# How to convert a Behr lover?



## getrex (Feb 13, 2017)

So I have a lady that wants her whole house done but she can only afford to do one room at a time. This is my wife's friend so... whatever. But she loves Behr because "it looks better" and because it uses a clay base which is supposed to be better... ad nauseam.

Long story short, I want to push her into the BM camp but I don't get any discount there. Was looking for suggestions. I'm thinking Natura but I don't know what that compares to in the SW lineup.

Thanks.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

So part of the dilemma seems to be the cost. It appears she'll be paying more for the BM. How do you get a homeowner to shift from an inferior product to a superior product when all they have to go on is the color and finish? Which to the untrained eye, appears to be the same, albeit at different costs.

There may have to be a carrot to coax this bunny. Maybe eat the the extra cost for BM on the first room (make it the one with the least amount of work) once you've demonstrated how superior it is, in terms of speed of application, less coats, better color and sheen, you charge her your normal rate for labor and quality material on the remaining rooms. 

And if there's a problem with her not liking the name of the BM color as much as she does the BEHR,( people can be extremely influenced by a name) simply make something up. Like, "This BM Pigeon Gray, should be called Dove Wing, or Shade of Love".


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## loaded brush (Dec 27, 2007)

Use Ultra 500 or Ben. At contractors cost it is around the same price as Behr and even less.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

loaded brush said:


> Use Ultra 500 or Ben. At contractors cost it is around the same price as Behr and even less.


He doesn't get a contractor's discount. And as far as Ben, I found the matte finish to mar real easily. Do you think Aura would be better?


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

I wish I knew the answer to this. If I did I could have been president of PPG by now. They have rooms full of people and spend millions of dollars to find the answer you seek. I would simply paint a piece of drawdown card (ask SW for a few) with the BM product you are planning on using and paint another card with whatever Behr hack paint she wants to use and just tell her to run her hand on them when they are dry. If she is so stupid that she still wants behr after that then there isn't much you can do. But i would suggest raising your price if you have to use behr to compensate you for the problems you are going to have when you use it.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

and "clay based"? Every idiot knows that clay is the cheapest paint pigment there is! Ask her if you can go dig up some clay and make the paint yourself if she is that stupid.


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## SWPB (Oct 6, 2016)

Your real issue is that you don't have a relationship with the local BM rep or retailer(s). I asked my rep who covered that area and apparently, it's a former S-W guy named Jesse Ramos (423-618-9162). I hear he's solid & bilingual. Maybe he could help you with pricing by working on your behalf?


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## SWPB (Oct 6, 2016)

Side Bar: Ben is the line used to go after Big Box. However, I would further qualify her needs (wash ability, major color change?). May need to use Regal Select for wash ability or Natura for anyone sensitive to odors / emissions.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

SWPB said:


> Your real issue is that you don't have a relationship with the local BM rep or retailer(s). I asked my rep who covered that area and apparently, it's a former S-W guy named Jesse Ramos (423-618-9162). I hear he's solid & bilingual. Maybe he could help you with pricing by working on your behalf?


God that name sounds familiar to me for some reason!


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

getrex said:


> How to convert a Behr lover?


******


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## stl911 (Jul 16, 2014)

Natura is designed for nursery room or people has allergy to paint. it is high end product with no smell. it costs more than regal. To me, it is SW harmony with no smell, but It covers way better than SW always. my pricing always includes paint so the customer does not have option to go with other brand or i will not take the job if they insist with certain brand that i am not familiar with. but, i have tried behr several time in the past and i dont see any issue and they cover pretty good also.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

RH said:


> ******


Oh come on! That's a little over the top don't you think?........


I'd use a .22. The bullets are a lot cheaper.:devil3:


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## loaded brush (Dec 27, 2007)

CApainter said:


> He doesn't get a contractor's discount. And as far as Ben, I found the matte finish to mar real easily. Do you think Aura would be better?


 Personally I have never used a flat or matte on walls. Always eggshell on walls. For me flat is strictly for ceilings and as far as matte, it flashes and touches up horribly. Could do away with that finish and I don't think many would miss it.


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

Any matte is gonna mar easily. Only time I use flat on walls is if I'm painting for decorinas who insist or elderly people with no grandchildren or pets.

Ben, eggshell. If you're on a budget.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

loaded brush said:


> Personally I have never used a flat or matte on walls. Always eggshell on walls. For me flat is strictly for ceilings and as far as matte, it flashes and touches up horribly. Could do away with that finish and I don't think many would miss it.


It could be regional, but flat has been a standard on walls in at least residential homes in the SF Bay Area for as long as I can remember. It may have to do with the popularity of skip textured walls of the 60's, to the spray textured walls of the 80's, through 90's. The matte finish does tend to hide imperfections very well, and also provides a nice soft non reflective finish that uniquely projects color without glare. It is also a nice complement to semi gloss trim work.

But as far as maintenance, it is the worst. The Aura matte finish marred the least of all the flats I've used. And lastly, flat is by far faster to apply and the most forgiving of sheens. This is why it is still a popular finish for builders out here.


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## getrex (Feb 13, 2017)

CApainter said:


> There may have to be a carrot to coax this bunny. Maybe eat the the extra cost for BM on the first room (make it the one with the least amount of work) once you've demonstrated how superior it is, in terms of speed of application, less coats, better color and sheen, you charge her your normal rate for labor and quality material on the remaining rooms.
> 
> And if there's a problem with her not liking the name of the BM color as much as she does the BEHR,( people can be extremely influenced by a name) simply make something up. Like, "This BM Pigeon Gray, should be called Dove Wing, or Shade of Love".




The only room that will be easy to do is the basement. She wants accent walls almost everywhere. Kinda sucks but I'm getting paid. I've already done two bedrooms, one with ppu and one with marquee. Maybe I can convince her to try Natura or Ben in the kitchen.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

CApainter said:


> It could be regional, but flat has been a standard on walls in at least residential homes in the SF Bay Area for as long as I can remember. It may have to do with the popularity of skip textured walls of the 60's, to the spray textured walls of the 80's, through 90's. The matte finish does tend to hide imperfections very well, and also provides a nice soft non reflective finish that uniquely projects color without glare. It is also a nice complement to semi gloss trim work.
> 
> But as far as maintenance, it is the worst. The Aura matte finish marred the least of all the flats I've used. And lastly, flat is by far faster to apply and the most forgiving of sheens. This is why it is still a popular finish for builders out here.


 
Must be, it's mostly all I ever use.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

chrisn said:


> Must be, it's mostly all I ever use.


What flat do you prefer. I seem to gravitate towards Kelly Moore 550 flat. But it does have a tendency to smell strange in certain environments and if it's stored too long. I don't use Aura as much as I would like. And as much as I like the application of Ben, it doesn't seem to stand up against marring to well. A mosquito could scuff that stuff.


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## NACE (May 16, 2008)

Compare spread rates. Behr data sheet says 250 sq ft per gallon. BM. 375-425 depending on product. Buy two of theirs or one of BM. I can spend a little more for BM, and use one gallon, or the labor and expense to put on two of Behr. Which would you prefer ma'am?


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

NACE said:


> Compare spread rates. Behr data sheet says 250 sq ft per gallon. BM. 375-425 depending on product. Buy two of theirs or one of BM. I can spend a little more for BM, and use one gallon, or the labor and expense to put on two of Behr. Which would you prefer ma'am?


Is this because the BEHR product has a higher SBV% than the BM? And is a higher SBV% necessarily an added value to the performance of a flat interior paint for example?


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

Ask her if she wants a diy finish or a professional finish.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## loaded brush (Dec 27, 2007)

Textured walls in my neck of the woods are almost nonexistent. Although popcorn and textured ceilings were all rage in the late 60s - early 80s. All walls here either plaster or drywall. Anyways eggshell on walls provide good durability to withstand daily living. For me it's an elegant finish on smooth walls.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

Wildbill7145 said:


> Any matte is gonna mar easily. Only time I use flat on walls is if I'm painting for decorinas who insist or elderly people with no grandchildren or pets.
> 
> Ben, eggshell. If you're on a budget.


In Canada, doesn't flat mean a dead flat like ceiling paint? Here, matte is slight sheen.

I almost always use Aura and sometime Regal Matte and only a couple clients that are very hard on walls have ever had any issues.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

CApainter said:


> What flat do you prefer. I seem to gravitate towards Kelly Moore 550 flat. But it does have a tendency to smell strange in certain environments and if it's stored too long. I don't use Aura as much as I would like. And as much as I like the application of Ben, it doesn't seem to stand up against marring to well. A mosquito could scuff that stuff.


I PREFERE Regal, but mostly use PPG's Manor Hall


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## NACE (May 16, 2008)

@;


CApainter said:


> Is this because the BEHR product has a higher SBV% than the BM? And is a higher SBV% necessarily an added value to the performance of a flat interior paint for example?


It's actually reology. High Shear Viscosity versus Low Shear. Proprietary resins versus cheaper commodity raw materials.


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

DeanV said:


> In Canada, doesn't flat mean a dead flat like ceiling paint? Here, matte is slight sheen.
> 
> I almost always use Aura and sometime Regal Matte and only a couple clients that are very hard on walls have ever had any issues.


I'd have to assume so. All the flats I've used are dead flat. I honestly can't remember using any paint that was labelled as matte.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

NACE said:


> @;
> 
> It's actually reology. High Shear Viscosity versus Low Shear. Proprietary resins versus cheaper commodity raw materials.


I find the reology of the behr products in general to be quite amazing. How they can get something to be so viscous in the can be so runny on the brush and the wall is beyond my level of training. An yet drag like an sob when you are brushing it. Amazing how they can get their paint to preform so badly just to be able to make people think it hides well and is "thicker". They've obviously put some thought into how to do this and keep their prices so low! Lots of engineering in that can, but for all the wrong reasons.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Wildbill7145 said:


> I'd have to assume so. All the flats I've used are dead flat. I honestly can't remember using any paint that was labelled as matte.


In the Cali lines "flat" means dead flat and "matte" has a very slight side sheen. I sell much more matte then i do flat, although i don't sell many production new house painters. When i sold to M/I and Dominion homes they never used anything but dead flat on nc.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

NACE said:


> @;
> 
> It's actually reology. High Shear Viscosity versus Low Shear. Proprietary resins versus cheaper commodity raw materials.


Well, I always knew painting had a lot to do with your personality.


I had the same impression in terms of SBV% not necessarily improving the performance of a paint. But it's one of the deceptions of a TDS. We think high solids and therefore the paint must be good. When in fact, the crucial performance properties are in the resin and binders. So your example of BM vs. BEHR is a good one. Less paint and higher quality with BM while providing ease of application. That's worth twenty bucks more a gallon.


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## getrex (Feb 13, 2017)

Everything is going eggshell. A dark brown and dark green throughout the house. I agree with PAC though... this stuff drags amazingly well.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

chrisn said:


> I PREFERE Regal, but mostly use PPG's Manor Hall


I've never tried Regal interior flat, but for over fifteen years now, Regal Pearl has been my standard interior paint for commercial settings. I typically bump it up to PPG Pitt Tech Plus for light industrial.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

getrex said:


> Everything is going eggshell. A dark brown and dark green throughout the house. I agree with PAC though... this stuff drags amazingly well.


Good luck. Last time I used BEHR eggshell in a forest green, it went through some sort of metamorphous. 

First stage, it went on amazingly.

Next stage it began oozing little oily droplets everywhere. After wiping all that off once it dried, if you can call it that, the third stage continued with a long period of suspended curing where everything stuck to it, dust, hair, etc. (this was in a bathroom BTW).

The final stage sadly came to a close when I tried to use a mild cleanser to clean the walls. It looked like I sprayed Clorox on a new pair of 501 jeans. It immediately created permant streaking on the wall right next to the toilet where the toilet paper hangs. Now, it looks as if I have trouble aiming. Very embarrassing BEHR!lain:


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

That's why I hate using the stuff. It seems like it's consistently inconsistent. You never know what's gonna happen when you start piling that stuff on. As soon as you open the can you're rolling the dice. I've had it work very well and I've had it work horribly.

When I gamble, I like to do it with cards on a poker table.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

Did a bid earlier this week where the HO was singing the praises of Behr ("We did one coat of a light yellow over a dark forest green and it was fine." riiiiiight). I explained why I didn't care for it or use it and then gave em' my bid which was for two coats since an extreme color change was involved. Her response was, "Wouldn't it be cheaper if we used Behr and just did one coat?" Sigh...


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Wildbill7145 said:


> That's why I hate using the stuff. It seems like it's consistently inconsistent. You never know what's gonna happen when you start piling that stuff on. As soon as you open the can you're rolling the dice. I've had it work very well and I've had it work horribly.
> 
> When I gamble, I like to do it with cards on a poker table.


The important issue I have with Big box paint, is in it's convenience. Even as a professional painter, who supposedly knows better, I will grab their paint while I shop for the lumber or drywall I need. 

If I were a lab rat and the experiment was either to go through a gauntlet of tubes, wheels, and beams to get to the tastier cheese, or take the ten short steps to the bland cheese, I would be eating the bland cheese every time. Despite having been exposed to the tastier cheese!


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

CApainter said:


> The important issue I have with Big box paint, is in it's convenience. Even as a professional painter, who supposedly knows better, I will grab their paint while I shop for the lumber or drywall I need.
> 
> If I were a lab rat and the experiment was either to go through a gauntlet of tubes, wheels, and beams to get to the tastier cheese, or take the ten short steps to the bland cheese, I would be eating the bland cheese every time. Despite having been exposed to the tastier cheese!


Whelp, I know what you mean about one stop shopping. I've heard enough of that over the years from GCs who buy their painter's paint from the same lumber yard they get everything else from. Then complain at the painter for stuff not looking as good as he wants it to.

"You're the painter! Figure it out! No, we're not changing paint! Those guys give me a big discount!"

I'm done with those days.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

Wildbill7145 said:


> I'd have to assume so. All the flats I've used are dead flat. I honestly can't remember using any paint that was labelled as matte.


Shoot. I meant to say "doesn't MATTE mean true flat in Canada." I think I remember GeorgeZ or someone saying that what the US calls flat (no sheen at all) is labelled matte in Canada. Maybe just Quebec or some French speaking area.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

As much as I dont like Behr, I dont see why you guys think its takes more coats of paint on the wall, providing its not their $12 a gallon contractor garbage, or a bright red in an ultradeep base or something. I roll two coats no matter what. Sometimes it looks like it doesnt need another coat, but I do it anyway. I've found anything Behr with a sheen is 'snotty' and likes to run, sag and drag, but after its said and done, I really dont see a difference from it, or any other paint. I've never had a coverage issue with it though. Trim, of course is a whole other story...

But, I can usually talk my clients out of Behr, cuz I tell them I can get better paint for cheaper, and they have always believed me. But, when I have to use it, I dont see a problem, other than the way it lays down during application.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

RH said:


> Did a bid earlier this week where the HO was singing the praises of Behr ("We did one coat of a light yellow over a dark forest green and it was fine." riiiiiight). I explained why I didn't care for it or use it and then gave em' my bid which was for two coats since an extreme color change was involved. Her response was, "Wouldn't it be cheaper if we used Behr and just did one coat?" Sigh...[/QUOTE]
> 
> 
> times 10!


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## slinger58 (Feb 11, 2013)

Usually one "Paint buying experience" from Home Depot will cure a person from ever wanting to repeat it. I know it cured me before I ever opened a can of Behr. But I guess a lot of DIYers figure a 45 minute wait to find someone to come to the paint counter to screw up a 2 gallon order is normal. Finally getting it home and attempting to spread tinted clay on the wall is just the frosting on the cake.:vs_laugh:


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## getrex (Feb 13, 2017)

CApainter said:


> Good luck. Last time I used BEHR eggshell in a forest green, it went through some sort of metamorphous.
> 
> First stage, it went on amazingly.
> 
> ...




I didn't have too many issues with it. The biggest issue is making sure you shake up the can or otherwise mix it at the beginning of each new day on the job. The colorant sucks. 😂

Oh, I will say this.... Behr trim paint is the worst.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

getrex said:


> I didn't have too many issues with it. The biggest issue is making sure you shake up the can or otherwise mix it at the beginning of each new day on the job. The colorant sucks. &#55357;&#56834;
> 
> Oh, I will say this.... Behr trim paint is the worst.[/QUOTE]
> 
> nobody can question that statement


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

Wildbill7145 said:


> I'd have to assume so. All the flats I've used are dead flat. I honestly can't remember using any paint that was labelled as matte.


Kinda new one for me too til the last few years. I always considered "Flat" a dead flat too. From what I've seen, "Matte" has a slight sheen. I use a Northwest local brand "Miller Paint" and their interior "Matte" is labled as "Paper" That one really throws me off. Exterior "Matte" labled as "Velvet" Both are pretty much my most popular choices both interior and exterior. 10 or 15 years ago everyone wanted satin on interior walls and now not so much. They want a matte finish. Exterior too. I was putting satin on HardiPlank for years and now nobody seems to care for that high a sheen anymore. They want matte 

http://thecolorevolution.com/our-paint.html

http://www.millerpaint.com/miller-exterior-paints/262-acri-lite.html


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## TKbrush (Dec 30, 2014)

I think ben moore ultra spec and behr are very similar paints at this point. I am guessing ben moore reformulated the ultra spec awhile back to match behr paint, with the consumer report ratings. For a zero voc paint, the ultra spec definitely suddenly smelled like behr paint and jumped up a few notches in quality and price, from what it was.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Clarification please*



TKbrush said:


> I think ben moore ultra spec and behr are very similar paints at this point. I am guessing ben moore reformulated the ultra spec awhile back to match behr paint, with the consumer report ratings. For a zero voc paint, the ultra spec definitely suddenly smelled like behr paint and jumped up a few notches in quality and price, from what it was.


I try not to comment too much on things I don't have that much experience with. I have most of my current experience (since I got back into painting in 2012) with Behr. The GC at the Chicago hi rises I work for uses Behr as his default paint unless customers specify otherwise. We did a job 2 years ago where the customer spec'd BM colors. The GC decided to get the paint in BM Ultra Spec without consulting me! Heavens! Having a premonition about this, I pleaded with him to at least get the trim paint in Regal Select.

My premonition came true. I hate Ultra Spec! I found that i can put marks in it just by looking at it too long! Obviously an exaggeration, but I did have to repaint a couple walls 3 times because of dings and blemishes to a degree that i have not experienced when using Behr PP or PPU. The ceiling paint was okay, but who goes around scuffing ceiling paint?

Ultra Spec is a tier of BM paint. Behr has 4 tiers I know of, Marquee at the top, then Premium Plus Ultra, then Premium Plus, then Behr Pro. What tier of Behr paint are you comparing Ultra Spec to?

futtyos

P.S. I painted the condo in question in May of 2015. Are you saying that BM reformulated Ultra Spec since then?


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*What trim paint?*



getrex said:


> I didn't have too many issues with it. The biggest issue is making sure you shake up the can or otherwise mix it at the beginning of each new day on the job. The colorant sucks. 😂
> 
> Oh, I will say this.... Behr trim paint is the worst.


Behr trim paint? I am familiar with Behr Pro, Behr Premium Plus, Behr Premium Plus Ultra and Behr Marquee. Which of these tiers of Behr paint are you referring to?

futtyos


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

chrisn said:


> getrex said:
> 
> 
> > I didn't have too many issues with it. The biggest issue is making sure you shake up the can or otherwise mix it at the beginning of each new day on the job. The colorant sucks. ��
> ...


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## TKbrush (Dec 30, 2014)

futtyos said:


> I try not to comment too much on things I don't have that much experience with. I have most of my current experience (since I got back into painting in 2012) with Behr. The GC at the Chicago hi rises I work for uses Behr as his default paint unless customers specify otherwise. We did a job 2 years ago where the customer spec'd BM colors. The GC decided to get the paint in BM Ultra Spec without consulting me! Heavens! Having a premonition about this, I pleaded with him to at least get the trim paint in Regal Select.
> 
> My premonition came true. I hate Ultra Spec! I found that i can put marks in it just by looking at it too long! Obviously an exaggeration, but I did have to repaint a couple walls 3 times because of dings and blemishes to a degree that i have not experienced when using Behr PP or PPU. The ceiling paint was okay, but who goes around scuffing ceiling paint?
> 
> ...




I am referring to behr premium plus. Yeah ultra spec is not the best to paint with, but if they consolodated the eco spec and super spec into the ultra spec, i think they did a good job...now they have to get rid of ben...and regal original.
Very interesting about the tier and quality levels.
Hopefully, in the future they will consoldate and have less tiers.
This way the highest quality paints can become the most common. 
Again, i was "guessing" on my opinion of ben moore ultra spec, suddenly smelling and painting like behr prem plus, for a few years now.


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

TKbrush said:


> I am referring to behr premium plus. Yeah ultra spec is not the best to paint with, but if they consolodated the eco spec and super spec into the ultra spec, i think they did a good job...now they have to get rid of ben...and regal original.
> Very interesting about the tier and quality levels.
> Hopefully, in the future they will consoldate and have less tiers.
> This way the highest quality paints can become the most common.
> Again, i was "guessing" on my opinion of ben moore ultra spec, suddenly smelling and painting like behr prem plus, for a few years now.


Maybe they want you to experience these kind of tears!


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## getrex (Feb 13, 2017)

futtyos said:


> Behr trim paint? I am familiar with Behr Pro, Behr Premium Plus, Behr Premium Plus Ultra and Behr Marquee. Which of these tiers of Behr paint are you referring to?
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I've used PPU and Marquee.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

futtyos said:


> chrisn said:
> 
> 
> > Chrisn, see post #46 where I question what tier of Behr paint getrex is referring to.
> ...


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

chrisn said:


> futtyos said:
> 
> 
> > ALL of them
> ...


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## slinger58 (Feb 11, 2013)

I remember that movie.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## ColorTheEarth (Feb 16, 2017)

Behr paint is actually very good, if you stick to their top lines. In fact, Ultra Plus Premium and Marquee cover much better than Sherwin Williams, at about half the price versus SW upper-end products. Behr works especially well on deep, saturated colors that otherwise need two coats. I've done fuchsia over stark white in one coat, aside from cut-in areas (which the brush always streaks a bit.)

If you go down into Behr's contractor grades, however, the quality drops off much faster than the price. Ben Moore is great paint in all the upper half of its products, but yes, the cost will be higher.


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## getrex (Feb 13, 2017)

That would be a negatory.. on multiple counts. For one thing... the brush won't leave streaks if you are brushing correctly... and second.. Behr is sh!t.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Comparing Behr quality to SW quality is like trying to compare a Ford truck to a Chevy truck. Only the Chevy truck costs twice as much but is sold in a gold and diamond bedazzled dealership. If you want to compare Behr with something that has any actual quality, you'll have to do a lot better than SW or Valspar! Ford-chevy-dodge, not much difference. Now throw in BMW-Mercedes Benz-Porsche. See my point? Especially if you can buy a BMW-MB-Porsche for the same price as a Chevy!


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

getrex said:


> That would be a negatory.. on multiple counts. For one thing... the brush won't leave streaks if you are brushing correctly... and second.. Behr is sh!t.


Actual side by side testing by trained professionals has proven this without any doubt. Unless you test paint in completely identical circumstances you are not actually going to get accurate results. I challenge ANYONE to do a side by side test using identical applicators and an identical substrate of any Behr product against a quality brand such as Ben Moore, California, P&L, and many others and then HONESTLY say that the Behr is a better product. I will provide drywall or wood or any other substrate AND identical brushes and rollers to anyone willing to do a side by side test of Behr and a paint of my choosing in the same price range. All the winner gets is to NEVER hear the loser say their paint is the best! And i get to video the test. 

Any takers? Didn't think so. Never will be.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

And fyi, I can still peal the Marquee off the drywall primer where i painted out a test patch 2 months ago. And off bare drywall that i painted with it at the same time. Good stuff.


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## getrex (Feb 13, 2017)

Behr is basically rubber with a sh!tty colored play dough for tint.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Anyone that opens a can of Marquee interior flat, sees how ridiculously runny it is, and isn't convinced to use something else probably deserves to use it, and doesn't have the two IQ points to rub together to realize it is crap paint.


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

getrex said:


> So I have a lady that wants her whole house done but she can only afford to do one room at a time. This is my wife's friend so... whatever. But she loves Behr because "it looks better" and because it uses a clay base which is supposed to be better... ad nauseam.
> 
> Long story short, I want to push her into the BM camp but I don't get any discount there. Was looking for suggestions. I'm thinking Natura but I don't know what that compares to in the SW lineup.
> 
> Thanks.


Take her to a priest or rabbi for the conversion, ask Behr which religion they are!


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## getrex (Feb 13, 2017)

Pretty sure they are terrorists.


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

Tell her if you want a professional job, you'll be using professional products.


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## loaded brush (Dec 27, 2007)

Bottom line. The public likes Behr. Proof is in their sales. A lot of homeowners can't justify $60-$75 a gallon of paint from Benjamin Moore or Sherwin-Williams. They don't care about better ingredients, or designer brands. For them it's priced right, gets the job done, and have the convenience of HD being everywhere. Let's face it, there are a lot more homeowners in this world than are painting contractors, so their sales will never dwindle. All the reasons professionals use Benjamin Moore, Sherwin Williams, PPG and the like, are not pertinent to the HO. We use these products every day and have to have certain expectations met by the products we use. But for the homeowner, who paints once a year, Behr, Duth Boy, Valspar, Olympic, and any other lower tiered brand offered at the home centers, works just fine for them.


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## Toolseeker (May 25, 2017)

What I like is standing at the paint counter for 40 minutes while the little old lady decides between Navajo White and Linen White, While the orange apron tells them all about paint and primer in one. Just my opinion but walls painted with flat always look like they are dull and need painted.


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