# Commercial wallpaper job.



## sincere painter

I haven't hung 54 for at least 8 years but I did a lot of it when I did. A paint contractor is asking me for a number on installing 54 and I'm needing a refresher course. I was an employee when I hung it last so I'm completely green on this endeavor. It's new construction and to be done 3 months from now.


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## sincere painter

I have to do this thread in sections. The words disappear after six lines and I can't see what I'm typing. 

Should I just rent a machine for this? It sounds like about 1000 yards or so I'm guessing. But I don't know the exact quantities yet. A bolt is about 30 yards? I used to do about around 30 to 100 max depending on difficulty and weight. Is 54 only vinyl? Or can it be higher end paper? I know it can be fabric too but I'm not well versed on that. 

I was pretty good at this and would like to get this job but I want to get all the info I can.


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## sincere painter

Is there any special considerations if the humidity is super high when its hung? I've seen old paste get moldy in the five and wonder if extreme humidity for long periods could be remedied somehow using different paste or other procedures. 

I'm guessing the walls have to be primed. I've hung 54 over 54 with vov and wonder if its the same argument as residential paper. I'm against doing this for residential. 

What's the depreciation/cost savings with a machine?


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## modernfinish

Wow, no offense but I think yr in over your head and need some qualified help to maybe piece work it out to someone . But if you are going to do it then 

Yes you need a decent paste machine ,a Viking ,or Paste Mate are what comes to mind . I don't know about renting ,never heard of that. 

Wallcoverings come in all kinds .. Vinyl , fiber back , houndstooth, grass cloth ,etc.. I hung all in 54" goods

If its vinyl with a random pattern and the rooms are relatively easy to hang ... Like a motel room? Then I would charge $3 a yard for labor . 
Clay paste stripable is all you need I think I pay $12 -17 a five . Mold is from old paste, never had issues w new paste . 

That's a best case scenario . Good luck , 

I've hung quite a bit of commercial W/C hit me up if you have any q's


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## modernfinish

If its for a house then install price goes way up .like Double , I reread your post and what I was talking about is more for like a Marriott hotel .you can really make out good $


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## sincere painter

modernfinish said:


> If its for a house then install price goes way up .like Double , I reread your post and what I was talking about is more for like a Marriott hotel .you can really make out good $


Thanks I will look into the Viking and paste mate. I used the advance for years and see many good comments on it. I wish it didn't have to be as bulky as the advance but don't want to sacrifice durability. One time the advance actually fell over on its side while strolling into a job and it continued to perform like new. I always took great care cleaning the rollers and all the gears pita but kept it cranking out the bolts. 

54 vinyl goods was one little nich out of many other skills. After 8 years of "hodgepodging" it I ended up focusing on just repaints until that got old. 

Maybe I could focus on paper now. I'm tired of painting. I wish I had your portfolio of varied 54 inch goods but always seem to do just one type. Eventually, I was showed up by a real hanger. But I new my vinyl. Lol. 

Thanks for your post. It's not my work to piece out. It's all been offered to me. I just have to come up with a good proposal.


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## modernfinish

Ya you need to find out what material it is . Most likely it's vinyl . 3 months

Is plenty time to find a good used paste machine . By the end you'll be hangin 200 yds a day


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## sincere painter

200 seems hard to believe to me IMHO. In my prime, I did around 110 with no cuts only trimming. My hats off to you. Maybe with humapro and vegan diet or something lol. I wish I new how to do that.


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## Underdog

sincere painter said:


> 200 seems hard to believe to me IMHO. In my prime, I did around 110 with no cuts only trimming. My hats off to you. Maybe with humapro and vegan diet or something lol. I wish I new how to do that.


I hate commercial, I am way too slow but there's a guy I know in town that can hang by 10:00 what would take me all day.

Hate to overuse this but I think it's genetic... the speed to which some people can hang.


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## ProWallGuy

$3 a yard? Only if I lived in a van down by the river....


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## Gwarel

Underdog said:


> I hate commercial, I am way too slow but there's a guy I know in town that can hang by 10:00 what would take me all day.
> 
> Hate to overuse this but I think it's genetic... the speed to which some people can hang.


I know a guy like that too. I got a call a few weeks ago to finish a job that he started. They were looking for quality.....not quantity. 200 yds per day for one man is a myth. I'm sure it can be done if the conditions were perfect, like a huge room with no detail or obstructions, but on average one man will work like a dog to hang 120 yds a day and put out a quality product.


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## modernfinish

Normal day is 120 to 160 yards in 5to 6 hrs ..i was trying to be funny w the 200 yards , but when Im doing hallways I've hung that plus some . I've been remodeling towers here in Vegas for well over 15 years . There's some serious competition here so one must hang clean and fast .


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## modernfinish

Typical hanger hired out of the hall is expected to hang about 120 yards give or take ... It's pretty easy to hang that once ya get the lay out . Residential is a whole can of bs cause HO only seem to want bathrooms and kitchens done an those have most cuts /wraps and they always choose crap materials and only order just enough they don't understand that a drop match wastes 10 to15% off the top ... Haha that sounds bitter but i hate residential wc jobs unless its a mural .


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## Gwarel

sincere painter said:


> Thanks I will look into the Viking and paste mate. I used the advance for years and see many good comments on it. I wish it didn't have to be as bulky as the advance but don't want to sacrifice durability. One time the advance actually fell over on its side while strolling into a job and it continued to perform like new. I always took great care cleaning the rollers and all the gears pita but kept it cranking out the bolts.
> 
> You might look at a pull box machine. They cost a lot less, are compact and the one I have is the best thing I have used for clay.


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## daArch

I do NOT do commercial, although I have done some in small areas.

Good clay paste is no longer in the $12 - $17 per five range. Prolly at least double that.

However you acquire a machine, get it motor driven (unless a gravity fed one) and capable of running clay. (I've helped on jobs that have used both Tapofix and Advance - both excellent machines)


The ability to throw commercial goods on the wall is only part of being profitable in the game. Knowing how to estimate both yardage and pricing is critical. And you do not seem comfortable with those aspects. (pricing is verboten here, as you know). I would suggest you hire on someone who is knowledgeable in those aspects. And having someone to help is never a bad idea.


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## Craftworks

Charge by the yard . One 8ft by 54in is like 2.5 yards or like a euro D/R a bit less so try not to charge less then standard type wall cover.
I guess a paste machine works well but a nice roller does the job with a helper. I have done my share of 54 by hand trimming One up - next Face down - This creates a natural razor bevel that butts well Most people who hang the 54 "goods double cut but you run the risk of cutting the rock and have a pop seam . A well trimmed 54" job will last a life time.
DON'T be a hero charge according to the reality of a perfect job, you don't want to discover your making little money . Count your strips analyze the areas you will get speed with and make notes on the areas that one sheet could take a 1/2 hour or more IT HAPPENS. Remember lots of razors and adhesive are going to be needed.


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## nacdec

200 yds? not happening. I've been hanging 54" for years. 1 man, paste mate with Heavy Duty Clear, 70-80 yds a day, trimmed and washed. I Am from Chicago and the hangers always had to hang 120 yds a day, but had apprentices double cutting, trimming and washing behind them.


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## modernfinish

nacdec said:


> 200 yds? not happening. I've been hanging 54" for years. 1 man, paste mate with Heavy Duty Clear, 70-80 yds a day, trimmed and washed. I Am from Chicago and the hangers always had to hang 120 yds a day, but had apprentices double cutting, trimming and washing behind them.


No bro , I'm talking sheets pulled in room . 50-60 yard rooms. You tell a hanger here in Vegas 3 and out .you watch how quick you get .150 yds plus an extra $150 for another room and still be home to pick up kids from school... Punch free or no early outs . 

I've met some really good hangers from Chicago that's where tiffany decorating is based am I right ? We turn a floor a week here 140 rooms a floor places like the MGM . I have remodeled almost every hotel on the strip and worked on them new . 200 yds is a hard day . but it gets easier once you get the lay out . 

I know guys that can hang 300+ yards in a day but you probably think I'm full of it.


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## modernfinish

Apprentice comes in 2 hrs early pulls his arse off for a dozen hangers wraps up sheets and headers in plastic ,so he can get wall time . Wallpaper hangers here are rarely out of work only recently have we bogged down but it's looking up the Sahara and Echelon are a go later this year and damn near every hotel on strip is ready for a remodel.


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## Craftworks

modernfinish said:


> Apprentice comes in 2 hrs early pulls his arse off for a dozen hangers wraps up sheets and headers in plastic ,so he can get wall time . Wallpaper hangers here are rarely out of work only recently have we bogged down but it's looking up the Sahara and Echelon are a go later this year and damn near every hotel on strip is ready for a remodel.


Sounds like I should live in north Las Vegas CAUSE I want to live and breathe wall cover 
Is it a good place to raise kids ?


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## TJ Paint

Craftworks said:


> Sounds like I should live in north Las Vegas CAUSE I want to live and breathe wall cover
> Is it a good place to raise kids ?


yup. Vegas is great. Too hot to play outside, gotta look out for the gangbangers, and prostitutes. Other than that it's ok.


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## modernfinish

Craftworks said:


> Sounds like I should live in north Las Vegas CAUSE I want to live and breathe wall cover
> Is it a good place to raise kids ?


It's alright here , I've done well . All the wallpaper jobs are on the strip and the strip is union . Local 159 . Wage is $35 and change . 
I joined in 1993 as an apprentice . The key to staying busy is being a combo guy, tape/paint/hang all production speed . They don't like to shut anything down so everything is fast track . 
Like everywhere it slowed to a crawl , Vegas took a hard hit . I was lucky and took a job at a casino for the last few years but it's picking back up , now I'm in process of getting my contractors license , lots of red tape longer process than anticipated . I'm hoping on catching the next wave of work . It's coming for sure.

Sorry for long winded answer


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## modernfinish

TJ Paint said:


> yup. Vegas is great. Too hot to play outside, gotta look out for the gangbangers, and prostitutes. Other than that it's ok.


Haha I play at Lake Mead just fine , and really haven't seen any "gangbangers" since highschool . My kids are happy . We got a skatepark down the street . Cracks me up how people perceive Vegas cause they only see it how TV portrays it


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## Craftworks

My kids are young - so truly I would not want gang banging or have hookers in vision But I have to assume that was sarcasm with a edge of truth. So it seems that a slow down at times can be universal. Well looks like a union job after tax $190 a day unless over time is a go some companies just wont go over 40 as a rule. 
Some times I forget how good times were as a paper hanger or painter for that matter in the 80's 90's as $15 to $20 per roll was a universal price any good painter was paid from $150 to $200 a day for a good skilled day (self employed) and paint was $10 to $14 a gal fuel was a $1 per gal .
Things are sill good though it's always up to us to make our world what it is.


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## modernfinish

Craftworks said:


> My kids are young - so truly I would not want gang banging or have hookers in vision But I have to assume that was sarcasm with a edge of truth. So it seems that a slow down at times can be universal. Well looks like a union job after tax $190 a day unless over time is a go some companies just wont go over 40 as a rule.
> Some times I forget how good times were as a paper hanger or painter for that matter in the 80's 90's as $15 to $20 per roll was a universal price any good painter was paid from $150 to $200 a day for a good skilled day (self employed) and paint was $10 to $14 a gal fuel was a $1 per gal .
> Things are sill good though it's always up to us to make our world what it is.


The jobs are always different . sometimes you make deals with the company you are working for. Overtime is normal but it depends what stage the of job it's at , they act surprised that theres a completion date and paint wallcovering is always last out the door . 
these builders get penalized big money if project is not completed by the promises date

I've worked 7days 11 hours a day for months at a time sometimes longer hours if its pressing . It gets into REALLY good money Saturdays and Sundays double time all day. From right after 9-11 ...2002 -2007 it was insane busy building frenzy ,I am sure you've read about the housing bubble Vegas was poster child of it. No one Never thought it was going to end . Stupid.

But nah , you never see prostitutes unless you go looking for them just like any other city. There's always thugs in every town. Vegas is big , very big . Nice areas and ghettos . It's like the 3rd or fifth largest school district in country .. Something like that. 

Work will never pick back up to that level but there will always be work here.


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