# Closing off side walks



## Epoxy Pro

This current RRP job I have been closing the side walks off around the front and side of the house. 

Today a gentleman walking his dog asked to speak to me. He asked me who I thought I was closing off the side walks. I explained to him we are removing lead paint and have to close the side walk off, He asked me if I had my permits all in order :blink:, I said what permits, he said to close down a side walk I needed one. I said no I do not, he then said who gave you the authority to make that call. I said the state of Ma, EPA and feds as we are following all their rules for lead work. He then said I am calling the building inspector. I said honestly he can't do any thing about this. I gave him our inspectors phone number, the 800 number and said to call them with any concerns if he isn't happy with my answer. Down the road was a cop doing a detail, the guy went to the cop and complained. The cop and guy came back over, I explained to the cop what we were doing and he said ok keep on working. That guy got pissed. He said he was calling the inspector to file a complaint. I then said I will call him right now for you sir if you would like, so I called the inspector. The inspector said Dave keep doing what your doing I drive by every day and see your following the rules like you should be.

This is a pretty active street for people walking, driving traffic not so much. I have been here for a week and see every one walk by numerous times a day, this guy I haven't seen before and come to find out he lives on the other side of the city. When I found that out I was at a loss of words. This job is for the ex mayor of the city. I informed her just incase that guy was going to knock on her door. She said who gives a  what that guys problem is just keep doing the great job your doing.


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## RH

Carry on. He would also be the one suing you because his dog got lead poisoning off the sidewalks.


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## Epoxy Pro

RH said:


> Carry on. He would also be the one suing you because his dog got lead poisoning off the sidewalks.


His dog seemed smarter than he was.


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## oldccm

Been there done that. Oddly enough in Winnipeg I do have to pull a sidewalk permit. Allows me to close sidewalk and up to one lane of traffic. Cost is about $90 (must be at least 2 lanes flowing in direction I want to close 1. Any more lanes I have to hire a company to direct traffic).


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## Red dog

Some people get joy out of causing others problems. I never will figure out why. Glad you didn't have any problem handling this jerk.


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## Roamer

We have to pull sidwalk permits if we inhibit anyone's egress. In Alexandria VA, it costs $200.00. Closing the sidewalks means barricading the jobsite so no one can pass through and also installing signage on A-frame barricades at each corner of the block with directions as to where to cross the street to avoid our jobsite.


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## Epoxy Pro

Roamer said:


> We have to pull sidwalk permits if we inhibit anyone's egress. In Alexandria VA, it costs $200.00. Closing the sidewalks means barricading the jobsite so no one can pass through and also installing signage on A-frame barricades at each corner of the block with directions as to where to cross the street to avoid our jobsite.


If we were working in the downtown section we would have to do the same. 90% of the traffic I see every day is people walking.


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## Epoxy Pro

Using the paint shaver on a trim board the paint is so thick it was bogging down. I adjusted the blades to only take some off then adjusted to take the rest off. This is the thickest paint I have ever seen. 

All the trim was originally black. What ever this paint is with in 30-40 seconds the sanding disc is smeared with the black paint stuff.

We have tried Smartstrip, Peel Away, 5f5, and some other liquid stripper. We let the paste strippers sit over night, put on nice and heavy. It did nothing, took the top layer or 2 off.

Liquid strippers we applied as instructions said and same thing 1 or 2 layers at a time. We let it soak for 30 mins, put it on so it was dang near running off and all we got was 2 layers at a time.

The Festool are struggling with 24 grit, the RO90 felt like it was going to catch on fire. Just the front entry alone we used a box of 25-24 grit pads. We adjusted the speeds but same thing.

Speedheater isn't doing much any faster.

The HO was watching us and couldn't believe how hard that damn paint was coming off.

I'm at a loss on this one.


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## chrisn

bummer


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## ReNt A PaInTeR

cdpainting said:


> Using the paint shaver on a trim board the paint is so thick it was bogging down. I adjusted the blades to only take some off then adjusted to take the rest off. This is the thickest paint I have ever seen.
> 
> All the trim was originally black. What ever this paint is with in 30-40 seconds the sanding disc is smeared with the black paint stuff.
> 
> We have tried Smartstrip, Peel Away, 5f5, and some other liquid stripper. We let the paste strippers sit over night, put on nice and heavy. It did nothing, took the top layer or 2 off.
> 
> Liquid strippers we applied as instructions said and same thing 1 or 2 layers at a time. We let it soak for 30 mins, put it on so it was dang near running off and all we got was 2 layers at a time.
> 
> The Festool are struggling with 24 grit, the RO90 felt like it was going to catch on fire. Just the front entry alone we used a box of 25-24 grit pads. We adjusted the speeds but same thing.
> 
> Speedheater isn't doing much any faster.
> 
> The HO was watching us and couldn't believe how hard that damn paint was coming off.
> 
> I'm at a loss on this one.


Just tell the homeowner that instead of $6800 you made a mistake when you bid the job and is supposed to be $10,000 :whistling2:


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## Jmayspaint

ReNt A PaInTeR said:


> Just tell the homeowner that instead of $6800 you made a mistake when you bid the job and is supposed to be $10,000 :whistling2:



Better yet, a clerical error was made and it's really $68,000


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## dan-o

If the trim is just basic trim stock, why not just rip it off and replace with new?
Cheaper, faster, will look better.


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## straight_lines

cdpainting said:


> Using the paint shaver on a trim board the paint is so thick it was bogging down. I adjusted the blades to only take some off then adjusted to take the rest off. This is the thickest paint I have ever seen.
> 
> All the trim was originally black. What ever this paint is with in 30-40 seconds the sanding disc is smeared with the black paint stuff.
> 
> We have tried Smartstrip, Peel Away, 5f5, and some other liquid stripper. We let the paste strippers sit over night, put on nice and heavy. It did nothing, took the top layer or 2 off.
> 
> Liquid strippers we applied as instructions said and same thing 1 or 2 layers at a time. We let it soak for 30 mins, put it on so it was dang near running off and all we got was 2 layers at a time.
> 
> The Festool are struggling with 24 grit, the RO90 felt like it was going to catch on fire. Just the front entry alone we used a box of 25-24 grit pads. We adjusted the speeds but same thing.
> 
> Speedheater isn't doing much any faster.
> 
> The HO was watching us and couldn't believe how hard that damn paint was coming off.
> 
> I'm at a loss on this one.


Sounds like the stuff of nightmares. When you bid a full strip do you do any testing to get an idea of what production would be?


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## Red dog

straight_lines said:


> Sounds like the stuff of nightmares. When you bid a full strip do you do any testing to get an idea of what production would be?


I was wondering the same thing. I guess if you have done enough of therm you just sorta know.


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## Gough

Red dog said:


> I was wondering the same thing. I guess if you have done enough of therm you just sorta know.


We generally have a pretty good idea, but every once in a while.... One church had an odd coating, stripping the paint took about 10x as long as usual.

When we've looked at removal jobs that seem unusual, we try to do a test patch to come up with better numbers.


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## straight_lines

Its a complete crapshoot what we see the thickness it was applied and how sound it is. I just can't see guessing on a large scale removal. 

You can pull a section of coating off and send it for testing I suppose. DFT percentage of lead.


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## Gough

straight_lines said:


> Its a complete crapshoot what we see the thickness it was applied and how sound it is. I just can't see guessing on a large scale removal.
> 
> You can pull a section of coating off and send it for testing I suppose. DFT percentage of lead.


We routinely take samples in for testing, the lead levels don't seem to have all that much impact on removal difficulty. It's the oddball coatings that are so time consuming in our experience.


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## Epoxy Pro

Gough said:


> We routinely take samples in for testing, the lead levels don't seem to have all that much impact on removal difficulty. It's the oddball coatings that are so time consuming in our experience.


The way this is coming off I almost want to say it may be some sort of epoxy. I could be wrong, I have yet to remove epoxy so I don't know how hard that would be.

As for a test strip area no we didn't try. Looking at this house the paint was dang near falling off.

What ever it is it's beating me. I don't like it. Oh well all we can do it keep plugging away.


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## Epoxy Pro

dan-o said:


> If the trim is just basic trim stock, why not just rip it off and replace with new?
> Cheaper, faster, will look better.


Why would you want to replace wood that's nearly 200 yrs old and in great shape (other than that paint bonding like no other). Even the siding that needs replacement it is all going to be reclaimed or custom made. No HD crap going on this house.


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## Epoxy Pro

ReNt A PaInTeR said:


> Just tell the homeowner that instead of $6800 you made a mistake when you bid the job and is supposed to be $10,000 :whistling2:


 After talking to the HO last night they said they will pay us a fair rate for going over the time I figured. I didn't ask they offered.


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## dan-o

cdpainting said:


> Why would you want to replace wood that's nearly 200 yrs old and in great shape (other than that paint bonding like no other). Even the siding that needs replacement it is all going to be reclaimed or custom made. No HD crap going on this house.


Where did I say HD crap?
If you recall I told you where to look for replacement claps for that job.
There are plenty of places to get any profile trim reproduced in high quality wood. Not cheap but no more expensive than burning through unanticipated hours, chemicals and tools like you're doing.

When does this get merged with the 'bid too low' thread?


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## straight_lines

dan-o said:


> Where did I say HD crap?
> If you recall I told you where to look for replacement claps for that job.
> There are plenty of places to get any profile trim reproduced in high quality wood. Not cheap but no more expensive than burning through unanticipated hours, chemicals and tools like you're doing.
> 
> When does this get merged with the 'bid too low' thread?


Unless there are historical society governances I agree with you. Do the math and if replacement is cheaper or the same price its irresponsible not to. I know homes are a lot different up there, but most of the higher end restorations we do get azek for a lot of the trim without details.


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## dan-o

straight_lines said:


> Unless there are historical society governances I agree with you. Do the math and if replacement is cheaper or the same price its irresponsible not to. I know homes are a lot different up there, but most of the higher end restorations we do get azek for a lot of the trim without details.


We can't use aZek in historic districts, though this house probably isn't in one if outside town center. The hysterical districts here want these seaside houses to rot authentically.


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## Epoxy Pro

dan-o said:


> Where did I say HD crap?
> If you recall I told you where to look for replacement claps for that job.
> There are plenty of places to get any profile trim reproduced in high quality wood. Not cheap but no more expensive than burning through unanticipated hours, chemicals and tools like you're doing.
> 
> When does this get merged with the 'bid too low' thread?


I miss understood your post, I thought you were saying to reside it with cheap stuff lol.

As for starting a bid to low thread any one of you would have run into this. I have stripped many houses and never saw this coming. The HO's already said they will take care of us for the overage. So it isn't as bad. Also We will only be a hundred or 2 over. Not to bad for a complete strip job.


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## Gough

dan-o said:


> We can't use aZek in historic districts, though this house probably isn't in one if outside town center. The hysterical districts here want these seaside houses to rot authentically.


This seems to come up a lot. Local standards do vary, but most of them follow the Secretary of the Interior's Standard for Treatment of Historic Properties.

" Using traditional materials to depict lost features is always the preferred approach; however, using compatible substitute material is an acceptable alternative in Restoration because, as emphasized, the goal of this treatment is to replicate the "appearance" of the historic building at a particular time, not to retain and preserve all historic materials as they have evolved over time."


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