# Do you let it dry?



## whodog94

Do you let your cut-in dry before rolling or do you always keep a wet edge. What are the pros and cons to both? (Speaking egg shell and satin )


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## RH

Wet - always.


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## Painter-Aaron

Depends on colour, where the light comes from, what paint and the sheen. 

Light neutral colour, with no light shining down the wall, with a lower sheen eggshell, or even a regular egg you can get away with letting it dry. 

Now, if its a darker colour I try and keep it wet as best as possible, especially if there is critical light. 
Sometimes the paint just dries way to quick, and sometimes it gets tacky quick and when you roll over it, it lifts the texture up too much.


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## Jmayspaint

To me it depends on the paint. If the paint allows for it, sure. If I'm painting with Aura or Ultra Spec, forget it, its nearly impossible and can be counter productive to try.


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## kdpaint

I know of hardly any paint that stays wet long enough to roll before the cut dries, even doing one wall at a time.


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## RedOak

Normally what I do is cut in, then back roll it with a wiz roller to blend in brush lines, I usually cut in the whole room/area. So depending on how large the area is, the edge is still wet or drying but ever completely dry, ESPECIALLY ANYTHING WITH A HIGH SHEEN (semi gloss, satin, enamels). That always manages to be visible to me...


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## burchptg

kdpaint said:


> I know of hardly any paint that stays wet long enough to roll before the cut dries, even doing one wall at a time.


 You must be on T&M! Wet always. Nothing like a nice hatbanding effect.


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## The 3rd Coat

burchptg said:


> You must be on T&M! Wet always. Nothing like a nice hatbanding effect.


Maybe he does 2 coats


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## Oden

kdpaint said:


> I know of hardly any paint that stays wet long enough to roll before the cut dries, even doing one wall at a time.





burchptg said:


> You must be on T&M! Wet always. Nothing like a nice hatbanding effect.


Nothing water based doesnt start to dry as soon as it's on a wall. Trying to keep a wet edge on it would be a waste of time. Cut for a couple hours. Roll for a couple hours. Or cut today and roll tomoro. Something like that.

Hat banding or picture framing- the biggest mistake I see guys make, they put this wide cut in on their work, the cut in should be as thin as needed and roll tight.


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## slinger58

Oden said:


> Nothing water based doesnt start to dry as soon as it's on a wall.
> Trying to keep a wet edge on it would be a waste of time. Cut for a couple hours. Roll for a couple hours. Or cut today and roll tomoro. Something like that.
> Hat banding or picture framing- the biggest mistake I see guys make, they put this wide cut in on their work, the cut in should be as thin as needed and roll tight.


As I remember when Aura was introduced, the directive from BM was to let the cut-in dry completely before rolling.

And as Oden and KD pointed out, it's not like we have a lot of choice in the matter. It's gonna start drying pretty dang quick whether you like it or not.

I think most hat-banding or lapping issues are the result of insufficient amount of material being applied or trying to cover in one coat where two are called for.


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## Boco

I like to add some floetrol when cutting in looks a bit off. in some cases working with a partner can give your better results. If you can work together and quickly on the brush work. You can keep it wet somewhat if you go wall by wall. The white wooster roller covers also seam to be better at getting real tight to the corners.


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## Jmayspaint

Oden said:


> Hat banding or picture framing- the biggest mistake I see guys make, they put this wide cut in on their work, the cut in should be as thin as needed and roll tight.











Or roll tight, then cut. Or if you are really feeling like a bad a$$, do away with the separation between cut and roll and just paint the wall all at one time. There can be no 'hat banding if there is no hatband.


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## The 3rd Coat

If there's proper coverage, there will be no picture framing, no matter how wide the cut-in is. All these "tricks" of trying to keep a wet edge on a wall and minimizing cut-in width, are for 1-coat-guys.


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## driftweed

On residential, we cut twice then roll tight with weenie roller then break out the 18". Rolling means we are almost outta there. Save the easy part for last. At least, on the 3 I did last year that was the methodology.

Got my first residential of the year in a couple weeks, will brush and roll just for old times sake (the sprayer has me spoiled, haha).


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## kdpaint

burchptg said:


> You must be on T&M! Wet always. Nothing like a nice hatbanding effect.


Never any hatbanding. Most paint I work with, BM Aura, RS, are made to cut in, let cut dry, then roll. It's 2014, not 1995, unless you use crap paint, in which case, it may be 1995 for you.


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## Splitter

DGQ (Darn Good Question). Considering that the walls were properly prepped in advance, we like to cut in clean not wide, let dry good, then we roll tight. Proper tools are key, good brushes, good skins and proper nap size.


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## Oden

Jmayspaint said:


> Or roll tight, then cut. Or if you are really feeling like a bad a$$, do away with the separation between cut and roll and just paint the wall all at one time. There can be no 'hat banding if there is no hatband.


Work that you know will need two coats definitely I roll first. Roll. Sand. Cut. Cut. Roll.
Especially on N.C. You reduce ur cut work by sooo much. You cut only what u can't get at with the roller. And ur second cut will be barely anything. So much faster like that but it looks better too.


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## Slopmeyer

The 3rd Coat said:


> If there's proper coverage, there will be no picture framing, no matter how wide the cut-in is. All these "tricks" of trying to keep a wet edge on a wall and minimizing cut-in width, are for 1-coat-guys.


Thats not true at all. The paint your using has alot to do with it. I'm sure many will remember the problems with the old Regal Wall Satin. No matter what you did it hatbanded. 

The new Cashmere deep bases are notorious for it. Leave it to SW to ruin a great product.


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## darrpreb00

You guys all painting smooth wall? No smooth wall over here. We just roll last when dry and its a perfectly straight line 1.5 in from celiing or corner that would look like a shadow if it did picture frame. Which it never does or looks so much like a shadow we never notice. Not even an issue that has ever come up.


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## The 3rd Coat

Slopmeyer said:


> Thats not true at all. The paint your using has alot to do with it. I'm sure many will remember the problems with the old Regal Wall Satin. No matter what you did it hatbanded.
> 
> The new Cashmere deep bases are notorious for it. Leave it to SW to ruin a great product.


If a surface has been prepped and sealed properly, then insufficient film thickness is the only reason for picture framing.

I've seen some painters whose rolling is very thin compared to the cut-in. They roll with an almost completely dry roller. As a result, the cut-in covers fully but the rolling doesn't even with 2 coats.
Those painters need to roll on more coats, or work on their technique to achieve proper film thickness.


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## Gwarel

I take a 4" mini up the ladder with me and roll tight as I cut, eliminating the brush mark. Rolling later into this band blends in fine, and since I've been using this method I haven't had any hat banding problems.


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## daArch

> Do you let your cut-in dry before rolling or do you always keep a wet edge. What are the pros and cons to both? (Speaking egg shell and satin )


Job today was fairly well hacked by the painters before me, HO said they had fired them.

I heard hubby say later to the wife, "they cut in with semi-gloss and rolled the rest with satin". He was in the hall when he said this. The walls there were a medium to deep gray - towards green.

I looked. Sure enough, it LOOKED like semi was used to cut in and satin used to roll, but quite obviously it was just flashed.

I'd say that was a con to letting it dry.


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## Jmayspaint

I think the most important thing about cutting in/rolling however you do it is to get consistent film build. If your using two application tools to apply the film, (brush/roller) that can be difficult. 

Keeping the paint wet while you apply it helps because you can somewhat blend the overlaps in the film between the two tools. 

If keeping the film wet while applying with two different tools isn't feasible, then you have two choices; Don't create an overlap/inconsistency with the two tools your using, or don't use two different tools. 

Hat banding is caused by inconsistent application. Any method we use is subject to that if you let it.


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## Boco

Slopmeyer said:


> Thats not true at all. The paint your using has alot to do with it. I'm sure many will remember the problems with the old Regal Wall Satin. No matter what you did it hatbanded.
> 
> The new Cashmere deep bases are notorious for it. Leave it to SW to ruin a great product.


 I have been using a lot of the cashmere deep base. I havent had any problems with hat band as long as you cut and roll as you go. We have been doing a level 5 then a coat of primer/sealer. After 2 top coats everything looks sweet. i had a problem about 6 months ago with SW promar 200 antique white about 8 months ago but lately I havent had any issues/ maybe SW is starting to get the new mixes sorted out.


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