# What kind of game is this anyway?



## Harry (Aug 4, 2008)

Who ever heard of a game where High man wins but low man wins also???

That's the game we're playing because we need to be high enough to make a profit and low enough to win the job...how fun is that?

That's the commercial sector life...


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## johnpaint (Sep 20, 2008)

See, you are a thinking man. I knew it.


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## Harry (Aug 4, 2008)

johnpaint said:


> See, you are a thinking man. I knew it.


Me and my shadow...strolling down the avenue...lol.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

Do you ever work? Seems like you got alot of time on your hands, no offense. I enjoy your posts so far. They are adamant, somewhat insightful, witty, and don't pull any punches.


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## Harry (Aug 4, 2008)

TJ Paint said:


> Do you ever work? Seems like you got alot of time on your hands, no offense. I enjoy your posts so far. They are adamant, somewhat insightful, witty, and don't pull any punches.


Yes, I work, sometimes, lol.

Of course I work. I work on my computer, more now than ever because I do all my work on computer.

Thanks for the comments. If you start thinking that I'm not a good guy, try to look for the good stuff and leave the other stuff, it's not worth it...


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

It seems as of late the larger company's have been going after large contracts for low dollars in the hopes of making up profits in change orders.


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## Rcon (Nov 19, 2009)

NEPS.US said:


> It seems as of late the larger company's have been going after large contracts for low dollars in the hopes of making up profits in change orders.


I don't imagine that's ever good for business...


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## Harry (Aug 4, 2008)

NEPS.US said:


> It seems as of late the larger company's have been going after large contracts for low dollars in the hopes of making up profits in change orders.


That's true NEPS but it's not just a "today thing". Change orders are great for businesses that can play the game...especially in rehab work. There's just so much that can be missed by the GC or owner...and a clearly written contract can rake in the dough..

Keep in mind, I'm not talking about shooting craps or playing russian Roulette...the original base bid needs to be sufficient to pay the toll...


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

Harry said:


> Keep in mind, I'm not talking about shooting craps or playing russian Roulette...the original base bid needs to be sufficient to pay the toll...


The only logical explanation would be that these company's are just trying to keep the lights on to make it onto the next bid, day, week, month and year. They think that any cash flow is good cash flow in these times. GC's can smell the desperation like blood to a shark. It has been a challenging year for a company like mine to qualify rfq's.


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## ewingpainting.net (Jun 2, 2008)

Their buying the jobs


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## johnpaint (Sep 20, 2008)

There is one large company here that is getting all the jobs, but from what I hear they are low bidding for some reason, maybe to keep their staff working in order not to lose them. It's anyone guess.


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## VanDamme (Feb 13, 2010)

johnpaint said:


> There is one large company here that is getting all the jobs, but from what I hear they are low bidding for some reason, maybe to keep their staff working in order not to lose them. It's anyone guess.


John.....here in town? Can you PM me the name?

My brother owns *one* of the largest painting companies in town, but last I heard, they weren't very busy, but you know how 2nd hand information is?


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## Harry (Aug 4, 2008)

NEPS.US said:


> The only logical explanation would be that these company's are just trying to keep the lights on to make it onto the next bid, day, week, month and year. They think that any cash flow is good cash flow in these times. GC's can smell the desperation like blood to a shark. It has been a challenging year for a company like mine to qualify rfq's.


That's not what I'm talking about at all...

I'm saying that many jobs, especially rehabs (where there are a lot of unknowns) can be winners BECAUSE of change orders. Most GC's buy on price and that's alright I guess, considering two can play that game.

As long as you cover your bases and state what you are painting and what you're not painting, you can make money. I've yet to see a rehab that didn't incur more costs. Properly worded, these extra costs can be money in the bank for a subcontractor.

See, the GC is buying on price and he tends to look at low price and many times fails to notice the little items that will turn this job into a bigger job for the painter. I'm not pulling this stuff out of a hat, I deal with it every day, in real life.


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## CK_68847 (Apr 17, 2010)

NEPS.US said:


> It seems as of late the larger company's have been going after large contracts for low dollars in the hopes of making up profits in change orders.


If you know commercial change orders are hard to come by. Most generals will do whatever they can to get you to do what would be a change order for free. I would never count on that philosophy.


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## Harry (Aug 4, 2008)

CK_68847 said:


> If you know commercial change orders are hard to come by. Most generals will do whatever they can to get you to do what would be a change order for free. I would never count on that philosophy.


If you know how to play the game, it's easy. I was brought up in this stuff and I watched rich people play the game. I deal with it every day and I do count on it....otherwise, it becomes a freebie and we don't need any freebies...


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