# Refinishing Maple Cabinets



## Paint and Hammer (Feb 26, 2008)

These are about 3 years old. I tried contacting cabinet maker on products used, but he doesn't return calls. I'm sure we can match stain ourselves, as customer is aware it may not be perfect as sun and aged and changed colour a bit already. 

Customer is mostly concerned about a resistant top coat. 

Clear coat product suggestions and considerations?

- Paul


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## MikeCalifornia (Aug 26, 2012)

That is most likely a nitro lacquer, if it is not holding up to the water areas very well. Probably a spray stain as well, as the finish is chipping away from bare wood and not embedded in it. Take a door and have it matched or make your own. You would probably want to just shade everything to blend. Use a vinyl sealer then a precat lacquer.


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## Rcon (Nov 19, 2009)

Those doors weren't stained, they were sprayed with coloured topcoat (toned). What are you trying to do with them Paul? Restain? Solid?

EDIT - looks like you're going to try to touch up the stain. Could be tricky since they weren't stained to begin with. You can try a touch up marker, but if they're really bad then you might want to try to sell them new doors. Just stain them to match the carcass (assuming carcass is in good condition). You could strip, but might be cheaper to get new doors (just shaker and flat doors, not too expensive). 

For product, that depends on what you can work with in that house. For solvent i'd go conversion varnish - MLC EnviroVar. Thin coat of vinyl sealer over squeaky clean surfaces should help reduce fisheye etc. Sheen looks like 20 or 25. For WB you could go Agualente or Aguatana (new only, and use WB stains). I wouldn't use wb clear over a solvent finish.


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## Damon T (Nov 22, 2008)

Rcon said:


> Those doors weren't stained, they were sprayed with coloured topcoat (toned). What are you trying to do with them Paul? Restain? Solid?
> 
> EDIT - looks like you're going to try to touch up the stain. Could be tricky since they weren't stained to begin with. You can try a touch up marker, but if they're really bad then you might want to try to sell them new doors. Just stain them to match the carcass (assuming carcass is in good condition). You could strip, but might be cheaper to get new doors (just shaker and flat doors, not too expensive).
> 
> For product, that depends on what you can work with in that house. For solvent i'd go conversion varnish - MLC EnviroVar. Thin coat of vinyl sealer over squeaky clean surfaces should help reduce fisheye etc. Sheen looks like 20 or 25. For WB you could go Agualente or Aguatana (new only, and use WB stains). I wouldn't use wb clear over a solvent finish.


I agree with Rcon. I did a job a little while back where we had to go over recently finished Cat-lacquer cabs with a product in the customers kitchen to blend in with the rest of the cabinets that were in there. We used Seal Coat and then Daly's Crystal-fin water based poly. It turned out really well. Brushed a few sections and it leveled out perfectly. So you can do WB over solvent, but need a tie coat in between. I went that route for a couple reasons, the cabinet shop had already put too many coats of cat-lacquer on the cabs and they weren't willing to come out and fix their issues of sheen difference with the rest of the existing cabinets.


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## Paint and Hammer (Feb 26, 2008)

Rcon said:


> Those doors weren't stained, they were sprayed with coloured topcoat (toned). What are you trying to do with them Paul? Restain? Solid?
> 
> EDIT - looks like you're going to try to touch up the stain. Could be tricky since they weren't stained to begin with. You can try a touch up marker, but if they're really bad then you might want to try to sell them new doors. Just stain them to match the carcass (assuming carcass is in good condition). You could strip, but might be cheaper to get new doors (just shaker and flat doors, not too expensive).
> 
> For product, that depends on what you can work with in that house. For solvent i'd go conversion varnish - MLC EnviroVar. Thin coat of vinyl sealer over squeaky clean surfaces should help reduce fisheye etc. Sheen looks like 20 or 25. For WB you could go Agualente or Aguatana (new only, and use WB stains). I wouldn't use wb clear over a solvent finish.



Thanks...in this case they want the doors 'repaired'.....as in, doors would be removed and done off site. They are willing to accept the touch up may not be perfect, but are more concerned with a coating that is more durable then what is there now. 

The pics show the worst of it. Most doors do not have any issues which is why I was thinking touch up on stain and top coat.

Carcasses are in good condition.

This isn't the first time I've seen this issue. Is there a 'common' coloured top coat product that cabinet makers use? 

I looked closely at my own cabinets which are Kitchen Kraft about 2 years old (Maple, light), similar shaker style and can see the same issue on one door that is near the sink.


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## Paint and Hammer (Feb 26, 2008)

Damon T said:


> I agree with Rcon. I did a job a little while back where we had to go over recently finished Cat-lacquer cabs with a product in the customers kitchen to blend in with the rest of the cabinets that were in there. We used Seal Coat and then Daly's Crystal-fin water based poly. It turned out really well. Brushed a few sections and it leveled out perfectly. So you can do WB over solvent, but need a tie coat in between. I went that route for a couple reasons, the cabinet shop had already put too many coats of cat-lacquer on the cabs and they weren't willing to come out and fix their issues of sheen difference with the rest of the existing cabinets.


Good to know, I'd brush out that bullnose.

Similar situation here, customer contacted cabinet shop, they came out and said she wasn't caring for them properly. I called and emailed numerous times to enquire what products used, but more so what colour of stain, but they never replied. 

What sprayer do you work with Damon?


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## Paradigmzz (May 5, 2010)

Its all toned. I see rcon posted, im sure he said the same havent read yet. Water prone areas delaminate, especially when the stain is riding in the clear coat. Granite countertop with bullnose? It will happen again, you may be able to buy a few years. Rule of thumb, you can put poly over lacquer, not the other way around.


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## Paradigmzz (May 5, 2010)

haha... I just looked at first pick. get some wiping stain and some wipe on poly. its an easy stop gap. polyshades works in a pinch. call me when you get some time later today, want to talk.shirts with.you...


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## Paint and Hammer (Feb 26, 2008)

Arg....I just checked PT...been swearing off during the day as I have to avoid the PT black hole to stay financially responsible. : )

Sure....let's chat. Today and tomorrow I have a full house if trades going, but I'll text ya shortly.


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## playedout6 (Apr 27, 2009)

I have a customer who has the same problem as these cabinets above only worse and she is furious at the cabinet guy . She is a clean freak and washes/wipes them a lot and they have many flaws now showing and they are only 2 years old . I told her I had little interest in touching them because I figured more to go wrong than right on them and she is VERY fussy !!! Now that I see that others have conquered or have had success in applying poly with a brush on these , I might revisit her and throw her a figure to do them . I probably will go with an oil poly and try and match up the color before I start . Great thread guys ! Thanks .


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## paintcore.ca (Apr 5, 2010)

We have done a bunch of these jobs. It has defiantly been toned or spray stain only. You can touch it up but it's only a touch up and if the client is happy with that I guess that's fine. Some Cabinet shops cut corners this way. I'm fine with toning but only as a multi step process. Wiping stain is a must IMO. You could touch up and re tone everything a bit darker to blend. Just make sure you clean,clean,clean. And sand well with a fine grit, even scratch pattern. You could use water base if its the right product. I wouldn't use a water based lacquer tho. I have used aluminium oxide clears with great success over solvent. Nano defence from rustoleum is awesome for something like this. Stuff is nails and sticks to everything when prepped right. It is expensive, like $75 a gallon here in Canada.


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## Damon T (Nov 22, 2008)

Paint and Hammer said:


> Good to know, I'd brush out that bullnose.
> 
> Similar situation here, customer contacted cabinet shop, they came out and said she wasn't caring for them properly. I called and emailed numerous times to enquire what products used, but more so what colour of stain, but they never replied.
> 
> What sprayer do you work with Damon?


A Titan 115 hvlp mainly, but I did a wipe finish on that particular refinish job, and then brushed the seal coat and WB poly on the new cabs where the sheen didn't match existing. I was really impressed with how well it leveled.


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## Paint and Hammer (Feb 26, 2008)

paintcore.ca said:


> We have done a bunch of these jobs. It has defiantly been toned or spray stain only. You can touch it up but it's only a touch up and if the client is happy with that I guess that's fine. Some Cabinet shops cut corners this way. I'm fine with toning but only as a multi step process. Wiping stain is a must IMO. You could touch up and re tone everything a bit darker to blend. Just make sure you clean,clean,clean. And sand well with a fine grit, even scratch pattern. You could use water base if its the right product. I wouldn't use a water based lacquer tho. I have used aluminium oxide clears with great success over solvent. Nano defence from rustoleum is awesome for something like this. Stuff is nails and sticks to everything when prepped right. It is expensive, like $75 a gallon here in Canada.



Thanks for the advise/contribution.....nice website and work!

-Paul


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