# Town hires unlicensed contractors for RRP



## Epoxy Pro

We had a chance to bid a job for the town I live in, an old meeting house covered in lead paint. We passed due to our schedule and not wanting to deal with RRP. For the last two weeks I have seen the painting contractor scraping without ground covered, power sanding with no hepa vac infact he had no vac attached.

There is an elementary school directly next door. I looked the company up on the state website and guess why. They aren't licensed or certified for RRP. The GC isn't either, no company on that site is.

One reason for us not wanting to deal with it, it seems the fines are being handed out to companies licensed but make a simple mistake (plastic not staked into ground is #1 here). I have yet to see or hear of an unlicensed getting nailed they usually get shut down.


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## PRC

Is it possible this meeting house is considered a non-childcare commercial building?


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## Epoxy Pro

PRC said:


> Is it possible this meeting house is considered a non-childcare commercial building?


School kids go on class trips to it all the time, It's a huge part of our towns history, right there with Americas first horseless carriage. plus a school right next door. 

Auto history about my town if any one is interested.

http://www.earlyamericanautomobiles.com/amesburybodybuilders2.htm


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## Jmayspaint

Sounds like you got a potential political scandal on your hands here Dave. 
Keep us posted. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## RH

Aw c'mon Dave. You know that no matter what level of government it is, they are only concerned about all the rest of us following the rules - not themselves.


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## PACman

You can report that to your states EPA office anonymously. I would do it in a heartbeat if I were you. This goes beyond politics and business when there is a school that close to it. I have seen way,way to many local government entities get away with stuff like this. Report it.


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## fauxlynn

That's messed up


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## Roamer

If the building does not actually house a daycare center or act as a residence then the RRP rules do not apply. It doesn't matter that kids visit on school trips.

However, in the interest of the public good the contractor should at least perform some basic controls to make sure he/she isn't poisoning the neighboring school.


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## PACman

Drop a dime on his a55!


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## Epoxy Pro

PACman said:


> You can report that to your states EPA office anonymously. I would do it in a heartbeat if I were you. This goes beyond politics and business when there is a school that close to it. I have seen way,way to many local government entities get away with stuff like this. Report it.


Last years and years before I would call the inspector. This year since I still see so many doing it wrong I don't care any more. We are passing on lead jobs except 1, trim only but it's an 8k sqft home we have to bid both interior and exterior. Only 1 painting company will get this one. This GC will use 2 different painters inside and out. We are hoping we have wiggled out bodies in the door and can get all their work.

I didn't know if the commute would be worth it. So far all of our bids are triple or more than what we charge in our normal work area.


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## Epoxy Pro

Roamer said:


> If the building does not actually house a daycare center or act as a residence then the RRP rules do not apply. It doesn't matter that kids visit on school trips.
> 
> However, in the interest of the public good the contractor should at least perform some basic controls to make sure he/she isn't poisoning the neighboring school.


I have to check on this. MA has it's own rules so you could be 100% correct. 

But the whole reason for RRP is to contain and dispose of the lead paint chips. If the ground isn't covered and all the lead paint chips fall into the grass, it's now contaminating the ground. I haven't yet but I want to stop by and see if they are even attempting to pick up the lead paint chips.

With kids coming and going from there it's asking for trouble. Right now this town has enough lawsuits it's fighting.


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## Epoxy Pro

PACman said:


> Drop a dime on his a55!


In a way I did. I posted this to my personal FB page which the inspector is a friend, he sent me a thumbs up message. But I didn't call.


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## Stretch67

Personally, I don't get the need to call the cops for every doggone thing. Do you call them everytime you see someone speeding or drive on the fog line? Can we not deal with any of this stuff ourselves as adults? Maybe just go have a nice visit with him, mention that it would be nice if they put in a little effort to contain the paint chips. Always keep in mind that whenever you start pointing fingers, there are three pointing back at you.

Everybody thinks that calling the tax collector should be the first response to dang near anything. No wonder our country is going the way it is. The further from home that decisions are made, the worse they will be.


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## PACman

bryceraisanen said:


> Personally, I don't get the need to call the cops for every doggone thing. Do you call them everytime you see someone speeding or drive on the fog line? Can we not deal with any of this stuff ourselves as adults? Maybe just go have a nice visit with him, mention that it would be nice if they put in a little effort to contain the paint chips. Always keep in mind that whenever you start pointing fingers, there are three pointing back at you.
> 
> Everybody thinks that calling the tax collector should be the first response to dang near anything. No wonder our country is going the way it is. The further from home that decisions are made, the worse they will be.


If you saw someone pointing a gun at a playground would you report it? Kind of the same thing really. And I do report people that are speeding and driving reckless enough that they could easily kill someone. Look at all of the mass shootings in the last few years. There was someone in every situation that had some idea that these people were going to do something but couldn't be bothered to report anything. The Orlando shooters wife for example. She flat out admitted that she knew something was up but didn't do a thing.


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## PACman

bryceraisanen said:


> Personally, I don't get the need to call the cops for every doggone thing. Do you call them everytime you see someone speeding or drive on the fog line? Can we not deal with any of this stuff ourselves as adults? Maybe just go have a nice visit with him, mention that it would be nice if they put in a little effort to contain the paint chips. Always keep in mind that whenever you start pointing fingers, there are three pointing back at you.
> 
> Everybody thinks that calling the tax collector should be the first response to dang near anything. No wonder our country is going the way it is. The further from home that decisions are made, the worse they will be.


Also keep in mind that there are areas of this country that you are quite likely to get the crap beat out of you or even get shot for having a nice visit to handle the situation. Cleveland comes to mind.


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## slinger58

PACman said:


> If you saw someone pointing a gun at a playground would you report it? Kind of the same thing really. And I do report people that are speeding and driving reckless enough that they could easily kill someone. Look at all of the mass shootings in the last few years. There was someone in every situation that had some idea that these people were going to do something but couldn't be bothered to report anything. The Orlando shooters wife for example. She flat out admitted that she knew something was up but didn't do a thing.


From RRP regulations violators to cowardly, deranged mass murderers?


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## Stretch67

PACman said:


> If you saw someone pointing a gun at a playground would you report it? Kind of the same thing really. And I do report people that are speeding and driving reckless enough that they could easily kill someone. Look at all of the mass shootings in the last few years. There was someone in every situation that had some idea that these people were going to do something but couldn't be bothered to report anything. The Orlando shooters wife for example. She flat out admitted that she knew something was up but didn't do a thing.


Slinger beat me to it. You don't actually consider them to be comparable do ya?


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## chrisn

slinger58 said:


> From RRP regulations violators to cowardly, deranged mass murderers?


This thread will turn to sh%t soon


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## PACman

The point is that many people can get sick or killed because someone saw something being done or new someone was doing something they shouldn't be doing and didn't speak up and report it. Every one of the recent mass murders had someone who knew something and said nothing about it. I had a cousin who died from mesothelioma from a school that did some renovations and asbestos dust floating everywhere while classes were in session. She died 20 years after the exposure, and a large number of students in that school also died from it in the last few years. At the time there where many people who knew they shouldn't be exposing the students to asbestos but not one person spoke up about it. 

At some point a moral person has to speak up and hold people accountable for doing things that endanger other people, especially children. Even if the chance of someone being injured is slight, someone in authority should be told. If you are the type that doesn't want to rat out someone because you wouldn't want the same done to you well, tough 5hit. This isn't about some biker gang code of honor, it's about children's safety and health.


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## CApainter

The problem with comparing guns to lead paint, is that guns have always been intended to destroy or kill something, where as lead paint was originally intended to protect something.

Lead paint has only recently been perceived as a poisonous weapon in the hands of ignorant, or irresponsible building and painting contractors, since aggressive environmental, health, and safety activism forced strict lead compliance and regulation into law.

Now a days , anytime a painter comes across anything painted before, during, or since 1978, they have to consider being criminally negligent, take on the burden of the lead compliance spectical, with all of it's bells and whistles, or just beat feet to something safer.

As far as turning people in, it is my opinion that the underlying hesitancy to turn people in to the authorities, may stem from our World's history of tyrannical governments encouraging their citizens to spy on one another, and rat on those who weren't in compliance with the ruling party's ideology.


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## Stretch67

One of your better posts CA.


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## Stretch67

PACman said:


> The point is that many people can get sick or killed because someone saw something being done or new someone was doing something they shouldn't be doing and didn't speak up and report it. Every one of the recent mass murders had someone who knew something and said nothing about it. I had a cousin who died from mesothelioma from a school that did some renovations and asbestos dust floating everywhere while classes were in session. She died 20 years after the exposure, and a large number of students in that school also died from it in the last few years. At the time there where many people who knew they shouldn't be exposing the students to asbestos but not one person spoke up about it.
> 
> At some point a moral person has to speak up and hold people accountable for doing things that endanger other people, especially children. Even if the chance of someone being injured is slight, someone in authority should be told. If you are the type that doesn't want to rat out someone because you wouldn't want the same done to you well, tough 5hit. This isn't about some biker gang code of honor, it's about children's safety and health.


I got the point. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

Our earthly lives are short imho. Too short to cure all of the problems that exist imho. So to that end, I like to prioritize. Biggest problems first, and work my way down the line. So imo, we should be starting with all of the fluoride that is in public drinking water, and the stuff that they make grade schoolers gargle with once a week or whatever. Then we can move onto the pharmaceutical monopoly. And on and on. For me, the lead paint issue would be somewhere around #1,324,576 on the list for example.

Not to mention that if we as a society, are constantly siccing the tax collectors on relatively minor issues, that may prevent them from being able to respond to real (emergency) issues in a timely manner. Either that, or keep hiring more badges. Maybe we could hire enough badges that we wouldn't ever even have to talk to each other directly. Whatever comes up or offends you, just call the badge and sort out the whole thing in court.

Not to mention that when the tax collector gets involved, they oftentimes go overboard in their pursuit of justice. Maybe they show up and put the poor guy outta business with fines who knows?! But is that really what we need? Could be the guy is just getting started in business and has no clue. Or he's down on his luck and that was the only job he could find to feed his family that week. Who knows there could be a million things going on. I'm not trying to encourage illegal activities, but I think its important to actually take some time and think through the situation a bit before calling the cops. We are all lawbreakers in some way shape or form practically everyday. The more we encourage getting the authorities involved, the more we are going to regret it.


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## epretot

The axe is gone. 

Know what I mean?


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## CApainter

epretot said:


> The axe is gone.
> 
> Know what I mean?


You now have body odor?


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## epretot

Have you ever used the natural rock deodorant? It never worked for me. 

I never tried axe either...I'm sticking with arm and hammer.


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## chrisn

CApainter said:


> The problem with comparing guns to lead paint, is that guns have always been intended to destroy or kill something, where as lead paint was originally intended to protect something.
> 
> Lead paint has only recently been perceived as a poisonous weapon in the hands of ignorant, or irresponsible building and painting contractors, since aggressive environmental, health, and safety activism forced strict lead compliance and regulation into law.
> 
> Now a days , anytime a painter comes across anything painted before, during, or since 1978, they have to consider being criminally negligent, take on the burden of the lead compliance spectical, with all of it's bells and whistles, or just beat feet to something safer.
> 
> As far as turning people in, it is my opinion that the underlying hesitancy to turn people in to the authorities, may stem from our World's history of tyrannical governments encouraging their citizens to spy on one another, and rat on those who weren't in compliance with the ruling party's ideology.


Like Russia(used to be, maybe still is?)


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## Epoxy Pro

First off I didn't and wouldn't call the cops. They can't do any thing about it. I also didn't call the inspector. He saw my fb post.

Yes I do and as of recently called thencops on eratic drivers. I have dash can video of a car on Thursday weaving in and out of slow moving highway traffic at well over 120 mph, weaving in and out of the breakdown lane, when he came up on me there was a car broken down and me in the slow lane. I had to lock up my brakes to avoid being hit, which I just made it, the video look like I was hit. So yeah I called the cops.

I'm not comparing any thing else to RRP. You guys are.


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