# Why does everyone hate kilz?



## Local paint pro (May 15, 2018)

It seems like there is a bias towards kilz products by professional painters.. I personally have used their products without complaint many times. kilz original oil based primer is $67 compared to zinnser all prime which I can get for$95 for what I would say are identical products from different manufacturers. Same with latex kilz 2 compared to bulls eye 123 almost identical but kilz is slightly cheaper. I have heard numerous painters refer to kilz as a do it yourselfer primer and not something professionals turn to, want to know why!!


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## Gymschu (Mar 11, 2011)

Personally, I like KILZ oil. Pretty good stuff. Not quite as good as CoverStain, but close and usually better-priced. Now, their latex stuff is over-marketed. They advertise them as "stain-blocking" but in reality they make the stains worse. So, I guess that alone makes me not want to trust any Kilz latex product.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

30+ years of failure and complaints. And i'm not talking about my sex life. It works ok, until it doesn't. But why risk it from a retailers standpoint? It's a price point item, and therefore it is and has been at the bottom quality wise for quite some time. If you need a cheap primer for a cheap job and don't mind the possibility of some kind of weird a55 issue 3-4 years down the line go ahead and use it. It has it's place. Just not on the shelf of reputable paint stores.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Kilz 2 vs Zinsser 123*



Local paint pro said:


> It seems like there is a bias towards kilz products by professional painters.. I personally have used their products without complaint many times. kilz original oil based primer is $67 compared to zinnser all prime which I can get for$95 for what I would say are identical products from different manufacturers. Same with latex kilz 2 compared to bulls eye 123 almost identical but kilz is slightly cheaper. I have heard numerous painters refer to kilz as a do it yourselfer primer and not something professionals turn to, want to know why!!


When I started painting hi rise condos for a GC friend of mine, he did a lot of skim coating and was using Kilz 2 after skimming to help with pointing up, then Kilz 2 after pointing up. I was able to get him to step up to Zinsser 123 instead and it definitely works better. Not saying 123 is the best product for what we do, but I don't think I could get him to step up to something else like Aqua Lock or PPG 6-2. 

The Kilz 2 dries to more like a flat finish whereas the 123 appears glossier than an eggshell, almost like a satin finish, which I am thinking helps to seal the surface better than Kilz 2.

futtyos


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## Lazerlnes (Sep 9, 2017)

I have never had a problem with Kilz oil, but Coverstain has performed better for me and I like how it sands better too.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

did you all know that Kilz oil doesn't meet the insurance industries standard as a smoke sealer on insurance work? And many insurance companies won't pay for a rehab job where the painter used it for this purpose? How do i know this? A Masterchem sales rep told me.I wonder why? It says on the can it will seal smoke.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

Local paint pro said:


> It seems like there is a bias towards kilz products by professional painters.. I personally have used their products without complaint many times. kilz original oil based primer is $67 compared to zinnser all prime which I can get for$95 for what I would say are identical products from different manufacturers. Same with latex kilz 2 compared to bulls eye 123 almost identical but kilz is slightly cheaper. I have heard numerous painters refer to kilz as a do it yourselfer primer and not something professionals turn to, want to know why!!





For a five, I hope


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## Local paint pro (May 15, 2018)

Which primer products do you guys prefer in the place of kilz and kilz2? (From all manufacturers and price points)


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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Local paint pro said:


> Which primer products do you guys prefer in the place of kilz and kilz2? (From all manufacturers and price points)



Its a fairly long list with kilz at the very bottom


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## MikeCalifornia (Aug 26, 2012)

Original Kilz from 30+ years ago was the shiz, until it was cheapened to keep its price point. Competitors like Coverstain stepped in with better abilities. Since it was a big seller it went into the big box store and came out with new offerings. Real painters do not shop at a big box store, if you do sorry, not sorry. I can't say I used Kilz as a painter. The last time I used it was my senior year of HS, our class had to prime over a ton of graffitti we had made, we went overboard.


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## Local paint pro (May 15, 2018)

I don’t usually use it these days, if I need a cheap kilz 2 type product I usually use SW quick dry primer. I get QUICK DRY at about $15 a gallon, but I recently started using Ben Moore and PPG products. I am just curious and eager to find a similar product at around same price points as kilz 2 and original from ppg and BM.


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## chrisn (Jul 15, 2007)

Just use this


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## jennifertemple (Oct 30, 2011)

Ask and ye shall receive! Now you know. :wink:


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## kmp (Jan 30, 2011)

MikeCalifornia said:


> Original Kilz from 30+ years ago was the shiz, until it was cheapened to keep its price point. Competitors like Coverstain stepped in with better abilities. Since it was a big seller it went into the big box store and came out with new offerings. Real painters do not shop at a big box store, if you do sorry, not sorry. I can't say I used Kilz as a painter. The last time I used it was my senior year of HS, our class had to prime over a ton of graffitti we had made, we went overboard.


I resent the comment that real painter's don't shop at big box store's. I am not a prima donna painter and will apply what a customer wants regardless of who makes it or where I get it. A real painter can have good results regardless of product.Been painting for over 30 years and can take a lot of crap but that put a burr under my saddle.


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## MikeCalifornia (Aug 26, 2012)

kmp said:


> I resent the comment that real painter's don't shop at big box store's. I am not a prima donna painter and will apply what a customer wants regardless of who makes it or where I get it. A real painter can have good results regardless of product.Been painting for over 30 years and can take a lot of crap but that put a burr under my saddle.



Not to put anymore burr's under your saddle Montrose, you guys still ride horses to work? But, if you shop at a big box store, as my comment said I'm sorry, not sorry. By shopping at a box store for things that you would normally buy from a paint store, you are giving money to a company that is advertising against you every day. I can't see myself ever not buying from them, you kind of need to sometimes. And yes, sometimes jobs will dictate using products from them, but specing their stuff when you don't have too, now that's dumb!!


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## kmp (Jan 30, 2011)

I use big box store when someone else requests it, not often but it happens. I know "real" painters only use aura and only work in mansions but the real world is different. Where I live you buy from S/W or HD or Ace so I guess real painters couldn't make it here so best to live in the ant pile somewhere else.


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## Tprice2193 (Oct 3, 2017)

I haven't ridden a horse in 30 yr and yet I get a burr under my saddle at least once a week. Lately its been once a day. I like that saying.... glad its has hung on, like a burr, for 7 or 8 generations.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

kmp said:


> I resent the comment that real painter's don't shop at big box store's. I am not a prima donna painter and will apply what a customer wants regardless of who makes it or where I get it. A real painter can have good results regardless of product.Been painting for over 30 years and can take a lot of crap but that put a burr under my saddle.


If someone is a "professional", then it is assumed by other "professionals" that time is of utmost importance! Time is money, especially if you make your living providing a service to a customer. A few minutes every day over the course of a year can translate literally to thousands of dollars lost or gained. "Spending" that profit in a box store using very inferior box store paints is not in the least "professional". Sorry, but the $$$$ don't lie. And there are hundreds if not thousands of "professionals" out there that chase every job they can for a few scraps of $$$ that shop at the box stores. Yet they can't understand why the "professional" up the street buys a new truck every few years and a boat or Corvette (whoa! Corvette is actually the name of a type of boat!) on a whim by using premium paint bought at a "real" paint store. There is a very good reason why box stores are cheaper and have to give discounts to "professional" customers. It's to attempt to offset the monetary loss that the "professionals" that shop there have but are not smart enough to see.

30+ years and i see painters struggle to make ends meet every day. And they are ALL the ones using paint solely because it is cheap and they can get it at Home Depot or Lowe's and don't have to worry themselves with selling their customer on quality. Some painters can make money doing this, but the amount of extra effort it takes to do it is entirely lost on them.


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## loaded brush (Dec 27, 2007)

A vastly experienced painter will make any product work for themselves with minimal effort. "Professional" is a title used by many legit contractors but also widely used by amatuers to give the impression to the public that they are an experienced contractor, who will have difficulties achieving stellar results with high end products let alone low end products. 
If the advertising of big box stores is hindering your painting business......your definitely doing something wrong. They're relying on super marketing, you should be relying on your reputation.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

loaded brush said:


> A vastly experienced painter will make any product work for themselves with minimal effort. "Professional" is a title used by many legit contractors but also widely used by amatuers to give the impression to the public that they are an experienced contractor, who will have difficulties achieving stellar results with high end products let alone low end products.
> If the advertising of big box stores is hindering your painting business......your definitely doing something wrong. They're relying on super marketing, you should be relying on your reputation.


No. The mass media hypnosis is the problem. Tell someone for long enough that a product is good, and then it will be good. That is the issue. To many sheep, not enough wolves.


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## Cusingeorge (Jan 19, 2008)

I know a few wood shops that use "Kiltz" under SW's Solo then put my precat clear over it all. I asked them what they were going to do when all these cabinets start cracking, bleeding, so on and so forth, and all they cared about was *"Kiltz is $9.00 a gallon and Solo is $19.00, we'll deal with the problems when they come up"*. 

Mind you, this was 5-6 years ago, I doubt Kilz is still $9.00 at Home Depot.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

Cusingeorge said:


> I know a few wood shops that use "Kiltz" under SW's Solo then put my precat clear over it all. I asked them what they were going to do when all these cabinets start cracking, bleeding, so on and so forth, and all they cared about was *"Kiltz is $9.00 a gallon and Solo is $19.00, we'll deal with the problems when they come up"*.
> 
> Mind you, this was 5-6 years ago, I doubt Kilz is still $9.00 at Home Depot.


what happens is the home owner brings a drawer front or door to me and asks "what is all this tiny cracking coming from?" and then "how do i fix it?".
oh what a pleasure it is to get to be the person to tell them the answers to those two questions! Especially when they paid what they paid to have them done "the right way" the first time.


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## PaPainter724 (Apr 22, 2016)

I dont like kilz because I never use oil unless I absolutely have to. And when I do, there are better options. 

Give me Ppg 6-2 anyday or sealgrip if I need adhesion or stain blocking


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