# Elastomeric Paints



## ewingpainting.net

After helping many members here at PT with Elastomeric paint and issues they were having with it. I am seeing a common misunderstanding on the basic of elastomeric paints. Since starting a blog, I have started a series on elastomeric, the 1st article being the basics of elastomeric coatings and their 3 common quality charaistics. 

To better fit the one researching elastomeric paints, if you have a pacific question on it, please feel free to ask in this thread as other profesionals can weigh in, or you may ask me on my blog.

Ewing Painting Blog and Reviews/Elastomeric Paints


Gabe Ewing
Ewing Painting


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## Sully

Beautiful! Seriously no sooner do I get a lead for my first elastomeric job do I find a thread for pointers. This site is getting better and better. Anyway I've looked up some info and past thread and read your blog. Awesome stuff and lots of great info to be found. I'll be going out tomorrow to look at a four story stucco row home. I believe it's unpainted and that it also connects to another home. So what I'm saying is a line is painted down between the homes.Is this a problem for elastomeric paint? Will that be a future point of failure since the coating isn't wrapping the house? Anything special I should do during cleaning? Can I brush and roll a hybrid or full blown elastomeric with exceptional results. I want to learn as much as possible I will be searching more. Ewing you really know your stuff I can tell can you give me some advice. I'll be posting pictures of what I look at tomorrow. Thank you


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## ewingpainting.net

Thank you for the compliment. I hope to hear others weigh in on this topic as well. 

You are right to ask if it is recommended to apply elastomeric to a surface without wrapping the entire structure. It is possible to apply the right elastomeric without wrapping the entire structure. However, it would have to be in the right environment on the right substrate. I will use this question to add to my next elastomeric article, as I would like to address you questions. 

By what you described I would not use elastomeric, the heavy build nor the hybrid.

The main issue that would concern me is you have a raw substrate on the structure, in this case it is unpainted/sealed stucco. I am assuming it is the entire surface that is raw. Stucco being a cement product is highly absorbent to moisture. The issue at hand will be where the elastomeric surface meets the raw stucco surface (the line you described). 

As the unpainted stucco will absorb moisture, it is possible for moisture to travel under the elastomeric. With a heavy build, it will trap moisture causing the painted side of your line to lift. The strong elongation of the
heavy build can result in bubbles or pealing in sheets. 

Though the hybrid has a higher perm rating allowing moisture to escape, the conditions would make the coating work harder than it would in normal conditions, lessening the longevity of the hybrid elastomeric. If enough moisture gets behind the hybrid, it is still possible for peeling and bubbles to surface. 

I would recommend a high end 100% acrylic flat paint. Like Sherwin Williams Duration or Vista Paint Duraglide.

As far as cleaning, you would clean the surface as you would for a regular paint. Just make sure all the surface is dry and free from moisture as it is more critical with elastomerics.


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## ewingpainting.net

sorry bb double post  delete at will


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## straight_lines

I left some feedback a few days ago check your spam.


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## Sully

Yeah the idea of that coating not wrapping the whole house kinda through up a red flag to me after reading a little bit about it. I've been creeping on google earth to kind of get an idea of what the property looks like before I go to actually look at the job. From what it looks like I'm seeing two houses connected one side unpainted and the other painted. So unless it's just a funky paintjob and he owns the whole of what I'm seeing I'll be recommending MAB Sea Shore with the proper sealing primer for the unpainted stucco.


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## vermontpainter

Nice blog, Gabe.


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## Sully

Here's the job.

































so I asked the HO what he knew about elastomerics and he said not very much other than that his stucco guy had recommended he get an elastomeric paint job instead of patching his house... I informed him that elastomeric paint is great for stucco and mainly used on commercial building. I explained some differences between high build and hybrid elastomeric paint and how both would span cracks and what not. Then I broke the bad news to him and said unfortunately the fact that this is row home and I am unable to paint the entire building I recommend not using the elastomeric. I pointed out that where there is bare block will be the first point of failure due to moisture seepage and that it would peel off in sheets. I also then noticed that the doorway to nothing on the top floor would be an area vulnerable to ballooning. Then I recommended the Acrylic latex Sea Shore paint. He told me he'd like separate estimates for both. He also informed me he didn't plan on keeping the house.


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## ewingpainting.net

You did good, it is a bad candidate for elastomeric, you can see the water run off areas and there is to may open areas. Sounds like he just wants a band aid to sell the place. If he does go with elastomeric, you need to write it in your contract that it is against your recommendations, with no warranty. 

I do want to clarify that the hybrid elastomerics are used on residential. But that sturcture is a bad fit for any elastomerics


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## Sully

ewingpainting.net said:


> You did good, it is a bad candidate for elastomeric, you can see the water run off areas and there is to may open areas. Sounds like he just wants a band aid to sell the place. If he does go with elastomeric, you need to write it in your contract that it is against your recommendations, with no warranty.
> 
> I do want to clarify that the hybrid elastomerics are used on residential. But that sturcture is a bad fit for any elastomerics


I did tell him that the hybrid elastos were made specifically for residential. I'm going to jack the price up on the elasto bid and I'm only going to put it in a letter along with the acrylic bid. I really don't want my name on something that going to fail period. I'll explain to him that a better band aid will be some stucco patch work and a properly primed and painted home at a more reasonable price. He did thank me for all the info and said he'd see what the other two bidders say. i will also explain to him that the only way to remove an elastomeric coating is to sand blast it off. He'd have to be just plain dumb and stubborn not to go with an acrylic paint job. Gabe thanks a bunch for this info. Had you not created this thread I could have been applying elastomeric paint to this home and been up shiites creek once it failed. Instead you've enabled me to know what I'm talking about and steer this HO in the right direction. I owe you brother thank you again. :notworthy:


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## TJ Paint

Sully said:


> Here's the job.


its got an old world look, why change it


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## Sully

TJ Paint said:


> its got an old world look, why change it


I need money  I think the HO is mainly concerned about the crack way up high on the side by the window. He says there are no leaks though.


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## ewingpainting.net

Sully said:


> I need money  I think the HO is mainly concerned about the crack way up high on the side by the window. He says there are no leaks though.


The crack looks like it might be to wide for elastomeric to bridge, being you can see it from where you took the picture. it would still require stucco patching.


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## Sully

ewingpainting.net said:


> The crack looks like it might be to wide for elastomeric to bridge, being you can see it from where you took the picture. it would still require stucco patching.


Agreed. The other crack runs down the whole side. Looks to me like it was already caulked in too. Any recommendations on a good stucco patching compound?


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## ewingpainting.net

I use Rapid Set stucco patch, it has bounders and dryers in it. It cures hard and can be painted over as soon as a hour of applying. you would want to mixs small amount as it sets up fast.


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## STAR

I was hoping you could tell me if this is the right product for this job.

Three storey apartment building all brick never painted. Customer is complaining of moisture problems on interior walls and would like the exterior coated to help keep the moisture out. I had suggested using an elastomeric paint, but would like your professional opinion.
I was planning on powerwashing and applying two coats of Glidden Decra Flex.

Is this a good idea?


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## pinchegordo

I have done upwards of 850 elastomeric jobs in my career 95% residential and 99% stucco. Although I have heard of moisture build up and separation I have never experienced it, it is that rare.its a situation that only arises when there's an improper bond between substrate and primer or primer and elasto.bonding usually only becomes an issue due to applicator error or negligence.I sure miss the old days when elasto was a full blown waterproofing product thick and sexy.... Lol 
For My application process onto stucco I use a 623 tip and a 1.25" nap roller sprayed until rippling on surface then bankrolled down to about 24 wet mils. Once dry this creates an almost impermeable finish and although the formula has changed drastically over the last ten years it is still as close to waterproof as you can get on a stucco substrate. I have applied elasto to wood siding and T-111 and have yet to have any seperation issues.... To me with the proper primer and preparation elasto is almost a fool proof product.... The only issues I've ever had with any elasto product is transparency with straight white and this was easily solved with a medium fog coat applied with a 517 tip.... Just wanted to share my experiences


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## ewingpainting.net

STAR said:


> I was hoping you could tell me if this is the right product for this job.
> 
> Three storey apartment building all brick never painted. Customer is complaining of moisture problems on interior walls and would like the exterior coated to help keep the moisture out. I had suggested using an elastomeric paint, but would like your professional opinion.
> I was planning on powerwashing and applying two coats of Glidden Decra Flex.
> 
> Is this a good idea?


What kind of brick is it? 

Have you determined how the moisture is getting inside? Is it just because the brick is not sealed? 

Decra Flex would be a great candidate, I have used tons of it. Decra Flex shell is harder than other elastomeric. It has a harder shell than most elastomerics, a perm rateing of 12 to allow moisture to escape, it also has a high elongation for a hybrid elastomeric at 200%. I would recommend priming for supior adhesion and higher hold out to efflorescence, then 2 coats of Decra Flex.

Another option you could go, is a product like MONOCHEM ELASTOSEAL which is a clear elastomeric sealer designed for brick. 

Either one you go with you need to add a sealant around windows, pipes, or any other open areas. With the Monochem you would caulk it after you seal, with Decra Flex caulk between the prime coat and 1st top coat, or before the final top coat.


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## ewingpainting.net

Pinche, Vista still makes their full blown elastomeric called Solotex, Frazee still has theirs and Sherwin williams carries it as well. it special order at most stores, most likely it's at least a 50 gal minimum


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## Ole34

sully is that house on Dupont St in Manayunk ??? .........sure looks like it


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## Ole34

BTW whats the deal with priming Stucco ?? Acrylic is self priming der :blink:


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## ewingpainting.net

Ole34 said:


> BTW whats the deal with priming Stucco ?? Acrylic is self priming der :blink:


That's actually a good question
It all depends what you want out of your top coat. I have painted many exterior substrates both with and without primer, years later the results stand for itself. With elastomerics a primer is needed even more so, because they need something to bite onto, as it is thicker bridging the pores rather than absorbing into the pores unlike a regular exterior acrylic product. As you see on Sherwin Williams Sherlastic It is speced for a primer, as well as Gliddens Decra Flex. My opinion is purely based off manufacture recommendations as well as my experience in applying a wide range of exterior products on many different cementitious substrates. Being from California in a demographic area where 90% of exterior substrate are cementitious substrates, I have found it a much more superior finish by simply applying a primer. I have dealt with failures, due to application failures, product failures and structure failures. These experiences came from working with a high volume painting contractor. We were on the front lines when elastomeric came to be in the housing market. Those failure I experienced I use as a advantage to help better myself and our industry. 

The following are the advantages to priming a raw cementitious substrates (stucco) prior to apply most exterior acrylic paints.

Betters adhesion between the prime coat and substrate.
 Betters adhesion between the prime coat and finish coat.
 Increases color retention.
 Higher resistance to efflorescence and alkalinity.
 Resists checking and cracking
Binds chalky and worn surfaces
Alleviates shadowing and gives a better overall finished product
The tighter the cementitious substrate, such as smooth coat, mission, tilt ups, etc, the more a primer is needed. Because its pores are tighter compared to a lace finish, giving the coating less to hold onto. This requiring a primer product with better adhesion properties. Although I would still recommend a primer on a heavily porous stucco finish for the reasons I pointed out in the bullet points


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## Ole34

ewingpainting.net said:


> The tighter the cementitious substrate, such as smooth coat, mission, tilt ups, etc, the more a primer is needed. Because its pores are tighter compared to a lace finish, giving the coating less to hold onto. This requiring a primer product with better adhesion properties. Although I would still recommend a primer on a heavily porous stucco finish for the reasons I pointed out in the bullet points


 
i have to agree with you there but as far as the rough stuff ill just do 2 top coats without any worries. its 8:00am over here so dont let my short reply do an injustice to your well though out post


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## JoseyWales

ewingpainting.net said:


> That's actually a good question
> It all depends what you want out of your top coat. I have painted many exterior substrates both with and without primer, years later the results stand for itself. With elastomerics a primer is needed even more so, because they need something to bite onto, as it is thicker bridging the pores rather than absorbing into the pores unlike a regular exterior acrylic product. As you see on Sherwin Williams Sherlastic It is speced for a primer, as well as Gliddens Decra Flex. My opinion is purely based off manufacture recommendations as well as my experience in applying a wide range of exterior products on many different cementitious substrates. Being from California in a demographic area where 90% of exterior substrate are cementitious substrates, I have found it a much more superior finish by simply applying a primer. I have dealt with failures, due to application failures, product failures and structure failures. These experiences came from working with a high volume painting contractor. We were on the front lines when elastomeric came to be in the housing market. Those failure I experienced I use as a advantage to help better myself and our industry.
> 
> The following are the advantages to priming a raw cementitious substrates (stucco) prior to apply most exterior acrylic paints.
> 
> Betters adhesion between the prime coat and substrate.
> Betters adhesion between the prime coat and finish coat.
> Increases color retention.
> Higher resistance to efflorescence and alkalinity.
> Resists checking and cracking
> Binds chalky and worn surfaces
> Alleviates shadowing and gives a better overall finished product
> The tighter the cementitious substrate, such as smooth coat, mission, tilt ups, etc, the more a primer is needed. Because its pores are tighter compared to a lace finish, giving the coating less to hold onto. This requiring a primer product with better adhesion properties. Although I would still recommend a primer on a heavily porous stucco finish for the reasons I pointed out in the bullet points[/QUOTE
> 
> What is a good primer for stucco?..Would "Seal Krete" be a good choice?
> 
> I'm going to bid on a job where the stucco is a pinkish color,about 20 years old..It's the original stucco color...Does that mean it's raw stucco?...Isn't stucco a tinted product like a dye when applied?
> 
> Also this stucco is quite spikey or jagged in parts,do you always backroll sprayed stucco?..Does the backrolling change the appearance of the original stucco look?...Stipple textured ceilings look different if rolled vs sprayed for example.I'm looking for the flattest acrylic possible to give an even finish look.
> 
> I just sprayed hardy board and that "flat" paint had a bit of a sheen to it..I don't want this with stucco...Any Canadian painters have a good suggestion for a great stucco paint?


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## ewingpainting.net

JoseyWales said:


> What is a good primer for stucco?..Would "Seal Krete" be a good choice?
> 
> I'm going to bid on a job where the stucco is a pinkish color,about 20 years old..It's the original stucco color...Does that mean it's raw stucco?...Isn't stucco a tinted product like a dye when applied?
> 
> Also this stucco is quite spikey or jagged in parts,do you always backroll sprayed stucco?..Does the backrolling change the appearance of the original stucco look?...Stipple textured ceilings look different if rolled vs sprayed for example.I'm looking for the flattest acrylic possible to give an even finish look.
> 
> I just sprayed hardy board and that "flat" paint had a bit of a sheen to it..I don't want this with stucco...Any Canadian painters have a good suggestion for a great stucco paint?


I prefer sticking with the manufactures specifications to determine what primer to use. The products were designed for each other, as they compliment each other. You can find the recommend primer on the product data page of the material. Look at Sherwin Williams Sherlastic as a example. 

I can't comment on Seal Krete as I haven't used it in a long time. The reason being they are not on a manufacture specifications, although I think it is a good product. Aaron with Integrity Finishes can better answer you on Seal Krete. 

Typically if the stucco is the original color it would be raw. However sometimes it is painted at the building stage. The best way to tell if it is a raw stucco is by wetting it down. If it is raw stucco the color will darken, as it absorbs the water. If it is painted, the water will not absorb, and just slide down the wall, without the color changing.


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## Sully

Ole34 said:


> sully is that house on Dupont St in Manayunk ??? .........sure looks like it


Maiden street in manayunk close it's a tight squeeze alley way


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## Ole34

Sully said:


> Maiden street in manayunk close it's a tight squeeze alley way


 
i lived in Manayunk for close to 30yrs..........heres a pic of a few condos i did (did about 30 total in that development) 1 coat MAB Acra-lastic 1400 ''Logia'' ...NO primer an NO powerwash..... heavy stucco so that paint isnt goin anywhere an its by far the best covering paint i have ever used in my life (brush/roller) you see those dark areas on the chimney?? GONE in 1 coat an thats after i cut it with about 3/4 gallon per 5. took me an another guy 2 days just to do the stucco front an back 


hey if you want i can take you over there an you can see for yourself so you know what the product can do first hand ........


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## ewingpainting.net

Ole34 said:


> i lived in Manayunk for close to 30yrs..........heres a pic of a few condos i did (did about 30 total in that development) 1 coat MAB Acra-lastic 1400 ''Logia'' ...NO primer an NO powerwash..... heavy stucco so that paint isnt goin anywhere an its by far the best covering paint i have ever used in my life (brush/roller) you see those dark areas on the chimney?? GONE in 1 coat an thats after i cut it with about 3/4 gallon per 5. took me an another guy 2 days just to do the stucco front an back


We do not have MAB here in California that I know of. 
Do you have finish pics? 

I just looked at the specs of MAB Acra-lastic 1400 looks very similar to loxon, only loxon has a higher perm rating with a lower elongation. Loxon XP spec say you can apply directly over stucco as well, even less than 28 day stucco cure. And like the Acra-Lastic, Loxon requires 2 coats on raw stucco. I've used alot of Loxon on raw stucco, it most defiantly is a superior product.

I really don't understand the rushing of any coating product that can monopolize the over all quality and longevity of the finish product. Every spec I have read, reads "Surface must be firm and free of dirt or other contaminants" Which means you need to clean the substrate prior to applying any coating, a exterior substrate even more so since it is exposed to exterior elements. 

I'm glad it worked for you, Elastomerics interest me, so I enjoy reading how others experiences are with it. :thumbsup:


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## Ole34

ewingpainting.net said:


> We do not have MAB here in California that I know of.
> Do you have finish pics?


 that is a finish pic ..........when i say that stucco is rough i mean ROUGH....literally had to chip some 1/2'' chunks off near the wood trim with my 5in1 so thats why no wash was needed....on a smooth wall id wash an prime though cause theres basically nothing for the paint to grab onto.........


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## Ole34

im thinkin this product would be great for sullys job .........1 an done an let the guy sell the building an im sure it will last for years cause those condos i did are goin on 7 yrs old without any problems but like i said that stucco was no joke lol painfull if you rubbed up against it


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## Ole34

you know how normal latex dries ?? well this acra-lastic kind of reminded me of dried concrete splater..thick stuff an dried hard an remained hard even after it cured or thats my immpression after i checked back on a few of them and as far as not washing a house causing adhesian problems?? you ever try to scrap paint off rough stucco ???? exactly it doesnt come off an never will


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## NEPS.US

Great thread Gabe! :thumbsup:


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## Sully

Ole I was looking at the acra lastic.. I'm an MAB boy what can I say I love the stuff! Anyway the HO decided to go with another company who had carpentry background since they offered to power wash stain and stabilize his deck for a little more than my price... Can't win um all... I'd like to win a few more though work has been painfully slow for me I'm going insane. Hopefully this hurricane brings some business my way


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## ewingpainting.net

Just wanted to update with a new article on elastomeric paint. Another common question I have been asked. Hope it can be helpful. :thumbsup:
*Elastomeric – The Rubber Band*


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## prototype66

Sully said:


> Ole I was looking at the acra lastic.. I'm an MAB boy what can I say I love the stuff! Anyway the HO decided to go with another company who had carpentry background since they offered to power wash stain and stabilize his deck for a little more than my price... Can't win um all... I'd like to win a few more though work has been painfully slow for me I'm going insane. Hopefully this hurricane brings some business my way


I use to use MAB elasto all the time back in Fl. The stuff was a dream to brush, we did a few malls with the stuff and a couple hotels along I drive too.
Havent thought about MAB in forever!


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## dwightiam

*For sale*

Neogard acrylic neoflex elastomeric coating
i over bid on a job and now just trying to get rid of the extra material .
I have :

20 - 5 gallon pails of 
neogard acrylic neoflex elastomeric coating

i will sell single pails or ther whole lot. If you buy the whole lot i will work out a deal for you.

Dwight

920-562-3378








sully said:


> beautiful! Seriously no sooner do i get a lead for my first elastomeric job do i find a thread for pointers. This site is getting better and better. Anyway i've looked up some info and past thread and read your blog. Awesome stuff and lots of great info to be found. I'll be going out tomorrow to look at a four story stucco row home. I believe it's unpainted and that it also connects to another home. So what i'm saying is a line is painted down between the homes.is this a problem for elastomeric paint? Will that be a future point of failure since the coating isn't wrapping the house? Anything special i should do during cleaning? Can i brush and roll a hybrid or full blown elastomeric with exceptional results. I want to learn as much as possible i will be searching more. Ewing you really know your stuff i can tell can you give me some advice. I'll be posting pictures of what i look at tomorrow. Thank you


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## dwightiam

*Neogard 7100 for sale*

My sales guy over bid on a job and now just trying to get rid of the extra material . I can't return it, so here i am. 

Neogard acrylic neoflex elastomeric coating
i have :

20 - 5 gallon pails of 
neogard acrylic neoflex elastomeric coating. I also have a few 5's of the primer as well.

I will sell single pails or ther whole lot. If you buy the whole lot i will work out a deal for you.

[email protected] or 920-562-3378

dwight


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## ewingpainting.net

What a coincidence, I get a text from my wife telling me to call this guy that wants a estimate to repaint a commercial building locally. I return the call and what do you know, it is the same building I posted about in my article on my blog (link below). I think I wet myself I was so excited. If I get this gig I can extend my research on this building, and the fix as well as watching it through time. 
Ewing Painting Blog and Reviews/Elastomeric Paints



I'm stoked :thumbup:


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## Paradigmzz

Hey Gabe,

Any follow up on this one?


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## woodcoyote

Has anyone ever applied Sherlastic or Conflex right over the grey coat? 

Stucco usually goes like this: Grey Coat, Brown Coat, Stucco. 

Just curious.


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## ewingpainting.net

Paradigmzz said:


> Hey Gabe,
> 
> Any follow up on this one?


are you talking about the job opportunity? if so I didn't get the job, they just used my expertise throughout the bidding process. then they had their maintenance guy paint the building. he was out there for weeks prepping, priming and painting. just like I put in my estimate only he used his idea of good products, like Behr elastomeric, he also did not cap it as I recommend they do so. been just a year and the coating is again failing. 

when it becomes a eye sore to the tenets, they will complain again, I suspect this to be the next year or so. maybe then he will remember ewingpainting.net


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## dereklawler

will I use Elastomeric Coating as roofing material or not?


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## ewingpainting.net

what do I get for the correct answer?


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## Bender

Hey Gabe, 
a couple pics for you. 
This was a quick patch-n-paint job where the stucco guys asked us to use 100% acrylic flat paint to fix a bunch of hairline cracks. It *might *have passed, but they did a lousy job matching the existing and we ended up using Kelly Moore's 1119 elastomeric.

The opposite side of the house was almost as bad, but instead of them patching the hairline cracks, we applied 2 coats of elastomeric.


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## ewingpainting.net

its a hard texture to match. is the close up on the patch crack a stucco patch or where you built the coating up? backrolling could have disguised that patch more. 

looks good


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## Bender

That was their patch and then I striped it and painted it. Couldn't get the paint to fill in. Thats why we switched to elasto.


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## woodcoyote

What are you guys using for elastomeric patches? Just curious. Or if the crack is let's say wider than a dime, are you floating grey/scratch coat back on it?


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## nogg

ewingpainting. I have a floor that has coronado Elast o Meric super stretch acrylic membrane on it (600% elongation).Looks like it was applied over a epoxy paint.It is peeling up in some areas but most seems tight.there are rust stains on it also.This floor is in a room with air handling equipment on the penthouse floor.They used to have issue with water on the floor and it would seep through cracks.I guess the in house painter at the time put down this coating as a fix for that.They do not have the water problems now.My question is,What type of coating can be applied over this?I would not think a hard floor type coating would be good.I dont see this product on cornados website.


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## two fingers

Coronado discontinued allot of there floor applications. I'm bummed too


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## CRS

Gabe,

The link to your blog didn't work. You'd be fun to talk to. I'm very familiar with the elastomerics from the chemical composition/formulation side. It would be great to get your insight of application experiences.


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