# Behr Premium Plus



## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

What a big surprise today on the job i started.i was told all the paint was going to be benjamin moore.there were 10 colors of trim,ceiling and wall paint and it wasn't BM but actually behr premium plus! I kinda freaked a bit but they told me I could get it matched to whatever paint I wanted.at least i have 10 gallons of a first coat on some walls so I'll certainly try it out.my main concern is spraying trim and doors in the semi.i know the ultra runs like crazy when brushed so i would never spray that product.

question: has anyone sprayed behr premium plus semi-gloss on doors and trim?


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## robladd (Nov 22, 2010)

Yes .013 airless and .015 AAA.


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

robladd said:


> Yes .013 airless and .015 AAA.


How did they come out? did you thin it? I'm not sure what brand i'll match it to.benjamin moore doesn't really have a good paint i like for doors and trim imo.

i might try dulux diamond semigloss .i like their exterior satin to spray on doors outside.


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## robladd (Nov 22, 2010)

Xmark said:


> How did they come out? did you thin it? I'm not sure what brand i'll match it to.benjamin moore doesn't really have a good paint i like for doors and trim imo.
> 
> i might try dulux diamond semigloss .i like their exterior satin to spray on doors outside.


Good I double passed all the jambs and crossed hatched the doors. The only tip I can give you is to get good solid coverage or it will flash on you.


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Trim 209 Doors 311


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Sprayed these yesterday with a 209. This was going over bare poplar with the pressure dropped. This is the 1st coat of 3. No reduction.

The top photo is from the same area in the video





Obviously spraying previously painted or pre-primed trim would be different than this video. I am applying a saturation coat in this video with the pressure dropped.


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

Looks like its on waaaaaaay to heavy there Jack.


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

NCPaint1 said:


> Looks like its on waaaaaaay to heavy there Jack.


Intentionally. Poplar takes anything you put over it and PP lays tight when dry. Guys experiencing bubbles priming over wood with an airless means the open grain was not sealed properly. One way prevent or minimize it is to be certain the 1st coat over wood is saturated. Often a non-issue with a brush because its worked into the grain. Having pressure dropped helps a great deal too for the 1st prime coat


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## 1963 Sovereign (Dec 14, 2011)

NCPaint1 said:


> Looks like its on waaaaaaay to heavy there Jack.


pretty sure if you came back and looked at that same area in 45 minutes,most of it would have soaked in and looked like it filled the pores in quite nicely.


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

1963 Sovereign said:


> pretty sure if you came back and looked at that same area in 45 minutes,most of it would have soaked in and looked like it filled the pores in quite nicely.


Or, run/sagged down the casing. I don't think its on heavy enough to do that, but its close. At least it looks it from the pic.


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## 1963 Sovereign (Dec 14, 2011)

NC,are you still located on haggerty road or moved since then?


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

It's heavy but none of that sagged. That film is not far off from the 2nd coat application. I'll try to make a video of each coat on that same piece.


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## Rcon (Nov 19, 2009)

Xmark said:


> i might try dulux diamond semigloss .i like their exterior satin to spray on doors outside.


Haven't used the exterior stuff, but the interior diamond will run and sag like crazy if you spray it, regardless of tip size or how fast your passes are. I found it incredibly aggravating to spray that product. The sg is also wicked shiny, like a full gloss.


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

1963 Sovereign said:


> NC,are you still located on haggerty road or moved since then?


We have 2 stores.  I'm at the other one


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

I'll take a photo of the window trim on Monday before and after sanding. It should be interesting for those not familiar with PP Satin to see how much of that 1st coat goes away deep into the bare wood like water base primers "should" do but often fail resulting in a dry film that sits like a blanket over the wood. 

Identifying the level of open grain penetration occurs when sanding to burn-out the first coat. If you see bare wood in the open grain---the primer failed to penetrate properly. This area is where PP Plus excels because it penetrates deep.

I used 1407 (current Diamond 350) for years as my go-to trim and door paint.

Here is the old Glidden 1407


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Here is the spray pattern with PP Satin w/209 (black tip). I have the pressure dropped to a tolerable level for the 1st coat.


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## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

jack pauhl said:


> Here is the spray pattern with PP Satin w/209 (black tip). I have the pressure dropped to a tolerable level for the 1st coat.


 Looks like it measured up!


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

mudbone said:


> Looks like it measured up!


Yep. Believe it or not, not everyone understands what the tip numbers mean.

Here it is for those folks:

The 2 in a 209 is the fan pattern width times 2 but you can make it larger by holding the gun further away from the object as seen in the video. I like to be up close and personal with my spraying to control overspray. 

The .09 is orifice size and 09 is small, .017 is big for mass areas like ceilings or doors if thats your style  or thicker coatings.

I use .015 or .017 on ceilings and I've been known to spray doors with a 515 to keep the task under 15 minutes.


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## StripandCaulk (Dec 30, 2011)

JP- are you priming the poplar with premium plus as well, or just finishing?


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

StripandCaulk said:


> JP- are you priming the poplar with premium plus as well, or just finishing?


Yes as a primer. Much of the first coat comes off. Looks like this. Half this board is sanded. The 2nd coat after sanded makes it solid and smooth like formica. The 3rd coat is for looks.


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

jack pauhl said:


> I'll take a photo of the window trim on Monday before and after sanding. It should be interesting for those not familiar with PP Satin to see how much of that 1st coat goes away deep into the bare wood like water base primers "should" do but often fail resulting in a dry film that sits like a blanket over the wood.
> 
> Identifying the level of open grain penetration occurs when sanding to burn-out the first coat. If you see bare wood in the open grain---the primer failed to penetrate properly. This area is where PP Plus excels because it penetrates deep.
> 
> ...


I hope you're right about the Diamond.i just bought four gallons for the job...if it runs I'll spray 'em flat on a saw horse.very nice looking doors and trim you sprayed with the Diamond semi.

I'm curious,in the video you barely sprayed the one side and leave the other side of the trim alone.it looks like you sprayed the trim dead straight.did you get the other side on the 2nd coat?


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Xmark said:


> I hope you're right about the Diamond.i just bought four gallons for the job...if it runs I'll spray 'em flat on a saw horse.very nice looking doors and trim you sprayed with the Diamond semi.
> 
> I'm curious,in the video you barely sprayed the one side and leave the other side of the trim alone.it looks like you sprayed the trim dead straight.did you get the other side on the 2nd coat?


Do some tests on sag resistance before you go blow a house. I always do a small test in the house before I spray anything on a similar surface or back of a door.

I was discussing this video with another paint contractor today. It is very difficult for me to make videos and take photos during the daily grind but I always have a tripod and camera ready in the house. 

For the window video---I was spraying windows that day and already started spraying that window before I thought I better shoot a quick video, so I did almost without missing a beat. 

The walls are 6" so the extension jambs are wide. I shot that face casing on a slight angle to get the edge by the drywall. When I spray the inside extension jamb it is identical to what you saw in the video but from the other side. I place the left side tail of the pattern on the center of the face casing.

In this video below you can see the face casing under the sill is the starting point, I go left to right then continue up where this video starts. I go across the top and back down where the previous video picks up. Then I go back to the right side extension and go up over and down to the sill plate and finish at the right.


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

That video shows the angle pretty good. I was holding my iPhone in my left hand.


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## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

Behr hugs your walls!:yes:


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

xmark, here is PP Satin. Notice the amount of paint I put on the 2nd door jamb. You mentioned ULTRA sagging... not sure what you are doing different but I am not experience sagging applying ULTRA heavy. What are you applying ULTRA over? Tip size?

I mounted the cam on the spray gun for this video. I'm uploading more.


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

very cool video jack! it's like you are taking the viewer into your shoes.

i have never sprayed ultra,only brushed it.it sagged in the ceiling cut (corners).there was a learning curve and i learned not to apply too thick,just like aura paint.did you say you are using a graco 210FF for trim?

edit: ok i see that you use a 209 and 311 for doors.why not use a FF?

Can you make a video showing your method of spraying doors? i'd like to see your setup.i prefer to spray them in their own room against the wall with a fiver stir stick on the top.i just spray one side and then turn the door around and lean against the wall.


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Xmark said:


> very cool video jack! it's like you are taking the viewer into your shoes.
> 
> i have never sprayed ultra,only brushed it.it sagged in the ceiling cut (corners).there was a learning curve and i learned not to apply too thick,just like aura paint.did you say you are using a graco 210FF for trim?
> 
> edit: ok i see that you use a 209 and 311 for doors.why not use a FF?


Premium Plus doesn't need help from a FF, the 209 lays it tight. Doesn't get any tighter. Same solid smoothness you see on that door pic I posted with 1407.


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

jack pauhl said:


> Premium Plus doesn't need help from a FF, the 209 lays it tight. Doesn't get any tighter. Same solid smoothness you see on that door pic I posted with 1407.



that looks like a 6" wide fan for the door trim.just the trim is 4" and the top piece in the hallway has the added crown piece or whatever you call it.it's more than 4".


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## Ultimate (Mar 20, 2011)

Nice vid


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

xmark, the smallest I take the 209 is 4" The header is taller so the gun is held further away. Here is a 2nd video showing more header area being painted.


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

I notice that you use 12" paper on the windows.doesn't the exposed part of the window get dusted?

great videos btw,the best you have produced so far.


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Xmark said:


> I notice that you use 12" paper on the windows.doesn't the exposed part of the window get dusted?
> 
> great videos btw,the best you have produced so far.


Thanks. When I make these videos--I have little time to do it so they are unrehearsed and one and only takes. I wish I had time to actually produce videos.

12" can dust the windows if you are not careful. These windows have plastic over the glass from the factory but normally I just run 12" around and keep an eye on the tail. A 209 gives nice control of that sort of thing. The bottom sill plates are the ones to watch for as the gun gets pointed up.


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

jack what tip do you use for your ceilings? i use a black 517.are you spraying the behr premium plus flat and backrolling?


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Xmark said:


> jack what tip do you use for your ceilings? i use a black 517.are you spraying the behr premium plus flat and backrolling?


I spray KILZ PRO-X 110 Flat w/515 or 517, no back rolling, one direction, overlapped in half. I saturate ceilings when they are new, soaked.


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

jack pauhl said:


> I spray KILZ PRO-X 110 Flat w/515 or 517, no back rolling, one direction, overlapped in half. I saturate ceilings when they are new, soaked.



you using the KILZPRO-Xp10PVA DRYWALL PRIMER for the 1st coat? It says ultra flat so i'll have to try it.are you adding any white tint?have you tried the killx pro X 300 dead flat?


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Xmark said:


> you using the KILZPRO-Xp10PVA DRYWALL PRIMER for the 1st coat? It says ultra flat so i'll have to try it.are you adding any white tint?


No on the primer. I tint my ceiling paint to custom match USG topping mud.


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

jack pauhl said:


> No on the primer. I tint my ceiling paint to custom match USG topping mud.


most of my clients want a bright white on ceilings.drywall mud is an offwhite.You saturate it and only ONE coat,no primer?that must save you tons.good idea matching to the topping mud.great idea if your builder is ok with the color.


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Xmark said:


> most of my clients want a bright white on ceilings.drywall mud is an offwhite.You saturate it and only i coat,no primer?that must save you tons.good idea matching to the topping mud.great idea if your builder is ok with the color.


I prefer soft white because blue-whites make wall colors look odd together imo. The stock 110 flat is a crisp white. The trim being sprayed in the video is also the same white which I use often on trim when they say, "paint it white".

What do you use primer for?


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

jack pauhl said:


> I prefer soft white because blue-whites make wall colors look odd together imo. The stock 110 flat is a crisp white. The trim being sprayed in the video is also the same white which I use often on trim when they say, "paint it white".
> 
> What do you use primer for?


I use primer to save money it's cheap and it seals mud.but that killz is pretty cheap too so thanks for the tip.actually last job i didn't use primer on the new ceiling.I rolled a vaulted ceiling with black beams on each side.the flat paint i used was benny moore's top of the line dead flat.beautiful paint but very pricey.$39/gallon.Also i used the premium plus as a base on the new walls and used dulux lifemaster for the top coat.got away with 2 coats and it looked great.


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

Ohhhhh....so here's the PT bathroom. I've been looking for it!


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

NCPaint1 said:


> Ohhhhh....so here's the PT bathroom. I've been looking for it!


the only thing chitty about it are Benjamin Moore prices.no need to spend that kind of money in this day and age to get equal or better product.:thumbsup:


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## NCPaint1 (Aug 6, 2009)

Xmark said:


> the only thing chitty about it are prices.no need to spend that kind of money in this day and age to get equal or better product.:thumbsup:


Says the $99/room guy


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## 6126 (May 9, 2010)

jack pauhl said:


> I mounted the cam on the spray gun for this video. I'm uploading more.
> 
> 1st person spraying - YouTube


:thumbup: Cool. I just found a new use for my GoPro Helmet Cam :thumbsup:


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## ColorQuest (Mar 19, 2012)

jack pauhl said:


> xmark, here is PP Satin. Notice the amount of paint I put on the 2nd door jamb. You mentioned ULTRA sagging... not sure what you are doing different but I am not experience sagging applying ULTRA heavy. What are you applying ULTRA over? Tip size?
> 
> I mounted the cam on the spray gun for this video. I'm uploading more.
> 
> Video Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbMxRpwonXk


Jack, 
Cool video, it didn't look like there was much overspray at all there man. You should do a brush-cam video bro, that would be pretty slick. What pump do you have going in there? I can't remember if you mentioned that. 
Thanks Jack,
Jay


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

ColorQuest said:


> Jack,
> Cool video, it didn't look like there was much overspray at all there man. You should do a brush-cam video bro, that would be pretty slick. What pump do you have going in there? I can't remember if you mentioned that.
> Thanks Jack,
> Jay


I dial-in for my spraying pleasure  

TIP: Graco 209
GUN: Graco SGPRO
PUMP: Titan 440i

Normally I spray with a Graco Tradeworks 150 but that was sitting in a bucket of KILZ PRO-X 110


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Here is the 1st coat from the video (dry) This coat was sanded smooth.




This photo is what the 2nd coat looks like dry. This 2nd coat is then sanded and a 3rd coat is applied


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## ColorQuest (Mar 19, 2012)

jack pauhl said:


> I dial-in for my spraying pleasure
> 
> TIP: Graco 209
> GUN: Graco SGPRO
> ...


Jack, 
Thanks for the feedback, I have been wanting to spray more of my trim and doors. 99% of my jobs are lived in repaints, with your pressure dialed down it looks like you could get away with painting inside an occupied home, with proper covering of course. Do you use an hvlp on any of your work Jack?
As always thanks bro,
Jay


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

ColorQuest said:


> Jack,
> Thanks for the feedback, I have been wanting to spray more of my trim and doors. 99% of my jobs are lived in repaints, with your pressure dialed down it looks like you could get away with painting inside an occupied home, with proper covering of course. Do you use an hvlp on any of your work Jack?
> As always thanks bro,
> Jay


I feel I have a nice gig going now with BEHR. Having produced countless powder coat-like finishes, both with brush and sprayer---quite honestly the finishes do not get any better than that. No HVLP or AAA needed for what I do. I use the Graco Tradeworks almost exclusively on trim and doors. Pump only weighs 16lbs. and easily handles 209-311

We spray in occupied homes. I prefer to limit the amount of brush work when possible.


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

JP what is your sanding procedure and cure times?


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

straight_lines said:


> JP what is your sanding procedure and cure times?


Today we had 70° / 47% humidity and sanded 2 hours after spraying. I always prefer to sand anything the next day and often time things that way.

Let's use the examples I posted over bare poplar

The bare wood got 120 Abranet, quick pass to address glue strands, glue, chatter, mud, remove sharp edges, high spots etc. Knowing the 1st coat will be sanded, I make sure the CEROS levels the wood so the next sanding minimizes burning through.

1st coat gets sanded with 180 Abranet with the CEROS anywhere it will fit along with a Festool Pocket Stickfix with 180, some hand sanding too

2nd coat gets sanded with 240, same procedure


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

Cool thanks for sharing that. I think a lot of painters forget you are a pro, and have excellent prep procedures. Its why you make behr paint look so good. 

I wonder how long my environmental conditions would effect cure time here. Very humid this time of year.


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

straight_lines said:


> Cool thanks for sharing that. I think a lot of painters forget you are a pro, and have excellent prep procedures. Its why you make behr paint look so good.
> 
> I wonder how long my environmental conditions would effect cure time here. Very humid this time of year.


You can perform the exact same procedure with a number of products and never produce the same end result. That would suck to put that amount of work into a trim package and spoil it with a paint that won't lay tight leaving faint orange peel. 

If orange peel is the end result, the level of orange peel determines the level of prep needed and it wouldn't be near what I put into it. The orange peel would supersede any smoothness you put into it. Make it smooth and stick orange peel on it makes no sense to me. Why bother. 

Same with brushing, why sand it if you are going to plaster your smooth sanding with brush marks. Again, makes no sense.


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## PhillysFinest (Jun 9, 2012)

NCPaint1 said:


> Says the $99/room guy


You can keep that Bennie Moore paint, for the painters that can sell over-priced latex paint, to the fools that believe the hype!


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## straight_lines (Oct 17, 2007)

jack pauhl said:


> You can perform the exact same procedure with a number of products and never produce the same end result. That would suck to put that amount of work into a trim package and spoil it with a paint that won't lay tight leaving faint orange peel.
> 
> If orange peel is the end result, the level of orange peel determines the level of prep needed and it wouldn't be near what I put into it. The orange peel would supersede any smoothness you put into it. Make it smooth and stick orange peel on it makes no sense to me. Why bother.
> 
> Same with brushing, why sand it if you are going to plaster your smooth sanding with brush marks. Again, makes no sense.


You can spray just about any coating flat if you get your pressure and viscosity right. I agree with some being ropey.


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## scottjr (Jan 14, 2012)

PhillysFinest said:


> You can keep that Bennie Moore paint, for the painters that can sell over-priced latex paint, to the fools that believe the hype!


Ben Moore has good products. What part of philly do you mostly work?


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

jack pauhl said:


> Today we had 70° / 47% humidity and sanded 2 hours after spraying. I always prefer to sand anything the next day and often time things that way.
> 
> Let's use the examples I posted over bare poplar
> 
> ...


What sander are you using? There isn't an abranet sanding pad that fits the festool ro90 i don't think.


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## TJ Paint (Jun 18, 2009)

PhillysFinest said:


> You can keep that Bennie Moore paint, for the painters that can sell over-priced latex paint, to the fools that believe the hype!


Don't be jealous of us that use Bennie Moore, you talk like you settled a score!

Sent from my MB508 using Paint Talk


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## jack pauhl (Nov 10, 2008)

Xmark said:


> What sander are you using? There isn't an abranet sanding pad that fits the festool ro90 i don't think.


Mirka CEROS


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