# Painting built-in bookcase: HVLP vs. Airless (and types of paint)



## Achilles

Hello, I’m building a built-in bookcase and I can’t decide what type of system I should use to spray the the bookcase with or what type of paint to use. 

A few years back, I did a similar project using an airless and latex paint but wasn’t satisfied with the outcome. It looked nice, and the wife was happy, but it was a little tacky and I was hoping for a smoother/ harder finish. 

I really struggle with becoming obsessed with perfection in my work so much that, if it wasn’t for my wife talking me out of it, I would have just ripped it all out and started over. Therefore, I really want to get this right this go around. 

I have an airless sprayer but I’m willing to invest in a HVLP system if that’s the best way to go. Any advice would be appreciated. 

A little more info if needed.

The material used will be mdf and poplar for the face frames of the cabinets underneath the bookcase. 

I will also be spraying wainscoting as well after this job and will probably be using the same approach as I do with the bookcase (If recommended). 

Lastly, I have heard a lot of talk about Ben Moore’s Advance paint for cabinetry. Does anyone have any experience with this product?


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## Wildbill7145

Achilles, just out of curiosity is painting your occupation?


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## Achilles

Wildbill7145 said:


> Achilles, just out of curiosity is painting your occupation?




Yes. I’m also a GC. However, I have little to no experience with painting cabinetry/ furniture. 


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## Woodco

if it cleans up with water, its better to use an airless.


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## finishesbykevyn

I've sprayed bookshelves with an airless, but find it a little aggressive. I also find that every airless I use likes to spit before and after trigger pull.
I use an Hvlp in my shop for some stuff using Advance with good success. Only issue is trying to get into tight spots with the cup gun..It has way more control for a finer finish though.
In a water based product for shelving, my choice would be either Advance or Scuffx. Both BM products.
You may consider a pressure pot or an air assisted airless. I'm also trying to justify spending some money on another system. .


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## Achilles

finishesbykevyn said:


> I've sprayed bookshelves with an airless, but find it a little aggressive. I also find that every airless I use likes to spit before and after trigger pull.
> I use an Hvlp in my shop for some stuff using Advance with good success. Only issue is trying to get into tight spots with the cup gun..It has way more control for a finer finish though.
> In a water based product for shelving, my choice would be either Advance or Scuffx. Both BM products.
> You may consider a pressure pot or an air assisted airless. I'm also trying to justify spending some money on another system. .
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk




It’s good to hear that you’ve had success with HVLP and advance! That’s the direction I’ve been leaning toward.

If you don’t mind asking, what tip are you using? 

How much did you have to thin advance in order for it to spray? I’ve heard a lot of people having troubles with it for being so thick. 


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## finishesbykevyn

Achilles said:


> It’s good to hear that you’ve had success with HVLP and advance! That’s the direction I’ve been leaning toward.
> 
> If you don’t mind asking, what tip are you using?
> 
> How much did you have to thin advance in order for it to spray? I’ve heard a lot of people having troubles with it for being so thick.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


HVLPs in general are not known for spraying Latex. However I actually don't find Advance very thick comparative to other products. 
Although, I do thin about 5-7%. It helps to have your paint warm as well.
I also spray INSLX Stix through my HVLP.
I use an 80 gal. Air tank, through filters. I spray through the 3M Accuspray gun with a 1.8 or 2.0 tip. Tank pressure at 90lbs , gun pressure at about 24lbs. 
Humidity between 40-60%.
If you were to get a portable unit. I like the looks of the Graco 9.5. Some others on here may have more opinions on the turbine units. I also want to get one for field work.

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## Redux

Picked up a Fuji Q5 a couple of weeks ago with a Fuji 5175g T75 
gravity feed gun. Read the reviews about the cup leaking beforehand. Sure enough I got a leaker, pretty bad too. It started leaking during its 5th use. It wasn’t cross threaded, the lid and cup where threaded were always kept clean and not with Scotch-brite abrasive pads. IMO, the gun is absolutely useless to me at this point. Although I can’t offer advice on spraying Advance with an HVLP setup, I can offer advice on which gun to probably stay away from...


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## RH

I have sprayed numerous built in bookcases with my airless. Use a fflp tip and dial down your pressure (experiment on some old pieces of plywood or even some large pieces of brown paper). The last thing I would do is invest in an HVLP for this type of work (and yes, I own one; a FIJI 4 stage). I bought mine for spraying latex enamels on doors and cabinets and experienced nothing but frustration trying to get to get it “right”. However, my Graco 395 with a 310 fflp tip has provided outstanding results. Just sharing my experiences in using both.


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## RH

d


Alchemy Redux said:


> Picked up a Fuji Q5 a couple of weeks ago with a Fuji 5175g T75
> gravity feed gun. Read the reviews about the cup leaking beforehand. Sure enough I got a leaker, pretty bad too. It started leaking during its 5th use. It wasn’t cross threaded, the lid and cup where threaded were always kept clean and not with Scotch-brite abrasive pads. IMO, the gun is absolutely useless to me at this point. Although I can’t offer advice on spraying Advance with an HVLP setup, I can offer advice on which gun to probably stay away from...


I too have the FUJI gravity feed gun. Don’t know what it is but they will often leak if not seated just right (and it’s always with enamels or primers - never with stains or clearcoats). I have learned to practice spray against some cardboard or large piece of paper and check for leaking. If it is starting I shut it off and spray off the pressure, and then loosen and retighten the cap. That will almost always fix the issue. Annoying yes, and one shouldn’t have to deal with it at all, but once you get the knack of stopping it, it more or less becomes a none issue.


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## Redux

RH said:


> d
> 
> I too have the FUJI gravity feed gun. Don’t know what it is but they will often leak if not seated just right (and it’s always with enamels or primers - never with stains or clearcoats). I have learned to practice spray against some cardboard or large piece of paper and check for leaking. If it is starting I shut it off and spray off the pressure, and then loosen and retighten the cap. That will almost always fix the issue. Annoying yes, and one shouldn’t have to deal with it at all, but once you get the knack of stopping it, it more or less becomes a none issue.


The gun itself produces nice results with clear finishes and the turbine is great. Did two kitchen sets with the EM8000 CV producing beautiful results. The first set I didn’t have any odd angles keeping the cup 3/4 full, the material not coming into contact with the lid, so no leaking/dripping.  The 2nd set had some tight difficult angles and started leaking as soon as the material came into contact with the lid. I stopped several times, depressurized, cleaned, and reseated the lid. To no avail it was still leaking, and pretty badly at that. The problem appears to be where the cup is seamed. There are two little plastic nibs sticking out where the lid seats. Maybe a sanding block with psa sandpaper will remedy it. I’m going to order up a few cups just to have spares on hand and maybe a pot setup with another gun, eliminating the cup altogether. I’m anxious to try it out with acrylic paints....the results with acrylics TBD...probably futile at best as many before me such as yourself have been there/tried it..


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## RH

Alchemy Redux said:


> The gun itself produces nice results with clear finishes and the turbine is great. Did two kitchen sets with the EM8000 CV producing beautiful results. The first set I didn’t have any odd angles keeping the cup 3/4 full, the material not coming into contact with the lid, so no leaking/dripping. The 2nd set had some tight difficult angles and started leaking as soon as the material came into contact with the lid. I stopped several times, depressurized, cleaned, and reseated the lid. To no avail it was still leaking, and pretty badly at that. The problem appears to be where the cup is seamed. There are two little plastic nibs sticking out where the lid seats. Maybe a sanding block with psa sandpaper will remedy it. I’m going to order up a few cups just to have spares on hand and maybe a pot setup with another gun, eliminating the cup altogether. I’m anxious to try it out with acrylic paints....the results with acrylics TBD...probably futile at best as many before me such as yourself have been there/tried it..


I don’t clean anything when reseating the lid (except the outside of the cup). Perhaps the small amount of product film on the gasket/cup rim from when it first leaks acts as a sealant, I don’t know. Have to say I am not typically holding the gun at difficult angles, usually just spraying downwards.


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## Achilles

RH said:


> I have sprayed numerous built in bookcases with my airless. Use a fflp tip and dial down your pressure (experiment on some old pieces of plywood or even some large pieces of brown paper). The last thing I would do is invest in an HVLP for this type of work (and yes, I own one; a FIJI 4 stage). I bought mine for spraying latex enamels on doors and cabinets and experienced nothing but frustration trying to get to get it “right”. However, my Graco 395 with a 310 fflp tip has provided outstanding results. Just sharing my experiences in using both.




That’s good to know! I will definitely try that tip out! What paint are you getting the best results out of for cabinetry? 


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## RH

Achilles said:


> That’s good to know! I will definitely try that tip out! What paint are you getting the best results out of for cabinetry?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I will use Kelly Moore’s Dura-Poxi, SW’s Pro Industrial Multi-Surface Acrylic, or SW’s Pro Classic acrylic enamel depending on the situation. The Dura-Poxi is probably my favorite.


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## Achilles

RH said:


> I will use Kelly Moore’s Dura-Poxi, SW’s Pro Industrial Multi-Surface Acrylic, or SW’s Pro Classic acrylic enamel depending on the situation. The Dura-Poxi is probably my favorite.




Good to know! And you have had success using all those with an airless? 


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## RH

Achilles said:


> Good to know! And you have had success using all those with an airless?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yes. The Pro Industrial Multi Surface is really designed to be sprayed rather than brushed/rolled.


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## finishesbykevyn

RH said:


> I have sprayed numerous built in bookcases with my airless. Use a fflp tip and dial down your pressure (experiment on some old pieces of plywood or even some large pieces of brown paper). The last thing I would do is invest in an HVLP for this type of work (and yes, I own one; a FIJI 4 stage). I bought mine for spraying latex enamels on doors and cabinets and experienced nothing but frustration trying to get to get it “right”. However, my Graco 395 with a 310 fflp tip has provided outstanding results. Just sharing my experiences in using both.


I've probably asked you this before..rh, but do you not have any issues with spitting from your graco airless?

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## RH

finishesbykevyn said:


> I've probably asked you this before..rh, but do you not have any issues with spitting from your graco airless?
> 
> Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk


It’s an on again off again issue - fortunately more off. If I did much more fine finish work than I do, or planned on doing it much longer, I’d try out another brand of gun. A few members have mentioned other brands/models that seem not to have that problem.


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## cocomonkeynuts

finishesbykevyn said:


> ... I like the looks of the Graco 9.5. Some others on here may have more opinions on the turbine units. I also want to get one for field work.
> 
> Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk



The graco 9.5 sprays cabinetcoat unthinned. Everyone likes the gun that comes with it better too. Not sure about advance. The pressurized liners are nice and the 9.5 procomp has a built in compressor to help with thicker latex.


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## Achilles

Thanks for all the advice! 


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## Mr Smith

finishesbykevyn said:


> I've sprayed bookshelves with an airless, but find it a little aggressive. I also find that every airless I use likes to spit before and after trigger pull.
> I use an Hvlp in my shop for some stuff using Advance with good success. Only issue is trying to get into tight spots with the cup gun..It has way more control for a finer finish though.
> In a water based product for shelving, my choice would be either Advance or Scuffx. Both BM products.
> You may consider a pressure pot or an air assisted airless. I'm also trying to justify spending some money on another system. .
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk


You need to repack your gun. It should never spit.


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## Mr Smith

I tried without success for years trying to dial in my HVLP for acrylic paints and eventually sold it.

It was a 3 stage turbine unit with a built-in compressor. I also had the 2 gallon pressure pot. I had two brand new guns with different nozzles so I didn't have to change for thinner coatings. 

I tried everything possible. I had to reduce paint a ridiculous 40% just to get it to spray acrylics.

That being said, I never tried a 6 stage HVLP. Titan has the 115 model. A painter named Damon (moderator too) used to post in here and he had a Titan 115 for spraying Kem Aqua wb lacquer. I don't think he was very happy with it towards the end.

The Idaho painter uses a Titan 115 HVLP for spraying kitchen cabinets with conventional Sherwin Williams high build precat lacquer.


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## finishesbykevyn

Mr Smith said:


> You need to repack your gun. It should never spit.


I bought a brand new one. Still spits.. 

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## finishesbykevyn

Mr Smith said:


> I tried without success for years trying to dial in my HVLP for acrylic paints and eventually sold it.
> 
> It was a 3 stage turbine unit with a built-in compressor. I also had the 2 gallon pressure pot. I had two brand new guns with different nozzles so I didn't have to change for thinner coatings.
> 
> I tried everything possible. I had to reduce paint a ridiculous 40% just to get it to spray acrylics.
> 
> That being said, I never tried a 6 stage HVLP. Titan has the 115 model. A painter named Damon (moderator too) used to post in here and he had a Titan 115 for spraying Kem Aqua wb lacquer. I don't think he was very happy with it towards the end.
> 
> The Idaho painter uses a Titan 115 HVLP for spraying kitchen cabinets with conventional Sherwin Williams high build precat lacquer.


 I'm no expert in the turbine world, but I would think you need atleast a 5 or 6 stage to spray latex. 

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## RH

Always thought that if I was going to really get into fine finish work, had the money to spend, and knew I would be doing it for another ten years (at least), I’d buy a AAA system. But, it seems I read somewhere not long ago that even those have their problems.


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## Packard

Keep in mind that if you are spraying MDF with a water based finish, all the factory surfaces will take the paint fine. All the cut or machined edges will have to be sealed before painting or the fibers will absorb the water and the "grain" will raise. It will look like painted sandpaper (from my experience). 

You say you will be using face frames, in which case only a few short edges will be exposed. An oil based finish can be brushed on those surfaces or BIN shellac based primer. (Some water based finishes have a problem going over shellac, so test first.)

Other than that, I find that MDF takes finish well--better than most other substrates.


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