# Are U a Cleaner or Painter??



## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

JTP is asking: 

What do you folks do regarding cleaning? 

Foil said in another thread: "There is tons of things that you can use a lot cheaper then $27.99 plus shipping. The idea is always to clean before you paint."

I think every painter has uttered, under the breath of course,: " These home owners are just pigs. There's food all over the kitchen walls, hair all over the bathroom walls and ceiling, inch of dust all over every sill, door jamb top, and so on"

Now, we don't mind cleaning up our own mess from sanding, but kneeling down and cutting baseboard against a filthy floor is one of the most frustrating jobs possible in my mind--and I think, we've all been there.

When I bid a job in a filthy house, you can bet your best buck, I highball it. If I have to be a maid, the customer is going to pay me painting rates for the service.

Just wondering what your approach is to this somewhat common problem in the repaint business. And, as an aside, I can tell you it just aren't the poor people who can't keep things clean.

JTP


----------



## Rich (Apr 26, 2007)

JTP said:


> Just wondering what your approach is to this somewhat common problem in the repaint business


no approach, I just clean it, can't mention it to them (it's rude and not respectful) 

that's pretty much it


----------



## Thepaintman (Jan 17, 2008)

Like Rich, we just grab the ammonia and clean it. We don't mind it too much since they are paying painter's wages for cleaning service. We usually don't mention it - they already know it's dirty.


----------



## timhag (Sep 30, 2007)

Bid the job as you see it is all i can say.


----------



## slickshift (Apr 8, 2007)

I have considered subbing out real bad pre-prep cleans and even after job clean-up

I haven't been able to make it work...I am still trying to figure it out

For now I add it into the bid and doowadyagottadoo


----------



## Brian (Apr 10, 2007)

I've looked at interiors that really needed a pressure washing to get clean. While I couldn't actually bid on pressure washing, I basically approached it that way. We never got one of those jobs.

Over time I realized that if someone was willing to live like that, they probably really don't care what their house looks like. Whatever their motivation for calling me, it probably isn't because they have suddenly decided to clean up their act. Most likely they think a coat of paint will cover up their years of acting like pigs.

Bottom line is I won't paint for pigs unless they are willing to pay, and I've yet to see a pig with the necessary pride. That's why they are pigs.

I hasten to add that the above is not meant to be an insult to swine, only those humans who attempt to emulate them.

Brian Phillips


----------



## Joewho (Apr 17, 2007)

LOL. this thread is funny.:thumbup:

I've never really run across a situation where I would be charging top dollar to do that type of house. It just doesn't happen. The only time I've seen a house as dirty as described was in apartments or single family rentals or on very rare occasion a house up for sale. So, the dirty ones are always the ones that don't require top notch work, hence it just doesn't happen that those jobs pay even goiong rate, much less top dollar.

If I do run into a situation like that, I just clean what needs to be cleaned so I can do my job. If the floor is dirty, you'll find a 4" clean stripe up to the base and so forth. If i'm only painting walls then you'll see a clean, freshly painted wall and a dirty ceiling with foongie hanging down And dark ceiling corners contrasted to clean wall corners.


----------



## Paul_R (Apr 19, 2007)

I have told folks, that I could clean for them at $25/hour, or they could, but one of us would have to. They opted to do the cleaning. I would do light cleaning, once over with detergent, and a rince, as a normal operating procedure, but heavy grease, nicoteen, or crayon excess is extra.

Happy painting, Paul.


----------



## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

Bottom line is I won't paint for pigs unless they are willing to pay, and I've yet to see a pig with the necessary pride. That's why they are pigs.

I hasten to add that the above is not meant to be an insult to swine, only those humans who attempt to emulate them.


It is always best not to insult the pigs,great post.


----------



## DelW (Apr 18, 2007)

The worst ones around here are the rental houses, like timhag said, bid em like ya see em.:yes:


----------



## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

During the initial visit I will tell the customer that there are some things they can do in anticipation of our start date to make the process easier and save a few bucks. These things include: Removing all pictures and small knick knacky items; Removing small furniture; any remaining large furniture items pushed to center of room; remove outlet and switch plates; and vacuum the room, especially baseboard tops. I tell them that this will enable us to come in and get started, save at least a couple of hours of messing around, and therefore, money. Most homeowners are really good about this and respond to it. If you dont mention it, they dont know.


----------



## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

*JTP Responds to input*

Just an interesting observation on my part as a preface: 

The reason I posted this thread is based on a job I am doing now. The home is being re-painted due to the owner's moving and selling. The owner is meticulous in many areas within his home. What struck me and my partner was the disregard shown to the cleanliness of the house while at the same time being so proud and anxious about paint getting on the woodwork.

When I sold the job, I of course understood the need to highlight how careful we were with cutting custom woodwork. We obviously got hired for the job.

Now, this house is not a total disaster, but it did strike us that the care given the woodwork was disproportionate to the care for many other items and areas in the home. As a matter of fact, as we work through the house, we find the homeowners messing up the brand new paint job we just completed. They are laying all manner of items up against the freshly painted walls. It's like they really don't care. If that is the case, what's the point in hiring us?

We get paid to do professional work. We do professional work. Technically speaking, we should not care what the customer does when we are done. It does, however, modify how we approach the rest of the work, if not on a practical level, at a psychological one. I guess you could say: "Heck if they don't give a rat's rear, then why should we care?" Our silent answer to ourselves is: "We paint with professionalism and sincerity for a job well done. The customer's appreciation or lack thereof does not make a difference." But, I can tell you, we will now shortcut some things b/c we know we can, and the homeowner cares not. I think this is just a very human reaction. Some of you will take issue with our small shortcuts given this situation, I am sure.

Now-- back to replying about the general thread. What I really enjoy is the breadth of experience and input given in this forum. Since there are so many real pros here, it is great to receive their best thinking.

We do not confront the little piggies when we do paint for them. It's their home and life. I do think that some h/owners do hire out a paint job based on the thinking that paint cleans up dirt. I guess painting over dirt makes it disappear like magic. Same with cheapo apartment paint jobs.

We clean what we must to paint--as in, sure we use a vac and or dust brush to clear a path for the paint! Why mess up your best brush? 

The cleaning aspect is just a sore spot with me. Recently, we got hired to re-paint an old farmhouse that had a very bad rodent problem. The new owner just set poison out and we had to smell dead rodents for month. 

This may be complaining, but whatever it is, these are conditions we do put up with in order to make a living painting in upstate NY.

I liked Vermont's suggestion to explain to the homeowner what should be done to save money prior to our arrival. I think I will incorporate that into my little sales pitch.

JTP


----------



## Joewho (Apr 17, 2007)

I like vermonts answer too. It sounds like the best solution before the problem. 

The psychological aspect goes one step further. Using this board to lay it out might prevent you from saying or doing something on the job that you'll regret later. Ha, a support group!

I wouldn't take the shortcuts. I don't take exception to the thinking, it's the most expected thing. I would'nt take the shortcuts because it could be a trap. The HO catches you, the excuse that they are dirty won't float.

It's also faily common to find people who realize that dirt is simple to wash up while paint is more permanent. They may take the attitude that it makes more sense to clean after the painter is gone,.....back to vermonts solution.


----------



## EricTheHandyman (Jan 29, 2008)

Keep in mind, if you don't clean it before you paint, the paint could fail and then you have to come back and do it anyway, better to do it right the first time and charge appropriately for your time.


----------



## Tmrrptr (May 4, 2007)

I've seen some bad ones...

Extended illnesses that ended up ded, and the people had house full of pets.

Flippers bought the houses and we brought em back to reality...

They gotta pay!

It's really hard work.


----------



## Rossiter Painting (Jan 31, 2008)

I don't usually clean up a home owners mess unless its just plain disgusting. One of my least favorite places to paint is around the Toilet. And then it just makes it even worse when its filthy.


----------



## Rich (Apr 26, 2007)

Rossiter Painting said:


> One of my least favorite places to paint is around the Toilet. And then it just makes it even worse when its filthy.


my SOP is to wrap toilets in plastic before going near them
have done this since day 1


----------



## CobraCDN (Jan 8, 2008)

I've had a few that I've flat out refused to paint the kitchen and the bathroom untill it was washed down..... I still got all the jobs... thing is to be tactfull and firm... we're professionals and we want our results to reflect it... most customers I've dealt with understand that.
Cheers


----------



## APC (Sep 25, 2007)

wrap the toilet! thats one Im using from here out- ablsolutley disgusting area to work.


----------



## Thepaintman (Jan 17, 2008)

Great idea. I think I will invent a "toilet cover" to distribute to paint stores for painters. Any takers? Any investors?


----------



## Housepainter (Jan 6, 2008)

Army Surplus, large green duffle bag:jester::whistling2:


----------



## Thomas Zayatz (Feb 26, 2008)

*Hazmat Suit?*



Thepaintman said:


> Great idea. I think I will invent a "toilet cover" to distribute to paint stores for painters. Any takers? Any investors?


Yes, I agree this is worthy of additional 'Research and Development" to develop a great product. For a larger area that is "foul" I'd use a Hazmat Suit.


----------



## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Between, the roaches, droppings, grease, mold, and urine, some of the houses I've painted were worse then a waste treatment plant. 
I carry my PPE where ever I go.


----------



## Faron79 (Dec 11, 2007)

*Cleaner AND Painter!!*

This thread is pretty cool!
The comment about people leaning stuff against new paint reminded me...

If you guys don't already do this...
* Educate clients about "Cure-times" of paint.
* "Dry-to-the-touch" DOESN'T MEAN it's ready to be washed/abused!
* In bathrooms, tell them to wait a day or two before steam and water-drops hit it.
* Inside of a month, the film is still "tender".
* Full washability is ONE MONTH away...I even saw a BM Spec-sheet that said this exact thing!
* It takes a while for that slow "hardening-off" process.

Hopefully, this info. will head off some trouble/complaints before you even pick up a brush.
Plus, the client will (hopefully!) feel a little more knowledgeable about their beautiful new paintjob...and therefore more careful with it!!!

Faron


----------



## painttofish (Aug 28, 2007)

Rich said:


> my SOP is to wrap toilets in plastic before going near them
> have done this since day 1


But how do you wrap it without going near it :whistling2:


----------



## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

*RE: Cleaning The Toilet Tips*

Post By Nick (Guest Post) (11/29/2005)







My favorite toilet cleaning brand is Comet. I use comet powered cleaner with bleach in my toilet and it works great because it gets my tough stains out from under the rim and were the water line is!

(Steps How To Clean The Toilet)

1. First put up both lids and flush the toilet.

Put your plastic gloves on first you idiot--

2. Then put a generous amount of cleaning powder or liquid into the toilet.

You mean blow this sucker up don't you?

3. Get your toilet brush and scrub away, make sure you get under the rim and were the water line is.

Say WHAT?

4. Let the product sit for at least 5 to 10 minutes then flush.

Get some etching acid.

5. Use a disinfectant spray or wipe for the outside of the toilet then clean it up.

Bag the entire toilet using proper protective gear and a Ray-Gun

(Do not mix any cleaning products together, could cause Flames)

((You mean like mixing bleach and amonia could cause flames? Hey Nick--yeah you man--get a life and stop writing to boards about this kinda stuff, OK?))


Or--JTP says: "I ain't paintin' round this bowl for no kinda money. If'n you don't bag that monster up, I'm history sister!:icon_eek: Cya!


----------



## Purdygirl (Mar 3, 2008)

Brilliant!!!! I always cover the toilets but never thought of wrappping the whole thing in plastic!!! When you just throw a drop over the toilet, you still deal with that part where your head gets really close to the bowl while you're trying to cut in the baseboard behind the throne.. 
From now on I'm a wrapper. 
Thanks, this is a great site!


----------

