# Washing Brushes in sink with septic??



## paint2ski (Jan 20, 2011)

OK so looked into this a little and no definite answers. But I got some heat today from a customer who said that rinsing paint brushes in a sink that leads to a septic kills the bacteria that eats the... well stuff in the septic tank...

I have never heard of this even in the 8 years I have been painting...

So looking into it i see a lot of Latex paint is fine to put down the drain, etc, etc. Or dumping paint down the drain is ok if it goes to a city septic system...

*Specifically I am wondering if it is ok to RINSE PAINT FROM BRUSHES IN A SINK THAT LEADS TO A SEPTIC??*

You would think if you can put drano down a sink you could put watered down paint from a brush... But maybe not?

Thanks


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

My old man washed brushes, buckets, and sleeves everyday for 20yrs in a slop sink at his house on a septic system without a problem. 

I'd say that's a that's a long enough testing time to conclude that it won't mess up a septic system. :yes:


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## paint2ski (Jan 20, 2011)

Yeah still looking into it. I want to tell the customer shes is worrying for nothing but no DEFINITE proof that it is OK or NOT OK... 

Usually I clean them in the backyard but it's the middle of winter...


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## Hines Painting (Jun 22, 2013)

I won't usually use a sink unless the customer offers or isn't home.


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## paint2ski (Jan 20, 2011)

It was a utility sink in the garage...


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

We were in a house for twenty years where I washed an awful lot of brushes and never had a problem. But I was also careful to have it pumped every other year and we had an extra large system of leach lines. I'd be careful not to put solvents or other nasties down it.

I don't think Drano should be used in a drain leading to a septic tank.

Just curious, was this the customer's sink?


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## paint2ski (Jan 20, 2011)

Yes customers utility sink in the garage, with by the way obvious signs of multiple paint jobs being washed down at some point... I always thought it was no big deal.. Did not realize it could even possibly be an issue....


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Yes there are biocides in the paint that will hamper the sewage eating microbes from doing their dirty work.

BUT, next time a HO complains at how you are upsetting their finely tuned septic system, ask DIPLOMATICALLY if they use bleach with their clothes, any kind of dish soap containing bleach (most ones for dish washers contain bleach), anti-deodorant soap, germ killing hand soap, any germ killing all purpose cleaner, etc etc etc.

Maintaining an efficient balance of sewage and microbes in a septic tank is very tricky and damn near impossible in today's world. One has to be dedicated and ever diligent to make sure NOTHING goes down the drain that will upset that balance.


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## ridesarize (Jun 19, 2012)

Yeah it's not a good idea to put paints down those drains. It seems it's just watered down paint but it builds up quickly, sludge settles on bottom quickly like a bucket with dirty brushes in it. I've been taught to keep stuff out septic system by several employers and if a customer is concerned don't try to reason with them just don't clean in sinks.


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## Brian C (Oct 8, 2011)

I think its unprofessional to presume you can wash up in a customers sink without permission. Take them home and wash them.


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

Use Ben's bucket and microfiber rag next time, don't even ask for permission, he's cool with it. :whistling2:


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## Stonehampaintdept (Jan 10, 2013)

daArch said:


> Yes there are biocides in the paint that will hamper the sewage eating microbes from doing their dirty work.
> 
> BUT, next time a HO complains at how you are upsetting their finely tuned septic system, ask DIPLOMATICALLY if they use bleach with their clothes, any kind of dish soap containing bleach (most ones for dish washers contain bleach), anti-deodorant soap, germ killing hand soap, any germ killing all purpose cleaner, etc etc etc.
> 
> Maintaining an efficient balance of sewage and microbes in a septic tank is very tricky and damn near impossible in today's world. One has to be dedicated and ever diligent to make sure NOTHING goes down the drain that will upset that balance.


Very true. Any household cleaner can kill those germs. I have a septic system (hate it) but you're damn skippy that I rinse out everything down the drain (except food), including brushes once in a great while. Will it kill bacteria, yes. However I also keep up on maintenance and open the cover once in a while and usually have it pumped once a year. Anyone with septic probably does the same,_ if_ they're smart enough. Yea it's rude to presume to rinse out in a sink, they're also probably over reacting about it. Next time rinse out in the flower bed :jester: ain't nothin' growin' in winter anyway.


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

If we only clean a couple brushes and the HO says it's ok for us to use their sink we will if not they come home with me I just have to remember to take them out of the van when I get home to clean them.


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## squid (Dec 25, 2012)

If you give in to this nonesense, she will be controlling everything that goes down the drain and you'll be shlepn around a empty 5 or goin' to McD's when the need arises. Stand your ground.


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## Bender (Aug 10, 2008)

The smallest septic tanks are 750 gallons. How many brushes would you have to clean to equal even 1 gallon of solids?


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## Slopmeyer (Aug 2, 2009)

"Take them home to clean" Nope. If they don't like it they can replace all equipment used. 

Don't take your work home with ya


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## paintpimp (Jun 29, 2007)

I've had my septic service company tell me the same thing. I would think interior paint would be fine. But would stay away from doing ext stain, ext paint or bathroom paint products. These contain waxes and anti mildew agents. You could store your brushes in this til you get back to your shop.


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## ExcelPaintingCo (Apr 16, 2011)

941owassard said:


> "Take them home to clean" Nope. If they don't like it they can replace all equipment used. Don't take your work home with ya


We regularly clean brushes and sprayers off site. It's another way to stand out from the crowd. Especially with environmentally conscious clients who don't even want wash water dumped in there yard. Think of it as a selling feature.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

squid said:


> If you give in to this nonesense, she will be controlling everything that goes down the drain and you'll be shlepn around a empty 5 or goin' to McD's when the need arises. Stand your ground.





941owassard said:


> "Take them home to clean" Nope. If they don't like it they can replace all equipment used.
> 
> Don't take your work home with ya


Sorry guys, we part ways on this one.

I've had customers with work sinks in their utility or garage who have said I could use them and I've politely declined to do so. In 90% of the jobs I do I wrap my brushes and take them back to my shop sink to clean. If the HO has a really grody slop sink in their garage or shop, and they have said it's okay, I will wash out some brushes, but even then it's likely the majority of them will get cleaned at my place.

There is absolutely no way I would argue with a customer if they actually came out and said they didn't want me to use their sink - for whatever reason. To do so is a good way to invite being kicked off the job IMO. It's my mess so it's my responsibility to deal with it - not theirs.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

I do hope this discussion is about waterborne brushes and not solvent based.

It is a big no-no to allow solvents in ANY water - waste or potable. We only got one planet and she is having trouble supporting the bazillion people as it is. Don't make her job any tougher. 

One gallon of solvent pollutes like 1 M gallons of water. Think of that, please, as you even wash a solvent rinsed brush into a sink.


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## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

daArch said:


> I do hope this discussion is about waterborne brushes and not solvent based. It is a big no-no to allow solvents in ANY water - waste or potable. We only got one planet and she is having trouble supporting the bazillion people as it is. Don't make her job any tougher. One gallon of solvent pollutes like 1 M gallons of water. Think of that, please, as you even wash a solvent rinsed brush into a sink.


I had too look it up
200 million gallons of oil was pumped into the gulf by BP petroleum when they blew that pipe offshore a couple years ago.
I'm not feelin the guilt over flushing some dirty thins. I'm just over it.


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

ExcelPaintingCo said:


> We regularly clean brushes and sprayers off site. It's another way to stand out from the crowd. Especially with environmentally conscious clients who don't even want wash water dumped in there yard. Think of it as a selling feature.


During the summer
I will give our sprayer a quick cleaning at the job site, I spray into an empty 5er and take it off site every day. It really gets under my skin when some one cleans their sprayer spraying it directly onto the ground, even cleaning brushes. 
Most of you would be pissed off if you got home to see paint stains in your yard. 
I worked for a different painting company a few years back and one of the employees uses a fish pond to clean his brushes and cleaned his sprayer spraying directly into the pond. He said the water is filtered so no harm. I walk away from that company. I even told him he was a scumbag for doing that.


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

Oden said:


> I had too look it up
> 200 million gallons of oil was pumped into the gulf by BP petroleum when they blew that pipe offshore a couple years ago.
> I'm not feelin the guilt over flushing some dirty thins. I'm just over it.


Thinners I pour back into the original container and dispose of it properly.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Oden said:


> I had too look it up
> 200 million gallons of oil was pumped into the gulf by BP petroleum when they blew that pipe offshore a couple years ago.
> I'm not feelin the guilt over flushing some dirty thins. I'm just over it.


and you are saying that and other crude oil spills have not been a unmitigated environmental disaster?

At least with crude, it don't mix with water like a highly refined solvent will. But if you want to have a mineral spirits cocktail with a twist of lime, go right ahead, but please don't force it upon others.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

cdpainting said:


> During the summer
> I will give our sprayer a quick cleaning at the job site, I spray into an empty 5er and take it off site every day. It really gets under my skin when some one cleans their sprayer spraying it directly onto the ground, even cleaning brushes.
> Most of you would be pissed off if you got home to see paint stains in your yard.
> I worked for a different painting company a few years back and one of the employees uses a fish pond to clean his brushes and cleaned his sprayer spraying directly into the pond. He said the water is filtered so no harm. I walk away from that company. I even told him he was a scumbag for doing that.




Wonder how he explained the coincidence of all the pond fish floating belly up.


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## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

daArch said:


> and you are saying that and other crude oil spills have not been a unmitigated environmental disaster? At least with crude, it don't mix with water like a highly refined solvent will. But if you want to have a mineral spirits cocktail with a twist of lime, go right ahead, but please don't force it upon others.


I'm saying all the painters in all the world from the beginning of time till now and till infinidum for that matter, couldn't put as much filth into the water as BP did in one instant. I throw my thins in the dumpster on the ground, whatever. It evaporates anyway.


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## ExcelPaintingCo (Apr 16, 2011)

Oden said:


> I'm saying all the painters in all the world from the beginning of time till now and till infinidum for that matter, couldn't put as much filth into the water as BP did in one instant. I throw my thins in the dumpster on the ground, whatever. It evaporates anyway.


Recycling and proper disposal isn't that difficult. It's all part of running a responsible business IMO.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

and all the human life lost by wars of mankind through the ages could not be equaled by one Mafia hit man ...........


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## squid (Dec 25, 2012)

RH said:


> Sorry guys, we part ways on this one.
> 
> I've had customers with work sinks in their utility or garage who have said I could use them and I've politely declined to do so. In 90% of the jobs I do I wrap my brushes and take them back to my shop sink to clean. If the HO has a really grody slop sink in their garage or shop, and they have said it's okay, I will wash out some brushes, but even then it's likely the majority of them will get cleaned at my place.
> 
> There is absolutely no way I would argue with a customer if they actually came out and said they didn't want me to use their sink - for whatever reason. To do so is a good way to invite being kicked off the job IMO. It's my mess so it's my responsibility to deal with it - not theirs.


I should start using smilies.


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## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

daArch said:


> and all the human life lost by wars of mankind through the ages could not be equaled by one Mafia hit man ...........


right. The guy the hit man killed and my dirty thins are both going to the landfill together in dumpsters.


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

RH said:


> Wonder how he explained the coincidence of all the pond fish floating belly up.


The owner of the painting company had to pay to clean the pond and replace the fish and filter system. I don't know if they died or not I am sure they did.


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## Brian C (Oct 8, 2011)

I stipulate to homeowners that all my equipment is washed off site and not in their garden or sink. This is one of my selling points that gives me the edge over other painters competing against me. 

I have seen other painters washing up rollers and brushes in the homeowners garden, and these-days, that is not a good work practice.


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## Marrone72 (Oct 12, 2013)

I can clean a brush 100% in a 5 gallon bucket, with a wire brush, dish scrubbing pad and clean water. There is no need to clean a brush with running water. 

Fill the bucket about 5" high and force the brush up and down to the bottom of the 5 about 30 times or as much as needed (no, it doesn't damage the brush). Be sure to change the water a few times throughout the process. It works like a charm.


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

Marrone72 said:


> I can clean a brush 100% in a 5 gallon bucket, with a wire brush, dish scrubbing pad and clean water. There is no need to clean a brush with running water.
> 
> Fill the bucket about 5" high and force the brush up and down to the bottom of the 5 about 30 times or as much as needed (no, it doesn't damage the brush). Be sure to change the water a few times throughout the process. It works like a charm.


Where do you dump the dirty water?


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## Oden (Feb 8, 2012)

Marrone72 said:


> I can clean a brush 100% in a 5 gallon bucket, with a wire brush, dish scrubbing pad and clean water. There is no need to clean a brush with running water. Fill the bucket about 5" high and force the brush up and down to the bottom of the 5 about 30 times or as much as needed (no, it doesn't damage the brush). Be sure to change the water a few times throughout the process. It works like a charm.


I'll line up three buckets in a row too if the job don't got water. Pre wash. Wash. Rinse. Good enuff. A lot of times the jobs got the water but don't got working drains and the water is a fire plug or some kinda outside hookup. Too cold for that these days.


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## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

Have a friend who specializes in pumping septics and says some people are skeptics and some are full of crap! Says it doesn't hurt anything!


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## Bender (Aug 10, 2008)

daArch said:


> I do hope this discussion is about waterborne brushes and not solvent based.


:laughing:
Only a paperhanger would say something like that


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## Brian C (Oct 8, 2011)

its not the only issue about washing waste water down the drain. Its also splattering residue around their sink and not cleaning up properly.


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## vermontpainter (Dec 24, 2007)

Bender said:


> :laughing:
> Only a paperhanger would say something like that


Sufferin' succatash!


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## slinger58 (Feb 11, 2013)

I use _bottled_ water only to wash latex tools. :whistling2:


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## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

cdpainting said:


> The owner of the painting company had to pay to clean the pond and replace the fish and filter system. I don't know if they died or not I am sure they did.


Gold fish?:blink:


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## Epoxy Pro (Oct 7, 2012)

mudbone said:


> Gold fish?:blink:


No a couple were white with black stripes and a couple other kinds maybe tie die colored after the paint cleaning.


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

squid said:


> I should start using smilies.


I kinda' wondered. Not something I expected from you.


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## ridesarize (Jun 19, 2012)

941owassard said:


> "Take them home to clean" Nope. If they don't like it they can replace all equipment used.
> 
> Don't take your work home with ya


If I was a client and the painters say "we have to clean paint tools in your sink" I would say "you wanna clean in my sink despite my concerns? clean up all your tools and don't come back." That's not mandatory to clean in someone's sink, or yard either.


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## squid (Dec 25, 2012)

paint2ski said:


> It was a utility sink in the garage...


 What I've learned from your experience is that just because a HO has a slop sink, ask first.

"all the fish that lay in dirty water dying, have they got you hypnotized"


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

I feel like I'm in heaven when a slop sink is available and permission to use it. 

This was/is my favorite home:










THREE oversize slop sinks . Love these 1920's mansions.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

941owassard said:


> "Take them home to clean" Nope. If they don't like it they can replace all equipment used.
> 
> Don't take your work home with ya


And guys keep asking how they can differentiate their company from the competition....

That's actually a point that's been brought up by a number of clients. They very much appreciate us taking our gear to the shop for cleaning.


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## jwilks75 (Jan 12, 2014)

Our clean up procedure is in our bid packet and has a few local links showing it okay to wash latex out of your brushes and naps. Since we're located in central Texas we can wash outside almost all year round. I bring a 50' garden hose with a high pressure nozzle so we can always wash away from the house. We find a grassy place in the yard away from buildings and items that you prefer not to get splatter on. We pre-wet the are to keep paint from drying on the grass. We then squeegee, squeeze, and pump the remaining paint out of buckets, naps, brushes, and sprayers back into there container. We then wash the equipment and then spray the grass. We use the general area till the job is complete and the only signs of us being there is a great paint job and greener grass. Solvent base equipment gets squeegeed, squeezed, and pumped back into container same as latex. Poles, ladders, sprayers, and anything else that can track back paint to the vehicle gets wiped down with rag and spirits. Brushes go in clean gallon bucket, naps, screens, and frames go in a five gallon and are brought back to my garage to clean. Sprayer is usually cleaned in yard on tarp with all solvents being sprayed into buckets and then brought back to my garage. I reuse my spirits over and over letting the paint settle in a metal five gallon bucket and then ladling off with plastic quart container. I use this for initial wash of sprayers, brushes, naps, etc. then you can finish clean with a lot less new solvent. The sludge left at the bottom after ladling off the top is taken to the cities hazardous materials drop off. I've saved myself a ton of money in solvents and gas making a trip to buy more since doing it this way.


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## ridesarize (Jun 19, 2012)

I never clean oil based roller covers. Waste of resources and time, and more sludge.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

ridesarize said:


> I never clean oil based roller covers. Waste of resources and time, and more sludge.


:thumbsup:With solvent costs and solvent-recycling costs, we rarely clean oil brushes anymore. We normally cost them out with each project. The only exception is for our oxhair varnish/enamel brushes and decorative painting tools.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

Gough said:


> :thumbsup:With solvent costs and solvent-recycling costs, we rarely clean oil brushes anymore. We normally cost them out with each project. The only exception is for our oxhair varnish/enamel brushes and decorative painting tools.


WOW, it's gotten to that point?

Even with the three bath system, allowing the sludge to settle, and using the solvents for many cleanings ?

Although, not for sleeves.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

daArch said:


> WOW, it's gotten to that point?
> 
> Even with the three bath system, allowing the sludge to settle, and using the solvents for many cleanings ?
> 
> Although, not for sleeves.


We found the three-bath system to be less effective than we wanted it to be, I think partially because the driers don't settle out. The rates from our solvent-reclaiming provider have gone up substantially, solvent prices continue to climb, and bumping up our labor rate all played a part in our decision.


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## ridesarize (Jun 19, 2012)

My friend who did union painting said they all throw away every frame, brush etc each single use. When you have dozens and dozens of painters, a lot of money is saved. Probably brushes $1-2, frames 25¢.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

daArch said:


> I feel like I'm in heaven when a slop sink is available and permission to use it.
> 
> This was/is my favorite home:
> 
> ...


I have ONE of those in my mansion:whistling2:

Solid concrete in a cast iron frame, one heavy bitch


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## RH (Sep 7, 2010)

chrisn said:


> I have ONE of those in my mansion:whistling2:
> 
> Solid concrete in a cast iron frame, one heavy bitch


But how many in all once you add up those in your other homes?


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## Toolnut (Nov 23, 2012)

If I'm doing trim I like to clean my brush a couple times a day, hey just me. I keep a 5er in the truck with a couple gallons of water in it, and a couple cups of fabric softener in it. Swish the brush around in it for 15 or 20 seconds, run a comb thru it, spin it out, done. after a couple days pour the water off the top (still useable) rinse the solids out of the bottom mix a little more, good to go. Takes about a minute for roller covers. Also keeps brush soft if stored for awhile.


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## jwilks75 (Jan 12, 2014)

Honestly I push latex products and rarely use traditional oil base products anymore unless there is a application where it is a much superior product. When we do I usually just use a contractor grade nap and toss it. If it is lambs wool or mohair then I clean. We always use good brushes and it only takes a couple minutes each so those get cleaned for sure. I've come to love a couple water/oil hybrid products that clean up in water http://www.kellymoore.com/products/paint/hybrid/. 

I like to wash brushes a couple times a day too here in the Texas heat.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

RH said:


> But how many in all once you add up those in your other homes?


 
ah, ah, have to wait for the wife to get home and ask:blink:


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