# Why I Love Sikkens (2)



## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

Ok, I will try to attach these pictures one more time:

















Yes, you have to maintain Sikkens or you will have issues; however, what stain is that not true of? Whenever we do a siding app I always explain the the customer that if they don't do maintenance coats every 3-5 years, they will have a huge mess on their hands. This is part of the trade off. Beautiful finish, maintenance has to be a priority. I am surprised that more of you don't like the product. Additional maintenance means job stability for all of us. If the customer doesn't do the recommended maintenance, the stain peels just like we told them it would - now we make even more $ beacuse we have to strip and then stain. That's not a bad thing. If a customer doesn't want it to peel, use SRD rather than Cetol 23 or Log & Siding.


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## Dave Mac (May 4, 2007)

Pin that looks good, I would think the maintence coat would be every other year, no way five years???? We have used the two coat product one time and so far love the results only a couple of months old, however the amount of work involved was un real, but so was the end result, we will apply a maintence coat probally every year for this guy.


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## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

On Decks I would do the maintenance coat every 2. On siding, every 3-5. You are correct about the work, it's intense. A more difficult app then a lot of other products but the finished result is really nice. Plus, I sell the product hard and try to explain why the client should pay extra. Then, we use our Sikkens maintenance cards we get from the P3 contractor program to keep our customers on schedule for maintenance coats. There are some contractors around here that don't even take new clients, they just apply maintenance coats on a 5 year revolve.


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

Did you use a brightener as well as cleaning??? Just curious.


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## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

I hope that's not a Sikkens Dek/Dek Base product you used on that deck with absolutely no ground clearance/ventilation! That puppy will peel good!


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## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

Thanks for the tip plain painter but I can read instructions. It's SRD. I power washed the deck - just water. Then I used my u-sand orbital floor sander w/ some 40 grit paper and sanded the whole deck. Looked brand new after cleaning. I used an air compresser w/ an air nozzle to blow the dust away and stained. 1 coat.


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

PinnacleResidential said:


> Thanks for the tip plain painter but I can read instructions. It's SRD. I power washed the deck - just water. Then I used my u-sand orbital floor sander w/ some 40 grit paper and sanded the whole deck. Looked brand new after cleaning. I used an air compresser w/ an air nozzle to blow the dust away and stained. 1 coat.



Thats what I figured.. next time try using a brightener and it will look even better... Just my opinion


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## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

MAK - I typically would have used a brightener but this customer's home is on a lake and they specifically requested no chemicals. Not my decision - theirs.


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## MAK-Deco (Apr 17, 2007)

PinnacleResidential said:


> MAK - I typically would have used a brightener but this customer's home is on a lake and they specifically requested no chemicals. Not my decision - theirs.


cool...


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## Boyfromthenorth (Jun 18, 2008)

I have two words.... sodium metasylicate. Its in fewer and fewer deck cleaners. Buts its one of the best ways to start a deck application. Our Sikkens rep says that they are going to come out with their own cleaner soon. You should see how this stuff works. Cleans, removes old coatings, kilss mold/mildew. Superdeck makes a kickin cleaner that has it in it. Please try, the results speak for themselves....


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## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

I mix my own tsp & bleach solution when cleaning. I hope sikkens comes out w something.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

Yes, you have to maintain Sikkens or you will have issues; however, what stain is that not true of? 

_Its true of all stains, but all stains dont fail as miserably as this. With most, a simple wash and restain is enough._ 

Whenever we do a siding app I always explain the the customer that if they don't do maintenance coats every 3-5 years, they will have a huge mess on their hands. 

_Most people dont maintain their cars, let alone their houses._ 

This is part of the trade off. Beautiful finish, maintenance has to be a priority. I am surprised that more of you don't like the product.

_Not that beautiful. Too much maintenance and catastrophic failure. With all due respect to you guys who love it, its not for everyone._ 

_I have met with too many unhappy homeowners who look at this everyday:_


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## bikerboy (Sep 16, 2007)

Never have done siding with sikkens, but love the SRD on decks. The bad thing about Sikkens in my area is the rep. I never had to deal with him, but every painter I've ever talked to claims he does not back up the product. It's ALWAYS the applicators fault so lots of guys just use the SRD.


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## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

Scott, How was the product applied in that particular app? The problem I have seen is spray or roller applications aren't back brushed and therefore, fail. We stained a log cabin about 7 years back with the product. We applied a three coat system all by brush. Up until last year, I drove by the place every day on my way to work. It has looked great ever since application. I have never seen a failure as shown. Some customers won't maintain the home, your right. But it isn't the products fault for failing, it's the ho's. Like I said, the reason I really like the product is the finished result. I am more than proud to show off the outcome to future clients and happy when the ho has company after the app because they are bound to be impressed with the results. I do explain before application how important maintenance is when using Log and Siding or Cetol 23. I tell them they will have to commit themselves to maintenance coats every 5 years. Many of my clients ask me to remind them when to have the maintenance coat applied so I keep them on record with reminders for myself to send them maintenance reminders. If they don't keep their commitment, they should understand the results..... If they do, they'll keep calling me every 5 years to re-stain their home. If the customer says that they will wait until failure occurs before a maintenance coat or the current stain that I am stripping is peeling (meaning they don't mind waiting until they NEED stain), I will recommend SRD. SRD doesn't peel. It fades over time.

Regardless, you don't have to use Sikkens if you are happy with the result of another product. There are many times in which I'll use Cabot if I have a customer on more of a budget. But there are a lot of staining questions on this site and a lot of people asking what others recommend. It's just my opinion. What do you like?


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## jr.painting (Aug 30, 2008)

Looks good. I have also have used the Sikkens SRD on decks and it works and looks good. I am a Sikkens fan.

We normally do maintenance costs over other year. Customers are happy with the product and willing to pay to get it up and looking nice.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

PinnacleResidential said:


> Scott, How was the product applied in that particular app? The problem I have seen is spray or roller applications aren't back brushed and therefore, fail. We stained a log cabin about 7 years back with the product. We applied a three coat system all by brush. Up until last year, I drove by the place every day on my way to work. It has looked great ever since application. I have never seen a failure as shown. Some customers won't maintain the home, your right. But it isn't the products fault for failing, it's the ho's. Like I said, the reason I really like the product is the finished result. I am more than proud to show off the outcome to future clients and happy when the ho has company after the app because they are bound to be impressed with the results. I do explain before application how important maintenance is when using Log and Siding or Cetol 23. I tell them they will have to commit themselves to maintenance coats every 5 years. Many of my clients ask me to remind them when to have the maintenance coat applied so I keep them on record with reminders for myself to send them maintenance reminders. If they don't keep their commitment, they should understand the results..... If they do, they'll keep calling me every 5 years to re-stain their home. If the customer says that they will wait until failure occurs before a maintenance coat or the current stain that I am stripping is peeling (meaning they don't mind waiting until they NEED stain), I will recommend SRD. SRD doesn't peel. It fades over time.
> 
> Regardless, you don't have to use Sikkens if you are happy with the result of another product. There are many times in which I'll use Cabot if I have a customer on more of a budget. But there are a lot of staining questions on this site and a lot of people asking what others recommend. It's just my opinion. What do you like?


 
I'm not sure how the coating was applied. I get calls to estimate and remedy failed Sikkens coatings every year. Its always unfortunate because the homeowner is never happy with Sikkens after seeing it fail. I'm sure they have some good coatings, but the film forming ones have been most noteable in failure, in my experience. 

For exterior stains, I use Cabot, BM, or Penofin. I definitely am of the school that prefers lower maintenance, non-film forming finishes that will fade rather than flake and peel. Again, I am sure Sikkens has some good non film forming coatings, but I have been happy enough with the performance of the ones I use that I have not felt the need to dabble. 
Also, too busy dabbling in product lines for other applications that are more critical to my business.

I am only outspoken on the film forming coatings because people are likely to let them fail. Its the American way. We wait until we are injured or sick to seek health care rather than taking on a healthier lifestyle. We let our cars breakdown before we take them to a mechanic for preventative maintenance...you know the story.


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## timhag (Sep 30, 2007)

PinnacleResidential said:


> Ok, I will try to attach these pictures one more time:
> 
> View attachment 1689
> 
> ...


If thats the finished product brother, Looks like it needs another coat. Kinda looks unevenly finished. Not being a wise guy here, just calling what I see. :thumbsup:


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## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

The problem w/ the picture is that it's not dry.


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## timhag (Sep 30, 2007)

PinnacleResidential said:


> The problem w/ the picture is that it's not dry.


Ok, may wanna wait till it's completed b 4 posting. Kinda thru me off thinking it was completed. Sorry.


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## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

I know homeowners will let them fail. They shouldn't be upset at the stain. they should be upset that they were to proud to listen. You're right though, if you want lower maintenance, a penetrating product is best. I like SRD apps the best because it's a single coat process. However, most of our Sikkens siding apps are Cetol 23 because the ho wants a satin finish.


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## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

Thats alright timhag. I would have gone back the next day to take the pic but this house was about 75 miles from my house (favor for an interior decorator) and I wasn't about to make the drive back for a pic.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

PinnacleResidential said:


> I know homeowners will let them fail. They shouldn't be upset at the stain. they should be upset that they were to proud to listen.


Homeowners will be upset at: each other, the house, the weather, the previous painter, the manufacturer, the dealer, the other painters who came to estimate before us...but *never* will they acknowledge that they let the product go beyond its recommended life span. 

I have had many cases where I am at the estimate meeting. I ask when it was last painted. They say: "hmmm...must have been about 3 years ago." I ask to see the left over paint cans in the basement so that I can confirm what products were used previously. On the can is a sticker with a date that the color was mixed at the paint store, and it becomes quite clear how time flies in the world of the homeowner.


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## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

*Here's a pic of the back deck a little bit drier:*


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## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

I know, you're right. It's a frustrating thing about ho's in general. I'll get clients whose deck has peeled and they are so angry at the last painter. I will often tell them it's just what happens overtime. It's funny how blame goes everywhere but to themselves.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

It helps not to turn it into a blame game with the customer. That just creates a contentious relationship right out of the box. However, there is always a bit of investigation that goes on during the initial meeting and estimate with the customer where you can learn alot about their perceptions and attitudes. As I said above, sometimes they are not quite in touch with the reality of the condition of their home. It can be as if they have themselves believing certain things and they want you to believe them too. If the homeowner can convince you that its not that bad, then maybe the price won't be too high. Its a subtle dance. 

Our job is to be objective, assess the situation and propose the most practical, cost-effective and durable solution that we can stand behind. Usually, their perception and the reality that we expose are two very different things.


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## PinnacleResidential (Aug 10, 2008)

Don't get me wrong, I would never make it a blame game. Your dance comment is very true. I try to make friends and give informative consultations. If it seems like you know more than the next guy, it is very helpful in getting the contract. A lot of this business seems to be perception - good first impressions mean a lot in getting the bid


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

PinnacleResidential said:


> Don't get me wrong, I would never make it a blame game. Your dance comment is very true. I try to make friends and give informative consultations. If it seems like you know more than the next guy, it is very helpful in getting the contract. A lot of this business seems to be perception - good first impressions mean a lot in getting the bid


I know, and any reasonably good sales/business person would never let that show, but we all think it from time to time when standing there face to face with the customer looking at the side of the house that you know hasnt been painted in 10 years. 

Getting consumers to accept the reality of the situation is part of educating them. Alot of your competition is not taking the time to do that.


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