# Gardz: don't try this at home.....or at work!



## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

Okay, this is no biggy and probably a number of those here have done this. I was working at the hi rises I do work at when I came across a friend who comes in from San Diego from time to time to do work at the hi rises. He usually does plumbing, basic electric, tile work, laying floors, etc., but not much painting. This time he was painting. I looked at the equipment he was using, took pity on him and loaned him some basic tools and gave him a few roller covers, both 9" and minis.

While going over the job he was doing, I noticed that the bathroom area that has the sink and vanity had had wallpaper removed, leaving very old, very hard and very dry wallpaper adhesive. It wasn't going to come off easily. Considering what he was being paid for the job, he just wanted to lightly sand it and paint it. I brought him a can of Gardz I had handy and explained to him that if he wanted to avoid both using a smelly primer and avoid having the top coat of paint crinkle after activating the wallpaper adhesive underneath, he would best be advised to apply 2 coats of Gardz and let thoroughly dry before painting. He did just this.

Below are 3 photos. 1) what the walls looked like after 1 coat of Gardz, 2) what the walls looked like after a 2nd coat of Gardz and 2 coats of paint, and 3) a close up of the texture the wallpaper adhesive left after the painting was done. 

I took the after photos about a week after the painting was done and found no peeling or crinkling paint. I am not saying that i would do this on one of my jobs, nor am I suggesting that anyone here try it (unless they already have and are comfortable doing so), I just wanted to take advantage of the situation to see if Gardz would seal over wallpaper adhesive without any attempt to wash it off. Time will tell if it starts to crinkle, but I don't think that I will ever know if it does......unless the deed can be traced back to me!
























The greenish color here is from the lighting. Below is one that is closer in color to the 2nd photo from top:








futtyos


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

Its that the paste showing through or were these walls textured, to begin with?


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Paste showing through*



Brushman4 said:


> Its that the paste showing through or were these walls textured, to begin with?


Brushman4, that is the paste texture showing through. I wouldn't have done this myself, but, then, I did not bid the job so low that there was no money to pay for the labor to do it. My friend was determined to just paint over the paste, so I decided to have him do an experiment with my Gardz, which he did and which, so far, seems to have worked.

If it was me, I would have bid the job to remove the paste, then skim coat and whatever, but doing the job correctly was not the goal here, at least not for me or for the one doing the job. My goal was to see how well 2 coats of Gardz would seal over wallpaper adhesive so that it would not become activated by the top coats of paint. So far it looks like it works well, but time will tell.

You can make notes with your sharpened pencils, just don't poke me with them, I'm very sensitive.

futtyos


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

futtyos said:


> Brushman4, that is the paste texture showing through. I wouldn't have done this myself, but, then, I did not bid the job so low that there was no money to pay for the labor to do it. My friend was determined to just paint over the paste, so I decided to have him do an experiment with my Gardz, which he did and which, so far, seems to have worked.
> 
> If it was me, I would have bid the job to remove the paste, then skim coat and whatever, but doing the job correctly was not the goal here, at least not for me or for the one doing the job. My goal was to see how well 2 coats of Gardz would seal over wallpaper adhesive so that it would not become activated by the top coats of paint. So far it looks like it works well, but time will tell.
> 
> ...


I can't believe he couldn't have gotten a bucket of hot water and some TSP and cleaned off the paste. I guess the people he was working for don't know a schlock job when they see one? So they actually paid this guy for this?:vs_shocked:


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

Did you do a tape test?


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*remember, it was an experiment.*



Brushman4 said:


> I can't believe he couldn't have gotten a bucket of hot water and some TSP and cleaned off the paste. I guess the people he was working for don't know a schlock job when they see one? So they actually paid this guy for this?:vs_shocked:


Brushman4, I am sure that there have been a lot of jobs that you and many here have examined after the fact and have scratched their heads incredulously while asking themselves how someone could do such a schlock job. The unit is a rental and the owner only paid $1000.00 to have it painted. My friend, who was staying with his friend at the hi rises, did not bid the job. His friend did bid the job and his friend did him no favors. This whole thing is not about how to do a job correctly. I realize that you, I and most others here would have bid the job appropriately to take into account getting rid of the wallpaper glue (that should wake up Chrisn). This is about what would happen if 2 coats of Gardz were applied to old, dry wallpaper paste (there, Chrisn, I said paste....just for you  ) to see if it could be painted over without the top coats of paint activating the wallpaper paste and cause krinkling and whatever else wallpaper paste does to paint coming into direct contact with it.

The units at Marina Towers that have only been painted over since the buildings were new had a pronounced orange peel texture on both ceilings and walls. Most of the clients that the GC I work for want the surfaces skim coated flat. The unit in question has the pronounced orange peel texture. This owner just wanted it painted so he could get it back on the market to rent. To be honest, if you go into the 5' x 6' area that has the sink and vanity, it is hard to get a close look that will tell you about all the imperfections on the walls. There is no direct exterior lighting. The view of all the walls is either oblique or at a right angle adn the finish is eggshell. You really have to get close to the walls to see the imperfections. The owner did not pay anything close to get rid of the imperfections. He should be very happy with the job that he got and should, in part, be grateful to me for heading off a potentil disaster at the pass.

This was not an attempt to help the owner get a proper paint job as you and I would consider it to be done. This was AN EXPERIMENT to see hwat would happen if 2 coats of Gardz were directly applied over old, dried wallpaper paste to see if this would allow paint to be applied over same without activating aforementioned wallpaper glue. I think it worked, but I don't know if I will have access to long term monitering of the experimental subject walls.

I hope this esplains all of what I was trying to accomplish. If not, perhaps you and I could meet for a beer and go over this in more depth. I probably live about 15 minutes from you. I guarantee you that I will benefit more from this meeting than you will. I have a very good idea that you know far more about painting and such than I do. First 3 beers are on me.

futtyos

P.S. If I were doing this job i would use a 2 qt pump up garden sprayer from HD and use hot water. I would put down a bunch of bath towels (I have many of them from cleanouts of houses) and spray away over all the walls about 5 times (small area remember) and then take my sponges and 3M scrubby pads and start going to town. If this failed to make a dent, I would either Gardz it, then skim coat with Durabond (Durabond has wonderful bonding/glueing properties), possibly Easy Sand after that, then Gardz, then paint - Or I might use Plaster Weld directly on top of the dry wallpaper paste, skim coat with Durabond, a 2nd coat of DB or Easy Sand, Gardz (I would not use a primer over either Durabond or Easy Sand as I found that 123 causes both DB and ES skim coats to "melt" as the primer is being rolled over and worked in.), then topcoat with whatever paint the reader of this post would most want to use (Note to reader of this post: I am trying to paint a happy picture in your mind that is free of the paint that I would normally be using - care to guess?)

P.S.S. I stopped work on the balcony railings at Marina Towers on 11/7/17. The next day I stayed home sick and have been at home since nursing what I call "the kruds." Hence my free time to type away as I feel.

P.S.S.S. This is going through my head right now, so I will share it with those here so I can leave this post on a happy and musical note!:


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*No*



Woodco said:


> Did you do a tape test?


No. :vs_laugh:

You are deadly! This made my night!

futtyoshjnfvwjiewjiptg


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

I love you guys here! This is therapy for me!

futtyos


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

futtyos said:


> Brushman4, that is the paste texture showing through. I wouldn't have done this myself, but, then, I did not bid the job so low that there was no money to pay for the labor to do it. My friend was determined to just paint over the paste, so I decided to have him do an experiment with my Gardz, which he did and which, so far, seems to have worked.
> 
> If it was me, I would have bid the job to remove the paste, then skim coat and whatever, but doing the job correctly was not the goal here, at least not for me or for the one doing the job. My goal was to see how well 2 coats of Gardz would seal over wallpaper adhesive so that it would not become activated by the top coats of paint. So far it looks like it works well, but time will tell.
> 
> ...


Lol. Goal achieved. Once the paste was sealed and and dried it's solid. Ugly, but solid. I'd have done it and not thought twice all things considered. Gardz is perfect for something like that...less than ideal conditions where you basically need a liquid glue. I really think gardz is just a real thin elmers white glue mix. Smells like it too imo....

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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

futtyos said:


> Brushman4, I am sure that there have been a lot of jobs that you and many here have examined after the fact and have scratched their heads incredulously while asking themselves how someone could do such a schlock job. The unit is a rental and the owner only paid $1000.00 to have it painted. My friend, who was staying with his friend at the hi rises, did not bid the job. His friend did bid the job and his friend did him no favors. This whole thing is not about how to do a job correctly. I realize that you, I and most others here would have bid the job appropriately to take into account getting rid of the wallpaper glue (that should wake up Chrisn). This is about what would happen if 2 coats of Gardz were applied to old, dry wallpaper paste (there, Chrisn, I said paste....just for you  ) to see if it could be painted over without the top coats of paint activating the wallpaper paste and cause krinkling and whatever else wallpaper paste does to paint coming into direct contact with it.
> 
> The units at Marina Towers that have only been painted over since the buildings were new had a pronounced orange peel texture on both ceilings and walls. Most of the clients that the GC I work for want the surfaces skim coated flat. The unit in question has the pronounced orange peel texture. This owner just wanted it painted so he could get it back on the market to rent. To be honest, if you go into the 5' x 6' area that has the sink and vanity, it is hard to get a close look that will tell you about all the imperfections on the walls. There is no direct exterior lighting. The view of all the walls is either oblique or at a right angle adn the finish is eggshell. You really have to get close to the walls to see the imperfections. The owner did not pay anything close to get rid of the imperfections. He should be very happy with the job that he got and should, in part, be grateful to me for heading off a potentil disaster at the pass.
> 
> ...


ROFLOLOLOL...you crack me up sometimes. Hope ya get to feeling better.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

lilpaintchic said:


> ROFLOLOLOL...you crack me up sometimes. Hope ya get to feeling better.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Thanks!

:kiss:

futtyos


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

futtyos said:


> I love you guys here! This is therapy for me!
> 
> futtyos


We'll be here all week and we're cheaper than a therapist.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

futtyos said:


> No. :vs_laugh:
> 
> You are deadly! This made my night!
> 
> futtyoshjnfvwjiewjiptg


Im actually not kidding about the tape test. I think you should do one, with a big long strip of duct tape.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Tape test*



Woodco said:


> Im actually not kidding about the tape test. I think you should do one, with a big long strip of duct tape.


When I get back to the Towers I will see if I can get back in and do a tape test. I was just concerned that putting paint over dry wallpaper paster would become a disaster. The Gardz seemed to have prevented that, but you make a good point about tape testing it as well.

futtyos


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

futtyos said:


> Okay, this is no biggy and probably a number of those here have done this. I was working at the hi rises I do work at when I came across a friend who comes in from San Diego from time to time to do work at the hi rises. He usually does plumbing, basic electric, tile work, laying floors, etc., but not much painting. This time he was painting. I looked at the equipment he was using, took pity on him and loaned him some basic tools and gave him a few roller covers, both 9" and minis.
> 
> While going over the job he was doing, I noticed that the bathroom area that has the sink and vanity had had wallpaper removed, leaving very old, very hard and very dry wallpaper adhesive. It wasn't going to come off easily. Considering what he was being paid for the job, he just wanted to lightly sand it and paint it. I brought him a can of Gardz I had handy and explained to him that if he wanted to avoid both using a smelly primer and avoid having the top coat of paint crinkle after activating the wallpaper adhesive underneath, he would best be advised to apply 2 coats of Gardz and let thoroughly dry before painting. He did just this.
> 
> ...


I would hope this San Diego dude is a better plumber, electrician etc. than he is a painter. I can see floods and electrical fires coming in the units he has worked on. Someone should ban him from owning a brush or roller.
So he lets his friends whom he stays with bid jobs for him? What about the airfare from SD to Chicago, how does he figure that into pricing?
I've been reading yelp reviews about the Towers and it seems like this has turned into mostly rental units with a lot of potheads and druggies occupying them.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*No tape test on this.*



futtyos said:


> When I get back to the Towers I will see if I can get back in and do a tape test. I was just concerned that putting paint over dry wallpaper paster would become a disaster. The Gardz seemed to have prevented that, but you make a good point about tape testing it as well.
> 
> futtyos


Alas, tenants have moved into this unit before I could get back to do a tape test.

futtyos


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

futtyos said:


> Alas, tenants have moved into this unit before I could get back to do a tape test.
> 
> futtyos


Should have just slopped some Marquee on it and been done with it!


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## lilpaintchic (Jul 9, 2014)

Know what else gardz is good for? Sealing a tape edge at a transition. Like wall color to black caulk n stuff.

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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

futtyos said:


> Brushman4, I am sure that there have been a lot of jobs that you and many here have examined after the fact and have scratched their heads incredulously while asking themselves how someone could do such a schlock job. The unit is a rental and the owner only paid $1000.00 to have it painted. My friend, who was staying with his friend at the hi rises, did not bid the job. His friend did bid the job and his friend did him no favors. This whole thing is not about how to do a job correctly. I realize that you, I and most others here would have bid the job appropriately to take into account getting rid of the wallpaper glue (that should wake up Chrisn). This is about what would happen if 2 coats of Gardz were applied to old, dry wallpaper paste (there, Chrisn, I said paste....just for you  ) to see if it could be painted over without the top coats of paint activating the wallpaper paste and cause krinkling and whatever else wallpaper paste does to paint coming into direct contact with it.
> 
> The units at Marina Towers that have only been painted over since the buildings were new had a pronounced orange peel texture on both ceilings and walls. Most of the clients that the GC I work for want the surfaces skim coated flat. The unit in question has the pronounced orange peel texture. This owner just wanted it painted so he could get it back on the market to rent. To be honest, if you go into the 5' x 6' area that has the sink and vanity, it is hard to get a close look that will tell you about all the imperfections on the walls. There is no direct exterior lighting. The view of all the walls is either oblique or at a right angle adn the finish is eggshell. You really have to get close to the walls to see the imperfections. The owner did not pay anything close to get rid of the imperfections. He should be very happy with the job that he got and should, in part, be grateful to me for heading off a potentil disaster at the pass.
> 
> ...


Well, you've finally admitted I was right about the high-rise you were working at was Marina Towers.
You can fool all the people some of the time and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool Brushman4 all of the time!


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

This GARDZ experiment is unremarkable in my opinion. It proves nothing. If it had been primed with Zinsser Bullseye 123 you would have had similar results. An encapsulated wall covering adhesive with a crappy looking finish coat. All it demonstrates is that personal preference is exercised far more than best practices in this industry, and that illusion is the driver and measure of the "Painting Product".

I hope you're feeling better


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

CApainter said:


> This GARDZ experiment is unremarkable in my opinion. It proves nothing. If it had been primed with Zinsser Bullseye 123 you would have had similar results. An encapsulated wall covering adhesive with a crappy looking finish coat. All it demonstrates is that personal preference is exercised far more than best practices in this industry, and that illusion is the driver and measure of the "Painting Product".
> 
> I hope you're feeling better


 
NOT true, try it and see. ANY oil primer would probably do the same though. Gardz works for this, I have done it many times. 123 does NOT work in this case.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

chrisn said:


> NOT true, try it and see. ANY oil primer would probably do the same though. Gardz works for this, I have done it many times. 123 does NOT work in this case.


None of it really works because it's bypassing best practices. That's the point. But I have done crappy jobs that didn't really matter, where I wasn't going to start digging petrified wall paper paste off of the walls, and settled for a coat of whatever primer I had available. In most of the cases, it was Zinsser 123. 

I just rolled it on. Walked away. And top coated it after it dried. I believe one time I actually skimmed over it thinking I'm really pushing the envelope. Bottom line, you could roll water on hardened paste, walk away, and still paint something over it after it dries. 

And to be clear, it is not a preferred practice for me to paint over wall covering paste. And I have used GARDZ to do just that with barely passable results. 

The bottom line for me in this thread, is that whether it's GARDZ, Coverstain, enamel undercoater, Shellac, or High Build Epoxy, it's all personal preference with no definitive recommendation by any paint authority.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

CApainter said:


> None of it really works because it's bypassing best practices. That's the point. But I have done crappy jobs that didn't really matter, where I wasn't going to start digging petrified wall paper paste off of the walls, and settled for a coat of whatever primer I had available. In most of the cases, it was Zinsser 123.
> 
> I just rolled it on. Walked away. And top coated it after it dried. I believe one time I actually skimmed over it thinking I'm really pushing the envelope. Bottom line, you could roll water on hardened paste, walk away, and still paint something over it after it dries.
> 
> ...


Because if you aren't going to take the paste off, you might as well just use Promar 700 on it. Nothing is going to fix it, so you might as well just do the best you can depending on what you are going to be paid. In that respect, Gardz would be better than 123 any day. But would i make a special trip to get gardz or pay anymore for it than 123 in this case? Hell no!


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

PACman said:


> Because if you aren't going to take the paste off, you might as well just use Promar 700 on it. Nothing is going to fix it, so you might as well just do the best you can depending on what you are going to be paid. In that respect, Gardz would be better than 123 any day. But would i make a special trip to get gardz or pay anymore for it than 123 in this case? Hell no!


See, this is why PACman is so loved here. He gets it.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Maquee over Gardz*



PACman said:


> Should have just slopped some Marquee on it and been done with it!


That is exactly what my friend did, 2 coats of eggshell.

futtyos


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Please read the title of the thread.*



CApainter said:


> This GARDZ experiment is unremarkable in my opinion. It proves nothing. If it had been primed with Zinsser Bullseye 123 you would have had similar results. An encapsulated wall covering adhesive with a crappy looking finish coat. All it demonstrates is that personal preference is exercised far more than best practices in this industry, and that illusion is the driver and measure of the "Painting Product".
> 
> I hope you're feeling better


CApainter, in case you and Brushman4 (and whoever else is crying foul at my experiment) failed to read the title of my thread, here it is: "Gardz: don't try this at home.....or at work!" What part of that title would lead you to believe that I was recommending anyone here using Gardz in the manner I described?

I spent several minutes with my friend going through what i thought would be the proper method to deal with the wallpaper paste, prep, skim coating and so forth. At a certain point I realized that he was bound and determined to "just paint over the wallpaper paste" and there was nothing I could do to dissuade him of this. What I tried to do then was to put a fear into him as to what might happen if he applied paint directly over the dried wallpaper paste without sealing it first. I told him of several products that might work to seal said paste, then told him that the least noxious of them (BIN, CoverStain) and the easiest to apply and clean up after was Gardz. I don't think that anyone here who has used Gardz an appreciable amount of times would disagree that applying Gardz is like falling off a log compared to applying virtually anything else.

My friend applied the 2 coats of Gardz as I suggested and let both coats dry thoroughly, also as I suggested. He then applied 2 coats of Marquee eggshell finish (see last photo above for color) that the owner had purchased and there were no problems with crinkling or other paint-directly-over-wallpaper-paste that I could see. The rough texture of the wallpaper paste was also difficult to see as this room/hallway is only about 5' x 7' and you are never directly next to a wall that has any light source showing onto it to highlight said texture. It actually didn't look too bad. I have seen worse paint jobs where the painter was using "better practice standards" than this.

This might not be a best practice, but I never suggested that it ever was supposed to be. I was just trying to help him execute what i thought was the best practice under the circumstances. Time will tell whether I was right or not.

If it was me doing this same NOT BEST PRACTICE scenario, for whatever the reason, I would have skim coated the walls after Gardzing them, then Gardz'd the skim coat and paint. My friend did not want to take the time to skim coat (which he probably would have done a poor job at anyway), he just wanted to get the place painted.

Now CApainter, if, after having read all that I have just wrote, as well as all my previous posts in this thread, you still think that I am advocating some inferior and NOT best practice, let me repeat the title of my thread. Gardz: don't try this at home.....or at work!

I appreciate your being a stickler for details and best practices and I appreciate and pay attention to what you have to say about best practices and such, but that is not what is being put forth in this thread.

I have never applied 123 over dry wallpaper paste, but it appears that Chrisn has and does not like the results. I personally would not even try using 123 over wallpaper paste for the following reason. I like to use Durabond and sometimes Easy Sand for a final skim coat. The directions for both products say not to use either for a final skim coat. On a recent job I did for the GC at Marina I put a final skim coat of Durabond on a wall that gets lots of exterior light. I did not finish the wall as the GC had not finished constructing a doorway. He finished the doorway and put a final skim coat of Easy Sand on the 3' wide x 8' tall area he had left unfinished. He has a habit of priming with 123 (he used to use Kilz2 before I convinced him to step up to 123) so that I only have to paint. When he primed this wall, the 123 started to "melt" the skim coat as he worked it smooth. Somehow he got it into paintable condition and I painted it. At another job I primed over a similar skim coat with 123 and it started to "melt the DB skim coat. I imagine that this is the reason why USG does not recommend using DB or ES for final skim coats. Since I normally seal my skim coats with at least one coat of Gardz, I never have a problem with it "melting" the top coat of DB or ES.

The reason I like using ES and more preferably DB is that ES gives a smoother surface than regular (or tinted, soft, waxed or otherwise dolled up) wall mud and DB gives an even smoother finish than ES. Just feel the dry powder of each and you can tell that the particles are fine in the ES and finer in the DB. Both product TDS show both to be 60-70% plaster of paris. I am not saying that what i do would be considered best practice, but it works for me and gives me the best finish and durability that I have so far found. The GC I work for is in love with final skim coats of Plus3 tinted. I discovered that if I tilt the roller on a ceiling or wall with this stuff on it in order to reduce roller lines, I put grooves into the surface. I have been told in the past here that I am rolling incorrectly. Perhaps that is true, but if I were trying to produce a finished painting product that had hallways final skim coated with Plus3 instead of DB, my best guess would be that the walls would soon have all kinds of dents in them, considering how soft Plus3 is.

For reasons detailed in the last 2 paragraphs above, I would be hesitant to use 123 to try to encapsulate dry wallpaper paste, but perhaps not Gardz. CApainter, if you want to tell us of your success in using 123 to encapsulate dry wallpaper paste, I am all eyes to read it.

futtyos


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## slinger58 (Feb 11, 2013)

I'm inclined to agree with Chrisn and futtyos here. While I know oil primer, Bin or Gardz won't rewet the paste, I'm thinking the 123 would.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

slinger58 said:


> I'm inclined to agree with Chrisn and futtyos here. While I know oil primer, Bin or Gardz won't rewet the paste, I'm thinking the 123 would.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yup, it does. Don't ask me how I know that. That's why I follow the rule where if you wet your finger, then wipe it across the wall... If you don't hear squeaks and it still feels slimey, keep scrubbin'. You didn't get it all off yet.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

futtyos "I Bleed GARDZ" Bulshinsky said:


> For reasons detailed in the last 2 paragraphs above, I would be hesitant to use 123 to try to encapsulate dry wallpaper paste, but perhaps not Gardz. CApainter, if you want to tell us of your success in using 123 to encapsulate dry wallpaper paste, I am all eyes to read it.


It was not a "real" success IMHO. But it held up long enough for me to impress the customer. Point is, again...yawn....it's never a good idea to prime over existing paste. But, if I had to do it again, and if I only had 123 available, ya damn skippy I would!

And you should apologize to anyone that had to read that manifesto on their phone.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Get back to work!*



CApainter said:


> It was not a "real" success IMHO. But it held up long enough for me to impress the customer. Point is, again...yawn....it's never a good idea to prime over existing paste. But, if I had to do it again, and if I only had 123 available, ya damn skippy I would!
> 
> And you should apologize to anyone that had to read that manifesto on their phone.


CApainter, you should be working.

futtyos


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

futtyos said:


> CApainter, you should be working. futtyos


I cleaned my desk. That took the whole day! I'm going into this year squared away. Can you dig it.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Can't believe everyone gets so worked up over a flip job. When they have problems they will look for a painter to do it correctly. Then that painter can charge top dollar because of all the labor involved. Bad paint jobs, like bad paint, keep the quality people in business.


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

PACman said:


> Can't believe everyone gets so worked up over a flip job. When they have problems they will look for a painter to do it correctly. Then that painter can charge top dollar because of all the labor involved. Bad paint jobs, like bad paint, keep the quality people in business.


Good job bad job, same price!


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

PACman said:


> Can't believe everyone gets so worked up over a flip job. When they have problems they will look for a painter to do it correctly. Then that painter can charge top dollar because of all the labor involved. Bad paint jobs, like bad paint, keep the quality people in business.


In the same way people seek a more quality burger after blowing their shorts out from a Micky D's.


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

futtyos said:


> CApainter, in case you and Brushman4 (and whoever else is crying foul at my experiment) failed to read the title of my thread, here it is: "Gardz: don't try this at home.....or at work!" What part of that title would lead you to believe that I was recommending anyone here using Gardz in the manner I described?
> 
> I spent several minutes with my friend going through what i thought would be the proper method to deal with the wallpaper paste, prep, skim coating and so forth. At a certain point I realized that he was bound and determined to "just paint over the wallpaper paste" and there was nothing I could do to dissuade him of this. What I tried to do then was to put a fear into him as to what might happen if he applied paint directly over the dried wallpaper paste without sealing it first. I told him of several products that might work to seal said paste, then told him that the least noxious of them (BIN, CoverStain) and the easiest to apply and clean up after was Gardz. I don't think that anyone here who has used Gardz an appreciable amount of times would disagree that applying Gardz is like falling off a log compared to applying virtually anything else.
> 
> ...


futtyos, I didn't say you recommended it, nor did I say it was you doing the work. I was questioning why someone had to be imported from California to perform this schlockery?


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

Brushman4 said:


> futtyos, I didn't say you recommended it, nor did I say it was you doing the work. I was questioning why someone had to be imported from California to perform this schlockery?


Brushman4, what does the home location of the painter have to do with my so called "experiment?" Perhaps I should not have mentioned that as it seems to have distracted you from the main point of what my thread was about. If I have offended you in any way, could you please forgive me?

futtyos


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Gardz on hand*



PACman said:


> Because if you aren't going to take the paste off, you might as well just use Promar 700 on it. Nothing is going to fix it, so you might as well just do the best you can depending on what you are going to be paid. In that respect, Gardz would be better than 123 any day. But would i make a special trip to get gardz or pay anymore for it than 123 in this case? Hell no!


PACman, I rarely make a special trip to pick up Gardz as I try to always have it with me on jobs. I certaily pay more for it than I do for 123 because 1) it costs more than 123 and 2) it is a different product than 123 and is not equally interchangeable with 123 in all circumstances. Actually, I like to have both on hand at most of my jobs. 

futtyos


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Brushman4 said:


> futtyos, I didn't say you recommended it, nor did I say it was you doing the work. I was questioning why someone had to be imported from California to perform this schlockery?


California has the best painters, that's why. Whaa?


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

futtyos said:


> Brushman4, what does the home location of the painter have to do with my so called "experiment?" Perhaps I should not have mentioned that as it seems to have distracted you from the main point of what my thread was about. If I have offended you in any way, could you please forgive me?
> 
> futtyos


As they say in real estate what are the 3 most important things, location, location, and location!:biggrin:


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*All confused!*



Brushman4 said:


> As they say in real estate what are the 3 most important things, location, location, and location!:biggrin:


Brushman4, you and CApainter are makin me crazy!

flubbyos


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

futtyos said:


> PACman, I rarely make a special trip to pick up Gardz as I try to always have it with me on jobs. I certaily pay more for it than I do for 123 because 1) it costs more than 123 and 2) it is a different product than 123 and is not equally interchangeable with 123 in all circumstances. Actually, I like to have both on hand at most of my jobs.
> 
> futtyos


As you should!


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## slinger58 (Feb 11, 2013)

futtyos said:


> Brushman4, you and CApainter are makin me crazy!
> 
> 
> 
> flubbyos




At this point, futtyos doesn't know whether to scratch his watch or wind his ass! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

I just bathed in a tub of warm Gardz. You wouldn't believe how hard my skin is! 

Thanks futtyos!


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## Pete Martin the Painter (Nov 8, 2012)

PACman said:


> Can't believe everyone gets so worked up over a flip job. When they have problems they will look for a painter to do it correctly. Then that painter can charge top dollar because of all the labor involved. Bad paint jobs, like bad paint, keep the quality people in business.


I am bidding one right now. My inner painter wants to scream. But, it is a big job and if keeps me busy in December I am willing to do the job. I have told the HO that not sanding and cleaning can lead to issues in the future, so that makes me feel a little better.

Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

Pete Martin the Painter said:


> I am bidding one right now. My inner painter wants to scream. But, it is a big job and if keeps me busy in December I am willing to do the job. I have told the HO that not sanding and cleaning can lead to issues in the future, so that makes me feel a little better.
> 
> Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk


Good job, bad job, same price$.


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

CApainter said:


> I just bathed in a tub of warm Gardz. You wouldn't believe how hard my skin is!
> 
> Thanks futtyos!


But is it moisturized?:vs_laugh:


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

futtyos said:


> Brushman4, you and CApainter are makin me crazy!
> 
> flubbyos


I can't speak for CA, but I will be here watching you, watching you, just like the guy under the seats!


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Aw man! I tried it at home and it look like crap! Dang-it i should have listened to you!


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