# Painting wall tile-suggestions?



## Masterpiece (Feb 26, 2008)

Got a call from a client that's moving into an old mansion soon. I have yet to inspect it myself, but according to the customer there is 4" square ceramic tile on the walls in the kitchen from the floor to the chair rail. They've asked for it to be painted and so I'm checking out some methods to clean, prep and paint the surface successfully.

If any have painted ceramic tile before with lasting results, suggestions are welcome.
So far, I'm looking at some cleaning solution/degreaser (perhaps ammonia/water mix,etc) to clean the tile and possible using a sander to rough up the surface just enough to give a little more tooth.
I've also considered an acid etching mix, not sure yet.

I've read of some using BIN shellac to prime w/an oil paint for durability but also am going to check out SW's Tile Clad and some 2 part epoxies...

Jeremy


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## tsunamicontract (May 3, 2008)

sounds like a job for XIM Tile Doc?


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## ewingpainting.net (Jun 2, 2008)

tsunamicontract said:


> sounds like a job for XIM Tile Doc?


My thoughts exactly


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## Jeff.Chicago (May 19, 2008)

ewingpainting.net said:


> My thoughts exactly



I agree x3! :thumbup:


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## greensboro84 (Feb 15, 2008)

I really have no clue, but off the top of my head, anything waterbased, i would think, would be a big NO. I mean, we've done tile in old bathrooms on rental repaints, it just looks stupid. But def, an oil based product would be the way to go. I guess you should sand it to get some tooth, but I don't know if that applies to ceramic like it does wood and plaster. IDK, ill leave this question to the pros


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## ibsocal (Apr 17, 2007)

Clean all tile with a strong cleaner to remove oils and grease etc.i use mek but u can use what ever your green heart desires that u know will get the same thing done (clean it).make sure u r using clean rags,dont spread oils and if u use solvents shut off pilot lights and use a blower and charcoal filtered respirator.once its clean mask off.i use a wipe on primer silane vs acid etching and spray with a turbine hvlp a polyurethane 3-4 coats 15 min between coats.u could use epoxies as well but they can yellow with time.STAY AWAY FROM THOSE DIY KITS.:laughing:


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## Masterpiece (Feb 26, 2008)

Thanks for the input guys. I did speak w/a rep about XIM's Tile Doc but my only concern at the time is that if I remember correctly, it's only in quart form and no gallons. 
That's not a deal breaker of course since it's a specialized product, but was just keeping my options open for any other proven and durable methods. 
I'm going to check out the XIM tomorrow and see what specific prep they recommend (ie whether or not any scuffing/sanding is recommended,etc) before meeting with the client.
I'm still curious about the BIN Shellac as a primer but this isn't the time to experiment...

Jeremy


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## Primer Guy (Apr 20, 2007)

Tile Doc is available in gallons on special order. For a perfect job, you can use Etch-I-M etching gel ( its reusable) to dull the surface and give more tooth (it beats sanding) . Your local paint supplier can order all of this directly from XIM. BTW- Tile Doc can be tinted to pastel colors.


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## Dmax Consulting (Jul 22, 2008)

XIM Tile Doc it perfect. Once you have used the Tile Doc, I think that using TileClad or any other 2 part epoxy will be overkill for a residential kitchen. If you want a satin finish, you can use use Sherwin's All Surface Enamel Alkyd base. If a gloss finish is okay, use Sherwin's Industrial enamel Urethane. Its a single component urethane thats is awesome. I just used some on exterior metal stairwells and the job rocks.


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## ibsocal (Apr 17, 2007)

:no:tiledoc:no:
@ around 30-40 bucks a qt vs a pro grade acrylic urethane @ 65 bucks a gal.a pint of silane @ around 20 bucks vs acid etch mess,U dont have a good clue as to what your doing or getting into but:rockon:


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## Wolverine (Apr 17, 2007)

We come across this alot since our customers do so much work in food and drug manufacturing. We make a silane treatment for tile and other vitreous substrates... Many of our applicators just do a light grind and use our BondTite 1101 but... I would recommend a good silane treatment as well...


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## Safety Guy (Jul 19, 2007)

We have great results with XIM in this sort of application. I am trying to find something that stuff will not stick to.


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## Masterpiece (Feb 26, 2008)

Well, just an update: We compromised after the clients (younger couple) let the SW rep talk them into trying their Tile Clad 2 part epoxy. It was going in the kitchen including around the sink area so we decided to try it for them. 
Not much to the application, after cleaning/rinsing, mix the 2 parts and apply w/a foam roller and brush (don't plan on keeping). Actually a few foam rollers since they like to start falling apart after 15mins

Ended up leveling pretty nicely and has a great gloss shine to it, which the clients wanted and were very happy with. It ran about $105 for the 2 parts, 1 gallon each.

Another individual in a hair salon wants me to use the same product on her 1950s tile floor made up of those small ocatagonal tile, as well as the same tile that runs about 4-5ft high up the walls but Tile Clad has a 14day cure time and w/moisture and bathroom traffic, I'm not sure how it would hold up, unless I covered the floor w/plastic and/or cardboard until it fully cured.....hmmm....

BTW, there's a couple of pics of the kitchen in the Photo section. I appreciate the feedback from everyone and will also check into the other products that were mentioned. TileClad is definitely NOT my favorite product to deal with...

Jeremy


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## ibsocal (Apr 17, 2007)

Masterpiece said:


> Well, just an update: We compromised after the clients (younger couple) let the SW rep talk them into trying their Tile Clad 2 part epoxy. It was going in the kitchen including around the sink area so we decided to try it for them.
> Not much to the application, after cleaning/rinsing, mix the 2 parts and apply w/a foam roller and brush (don't plan on keeping). Actually a few foam rollers since they like to start falling apart after 15mins
> 
> Ended up leveling pretty nicely and has a great gloss shine to it, which the clients wanted and were very happy with. It ran about $105 for the 2 parts, 1 gallon each.
> ...


 SW rep told them and U rolled it:bangin::no:.I know u could have found something better than that to use.search bathtub refinishing companies and their suppliers for 411.I dont want to talk about it right now:wallbash::drink:


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## Masterpiece (Feb 26, 2008)

Hehe, I knew you'd freak out (and I don't even know you)

I never mind trying new products as long as I'm sure it's going to work. I don't deal with urethane/silane products and the job's time frame was based on the couple's leaving for the weekend, hence the lack of time to research other suitable products. Either way, the job turned out very nice, the client loved it and we made excellent money on it.

I do plan on looking into what you were referring to though...if you want to be a little more specific in your suggestions, I'm open to anything, such as particular products and where to find them...

Thanks 

Jeremy


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## mattysoftball (May 7, 2008)

TILE DOC ONLY
TILE CLAD AND OTHERS WILL YELLOW
TRUST ME:thumbup:


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## A Better Painter (Jun 25, 2008)

*next time*



Masterpiece said:


> Got a call from a client that's moving into an old mansion soon. I have yet to inspect it myself, but according to the customer there is 4" square ceramic tile on the walls in the kitchen from the floor to the chair rail. They've asked for it to be painted and so I'm checking out some methods to clean, prep and paint the surface successfully.
> 
> If any have painted ceramic tile before with lasting results, suggestions are welcome.
> So far, I'm looking at some cleaning solution/degreaser (perhaps ammonia/water mix,etc) to clean the tile and possible using a sander to rough up the surface just enough to give a little more tooth.
> ...


My first time painting tile was on an exterior of a building, around the doorway, black and white checkerboard ceramic tiles, about an 80 square foot area. The customer wanted them painted red - it was also the first time I used a deep red color. It took a number of coats [as any experienced painter knows (and they all laugh, remembering their first time painting red)] but turned out great... as it always does. :whistling2:

*Here are a few links*: (this is what came up searching for *painting tile*
_this is the first site I saw_:
http://interiordec.about.com/od/tilepainting/Painting_Over_Tile.htm
_on that page, one article is here_:
http://interiordec.about.com/gi/dyn...&bts=1&zu=http://www.grahampaint.com/tile.htm
_same page, this articles says you should sand 'unless you use Zinzer 1 2 3'_
http://interiordec.about.com/gi/dyn...www.ssan.com/howto/paint/paintceramictile.htm
_same page, another article is here_:
http://interiordec.about.com/gi/dyn...//www.alsnetbiz.com/homeimprovement/faq3.html

On another website, one I like, *www.doityourself.com*, I found this:
http://www.doityourself.com/stry/paintceramictile informative article - he says to use OIL based primer and paint as do many other professionals. 

a great website [and television show, and magazine] is www.thisoldhouse.com for
many tips and articles and advice on anything to do around the old house.

I realized, after writing this, that you had already done the job. Sheesh, perhaps some day I'll learn to start posts and reply at the end of the thread :shutup: ~ duh, oh well

I've got a few links on my website to some help tips sites in general, and more to be added as soon as time allows.
As far as specific articles, tips, sugestions and advice directly from others, I like coming here > http://www.painttalk.com


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## Primer Guy (Apr 20, 2007)

skip the sanding to get some "tooth" on tile. Get some Etch-I-M etching gel. Wipe in on, let it sit, wipe it off and rinse. No dust to contaminate your job. Tile Doc is overkill for some of these jobs. It is best used in bathrooms where water splash and immersion is a problem. Use 400W or UMA after the Etch-I-M and a good latex topcoat.


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## timw (Aug 21, 2008)

Mr wolverine 

im in egypt everthing here is either marble, granite, ceramic or cement all the larger business are currently looking for solutions short of removing all the old tiles.

that said I have met with most of the local paint compaies and they think im crazy when i ask about material for use on hard surfaces as mentioned above.

I honestly think some of these people dont understand the products they have or the correct use.

I have been reading whats avialable on the internet for use and it seems like theres not a lot of information. what saline product do you market as a primer?

we resell some hvlp equipment and do some select painting currently.and this subject just keeps coming up ..so i guess its time to start with the real foot work/research

almost every building has water damage just above the tile trim line which is applied at floor level I have suggested to use a clear coat matching the substrate gloss and everybody here claims it cant be done and im crazy.

its very third world here and cost is a major factor on all building programs and maintenance operations within the larger hotel chains/groups

ill be looking over your site later today

thanks for your input/help

Tim 

my background relates to military painting and coatings.


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## ibsocal (Apr 17, 2007)

Your not crazy.do u have pictures of damage.I know me know chemist but i know what i know if u know what i mean.dont answer that.


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## timw (Aug 21, 2008)

will gather up some pictures of the type area i wish to treat and other normal paint failures "here" I see daily on my drive home...most are directly related to a lack of cleaning and pre paint treatments and or cleaning not being done at all. by the local labors and or builders who are also clueless and just blame the paint companies for every failure..

we have been talking with one of the local paint company's and they told me. even the seventy two stores. they have, use contract labor which short cuts every step they can for fast cash. and shortly there after customer complaints follow.


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## oakley (Dec 14, 2007)

I have seen XIM Tile Doc work great, but I have also seen Devoe Mirrolac-WB DP83XX/Devoe Coatings 4206-XXXX waterborne stick directly to clean tiles for a 1 coat system. It it is getting beat on, I would suggest an epoxy. If it decorative, you might cajole your local dealer into giving you a sample.


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