# Out of the box thinkin'



## JoseyWales

Just curious,don't kill me on this.

A paint sprayer is basically a pump,corect? Can you use your paint sprayer to apply cleaning solutions for siding or a roof? There must be a way to hook up a siphon hose to say a large garbage container filled with a cleaning solution.You could then get or make a nozzle for your 50 or 100' pressure hose.I hear some guys even use their spray guns at low pressure to apply chemicals.

I'm not sure if 50% bleach would ruin your Paint spray pump,but their are green alternatives.

If I was to clean a roof I'd look into the green type of cleaning solutions.That way you have zero risk of killing plant life or staining concrete [or the house].You also don't need a guy on the ground.

OK fire away!


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## Schmidt & Co.

Aaron has a pretty good system down. You might want to check it out.....
http://www.painttalk.com/f24/detail-roof-wash-11701/


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## JoseyWales

Schmidt & Co. said:


> Aaron has a pretty good system down. You might want to check it out.....
> http://www.painttalk.com/f24/detail-roof-wash-11701/


Yeah I saw that but I'm not prepared to buy a complete low pressure system considering the small number of exterior jobs I do a year.Aaron probably has enough cleaning work to pay that off in just a few jobs.

Maybe someone could convert an old paint sprayer into a useful cleaning tool.I'm just thinking outside the box,I have to watch my budget.


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## Workaholic

About the closest I have came is using one of my pumps to spray clear brick sealer.


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## Schmidt & Co.

JoseyWales said:


> Yeah I saw that but I'm not prepared to buy a complete low pressure system considering the small number of exterior jobs I do a year.Aaron probably has enough cleaning work to pay that off in just a few jobs.
> 
> Maybe someone could convert an old paint sprayer into a useful cleaning tool.I'm just thinking outside the box,I have to watch my budget.


I would be concerned about how the chemicals would affect my sprayers internal components. Maybe talk to a rep, or even a spray repair guy and get there advise before you commit?


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## NCPaint1

I used one of mine to apply stripper to my deck. I turned the pressure down, and reversed the tip backwards. It worked just fine, and was much faster than using a pump sprayer. I wouldnt hesitate doing it again.


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## Dave Mac

Yea I wonder if you can by bass the chemical from going into the pump like a xjet does with the PW, because nothing cleans the roof like SH and i know you don't want to run that threw the packings.


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## PressurePros

Those things flow at .5 gpm. It would take you forever to coat a roof. You have to saturate it. We use 8 gpm pumps. Low volume pumps are not really a viable option. You'd be faster with a pump up. And honestly, the sprayer needs neoprene or Viton valves and seals. I would never risk an expensive pump trying to apply strong bleach. 

Buy one of these and be done with it.
http://www.pressuretek.com/de58secorocl.html


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## PressurePros

As to the green way of cleaning ---> :lol:


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## JoseyWales

PressurePros said:


> As to the green way of cleaning ---> :lol:


Which green alternatives have you tried and failed with?Just curious.

Nothing wrong with going with the latest chemical cleaning technologies..Painters laughed at latex paints in the past.


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## JoseyWales

PressurePros said:


> Those things flow at .5 gpm. It would take you forever to coat a roof. You have to saturate it. We use 8 gpm pumps. Low volume pumps are not really a viable option. You'd be faster with a pump up. And honestly, the sprayer needs neoprene or Viton valves and seals. I would never risk an expensive pump trying to apply strong bleach.
> 
> Buy one of these and be done with it.
> http://www.pressuretek.com/de58secorocl.html


How about using my pressure washer with a tip to slow it down to 100 PSI? I have a Giant brand pressure washer,3000 PSI and 4 GPM.

I'll be washing more siding,stucco,wood and brick on the houses.If I get a roof to clean,that's a bonus.


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## CApainter

Paint strippers, that include methylene chloride, should not be used in an airless.

Check out the warning in the following link to the graco operating manual.
http://wwwd.graco.com/Distributors/DLibrary.nsf/Files/308714/$file/308714C.pdf


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## JoseyWales

CApainter said:


> Paint strippers, that include methylene chloride, should not be used in an airless.
> 
> Check out the warning in the following link to the graco operating manual.
> http://wwwd.graco.com/Distributors/DLibrary.nsf/Files/308714/$file/308714C.pdf


 
Yeah,that's why I'm looking for a green alternative that won't harm the sprayer.Why can't you use a wand and a 621 tip to just spray the stuff on then rince it off later?...It's faster than using a garden "pump" sprayer.

I've already contacted a rep who says he has a great cleaner that's safe to use.Its a concentrated powder you just add to water.

Here it is:

http://www.wash-safe.com/painters-wash-2


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## Pressure Cleaning

*Roof Cleaning*

Isn't bleach green?:yes:


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## JoseyWales

Pressure Cleaning said:


> Isn't bleach green?:yes:


lol maybe,but it turns the grass brown and the cement white.

I'm looking for a non-toxic cleaning agent.


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## Lambrecht

JoseyWales said:


> Yeah,that's why I'm looking for a green alternative that won't harm the sprayer.Why can't you use a wand and a 621 tip to just spray the stuff on then rince it off later?...It's faster than using a garden "pump" sprayer.
> 
> I've already contacted a rep who says he has a great cleaner that's safe to use.Its a concentrated powder you just add to water.
> 
> Here it is:
> 
> http://www.wash-safe.com/painters-wash-2


Hey Josey, I have used some of there products and they work great, especially the Cedar Wash. The roof cleaner does work good also, the drawback is that it requires you to use a pressure washer rinse. Big no-no roof cleaning. Tried it on my garage which had heavy carpet mold all over it. It did kill, remove, and brighten the roof but it also removed a lot of granules even though I used low pressure. the Painters wash is also a great product.


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## JoseyWales

Lambrecht said:


> Hey Josey, I have used some of there products and they work great, especially the Cedar Wash. The roof cleaner does work good also, the drawback is that it requires you to use a pressure washer rinse. Big no-no roof cleaning. Tried it on my garage which had heavy carpet mold all over it. It did kill, remove, and brighten the roof but it also removed a lot of granules even though I used low pressure. the Painters wash is also a great product.


I just talked to the rep today of "safewash" [SFI] and he says they also carry a product for roofs [Roof Wash] that is eco friendly.He said you just apply the cleaner with a pump sprayer or whatever,,let it set-up, and then just rinse it off with a garden hose. No pressure washing for the roof he said.

Re: Cedar Wash the company says "The alternative has always been chlorine bleach or TSP but the problem with those cleaners are that they leave the wood surface with a very unnatural bleached look, it also rarely comes out uniformly clean, more often than not it has a "blotchy" look that looks as if a bucket of bleach was thrown on the house.
As you can see by the photos below the cedar siding or roofing shingles come out uniformly clean, our Cedar cleaning product does not contain bleach nor does it require bleach to be added."

There are plenty of cedar decks and cedar shakes to be cleaned in any city! That said,wet cedar shakes is extremely slippery..I wouldn't go on the wet roof without a harness...I nearly slipped off a wet roof with cedar shakes once while cleaning the stucco...Maybe spiked shoes of some type would be helpful.


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## vermontpainter

I'm much more interested in getting my pressure washer to spray paint, rather than getting my paint sprayer to pressure wash.


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## Lambrecht

They have a video on their site showing how to rinse their roof wash off with a pressure washer. Yes, the product is environmentally friendly, it us sodium percarbonate which breaks down after 6 hours.


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## JoseyWales

vermontpainter said:


> I'm much more interested in getting my pressure washer to spray paint, rather than getting my paint sprayer to pressure wash.


 
Of course.I wouldn't use my good sprayer either.I'm just kicking around the idea of using an old airless Paint sprayer that you can find used somewhere and convert it into a cleaning pump.


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## JoseyWales

Lambrecht said:


> They have a video on their site showing how to rinse their roof wash off with a pressure washer. Yes, the product is environmentally friendly, it us sodium percarbonate which breaks down after 6 hours.


 
I haven't seen the vid.I just talked to the local rep for SFI and he outlined the process saying you don't use a pressure washer on roof tiles..He must be wrong!


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## Lambrecht

Yes the Cedar Wash does an incredible job. Removes the old stain, kill the mold, and brightens the wood with no splotchiness. I did a very large craftsman last year by myself in 12 hours. If I can find the pics I will post them.


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## Lambrecht

I used a 150 dollar transfer pump to apply the product.


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## JoseyWales

Lambrecht said:


> They have a video on their site showing how to rinse their roof wash off with a pressure washer. Yes, the product is environmentally friendly, it us sodium percarbonate which breaks down after 6 hours.


6 hours? I wonder if you still have to wet down the vegetation because 6 hours active solution might still do some damage.I'll have to ask them.


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## vermontpainter

JoseyWales said:


> Of course.I wouldn't use my good sprayer either.I'm just kicking around the idea of using an old airless Paint sprayer that you can find used somewhere and convert it into a cleaning pump.


You could probably get a really good pump sprayer for less money.


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## JoseyWales

Lambrecht said:


> I used a 150 dollar transfer pump to apply the product.


That's cheap. Maybe it's like the one PressurePro's linked to in this thread..I wasn't sure what the hell it was.


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## JoseyWales

vermontpainter said:


> You could probably get a really good pump sprayer for less money.


 
I have an expensive metal pump sprayer [that I use for wallpaper removal solution] that is meant for very strong chemicals but I want an electric one.Those things are a pain in the azz to pump up every 10 minutes.


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## aaron61

A paint sprayer will atomize, whatever your sprayin,to much.
Bleach will kill your pump quickly.
Start doing some research and have a little faith in those that have gone before you.
There is a reason why they are using what they use.
There are pressure washing & cleanig forums that will definetly help you


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## JoseyWales

aaron61 said:


> A paint sprayer will atomize, whatever your sprayin,to much.
> Bleach will kill your pump quickly.
> Start doing some research and have a little faith in those that have gone before you.
> There is a reason why they are using what they use.
> There are pressure washing & cleanig forums that will definetly help you


Using a 7/21 tip spraying out 99% water at low pressure won't atomize.It's just a transfer system.

I'm searching for eco alternatives to bleach and have found a few.I'll let you know how it goes this spring and summer.

Do you have a favourite pressure washing/cleaning forum?

Hopefully there are some companies that prefer to go the eco friendly way that I can learn from.


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## Lambrecht

JoseyWales said:


> 6 hours? I wonder if you still have to wet down the vegetation because 6 hours active solution might still do some damage.I'll have to ask them.


You can spray it directly on plants without any problems. The garage on the craftsman that I did was completely covered with vines on the back side and it did no harm to them other then a few small brown spots on a few leaves.
Takes Aarons advice, no reason to try and reinvent the wheel. There is a wealth of info on roof cleaning out there. Take the time to learn everything you can before you take the leap and best if luck to you.


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## JoseyWales

Lambrecht said:


> You can spray it directly on plants without any problems. The garage on the craftsman that I did was completely covered with vines on the back side and it did no harm to them other then a few small brown spots on a few leaves.
> Takes Aarons advice, no reason to try and reinvent the wheel. There is a wealth of info on roof cleaning out there. Take the time to learn everything you can before you take the leap and best if luck to you.


Thanks. I won't do any cleaning with bleach I can promise you that.If there are no good eco friendly alternatives then I'll pass.Nothing like the smell of beach..err..napalm in the morning!


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## Pressure Cleaning

I'm not the Chem guy but isn't sodium percarbonate a form of bleach? " Oxygen Bleach" It has no Chlorine people should stop claiming thier product has no bleach. Its a bleaching agent based on hydrogen peroxide. It is non toxic.


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## JoseyWales

Pressure Cleaning said:


> I'm not the Chem guy but isn't sodium percarbonate a form of bleach? " Oxygen Bleach" It has no Chlorine people should stop claiming thier product has no bleach. Its a bleaching agent based on hydrogen peroxide. It is non toxic.


When people "bleach" their teeth they use hydrogen peroxide.I'm not sure how harsh sodium percarbonate it.


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## johnpaint

NCPaint1 said:


> I used one of mine to apply stripper to my deck. I turned the pressure down, and reversed the tip backwards. It worked just fine, and was much faster than using a pump sprayer. I wouldnt hesitate doing it again.


I bet it cleaned out the lines good too.


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## Lambrecht

JoseyWales said:


> When people "bleach" their teeth they use hydrogen peroxide.I'm not sure how harsh sodium percarbonate it.


These are the same thing. Hydrogen peroxide is a liquid and sodium percarbonate is a powder. They are a naturally occurring chemical. I believe that sodium hypochlorite that is used for roof cleaning is a very strong form of salt that will eventually break down and no longer be harmful.


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## JoseyWales

Lambrecht said:


> These are the same thing. Hydrogen peroxide is a liquid and sodium percarbonate is a powder. They are a naturally occurring chemical. I believe that sodium hypochlorite that is used for roof cleaning is a very strong form of salt that will eventually break down and no longer be harmful.


 
Tide laundry soap!

Per Wiki:

Sodium percarbonate is an oxidizing agent and ingredient in a number of home and laundry cleaning products, including eco-friendly bleach products such as OxiClean and Tide laundry detergent.[1] Dissolved in water, it releases hydrogen peroxide and soda ash (sodium carbonate):[1]
2(Na2CO3·1.5H2O2) → 2 Na2CO3 + 3 H2O2Sodium percarbonate can be used in organic synthesis as a convenient source of anhydrous H2O2, particularly in solvents that cannot dissolve the carbonate but can leach the H2O2 out of it.[5]


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## Lambrecht

All true. However, I think if your going to get into roof cleaning I would strongly suggest doing what the other roof cleaning companies have been doing successfully for years. In researching more you will find that killing plants and grass is minimal when done correctly. Apple roof cleaning in Florida has been in the business for years and is a treasure chest of info. Google him and check some of the pressure cleaning forums. He is on quite a few.


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## Different Strokes

JoseyWales said:


> Just curious,don't kill me on this.
> 
> 
> OK fire away!


mmmmmm


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## PressurePros

Bleach neutralizes into a soluble salt. With proper dilution of runoff, it is both green and safe to use. If a person hurries or tries to do a roof clean as a one-man show, that may be where they get into trouble. 

Sodium percarbonate, while an oxidizer, is just not potent enough to remove black streaks and what grows on roofs without having to use higher pressure to wash. The same process applies to sodium hydroxide, another chemical used by the non-bleach folk. You can trust that you do a greater disservice using pressure on a roof than you do using sodium hypochlorite (bleach).


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## mr.fixit

bleach will attack the packings in your sprayer. if you attempt to use it flush it real good so that when it sits until the next use there is no bleach residue.
Personally I think bleach under any pressure would be bad news.


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## kennyb

So true clorine under pressure will attack aluminium and disolve it!


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## CliffK

PressurePros said:


> Bleach neutralizes into a soluble salt. With proper dilution of runoff, it is both green and safe to use. If a person hurries or tries to do a roof clean as a one-man show, that may be where they get into trouble.
> 
> Sodium percarbonate, while an oxidizer, is just not potent enough to remove black streaks and what grows on roofs without having to use higher pressure to wash. The same process applies to sodium hydroxide, another chemical used by the non-bleach folk. You can trust that you do a greater disservice using pressure on a roof than you do using sodium hypochlorite (bleach).


Absolutely agree:thumbsup:


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