# New from Benjamin Moore: ARBORCOAT



## BMDealer (Jun 2, 2008)

Just to give the heads up and some on this forum may already know. Ben Moore is introducing a new line of premium stains in the spring. The product will be called Arbor Coat and it will be based on the Genx "Aura" colorant system. With in this hybrid/waterborne stain line there will be a transparent, semitranparent, semisolid, and solid. Retail should be mid $30s to low $40s.......the biggest advantage that I have heard is coverage and color longevity especially in the deeper tones.


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## nEighter (Nov 14, 2008)

semi solid? Sounds interesting..


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

BMDealer said:


> Just to give the heads up and some on this forum may already know. Ben Moore is introducing a new line of premium stains in the spring. The product will be called Arbor Coat and it will be based on the Genx "Aura" colorant system. With in this hybrid/waterborne stain line there will be a transparent, semitranparent, semisolid, and solid. Retail should be mid $30s to low $40s.......the biggest advantage that I have heard is coverage and color longevity especially in the deeper tones.



yes.. I have been waiting for the Solid hopefully it will be flatter than Aura Flat.


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## deach (May 11, 2008)

I guess my question is, will this be pure soap and water clean up? I know what I've used for solid cover so far has required thinner even though it's "acrylic" formula. Ruined I don't know how many brushes the first few times.


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

deach said:


> I guess my question is, will this be pure soap and water clean up? I know what I've used for solid cover so far has required thinner even though it's "acrylic" formula. Ruined I don't know how many brushes the first few times.


The old Moorwood line from BM was similar to Moorgard etc.. yes thinner wash was required..

if the new Product is Gennex then your answer is no thinner would NOT be required.


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## deach (May 11, 2008)

MAK-Deco said:


> The old Moorwood line from BM was similar to Moorgard etc.. yes thinner wash was required..
> 
> if the new Product is Gennex then your answer is no thinner would NOT be required.


OK. Just always had problems grasping that one for some reason. I don't want to mess with thinner on an acrylic product......


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

I wouldnt rule out some dish soap for clean up


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## slickshift (Apr 8, 2007)

...deck, siding, or int. trim/door stain?


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

I have heard the latex semi-transparent cabots product are not very good. I wonder how this will fare (assuming exterior siding product here).

I wondered if they were going to bring out a stain in the Gennex system.


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

DeanV said:


> I have heard the latex semi-transparent cabots product are not very good. I wonder how this will fare (assuming exterior siding product here).
> 
> I wondered if they were going to bring out a stain in the Gennex system.


I have been asking for the solid since they came out with Aura...


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

Its all exterior as of now. Im guessing it will be similar to the old "hybrid" moorgard-life-glo formula ( but thats just my guess ) There will also be a BEN exterior. These products will all be tinted with the Gennex colorants. Im "assuming" that color retention in the semi solids should be pretty good with the 100% acrylic colorants. Im also "assuming" that application should be better with tha hybrid formulations giving more open time with less lapping.


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

NCPaint1 said:


> Its all exterior as of now. Im guessing it will be similar to the old "hybrid" moorgard-life-glo formula ( but thats just my guess ) There will also be a BEN exterior. These products will all be tinted with the Gennex colorants. Im "assuming" that color retention in the semi solids should be pretty good with the 100% acrylic colorants. Im also "assuming" that application should be better with tha hybrid formulations giving more open time with less lapping.


I had heard Ben exterior would come out to give a less expensive alt to Aura's pricing.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

Please do not do the hybrid thing BM, please. No one else feels the need to do that with their exterior lines and it is not like your hybrid products had reviews that were better than comparable SW or California options that were not hybrid.


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

I do not see why they would be hybrid as the Aura line is not... 

I can not see Ben being hybrid either as the price is going to be cheaper then the current moor-gard etc line.


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## BMDealer (Jun 2, 2008)

NCpaint is correct...Ben will also have a exterior line coming out but we here in the Northeast have not heard any official word. The new Genx stain line will be exterior and most products are designed like their oil cousins, multi use deck and siding. 

The only problem this produces for the dealer is a lot of product coming in a short span of time. So on top of the capital needed there is also floor and warehouse space to consider for all these new products. So my guess is every Ben Moore store will or could be different creating issues for the end user, you guys.

I am also guessing that at some point this year we will see a Genx version of Regal since there seems to be color formulations for W221, W319 and so on. Just a guess though.


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

BMDealer said:


> I am also guessing that at some point this year we will see a Genx version of Regal since there seems to be color formulations for W221, W319 and so on. Just a guess though.


 
Yep, that will probably happen early in the new year. The new "stain" line im almost positive will be a "hybrid" formula. The BEN line im not sure if it will or not, my guess is that it will be a vinyl/acrylic. The hybrid stain's seems to make sense to me. The longer dry time would mean better penetration and better for application. The acrylic colorants would help with color retention. The drawback would be clean up....oh well. Keep a bottle of dish soap in your vehicle for cleaning brushes. It'll take a bit longer to clean your tools...but you'll have nice soft hands


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

NCPaint1 said:


> Yep, that will probably happen early in the new year. The new "stain" line im almost positive will be a "hybrid" formula. The BEN line im not sure if it will or not, my guess is that it will be a vinyl/acrylic. The hybrid stain's seems to make sense to me. The longer dry time would mean better penetration and better for application. The acrylic colorants would help with color retention. The drawback would be clean up....oh well. Keep a bottle of dish soap in your vehicle for cleaning brushes. It'll take a bit longer to clean your tools...but you'll have nice soft hands


So if there are hybrids then are then just re-doing he formulas for current products to tint with Gennex? if so I thinks that's a cop out and new products should be designed like Aura was. I won't use a Moorwood solid shot with Gennex its not a good product and the tint is going to help it.


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

I've also heard that there will be a decent warranty on the new exterior stains. I dont know if the warranty will be a standard product replacement like the current warranties...or if labor will be included...I have no idea as to that. BUT in order to meet warranty requirements the products must not be applied over any existing coating. So that means...the substrate is either "NEW", or has been completely stripped. 

It makes sense, how can a company warranty a coating for X number of years....when they have no control over whats underneath it. I cant tell you how many jobs i've had to look at because the paint I sold was peeling. When actually....it wasnt mine peeling, it was the previous coating, mine just peeled with it.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

I really have no respect for ANY paint company warranty. An exterior stain is not going to last 10-15 years and not need anything done. An exterior paint job is not going to last for a lifetime or 25 years. I have a Cabot's brochure in my office though that says to expect around 5 years for a stain job and 8 years from a paint job (I do not have it in front of me right now to check the exacts years). That is refreshingly realistic.


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

DeanV said:


> I really have no respect for ANY paint company warranty. An exterior stain is not going to last 10-15 years and not need anything done. An exterior paint job is not going to last for a lifetime or 25 years. I have a Cabot's brochure in my office though that says to expect around 5 years for a stain job and 8 years from a paint job (I do not have it in front of me right now to check the exacts years). That is refreshingly realistic.


 
I can agree with that. I dont know what type of warranty BM will have on the new stains at this point. All I was told is that it will be a good one, with excellent backing as long as it is applied according to their specifications.


Sikkens has never had a written warranty on any product that they have ever made in over 100 years, yet they still "warranty" product defects. They also certify contractors in their products and list these contractors on their website. I think it would be great if BM went this route with their "high end" products.


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## slickshift (Apr 8, 2007)

BMDealer said:


> I am also guessing that at some point this year we will see a Genx version of Regal...


As the Natura line is pretty much the no-VOC Regal alternative (at this point), I'm not sure I'd go that far (just speculation)
But it does look like they are leaving some doors open
...and yes that would head them into the SW arena of multiple-to-the-point-of-confusion (or arguably "way to many") lines


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

Not too many lines, just fitting existing products to their new tinting system. The new products added are just that....new products.... in an area where they havent had a product before. SW just replaces a product with something similar, adds some hype, makes a fancy label, then sells it for random prices depending on who they sell it to.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

I like the random prices part NC Paint. That is one thing I can never figure out about SW when I go there is their pricing structure.


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

slickshift said:


> As the Natura line is pretty much the no-VOC Regal alternative (at this point), I'm not sure I'd go that far (just speculation)
> But it does look like they are leaving some doors open
> ...and yes that would head them into the SW arena of multiple-to-the-point-of-confusion (or arguably "way to many") lines


I believe they are tinting Regal ( "W" on the label instead of the "N")with Gennex on the west coast all ready and in my belief they will switch regal to gennex and that will be "regal" not anew line.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

Speaking of Benjamin Moore Prouducts, I have a sample board right now with Aura Matte, Regal Matte, Ben Flat and Eco Spec Flat in HC-44. None of the colors match each other. I also have 4 other types of paint custom matched to HC-44 and one of the custom HC-44 matches is closest to the Benjamin Moore chip.

Crazy.


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

DeanV said:


> Speaking of Benjamin Moore Prouducts, I have a sample board right now with Aura Matte, Regal Matte, Ben Flat and Eco Spec Flat in HC-44. None of the colors match each other. I also have 4 other types of paint custom matched to HC-44 and one of the custom HC-44 matches is closest to the Benjamin Moore chip.
> 
> Crazy.


That does not surprise me at all...


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

I agree, all the different products, the colors will look slightly different.

And yes, Regal will be going to Gennex colorants in the near future, not reformulated....just an update for the computer tinting system.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

Eco and Ben were close to each other, also Regal and Aura were close to eachother. But those two groups had the greatest differences of all the samples.

There is another brand I use where I had them take the formula for a solid exterior oil stain and put it in a interior ceramic flat, and the colors matched. Now, why can't Benjamin Moore do that?


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## slickshift (Apr 8, 2007)

MAK-Deco said:


> I believe they are tinting Regal ( "W" on the label instead of the "N")with Gennex on the west coast all ready and in my belief they will switch regal to gennex and that will be "regal" not anew line.


Ahh yes, SoCal does have the "W" Regal as per that region's "stricter than the rest" VOC laws

IIRC, the BM guys I talked to last year (or was it more than that?) said that the "W" was a "stop-gap" measure due to local regs (Aura et. al. was not ready before the regs went into effect), and wasn't really intended to be permanent ...or nation-wide

However...
If they did introduce the W Regal to the rest of North America, that would make sense as (I think) it would be a "Low VOC" or "Ultra-Low VOC" rather than a "No-VOC" line

I would not be surprised if that is now the plan
BM is firmly committed to the Gennex platform, so I'm sure most every product will go that way eventually


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