# ProVT Wet Edge Time



## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

Hello friends,

Need some advice if you don't mind helping me out. I am in the middle of doing a barn restoration. I have applied a first coat of Cabot's ProVT. Since the span is 40 feet x 60 feet and I am spraying, what technique do you suggest I use to prevent lap marks. Keeping a wet edge is the only way I know to prevent lapping.

I cannot simply wait for overcast days and much of the staining will have to be done in direct and full sun light. Would you use an latex extender like Flotrol?

Any ideas will be helpful. I am using an articulated lift but moving along, even though much faster than moving ladders, still cuts down on my ability to keep a wet edge.

Pictures are from last year. But you get the idea of the size involved. Thanks. 

Stan--if you are listening--the exterior brown glue worked out very well so far.

JTP

Thanks all.

JTP


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

JTP

I dont do much exterior spraying these days, and there are guys here that can jump in with more ideas...but since you are a buddy, here are my thoughts:

I am assuming its horizontal clapboard siding on the upper section and just vertical barnboard at the bottom? Or is it vertical all the way and they just havent installed blocking yet in these pics?

I suppose in either case, it doesnt look as if there are any ungodly runs of siding that arent broken up by window openings. While I dont spray much exterior, I do a lot of lift work and can tell you without a doubt that its much better as a two man operation...one guy operating the machine and one guy on the spraying. This reminds me of a barn restoration we did back in the 90's...I'll see if I can find a pic.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

JT

This is from about '93...before I ever set foot in a lift or owned a sprayer. Did it the good old fashioned way, and I think it took all summer. 

I'm glad you are using technology. These things are beasts.


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

Scott-

Supposed to rain all day here tomorrow. But next op, I'll get the updated pictures on line. The lap board runs horizontal. Just the t&g on bottom is run vertical.

Having a driver makes sense. And, that is certainly doable. Appreciate your response my friend.

BTW-- White series 800 ProVT being used for the main and trim out in red--go figure. The owner wants exactly the opposite of the tradiional red body with white accent.

JTP


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## IHATE_HOMEDEPOT (May 27, 2008)

Hey whatya know my first post! Painting the boards before they go up would be best.

You would be well off to get yourself a 4'-5' extension with a swivel head ($80) for your gun,that is assuming you are not back brushing. Scott that barn you painted looks Xcellent.


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## GMack (Jan 18, 2008)

I wish you were using the Cabot solid oil instead of the ProVt; it would obviously stay open longer . . .

Are you spraying and backbrushing or just spraying. Either way, don't get too greedy with the sprayer. For example, say it's clapboard siding and you know you can easily spray 10 or more boards per move from where you are. Don't do it. Keep the lift moving accross and spray 4 at a time. (I'm making up the numbers; you know what you can safely do to avoid lap marks) . . . When we spray outside, it's a game of leapfrog: Two guys on two ladders. guy one sprays a section and hands off sprayer to guy two. Guy one brushes out what he just sprayed while guy two is spraying his section. In the meantime, guy one has finished brushing out his section and is off the ladder and moving the ladder around the other side of guy two. As guy one gets back up the ladder on the other side of guy two, guy two hands him the sprayer and finishes brushing out his section. Guy one sprays . . . With four guys, we go around most houses twice in one day.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

You shouldn't have too many problems with white. The weather conditions may be the most important aspect to spraying it. Not too windy and of course not in the direct sun. Cut it with Flotrol and have at least two guys spraying next to each others(one gun or two guns). One is always spraying while the other is leap frogging around him. Dont spray too much at a time, keep over the ladder, about 6-8 feet high at a time and keep working across. Got too hustle. When you get to about 25-30 feet dump the ladders and get a 20ft extension pole for your gun and finish it up.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

GM

I thought you would have some good tips...remember a couple of 4th of July's ago when you painted that rather large red barn here in my town (for my former customer!)...

NEPS

JTP is using a lift here and the siding is vertical, so I dont think it should be that difficult to keep wet vertically compared to horizontally...what do you guys think, easier on vertical in terms of maneuvering the lift to stay on top of it?


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

vermontpainter said:


> GM
> 
> I thought you would have some good tips...remember a couple of 4th of July's ago when you painted that rather large red barn here in my town (for my former customer!)...
> 
> ...


 
OH ...WELL THEN. ITS A >>>>>>>>>










///////////still add some flotrol.................


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

That looks pretty good


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

JTP said:


> Hello friends,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It should be easier too keep a wet edge. The edge you should be worried about is the verticles. Just keep moving horizontal, dont get too fat and dont use a fat tip. Use a new 517 every 25-30 gallons and make sure your pressure is up.


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

*Super Suggestions*

Thanks for the great ideas and suggestions. I must confess, however, that I am a one man show. I can get a helper to drive the rig around while I spray. 

I did think about using oil solid stain instead of the ProVt. It was suggested to me that the ProVT would work just fine, and I think it will as long as I move along and keep that wet edge.

I really will have to do some spraying in direct sun light I think. It would be great to pick and choose the right days for this, but scheduling considerations mean I have to move along. I think I'll try the Flotrol to increase wet edge time and get me a chaffeur for big momma.

The pictures are from last year, but I will update soon with the barn completed. So, can't do any ground work--wood is up and dry. 

Addtionally, I am going to try my old paint pot and compresser--the old 2 1/2 gallon pot can lay some paint on. The lap board is smooth pine. The soffits, facia, window trim are all rough sawn--altogether juice suckers. Think I'll just spray with the compressor rig, load up the grain and back brush.

I know the airless will do the same thing, but using the pot will not wear my tips or the piston out. Just bought a Titan for this specific job.

Thanks all. Please keep the suggestions coming. They are truly appreciated.

JTP


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## GMack (Jan 18, 2008)

vermontpainter said:


> GM
> 
> I thought you would have some good tips...remember a couple of 4th of July's ago when you painted that rather large red barn here in my town (for my former customer!)...
> 
> Yep, the thing I remember most is that we were working the 4th of July! BTW, thanks! He's a great customer.


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## tsunamicontract (May 3, 2008)

gmack thats brilliant. i never thought past just having a guy leapfroging the ladders for me. maybe I will try that tomorrow, assuming the wind stays in check. Were you running two sprayers or two guns, 1 sprayer? 4 guys leap-spraying or two leapspraying 1 tending the sprayer, one running around masking, doing other stuff?


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> GM
> 
> I thought you would have some good tips...remember a couple of 4th of July's ago when you painted that rather large red barn here in my town (for my former customer!)...
> 
> ...


Scott-- The siding is horizontal except for the bottom where it runs vertically. Two and 1/2 stories the siding runs horizontal. Knew I should have taken pictures today--as they say they are worth a words.

JTP


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

JTP said:


> Thanks for the great ideas and suggestions. I must confess, however, that I am a one man show. I can get a helper to drive the rig around while I spray.
> 
> I did think about using oil solid stain instead of the ProVt. It was suggested to me that the ProVT would work just fine, and I think it will as long as I move along and keep that wet edge.
> 
> ...


You might be there a while with that pot. ...The paint one. The airless and backroll the boards should go fine even if your alone in the bucket. Just work 6 feet at a time and dont forget the sunblock!


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## GMack (Jan 18, 2008)

tsunamicontract said:


> gmack thats brilliant. i never thought past just having a guy leapfroging the ladders for me. maybe I will try that tomorrow, assuming the wind stays in check. Were you running two sprayers or two guns, 1 sprayer? 4 guys leap-spraying or two leapspraying 1 tending the sprayer, one running around masking, doing other stuff?


One sprayer . . . depending on the setup of the side you're on, you work it different ways but usually you'll have two guys up high on the extensions doing the leapfrog thing. If there is a lot of cutting and tight spaces down low then you have a couple guys cutting around it all (lights, small sections of clapboard, etc) with their brushes. If it's wide open down low then the sprayer gets passed down and back up. And like NEPS said, you HUSTLE. We'll be spraying one on wednesday with a pretty green crew but by the end of the summer, they'll have it down pat.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

GMack said:


> One sprayer . . . depending on the setup of the side you're on, you work it different ways but usually you'll have two guys up high on the extensions doing the leapfrog thing. If there is a lot of cutting and tight spaces down low then you have a couple guys cutting around it all (lights, small sections of clapboard, etc) with their brushes. If it's wide open down low then the sprayer gets passed down and back up. And like NEPS said, you HUSTLE. We'll be spraying one on wednesday with a pretty green crew but by the end of the summer, they'll have it down pat.


1 guy working ahead covering windows, shrubs ect
1 guy cutting
1 guy humping ladders and paint
2 guys spraying and leapfroggin'


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## GMack (Jan 18, 2008)

NEPS.US said:


> 1 guy working ahead covering windows, shrubs ect
> 1 guy cutting
> 1 guy humping ladders and paint
> 2 guys spraying and leapfroggin'


We have a name for the guys tying off the shrubs, masking lights, and moving the sprayer setup: Ground Pounders.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

We call them Timhags


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

*Wet Edge Pics*

Here is the monster job for JTP. It's in the works as you can see and all the suggestions are appreciated. Wish I had some people to play leap frog with, but I don't. There is a sister barn about 1/2 the size, but that one is not a critical component of the job.

I think going slowingly and switching out to a 517 from a 415 tip on the second coat will make a difference. I didn't want to load up the first coat of ProVt. But, it definitely needs a heavier final coat for coverage and wet edge time. The lift makes a hugh difference and if I spray 4 or 5 boards, 8 feet at a time, I should be able to keep the open time to prevent lapping.

JTP


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## GMack (Jan 18, 2008)

Two coats on that bear by yourself? JTP, you are the man!


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## Dave Mac (May 4, 2007)

GMack said:


> Two coats on that bear by yourself? JTP, you are the man!


 
thats what I was thinking, good job :thumbsup:


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

*Knots--*

Interesting point to make about some prep work on this job. 

I was in contact with another PT member last year who suggested I use brown exterior carpenter's glue to prime the knots. At first, I was somewhat skeptical, but this fellow swore it was the best knot primer since who knows when.

I experimented with BIN, Cover Stain, and the wood glue last year. Guess what--the wood glue kicked a--! Stan explained that the reason the glue works better than almost any other knot sealer is--it contracts and expands with the wood. A primer is far more brittle and likely to split with the constant expansion and contraction of wood. Once the seal on the primer is broken, well--you get that bleed through. This is one job I absolutely did not want to do again for free.

I picked up 5 gallons of Tite Bond III Exterior Brown Carpenter's glue made by Franklin. Costs about 35 a gallon. Worth its weight in gold. Forget Bin and the other shallac based stuff. You'll be happy. And if you don't believe me, try yourself on a couple of test areas. Goes on just like any primer, is water based. I bought a pack of 2" chip brushes and tossed them at the end of the day. Again--thanks to Stan--North of Vermont and I think somewhere near Toronto.

And yes--I also have to do the sister barn solo. I do have one helper hired by the farm owner. I hand picked the lady. She is not fast, tall, or good looking. She doesn't know a sash brush from a monkey--but she shows up, learns fast enough, and can do the full damn cut on the red trim and leave me to do other stuff--like spraying my behind off.

As you can see-I am still wrist deep in the bucket--and it's ok.

JTP


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## GMack (Jan 18, 2008)

I picked up 5 gallons of Tite Bond III Exterior Brown Carpenter's glue made by Franklin. Costs about 35 a gallon. Worth its weight in gold. Forget Bin and the other shallac based stuff. You'll be happy. And if you don't believe me, try yourself on a couple of test areas. Goes on just like any primer, is water based. I bought a pack of 2" chip brushes and tossed them at the end of the day. Again--thanks to Stan--North of Vermont and I think somewhere near Toronto.

One application or more, JTP?


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

Does it flash? I can't see how that wouldn't flash. I have not had any problems with BIN.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

MAK-Deco said:


> Does it flash? I can't see how that wouldn't flash. I have not had any problems with BIN.


 
BIN is actually not the greatest thing on exterior. Its very brittle, and as JT mentioned, cracks as the wood expands and contracts. I have it happening on my own house trim in some places right now. All field testing happens at my house. I will be testing the glue next.


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

*Mack-Mak-Scott*

Mack-- one coat seems to completely seal off each knot. Brush it well into the crevices and open grain sections of the knot as well.

Mak--Flashing--for sure. First coat looks awful--but---Disappear after the full and thorough second coat of ProVT. Pictures don't allow you to see the flashing too much. If you look at the finished back doors-- two full coats of white--one red--no flashing. Mak--I've used BIN as well. I like this much better and I think you may as well.

Scott--Try the glue--I'm telling you it works.


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> BIN is actually not the greatest thing on exterior. Its very brittle, and as JT mentioned, cracks as the wood expands and contracts. I have it happening on my own house trim in some places right now. All field testing happens at my house. I will be testing the glue next.


I only use for spot priming knots nothing else. My exterior rough cedar gets two coats. I have re done a few after 7 years and have not had any problems.

A lot of time if I have one that I have not done before and there's a lot of knots bleeding I spec a full coat of oil for first coat and one coat of pro vt. that seems to work well too.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

MAK-Deco said:


> I only use for spot priming knots nothing else.
> 
> _Same here...I have resigned myself to the fact that in the end, the knot always wins. _
> 
> ...


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

I hope you did OK pricing that sucker out. Just glueing those knots could kill ya. I cant wait to see it done!


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

NEPS.US said:


> I hope you did OK pricing that sucker out. Just glueing those knots could kill ya. I cant wait to see it done!


Just pm Scott on that issue-- I bid it time and materials--cheap. But farm owner pays travel time and all expenses of the job. Bought a Titan airless for me too. I made a deal with him. He buys the airless. I buy it back at the end of the job. 

You may not believe this, or you may-- priming the knots on both barns took about 16 hours or less-- Big Momma--the 60 foot lift really makes life better. They cost about 35-45 grand used. Thinking about buying one--NOT!

JTP


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

I would only do something that scale on a t&m basis if I could do the whole thing with my 2" brush! :thumbup: That would be mint. Go ahead Neps...I just lobbed you a softball!


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

vermontpainter said:


> I would only do something that scale on a t&m basis if I could do the whole thing with my 2" brush! :thumbup: That would be mint. Go ahead Neps...I just lobbed you a softball!


WOW! The only bad part about that is that we would have to listen to you pat yourself on the back on how you didn't need to tape off the white when you cut the trim in.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

NEPS.US said:


> WOW! The only bad part about that is that we would have to listen to you pat yourself on the back on how you didn't need to tape off the white when you cut the trim in.


hey now


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

My helper cut the trim better than I could--she will be doing all of that--no tape and she hasn't been painting too long either--she can handle a brush-- a ladder--hmm. If it's over 24 foot--nope.

JTP


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

*ProVt Update--Wet Edge*

Short Update-- I loaded up the second coat--used a 517 tip, turned the pressure dial to sizzle, and smoked that bad boy barn. Buzzed along on that 60 foot big momma lift--took me about 4-5 hours per gabel end for white with 13 windows, the soffits and facia. I over sprayed the windows and scraped them clean. Much quicker than cutting. Yeah, I know the old timers would have masked, but since the windows and siding are all the same color, what the hell--it worked great. Not a lap mark or flash through on the glue primer.

JTP


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

JTP

Sprayed _and _backbrushed? If so, I'd say thats a rather impressive pace...


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## painterman (Jun 2, 2007)

John, good to hear that job is going well. Did you end up colouring the glue? How many gallons in total were used on each gable end? I see you sprayed over that windows, could you not get the 3m product for that job? Any pics of you on the boom? Pics you posted look great :thumbup:

Stan (2hours from Toronto)


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

JTP said:


> Short Update-- I loaded up the second coat--used a 517 tip, turned the pressure dial to sizzle, and smoked that bad boy barn. Buzzed along on that 60 foot big momma lift--took me about 4-5 hours per gabel end for white with 13 windows, the soffits and facia. I over sprayed the windows and scraped them clean. Much quicker than cutting. Yeah, I know the old timers would have masked, but since the windows and siding are all the same color, what the hell--it worked great. Not a lap mark or flash through on the glue primer.
> 
> JTP


:thumbsup: cant wait to see it!


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> JTP
> 
> Sprayed _and _backbrushed? If so, I'd say thats a rather impressive pace...


Scott- I had planned on back brushing. As it turned out, I did not back brush at all. Back brushing would have been preferable, but with just me and keeping that wet edge time, I sprayed and moved big momma long. So-- the 4-5 hour time was for blowing and going.

JTP


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

JT

Still impressive. If you said you had backbrushed too, I would think that was pushing the bounds of human productivity.


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

painterman said:


> John, good to hear that job is going well. Did you end up colouring the glue? How many gallons in total were used on each gable end? I see you sprayed over that windows, could you not get the 3m product for that job? Any pics of you on the boom? Pics you posted look great :thumbup:
> 
> Stan (2hours from Toronto)


Stan-- Seems to me, I used about 5 gallons on the second coat. No, I did not color the glue. Was not necessary as it turned out. The glue glazed over quickly allowing me to follow the trail of finished and undone knots. 3M bought the license for that spray mask, but dropped the license agreement. The firm that developed the spray masking is till marketing it, but it does not seem very popular. When I read the directions for use on line, I decided the old razor scraper and lots of blades would suffice. Those new 3 inch scrapers work very well. Takes about 15 minutes for each 9 light window. No pictures of me up on the boom yet. I am planning on posting some updated pictures of the project shortly though.

Stan--your help was really important. The glue and other suggestions helped me make a few bucks and keep a happy customer. And, the customer seems quite satisfied with the progress and work quality.

JTP


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

NEPS.US said:


> :thumbsup: cant wait to see it!


 
NEPS-- Your suggestions for loading up on the pressure and shooting with the 517 was right on target. I laid a nice wet edge down at about a foot, 1/2 overlap, and steady straight wrist. By the book. Had to get a little closer when the wind kicked up--but no runs, drips, sags, passed go and collected $200.

JTP


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

JTP said:


> NEPS-- I laid a nice wet edge down at about a foot, 1/2 overlap, and steady straight wrist.
> JTP


Do you mean the gun was a foot from the surface or you were getting about a foot wide fan off the gun?


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> Do you mean the gun was a foot from the surface or you were getting about a foot wide fan off the gun?


Scott-- Is that a trick question? You know a 517 tip blows a 10 inch fan if it's not worn. The tip was brand new. So-- I blew a 10 inch fan -- about one foot (12") from the siding. Hmm? Did I pass--

JTP


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

JTP said:


> Scott-- Is that a trick question? You know a 517 tip blows a 10 inch fan if it's not worn. The tip was brand new. So-- I blew a 10 inch fan -- about one foot (12") from the siding. Hmm? Did I pass--
> 
> JTP


 
No trick. I honestly dont spray alot and didnt even know that a 517 had a 10 inch pattern, so thanks! My thought was if you were a foot off the surface you would really have to be moving that maddog to keep from overloading it.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

vermontpainter said:


> No trick. I honestly dont spray alot and didnt even know that a 517 had a 10 inch pattern, so thanks! My thought was if you were a foot off the surface you would really have to be moving that maddog to keep from overloading it.


The art of spraying is similar to the art of cutting with no tape.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

NEPS.US said:


> The art of spraying is similar to the art of cutting with no tape.


I'm with you NEP...there is alot to being a great spray man, which I dont consider myself to be.


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## painterman (Jun 2, 2007)

JTP, Glad to help...thats what this site is all about.:thumbsup:


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> No trick. I honestly dont spray alot and didnt even know that a 517 had a 10 inch pattern, so thanks! My thought was if you were a foot off the surface you would really have to be moving that maddog to keep from overloading it.


OK-- Spray tips go like this: Double the first number for fan width, next two numbers indicate aperture in thousanths--So a 517 tip blows a 10 inch fan and shoots atomized spray out of a 17 thousanths (spelling) diameter hole. The hole is really oval shaped. When worn, it widens the fan and opening causing a bad spray pattern. If your airless is working properly, and most of the time it is, and your spray pattern becomes inconsistent with what was happening on your last use or just two minutes ago, try replacing the tip.

I am no spray expert and actually read directions lots of the time to get the damn airless set-up properly, primed properly, pressurized properly, and so on for breaking it down and cleaning. I can say that I've sprayed a few thousand square feet over quite a number of years. I use a cup gun and compressor for metal doors. Usually spray oil cut with a little laquer thinner for a nice, auto like finish. I've got that procedure down pretty well. The doors I've done over the years. those I still go by, have held up extremely well. Now that the vocs have changed, don't know how this system will hold up to years of weathering and abuse.

JTP


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

painterman said:


> JTP, Glad to help...thats what this site is all about.:thumbsup:


Agreed--This site has lots of pluses and no negatives. Sqaubbles? So what.

JTP


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

vermontpainter said:


> Do you mean the gun was a foot from the surface or you were getting about a foot wide fan off the gun?


For example a 517 tip has a 10" fan with .017 opening ...the first digit x2= the fan width and the last two digits the opening in inches .. higher number - more product coming out.


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## tsunamicontract (May 3, 2008)

so no backbrush? and with especially with a waterbase? I don't know if there is any available information on backbrush but isn't it always recommended? Not trying to dump on your staining job JTP but what are peoples thoughts on backbrushing, especially on bare wood? maybe im hijacking the thread tho


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

tsunamicontract said:


> so no backbrush? and with especially with a waterbase? I don't know if there is any available information on backbrush but isn't it always recommended? Not trying to dump on your staining job JTP but what are peoples thoughts on backbrushing, especially on bare wood? maybe im hijacking the thread tho


It really depends on the circumstance, the texture of the wood, coverage and the product. I cant say you "always" have to back brush. Usually your primer and your first coat get back brushed and your top coat is a nice finish coat over the top.


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## tsunamicontract (May 3, 2008)

thats kind of where I am at NEPS, just wondering what others thought too


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## painterman (Jun 2, 2007)

Back brushing is an interesting topic for me. I always back brush on exterior siding but never on trim. I'm sure that the factory finished siding is not back brushed. Any interior trim I have done is never back brushed. Actually the more I think about it the more I am confused.:blink:


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

tsunamicontract said:


> so no backbrush? and with especially with a waterbase? I don't know if there is any available information on backbrush but isn't it always recommended? Not trying to dump on your staining job JTP but what are peoples thoughts on backbrushing, especially on bare wood? maybe im hijacking the thread tho


You're not dumping or high jacking the thread in my opinion. I do believe backbrushing is always preferable for new wood. I did what I had to do given the situation. I don't think there will be any substantial negatives for simply spraying the two coats of solid ProVT stain. 

If possible, I would have sprayed and had a second man back brushing. Flying solo most of the time makes practical bedfellows.

I hand rolled and brushed all the trim on the first coat and faced rolled the trim on the second run. The siding, however, was a blow and go with no backbrushing on both coats. I agree wtith NEPS that the first coat should be backbrushed on new siding and the second coat is ok for spraying with no backbrushing. 

Backbrushing is an interesting topic and I'd look forward to other painter's ideas on the subject as well as others have mentioned.

JTP


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## tsunamicontract (May 3, 2008)

JTP was that cedar smooth? that would probably cut the backbrushing need. Does anyone have any information on BB(backbrushing) vs not BB on durability or peeling or anything. Or maybe you will just have to go back in 5 years and let us know how its doing :yes:
my understanding is that usually people don't backbrush interior trim to keep that nice smooth look and since the substrate has been filled/sanded smooth there aren't nooks and crannies to rub the paint into. but I wonder about backrolling. I always backbrush exterior except I stained a new fence last summer and just back rolled it and it seems to be doing fine and was way easier than backbrushing. One of the larger contractors here back rolls exteriors too.


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

If you have to back brush interior trim you are doing something wrong. Poor prep, wrong size tip, blown out tip, wrong pressure or just bad technique.


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

*Couple Of Pics Work In Progress*

No cedar here--it's all pine--either rough cut or finished.

JTP


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## tsunamicontract (May 3, 2008)

how'd you get 'er sprayed so fast if you kept poising for the camera?
no but looks great, bet you had a happy HO. I kind of like that reverse barn look.
But is that door 40 feet off the ground for the guest that overstay their welcome?


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

tsunamicontract said:


> how'd you get 'er sprayed so fast if you kept poising for the camera?
> no but looks great, bet you had a happy HO. I kind of like that reverse barn look.
> But is that door 40 feet off the ground for the guest that overstay their welcome?


 
I thought the work gets done by leaning on big momma and smiling. We are putting a stairway up to the guest apartment. We think the stringer will be super when complete. Home owner is calling it "Stairway to Heaven".

Yes, the reverse of the traditional colors is an interesting reversal of the usual.

JTP


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## painterman (Jun 2, 2007)

Great job!!!!!!!!!!!!! Same boom that I have used ,a real time saver. Oh ya you sounded taller on the phone


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

painterman said:


> Great job!!!!!!!!!!!!! Same boom that I have used ,a real time saver. Oh ya you sounded taller on the phone


Stan--

I am now officially spoiled. Time Saver for sure. No way could I ever have done this job without this boom. I have never used one before. After more than 40 hours on this thing, I can get around pretty well. I stopped slamming into the barn finally--learning curve ya know. You must have all wheels level or else the safety disallows side to side movement. It is somewhat tricky finding a level spot to plant big momma sometimes. But when you hit the sweet spot-- that 65 foot reach with articulated jib makes short work of spraying.

I am all of 5' 10" and shrinking. Did you know you really do shrink when you get older? Yep-- your discs compress somewhat. I used to be 6' 5" and now look at me. :jester:

JTP


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

JT

Thats quite an accomplishment...nice job!

The lift does spoil you. When we do exteriors where its not a logistical option, its a real bummer. 

The barn looks great.


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> JT
> 
> Thats quite an accomplishment...nice job!
> 
> ...


Thanks Scott. Right now, my customer is in for about 12 grand. I probably have another 30 hours or less to finish up the big barn. Then, sister barn gets done next. Not near as important to the customer or as dramatic for me. The sister barn is less than half of the big one in these photos. I imagaine by the time I get done--time and materials, this will cost 17K to 20K depending on how my customer wants the little barn finished.

JTP


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

So its like a red headed stepsister barn...

You are going to have PPD...post project depression. After my magnum opus a few years ago, no project has excited me too much. You slay a big dragon, and then you're chasing the next dragon for years. 

Welcome to my world, JTP.


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> So its like a red headed stepsister barn...
> 
> You are going to have PPD...post project depression. After my magnum opus a few years ago, no project has excited me too much. You slay a big dragon, and then you're chasing the next dragon for years.
> 
> Welcome to my world, JTP.


Monte Man,

I was very tentative about doing the job--especially alone. I booked the job, t & m, last year. Stan-painterman--helped me out with some great suggestions and products to use--the glue and ProVt. I would have used other materials and glad I listened to Stan. 

Glad I took much of the advice here on this thread regarding wetedge time. I was able to move along at a nice clip and keep the wet edge fine. The 517 tip and almost maxing the pressure out on the Titan, and driving big momma made it a relative breeze even for an old guy like me. Forgetting about masking windows and showing my lousy cutting skills, overspraying and scraping the windows was far, far quicker than masking and hand cutting. Even though the job is t & m. I did not relish the thought of cutting in 50 windows twice. Takes about 10-15 minutes or less per 9 light window to scrape.

I am not looking for my next master piece. I'm just an average painter. I am used to working hard and like to work hard. Something about physical labor that is good for me.

I am sure, I could not hold a candle to many pros here. But, that's OK b/c I have plenty of work and like the challenge of getting each job done in a slightly better than average manner. On a scale of 10, I would put my skill level at 5.5. When I put my cutting glasses on, I might get to a 6!

JTP


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

JTP said:


> Monte Man,
> 
> I am not looking for my next master piece. I'm just an average painter. I am used to working hard and like to work hard. Something about physical labor that is good for me.
> 
> JTP


Thats the whole point. You are one man doing the best you can. You are working in a beautiful little slice of heaven and overcoming a huge challenge. You left the comfort zone for total uncharted territory and are doing a beautiful job. 

I am not wishing it upon you, but I find it tough to transition out of that. In the past, I have found myself returning to the scene, just to stand there and look at it. When the pigeons start crapping on it, you will be sad. I dont wish this on you. Forget I said anything...


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> Thats the whole point. You are one man doing the best you can. You are working in a beautiful little slice of heaven and overcoming a huge challenge. You left the comfort zone for total uncharted territory and are doing a beautiful job.
> 
> I am not wishing it upon you, but I find it tough to transition out of that. In the past, I have found myself returning to the scene, just to stand there and look at it. When the pigeons start crapping on it, you will be sad. I dont wish this on you. Forget I said anything...


Scott--

You have it right. But, the birds hve already moved in. I had to roust them in order to paint. 5 in 1 in one hand, wet rag in the other. A couple of different kinds of barn swallows claim that barn for thier own. No stopping the bird droppings or nesting swallows. Oh well-- not my problem and I like the swallows. They are pretty friendly except when destroing their nests. No eggs though, so I felt I was doing the Zen thing--at one with nature.

I can tell you, that view from 60 feet is incredible. Take a deep breath and take it all in--yep makes you want to order a pizza--a softdrink--start a fire and kick back. But then, you realize, you're 60 feet in the air and daydreaming.

JTP


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## NEPS.US (Feb 6, 2008)

JTP ....Not only can you stand back and admire your work when finished ....you can drive 50 miles away to admire and see your work sitting among those fields ...Now thats good feeling!


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

JTP said:


> Scott--
> 
> I can tell you, that view from 60 feet is incredible. Take a deep breath and take it all in--yep makes you want to order a pizza--a softdrink--start a fire and kick back. But then, you realize, you're 60 feet in the air and daydreaming.
> 
> JTP


I love being in a 60 fter for days on end. The solitude of it cannot be achieved in any other work format I have found. You notice everything. It gets to a point where it feels strange to have your feet on the ground and not have that slight "swaying" feeling.


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## JTP (Apr 29, 2007)

vermontpainter said:


> I love being in a 60 fter for days on end. The solitude of it cannot be achieved in any other work format I have found. You notice everything. It gets to a point where it feels strange to have your feet on the ground and not have that slight "swaying" feeling.


I am smiling strongly--might even be a chuckle . I thought the shower floor was swaying to the beat--you mean you sway too? Yeah--when the arm is fully extended--you get that bounce back. No wonder I kept on dropping the soap--an no--no one else was in the shower with me.

JTP


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