# Filling Oak Grain For Cabinet Paint with 3m Patch and Primer



## Trox

It is used under all kinds of topcoats for trim painting why would filling grain in cabinets be any different? 



Why is this a good idea and everyone should do it?


Why is it a bad idea?


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## woodcoyote

First one to post: Bad idea.


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## woodcoyote

Reason being: For me..it wouldn't dry hard enough and I wouldn't trust it to not shrink.

They have special formulation for grain filling for a reason. Otherwise sheetrock mud would work (aka joint compound). 

The 3m patch and primer is meant for patching mostly sheetrock repairs and is thus formulated to do so properly. From personal experience, it doesn't dry very hard and with fillers you need to be able to clean & sand them well. 

I would avoid having issues and just use the right stuff. You can get a gallon of it from Sherwin at a pretty good price and a little goes a long ways.


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## ridesarize

3M patch and prime is not good for shallow imperfections suchs as oak grain. I don't believe it's good for much of anything. I find it doesn't sand well at all. It remains built up instead of sanding flat. 
Top that off with it is hard to spread and smooth. It dries on the putty knife quickly and dries crusty hard on the knife too fast. It also is not self priming (not that I thought it would be).

Avoid that stuff in my opinion.


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## chrisn

ridesarize said:


> 3M patch and prime is not good for shallow imperfections suchs as oak grain. I don't believe it's good for much of anything. I find it doesn't sand well at all. It remains built up instead of sanding flat.
> Top that off with it is hard to spread and smooth. It dries on the putty knife quickly and dries crusty hard on the knife too fast. It also is not self priming (not that I thought it would be).
> 
> Avoid that stuff in my opinion.


 
bbbbbuut it says so right on the label:blink:


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## Jmayspaint

It's a terrible ideal. As mentioned, it simply doesn't dry hard enough. There's a reason specialty products for grain filling exist, and that's because the job requires specialty performance. 

Coincidentally, I did a vanity recently as part of a bathroom remodel that the home owner had started himself and never finished. He had primed the two cabinet doors and skimmed them out with Easy Sand which is a good deal harder than any spackling compound. 

After an inordinate amount of time sanding two vanity doors, re priming and coating with Breakthrough, the doors were still so soft I could barely move them around the shop or sand between coats without nicking them. It was ridiculous. 

If you look on here there are several threads on grain filling oak with product suggestions. Everything from brush on grain fillers, to spray on ones. My personal favorite is Masters Finishing Medium from Faux Effects. It can be sprayed, brushed, or rolled on, bonds tenaciously and is hard as a rock. Do yourself a favor and use a product suited for the job. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## RH

Technogod said:


> i have no idea why you will kill your self with a product that it will never work for that purpose.
> Go auto body shop supply and get your self a gallon of polyester primer. catalyze the product as much as you need in a plastic container and brush like a regular paint.very easy and sands like a chalk after 2 hours.Fills anything you want and sticks to anywhere just be careful )


Plus you will have the additional benefit of being able to drive those cabinets in any type of traffic when you are done.:yes:


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## Gough

We use Swedish Putty, either FPOE or shop-made with whiting and enamel undercoater.


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## Trox

Thanks for the replies. I am a total novice so things like this pop in my head from time to time and I wonder, "Why wouldn't this work?" Appreciate the responses.


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## Trox

woodcoyote said:


> Reason being: For me..it wouldn't dry hard enough and I wouldn't trust it to not shrink.
> 
> They have special formulation for grain filling for a reason. Otherwise sheetrock mud would work (aka joint compound).
> 
> The 3m patch and primer is meant for patching mostly sheetrock repairs and is thus formulated to do so properly. From personal experience, it doesn't dry very hard and with fillers you need to be able to clean & sand them well.
> 
> I would avoid having issues and just use the right stuff. You can get a gallon of it from Sherwin at a pretty good price and a little goes a long ways.


You are the man around these parts. lol You have replied to every one of my posts I really appreciate that! 

If I am trying to stick to waterborne products only it kind of limits me. It seems that most grain fillers are oil based products. Even sherman williams Sherwood Natural Grain Filler...

I did try AquaCoat Waterborne Clear Grain Filler and it worked well but did not sand very well for me at all. Any suggestions for non toxic grain fillers? Seems to be kind of difficult to find anything.

Also when you finish painting a cabinet if it is white would it be a bad idea to Caulk the gaps on the face with a Urethanized Elastomeric caulking? I know doing it before the top coat can cause cracks but if you did a tiny little bead after the fact it seems that it might work okay and take away from that gross paint in the seam look you get?


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## Packard

Bona and Parks both make a trowel on grain filler intended for open pore wood floors. I bought a tub and it sands very easy and trowels on easily too. But is it going to be hard enough under paint? Does any one know? I am building new doors for a refacing of red oak cabinets. Only the face frames will require filling. The doors and end panels will be replaced with Shaker style doors in poplar and maple ply. The end panels will also replaced with maple ply. 

I applied a sample and it applied easily and sanded nicely. I am just wondering if it will be hard enough. I don't do much refacing, so not much experience here. I would hope to just brush the topcoat (either Advance or Command).


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## cocomonkeynuts

Packard said:


> Bona and Parks both make a trowel on grain filler intended for open pore wood floors. I bought a tub and it sands very easy and trowels on easily too. But is it going to be hard enough under paint? Does any one know? I am building new doors for a refacing of red oak cabinets. Only the face frames will require filling. The doors and end panels will be replaced with Shaker style doors in poplar and maple ply. The end panels will also replaced with maple ply.
> 
> I applied a sample and it applied easily and sanded nicely. I am just wondering if it will be hard enough. I don't do much refacing, so not much experience here. I would hope to just brush the topcoat (either Advance or Command).


I had a wood working outfit doing a bunch of high gloss stuff recently, they must have tried 12 different grain fillers including Bona. I demo'd him some Goodfilla then an hour later guy called me up and said it was the best **** he's ever used. Ordered him 36lbs of the stuff, roughly $50 for 12lbs.


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## finishesbykevyn

Packard said:


> Bona and Parks both make a trowel on grain filler intended for open pore wood floors. I bought a tub and it sands very easy and trowels on easily too. But is it going to be hard enough under paint? Does any one know? I am building new doors for a refacing of red oak cabinets. Only the face frames will require filling. The doors and end panels will be replaced with Shaker style doors in poplar and maple ply. The end panels will also replaced with maple ply.
> 
> I applied a sample and it applied easily and sanded nicely. I am just wondering if it will be hard enough. I don't do much refacing, so not much experience here. I would hope to just brush the topcoat (either Advance or Command).


Never used it, but if its hard enough for floors, then its most definitely hard enough for cabinets.


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## Packard

I tried filling the grain by applying 3 coats of 1-2-3 and sanding between coats. It did not quite make the mark. Three coats of Advance over the 3 coats of 1-2-3 worked. But when I tested the finish for hardness, the plastic deformation was noticeable. The plastic deformation is where you can make indents easily in the finish but not damage the surface. The substrate with all that paint and primer was soft. 

I will test again using the Parks material. I will try it both as a trowel on, and thinning with water to use as a brush on filler.


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## cocomonkeynuts

Packard said:


> I tried filling the grain by applying 3 coats of 1-2-3 and sanding between coats. It did not quite make the mark. Three coats of Advance over the 3 coats of 1-2-3 worked. But when I tested the finish for hardness, the plastic deformation was noticeable. The plastic deformation is where you can make indents easily in the finish but not damage the surface. The substrate with all that paint and primer was soft.
> 
> I will test again using the Parks material. I will try it both as a trowel on, and thinning with water to use as a brush on filler.


Call barry gork at goodfilla, I'm sure he wouldn't mind sending you some to try out. The feedback I'ev gotten from wood finishers its superior to Bona for sure.


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## Packard

cocomonkeynuts said:


> Call barry gork at goodfilla, I'm sure he wouldn't mind sending you some to try out. The feedback I'ev gotten from wood finishers its superior to Bona for sure.


Thanks for the offer. I have already ordered a small bottle of Goodfilla to test. It is more expensive than the Parks, but if it works better, not that much of an issue. I will compare.


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## cocomonkeynuts

Packard said:


> Thanks for the offer. I have already ordered a small bottle of Goodfilla to test. It is more expensive than the Parks, but if it works better, not that much of an issue. I will compare.


It comes in a powder, very economical


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## Packard

I did not realize that. It has not shown up yet. Thanks.


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## Masterwork

I want something that's easy to work with when it's wet. Some of the wood fillers are so difficult.


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## cocomonkeynuts

Masterwork said:


> I want something that's easy to work with when it's wet. Some of the wood fillers are so difficult.


Its very easy to work with



__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=277442009774107


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## Packard

cocomonkeynuts said:


> I had a wood working outfit doing a bunch of high gloss stuff recently, they must have tried 12 different grain fillers including Bona. I demo'd him some Goodfilla then an hour later guy called me up and said it was the best **** he's ever used. Ordered him 36lbs of the stuff, roughly $50 for 12lbs.


I ordered Goodfilla from Amazon.com. The package arrived yesterday--empty. I got a credit from Amazon, but now I have to find this elsewhere. Any suggestions? I've never seen this on display at any of my regular vendors.


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## cocomonkeynuts

Packard said:


> I ordered Goodfilla from Amazon.com. The package arrived yesterday--empty. I got a credit from Amazon, but now I have to find this elsewhere. Any suggestions? I've never seen this on display at any of my regular vendors.


Ugh amazon...
I can send you some, or if you call barry gork @*GoodFilla* I'm sure he will send you a package.








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