# Nightmarish Peeling. Interior



## Criard (Nov 23, 2013)

Scuff sanding walls and noticed a tiny piece flaking up, pulled it, which led to this mess....

Any suggestions?


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

Is that bare plaster under the peeling layer? That's what it looks like in the first photo. When I zoom in, it looks as if there is widespread cracking or crazing.

What's on the outside of the wall? Brick?


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

Criard said:


> Scuff sanding walls and noticed a tiny piece flaking up, pulled it, which led to this mess....
> 
> Any suggestions?


keep on peeling:yes:


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## Criard (Nov 23, 2013)

Yes, this is an exterior facing wall. Vinyl siding on the outside, might be over brick?

As you can see the majority is just peeling down to this white base, which is extremely chalky. Run your hand over the wall and it will be white and dusty. 
There are one or two tiny spots where some of this white has chipped off the wall too. It seems there's some sort of peach underbody. I'm guessing the peach could have been an original coat of oil-based paint (as the tiny bit that has chipped off is very brittle and cracks, opposed to the peeling sheets of vinyl acrylic) and this white we're seeing is whatever primer was used. The primer stuck, but nothing stuck to the primer. 

And yes, underneath it all, it looks like the plaster wall itself is covered in these hairline fractures.

I wonder what the chances are of this being a lead-containing paint that I'm getting myself all dusty with...


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## ligboozer (Oct 13, 2009)

Oof.


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## jacob33 (Jun 2, 2009)

I would run from that job if you didn't already agree to do it.


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## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

jacob33 said:


> I would run from that job if you didn't already agree to do it.


Same here.Peel out!:whistling2:


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## Andyman (Feb 21, 2009)

Inform the property owner that conditions have changed! Reestimate with a solution!


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## Brian C (Oct 8, 2011)

if the wall is chalky underneath the peeling paint then it could be Kalsomine paint which can be fixed with oil based sealer binder. . Whats the age of the house ?


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## Stonehampaintdept (Jan 10, 2013)

Brian C said:


> if the wall is chalky underneath the peeling paint then it could be Kalsomine paint which can be fixed with oil based sealer binder. . Whats the age of the house ?


That was my secondary reaction after bare plaster. I second the peeling route and oil primer. Requote seems to be in order. Anymore demons popping up?


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

I'm guessing here, but it looked more like failing plaster than calcimine. One way to check: calcimine will wash off with a wet rag, that was part of the appeal. Elaborate plasterwork could be washed down before repainting, avoiding a build up of paint that would obscure the detail.


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## Criard (Nov 23, 2013)

Unfortunately for me, this was supposed to be a quick job for my brother (whom I owe one....one) and initially told him not to worry about paying me. 

He's since seen what I'm dealing with here and said he would compensate me for my time. How much, I don't know. Who cares, it's family.

The situation has gotten worse though. I was on the last stretch of this wall and was pulling off the last strip of paint (looks like there's 4 coats of different paint coming off in these sheets) from the upper corner; the strip pulled around the corner onto the next wall and continued peeling upward too, with some of the crown molding paint peeling off too.
It's actually kind of neat (albeit very disheartening) to see how the entire corner and molding peeled in one piece. Thankfully it stopped at the crown molding and didn't continue onto the ceiling. I think I would have cried if it did. hahaha


Yes, the white underbody is EXTREMELY chalky. Rub your hand along the wall and it will be covered in white powder. It reminds me of when I was refinishing a hardwood floor, how everything in the room gets coated in a dust that rubs off on everything. 
Like I said there seems to be something still underneath this cracking white surface. There are a few spots where it's chipping off (as in, very brittle chips that come off) and you can see a smooth orange-ish surface underneath, but most of the white is staying very well adhered to it.
That being said, I have run into several areas where it looks like this white layer may have started chipping badly on the previous previous owner and they just put on some spackle to repair the chipping.

I'll get some more pictures today. This is making me sad just thinking about it lol


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## driftweed (May 26, 2013)

Dontcha love demo? Peel & scrape away...re-mud as needed to bring back to even finish, & carry on.


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## Brian C (Oct 8, 2011)

I would bet its white Kalsomine over bare plaster that is causing this problem. Do a test and wash off an area and see.


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## Criard (Nov 23, 2013)

Well I can already tell you that dust will wash off it if I use a wet rag.

Are you saying this calcimine will remain chalky, even after being washed? So if I wash it and go back a few hours later and it's still chalky/dusty that would be the giveaway for it being calcimine?


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

I think Brian hit the nail on the head. I used to run into this problem with some older homes in San Francisco. When my boss would explain what it was, I could never real grasp that painters would apply such a crappy coating back in the day.

I did what basically Brian suggested. Wipe the walls down as good as possible then apply a primer. I suppose oil if in fact the carbonate isn't too high in alkaline. I'm sure there's a recommended primer for this situation. According to the Wiki link I provided, the Germans and Brits are using silicate paints. But I'm not sure if that's in another form of whitewash.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

this works


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

Criard said:


> Well I can already tell you that dust will wash off it if I use a wet rag.
> 
> Are you saying this calcimine will remain chalky, even after being washed? So if I wash it and go back a few hours later and it's still chalky/dusty that would be the giveaway for it being calcimine?


No, it may take some work, but you *can * wash it off and be left with a clean plaster wall.

http://www.oldhousejournal.com/cures_for_calcimine_ceilings/magazine/1015


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## Brian C (Oct 8, 2011)

I remember back 37 years ago when I was a young apprentice, this stuff was a common problem for old school painters .My old boss would get a can of oil based undercoat and add a pint of linseed oil and mix it in well. This was applied to the kalsomine and left to dry for a few days to bind it back well. 
I know there are better products available that would work these-days.


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## jason123 (Jul 2, 2009)

All the man is trying to do is slap some gosh darned paint on the wall and he get this. Sounds like a job for stinky paint.


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## Criard (Nov 23, 2013)

Took a few days to finish the scraping. Then I wiped down the excess chalk from the walls and put on two coats of Gardz. Definitely did the trick so seal up the chalkiness. 

Just have to skim patch a few spots, Gardz those, and then I can finally prime and paint.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

Criard said:


> Took a few days to finish the scraping. Then I wiped down the excess chalk from the walls and put on two coats of Gardz. Definitely did the trick so seal up the chalkiness.
> 
> Just have to skim patch a few spots, Gardz those, and then I can finally prime and paint.


 
Gardz IS a primer, so maybe you really don't have to prime again( unless you need a white base)


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## Criard (Nov 23, 2013)

I did need an even base as there some color differences in the bottom coat, also needed a tinted primer as I was using a neutral base green with minimal hiding, and also wanted to fill in some of the hairline cracks without skim coating. 2 coats of 1-2-3 did it.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

It's not unheard of that calcimine was used on walls - I've even seen it on woodwork.

If it's on the walls, I would be surprised it it's NOT on the ceiling

Wash, wash, wash. We found the only REAL solution was to wash it repeatedly until as much is off as possible, and then wash it again. Too often we seen failures with cal-coaters even with thorough washings

The Big Z says that Gardz is a good cal-coater, I've had not satisfactory results with it. And I'm not sure with the VOC laws a good old fashion cal-coater is still made. 

Although not always practical on walls, we found the best fix was overlay with 3/8 sheetrock. 

Calcimine is a bitch if you want to paint , and there's no way around that .


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