# Primer as finish



## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

Hello All,

Can tinted primer be used over exterior wood as a finish? What are the drawbacks and plusses, if there are any. I really would like to use a flat, exterior oil for a job. I use Benjamin Moore, but know of no products like this in their arsenal. Input appreciated.

JTP


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

JTP said:


> Hello All,
> 
> Can tinted primer be used over exterior wood as a finish? What are the drawbacks and plusses, if there are any. I really would like to use a flat, exterior oil for a job. I use Benjamin Moore, but know of no products like this in their arsenal. Input appreciated.
> 
> JTP


My understanding is that primer is not equipped as a finish to withstand uv (sun) exposure. The rule of thumb is that after a month it loses its schitnitz.


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## NACE (May 16, 2008)

JTP said:


> Hello All,
> 
> Can tinted primer be used over exterior wood as a finish? What are the drawbacks and plusses, if there are any. I really would like to use a flat, exterior oil for a job. I use Benjamin Moore, but know of no products like this in their arsenal. Input appreciated.
> 
> JTP


 Primers will fade chalk, and become brittle if left exposed. They are designed to penetrate a surface, and provide a flexible, uniformly sealed foundation to hang a top coat. Like pre-primed lumber, it should be re-primed if the primer is older than 30 days. BM does not make any exterior flat oils anymore. VOC laws and less demand for solvent based coatings forced technoldgy into flat waterbased finishes. Flat oils had a tendency to flash even over primer. Latex flats are supperior to oil flats now a days. Is there any reason you want to stick with an alkyd system?


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

What is the surface you are working on? Sounds like an oil stain may work instead for you.


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## Dave Mac (May 4, 2007)

I would not use it as a finish coat, as scott said after a certain amount of days, you really should reprime.


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

Dean-- Surface is regular old exterior wood trim. I can get alykd finishes, just not with a flat finish. So, after reviewing the information presented, looks like I will just put an oil base trim paint on with the lowest sheen I can find from Benny Moore.

Thanks folks. Great info.

JTP


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## sage (Apr 29, 2007)

NACE said:


> Primers will fade chalk, and become brittle if left exposed. They are designed to penetrate a surface, and provide a flexible, uniformly sealed foundation to hang a top coat. Like pre-primed lumber, it should be re-primed if the primer is older than 30 days. BM does not make any exterior flat oils anymore. VOC laws and less demand for solvent based coatings forced technoldgy into flat waterbased finishes. Flat oils had a tendency to flash even over primer. Latex flats are supperior to oil flats now a days. Is there any reason you want to stick with an alkyd system?


Nace,
Good info., I had not heard that pre primed lumber should be re primed if older then 30 days. Guess we should treat all pre primed as if it were older then 30 days since we hav3e no way of knowing how old it really is.
Thanks for the info.!
Sage


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

sage said:


> Nace,
> Good info., I had not heard that pre primed lumber should be re primed if older then 30 days. Guess we should treat all pre primed as if it were older then 30 days since we hav3e no way of knowing how old it really is.
> Thanks for the info.!
> Sage


 
There is a difference between thirty days stacked in a pile at the lumber yard and thirty days on the side of a house exposed to the elements.


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

Nace-- I began using oil years ago and still can't get it through my head that the latex technology is now superior. Just an old timer not used to newer tricks. I shall reconsider the oil stance. Also--oil stain, as in Cabot's OVT, is not really an option here. The prior finish is latex-exterior semi. Going to scuff sand, spot prime, and finish it up with either the oil or latex trim. 

JTP


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

Scott--schitnitz is exactly what I am looking for--good word for the thread on painter terminology specific to the trade. Don't we all know what *schitnitz *is?


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

JTP said:


> Scott--schitnitz is exactly what I am looking for--good word for the thread on painter terminology specific to the trade. Don't we all know what *schitnitz *is?


If you have been in this business more than about a minute as an owner, you see schitnitz from a mile away. I spend alot of my days making lemonade, dont get me started!


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## NACE (May 16, 2008)

Usually the bundles of lumber do have a prime date stamped on the wood or on the wrapping. Many of the pre-prime lumber houses use a poor quality alkyd or latex primer with insufficient mil thickness or applied over a freshly milled board. What it does do is create dimensional stability which is good. If it is primed at the factory with a poor quality primer, or on wet wood, and then it is topcoated in the field and starts to bleed or mildew through the film, who's fault is it? As Scott said, bundled lumber vs installed lumber are two different animals. It is a good idea to wash the pre-primed wood before you prime too, as dirt and mildew spores may already be embedded in the primer, or attracted to the alkyd or organic matter that has accumulated on flat finish. The lowest alkyd sheen we make is C163 Alkyd Low Luster Metal & Wood. It is the old Ironclad primer/finish for metal. It has rust inhibition in it, so it is a low luster DTM. Since it has such a low sheen, it is also flexible enough to go on siding. Not available in some colors and bases.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

NACE said:


> It is a good idea to wash the pre-primed wood before you prime too, as dirt and mildew spores may already be embedded in the primer


This is more than a good idea. Most lumber yards have them under lean-to's where they are out of the sun but still trapping moisture. Excellent call.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

Factory primer, at least on door casings, brick mold, etc is absolute garbage lately. It will not hold up to anything or provide a sound foundation for paint anymore. It has absolutely no penetration into the wood, scrapes off easily, etc. I guess you could say this is a sore point with me, as I have mentioned this several times here.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

DeanV said:


> Factory primer, at least on door casings, brick mold, etc is absolute garbage lately. It will not hold up to anything or provide a sound foundation for paint anymore. It has absolutely no penetration into the wood, scrapes off easily, etc. I guess you could say this is a sore point with me, as I have mentioned this several times here.


 
What he said...:yes:


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## Dmax Consulting (Jul 22, 2008)

Primers won't hold up. They don't have the same durability characteristics as paint. You will have problems if don't topcoat them.


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