2013)

daArch said:


> sorry, you know how insensitive I can be.
> 
> I blame Steve Richards (only because I know if I mention the words "Steve Richards" I will get at least one THANKS, and *unlike* anyone else on this forum, I keep track of my THANKS :thumbsup: )
> 
> ...


Yeah, I'm that shallow. What about it?! But I'm sensitive, too!:whistling2:


----------



## Bender (Aug 10, 2008)

muracoat said:


> yes, i realize that. I get regal for under $40.
> But i actually like behr. :yes:





zoomer said:


> i prefer the behr as well.





mudbone said:


> me three!:thumbsup:


----------



## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

Bender said:


>


 The three behrs!:thumbsup:


----------



## Bender (Aug 10, 2008)

_"You'd think a six year old named it."
:lol::lol::lol:
_


----------



## loaded brush (Dec 27, 2007)

daArch said:


> Mura,
> 
> If you notice, I have been trying to have a mature and respectful discussion with you and any other promoter of Behr.
> 
> ...


I try not to chime in too much because this site can become so petty it's ridiculous. Seriously,where have you been. Being respectful to one another is one thing this site does not promote. Take the time to go back and read many of the past threads and posts as a reminder to the lack of respect this site possesses. It's not a place to post ones personal opinions about a given product. If it goes against the masses, you will be torn apart. I guess that's what you consider professionalism. Instead of saying "if it works for you great, but not my cup of tea". But no, instead it turns out to be a long winded thread with the sole purpose of beating a person down because they like a product that you and others do not. Come on people lighten up. I have said in a previous, post if you know what you are doing and truly are a professional painter, you can make any brand work and look great in the end regardless of it's price tag.


----------



## Zoomer (Dec 17, 2011)

loaded brush said:


> I try not to chime in too much because this site can become so petty it's ridiculous. Seriously,where have you been. Being respectful to one another is one thing this site does not promote. Take the time to go back and read many of the past threads and posts as a reminder to the lack of respect this site possesses. It's not a place to post ones personal opinions about a given product. If it goes against the masses, you will be torn apart. I guess that's what you consider professionalism. Instead of saying "if it works for you great, but not my cup of tea". But no, instead it turns out to be a long winded thread with the sole purpose of beating a person down because they like a product that you and others do not. Come on people lighten up. I have said in a previous, post if you know what you are doing and truly are a professional painter, you can make any brand work and look great in the end regardless of it's price tag.


Sooooooooo true!


----------



## caulktheline (Feb 10, 2011)

loaded brush said:


> I try not to chime in too much because this site can become so petty it's ridiculous. Seriously,where have you been. Being respectful to one another is one thing this site does not promote. Take the time to go back and read many of the past threads and posts as a reminder to the lack of respect this site possesses. It's not a place to post ones personal opinions about a given product. If it goes against the masses, you will be torn apart. I guess that's what you consider professionalism. Instead of saying "if it works for you great, but not my cup of tea". But no, instead it turns out to be a long winded thread with the sole purpose of beating a person down because they like a product that you and others do not. Come on people lighten up. I have said in a previous, post if you know what you are doing and truly are a professional painter, you can make any brand work and look great in the end regardless of it's price tag.


Spare the after-school special. You are not portraying the situation accurately. Expressing confidence in a product is one thing; applying a condescending tone in addition to said expression is gonna get you some feedback. The persons you are defending here do not agree that any product can be applied successfully when done skillfully. As a matter of fact, the implication was that 23 different common products were useless.


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

loaded brush said:


> I try not to chime in too much because this site can become so petty it's ridiculous. Seriously,where have you been. Being respectful to one another is one thing this site does not promote. Take the time to go back and read many of the past threads and posts as a reminder to the lack of respect this site possesses. It's not a place to post ones personal opinions about a given product. If it goes against the masses, you will be torn apart. I guess that's what you consider professionalism. Instead of saying "if it works for you great, but not my cup of tea". But no, instead it turns out to be a long winded thread with the sole purpose of beating a person down because they like a product that you and others do not. Come on people lighten up. I have said in a previous, post if you know what you are doing and truly are a professional painter, you can make any brand work and look great in the end regardless of it's price tag.


Hey thanks man!

Chrisn & Arch are paperhangers, the way it appears - not really painters, however, long time PT members... We are on the outside man. Disagree or say the wrong thing to long time members and you will be eliminated. It's kind of a "who you know deal and/or might makes right" ya know?

Mods - Behr sucks - sorry, my bad. :blink:


----------



## MuraCoat (Jan 26, 2013)

caulktheline said:


> Spare the after-school special. You are not portraying the situation accurately. Expressing confidence in a product is one thing; applying a condescending tone in addition to said expression is gonna get you some feedback. The persons you are defending here do not agree that any product can be applied successfully when done skillfully. As a matter of fact, the implication was that 23 different common products were useless.


You are 34 y/o? 
I am 52 and have been painting since the late 70's, running my own biz since the late 80's and have been estimating for 22 years... 

Put me, you and 99.99% of PT in a room together, and you will see who can 'talk the talk' and who can 'walk the walk'. :notworthy:


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

muracoat, the paint wizard, knower of all


----------



## caulktheline (Feb 10, 2011)

not worth it


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

Some people here just like to argue.

On Pot talk.com, if we disagree with something someone says, we just forget it and move on.

If we agree with it... we just forget it and move on too.


----------



## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

Bender said:


> _"You'd think a six year old named it."_
> _:lol::lol::lol:_


 Smart kid!:yes:


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

loaded brush said:


> I try not to chime in too much because this site can become so petty it's ridiculous. Seriously,where have you been. Being respectful to one another is one thing this site does not promote. Take the time to go back and read many of the past threads and posts as a reminder to the lack of respect this site possesses. It's not a place to post ones personal opinions about a given product. If it goes against the masses, you will be torn apart. I guess that's what you consider professionalism. Instead of saying "if it works for you great, but not my cup of tea". But no, instead it turns out to be a long winded thread with the sole purpose of beating a person down because they like a product that you and others do not. Come on people lighten up. I have said in a previous, post if you know what you are doing and truly are a professional painter, you can make any brand work and look great in the end regardless of it's price tag.


you are absolutely correct that too often too many on ALL sides of a "discussion" use disrespectful and unprofessional language. The mods would love everyone to take note of the Terms of Agreement :


> Users shall treat each other with respect at all times on PaintTalk.com. Name calling, personal attacks, or other inappropriate behavior will not be allowed and may cause you account to be banned.


EVERYONE should use self restraint when discussing differences of opinion. All too often it becomes a pissing contest or a measurement of one's "junk". 
AND if we come down on people who step over the line, people cry and moan that we are being fascists, power crazy, past our expiration date, etc and should step down.

as the old saying goes, "Damned if we do, damned if we don't"

So, what YOU can do if you think someone is being dissed is REPORT THE POST. This will go a long way with "peer group pressure" to keep this forum professional. 


AND if you are dissed, remaining respectful despite the slings and arrows will also help keep the temperature moderate. As our mothers used to say, "it takes two to tango"


----------



## benthepainter (Jun 17, 2011)

Steve Richards said:


> Some people here just like to argue.
> 
> On Pot talk.com, if we disagree with something someone says, we just forget it and move on.
> 
> If we agree with it... we just forget it and move on too.


thats the Aussie way Steve forget it and move on 

Actualy Aussie way is a punch up with your mate then a beer


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

MuraCoat said:


> Hey thanks man!
> 
> Chrisn & Arch are paperhangers, the way it appears - not really painters, however, long time PT members... We are on the outside man. Disagree or say the wrong thing to long time members and you will be eliminated. It's kind of a "who you know deal and/or might makes right" ya know?
> 
> Mods - Behr sucks - sorry, my bad. :blink:



Mura, 

ya see this striking out unnecessarily is what draws you fire. This post was meant as a tweak, a bait.

But I accept you for what you are. And because I understand and accept you, I probably will refrain from attempting to enter into any more professional, respectful, and intelligent discussions with you. 

have a great life.


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

I agree, daArch. But if I say more than that..sure as hell you-know-who is gonna call me a leghumper again.
Can't we do something about that guy?



benthepainter said:


> thats the Aussie way Steve forget it and move on
> 
> Actualy Aussie way is a punch up with your mate then a beer


I like Aussies (in a non-leghumping way).

WTF Ben. They don't even sell Behr in Australia, so why are you reading this thread?


----------



## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

While I'm on the subject,

TO EVERYONE:

If you feel that you MUST post some sarcasm, insults, or disrespectful words about another, think about this tactic to "hurt" that person. 

IGNORE him/her.

Most are here to present thoughts and read the replies. Face it, we ALL like the feedback, the give & take, the attention. So think what YOUR reaction would be if when you posted, NO ONE responded, NO ONE took notice of your opinion, NO ONE acted like you were alive, EVERYONE ignored you. You would prolly go somewhere else. 

There is an option on vBulletin called "Tachy Goes To Coventry" where a person's posts are seen *only * by him/her. No one else sees them and therefore no replies are posted. I've never seen it used in any forum I've helped admin or moderate. But you can imagine the effect it has on the miscreant member.


So, may I suggest that instead of feeling the need to "put someone in their place" just ignore that person. Like a little misbehaving child to whom the adults do not acknowledge, the problem will go away on its own.

Just thoughts


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

Putting them on your SL also helps.


----------



## Steve Richards (Dec 31, 2010)

It also helps if you log off and go to work.

You guys have a good one.


----------



## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

You behr guys are die-hards, and nothing if not loyal. 

I want a woman like you Mura.


----------



## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

TJ Paint said:


> You behr guys are die-hards, and nothing if not loyal.
> 
> I want a woman like you Mura.


Every guy wants a loyal woman, until they realize they're stuck with them and only them for the rest of their long depressing life.....


----------



## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

plainpainter said:


> Every guy wants a loyal woman, until they realize they're stuck with them and only them for the rest of their long depressing life.....


The guy or woman?


----------



## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

Yikes! Thanks a lot, I'm sure the mods will take that pic down in short order, but its too late for me! I will have nightmares for a week!

Dang Mura, I WAS picturing you as angry John Mcain in my PT fantasy world.... Not any more:jester:


----------



## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

What guy would ever pose in a woman's bikini like that for the whole wide world web to see?


----------



## 1963 Sovereign (Dec 14, 2011)

plainpainter said:


> What guy would ever pose in a woman's bikini like that for the whole wide world web to see?


JUDGE NOT,LEST YA BE JUDGED... same is kind of true for behr paint...


----------



## slinger58 (Feb 11, 2013)

benthepainter said:


> thats the Aussie way Steve forget it and move on
> 
> *Actualy Aussie way is a punch up with your mate then a beer*


Well we can't punch up online and I don't wanna encourage drinking on this forum, so how about everybody go spray a couple of gallons of lacquer without a respirator and we'll meet back here and sort this out. Whadda ya say? :jester:


----------



## Damon T (Nov 22, 2008)

This thread has been closed due to the overall lowering effect it has on the collective IQ. Thanks for playing and I'm sure we can all wait with baited breath for Behr part 3 to rear it's ugly head. Buh-bye


----------

