# Best for stucco



## Toolseeker (May 25, 2017)

House is in central Fl. Really in pretty good shape, some hairline cracks, but not a lot of them. With stucco being known for these cracks I'm trying to decide between Aura and an elastomeric. Have used an elastomeric caulk to fill the ones present. I have never used Aura before and from what I have read on here I'm a little nervous using it to do a whole exterior for the first project. It will be brush and roll. The house is a light beige and she wants a light (almost white) gray. Again from being on here it seems 1 coat coverage is doable making it cheaper than 2 coats of Regal Select.

Aura or Elastomeric? or does someone have something better?


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

Well, I always only do one coat of elastomeric, but its sprayed on REALLY REALLY THICK and backrolled. If your brushing and rolling, dont count on a one coat coverage from anything. MAYBE an elastomeric could cover in one, but like I said, its thick as molasses, and takes about three times the paint you'd normally use. Its best to use an 1 3/4" nap with elasto.

This is assuming its that really rough stucco. The smoother stucco you can use a 1" nap.


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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

What sheen are you planning on using? Even with Aura, I hate the idea of one coating stuff, but my paint supplier keeps telling me I can do it with low luster. I never believe them, but there's no stucco around here.


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## Toolseeker (May 25, 2017)

Sounds like I need Low Luster. For The Elastomeric. I was thinking Satin. I really have concerns about the 1 coat claims for the Aura. And at the price to go back and say OOPs we're going to need a second coat isn't too appealing.


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## kmp (Jan 30, 2011)

Have never used aura but have used a lot of elastomeric. Rolling it can be a daunting and tiring task. Elastomeric needs to have a certain mill thickness to expand and contract with the stucco and one coat will not give you that mill thickness and for hide you will need two coats.Elastomeric is cheaper than aura, no secret there,but you will need a lot more to give you the proper thickness you need.


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## kmp (Jan 30, 2011)

Satin finish or anything with a sheen looks real funky on stucco. Elastomeric has a matte sheen and is slightly shiney because of the stuff that's in it to make it work. It is softer than regular paint and will hold dirt more than other paints.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Elastomeric can create an unwanted moisture barrier. They are typically spec'd for serous structural or moisture issues. If the stucco cracks are hairline and caused by natural curing of the stucco rather than structural stress, I would recommend applying an acrylic exterior flat or low sheen. Preferably in one coat to allow proper vapor passage.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

CApainter said:


> Elastomeric can create an unwanted moisture barrier. They are typically spec'd for serous structural or moisture issues. If the stucco cracks are hairline and caused by natural curing of the stucco rather than structural stress, I would recommend applying an acrylic exterior flat or low sheen. Preferably in one coat to allow proper vapor passage.


I lived in Reno for ten plus years, and I'd say about half the new construction is stucco, spec'd for elastomeric. Granted, we're talking that thick and rough AF raw stucco. This is high desert. Moisture isnt an issue. Why would they spec it if it creates problems?


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

CApainter said:


> Elastomeric can create an unwanted moisture barrier. They are typically spec'd for serous structural or moisture issues. If the stucco cracks are hairline and caused by natural curing of the stucco rather than structural stress, I would recommend applying an acrylic exterior flat or low sheen. Preferably in one coat to allow proper vapor passage.


One coat of an acrylic solid stain. Those hairline cracks are just cosmetic and you can actually cause bigger structural issues using something that will hold moisture in the stucco. 10 years of selling paint in one of the most stucco prominent markets in the country has taught me this. Home owners don't understand why they are getting those cracks and they tend to freak out when they see them. Unless the cracks are already to the point where they are causing the stucco to fail and fall off just a good exterior flat or solid stain is all i would recommend. That and someone somewhere teaching paint store people and home builders to learn how to tell homeowners about stucco.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Woodco said:


> I lived in Reno for ten plus years, and I'd say about half the new construction is stucco, spec'd for elastomeric. Granted, we're talking that thick and rough AF raw stucco. This is high desert. Moisture isnt an issue. Why would they spec it if it creates problems?


Without the moisture, elastomeric isn't a problem. But where moisture is a problem and the exterior walls need to be treated as if it were a roof surface, the elastomeric coating system has to be applied in a manner that will not allow water to permeate anywhere on the surface. Often, painters don't meet that criteria, and as PAC suggests, the elastomeric traps in moisture that gets into an improperly caulked window, wall, casing etc. Then, the bubbling begins as vapor tries to escape.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

So, Elasto isnt a good idea here in Humid Austin Texas? Good to know...


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Woodco said:


> So, Elasto isnt a good idea here in Humid Austin Texas? Good to know...


It's not that elastomeric isn't a good system. It is an excellent system for problem structures where cracks are constantly expanding and contracting. But if a stucco home is only experiencing hairline cracks from either thinned up stucco during construction, or too quick of curing, than a simple acrylic system that includes a masonry primer, is typically all that is needed.

In fact, it is my contention that stucco is not intended to be painted in hot climates. I've noticed that a painted stucco wall will retain a lot more heat than a non painted stucco wall.


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

CApainter said:


> In fact, it is my contention that stucco is not intended to be painted in hot climates. I've noticed that a painted stucco wall will retain a lot more heat than a non painted stucco wall.


I've done temperature tests and it's very color dependent. There are different types of "stucco" and that also has a roll the play. Big role.


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

I'll chime in since this is what we basically deal with on a day to day basis. I have 3 exteriors to be done in 2 weeks. Stucco*. 4th being siding which is rare and not in our city. 

Anyway, it sound to me like the OP is worried about coverage. With coverage and "single coat" paint job being the primary concern. 

Never used Aura, hear some good and some bad. Who knows. 

You won't get a water tight system with 1 coat of paint, even with elastomeric. You can make 1 coat work sure, but to be considered "water tight" according to the specs, it ain't going to happen with 1 coat. Elastomerics do breathe they have a perm rating, and most of the stucco now adays that is applied is synthetic anyway. The actual stucco you paint over is more than likely acrylic, with elastomeric resins etc depending on the type/manufacturer/cost, etc. So your essentially painting over paint, not a big deal.

If your painting over a cementious based finish your going to have to tweak the process some, because the first coat or two will probably be obsorbed into the stucco material. Cementious and synthetics are 2 different animals completely. So the whole notion of stucco is stucco, similar to paint is paint, is not true. 

My advise to you is to find out:
1.) What type of stucco it is, cement or synthetic. Does it get dark when water is put on it or does it only get a hair darker. Just like concrete, put water and it gets super dark, same thing.

2.) Once you find out what it is you have to figure 2 coats no matter what. If you want a smooth look you can use elastomerics. They'll have more milage and with that you'll water proof better, eliminate pin holes, and get a "smoother" looking job. If it's simply a color change you can go with a high end acrylic and be done with it. 

3.) If it is cementious based, there's various ways to treat it. Easiest solution, primer (loxon primer or loxon conditioner), and 2 coats of elastomeric paint. Elastomerics will have more stretch and elongations and will hide/fill cracks better. An regular acrylic won't hide anything it's merely for color and color retention. 


Good luck to yah and post some before/after photos.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

Hmmm. So, after reading this, and doing a little more research, I think the kind of stucco they do in Reno isnt as common everywhere. Its called 'heavy lace.' We would spray elasto on the raw stuff with a 629 tip about 6 inches from the wall, till it was running and dripping down the side, and the backroller would roll the crap out of it with an 1 3/4 nap roller. It had some SERIOUS mils. We would put 40-50 gallons on a single story house. I've never heard of anyone putting a second coat on. And it was a hot and dry climate. (sorry to detract from the OP)

Im assuming others on here refer to a less rough kind of stucco? Im attaching a pic.


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## kmp (Jan 30, 2011)

In Az that is Spanish lace. Cementious stucco will suck up a lot of paint. I would use 40 50 gallons of regular paint on a stucco house with two coats, one sprayed and back rolled and one sprayed. One heavy coat of elasto is to hard to control so that is why i would spray one heavy with a back roll and come back and spray a second. I would never use elastomeric on new construction. paint it with regular paint and let it crack,because it will and use elastomeric on the repaint if it is needed.


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## Toolseeker (May 25, 2017)

Was not really concerned about 1 coat coverage except for the Aura. The house has been previously painted and is in pretty good shape. This is more a color change, from a light beige to a light grey. The only cracks are cosmetic. I have pressure washed and filled the cracks with Big Stretch. There are a few places around the bottom where the paint has peeled some, these will be primed (Loxon).

When I first moved to Fl. worked for a guy that only used semi gloss on stucco houses. Sounds awful but after they weathered a little they didn't look bad.


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## Eagle Cap Painter (Nov 14, 2016)

Apologies for the slight derail, but how do you folks that deal with elastomerics on a daily basis feel about using them on brick, block, and masonry substrates in a climate where we get the full gamut of weather? I prime with Loxon and usually topcoat with a standard acrylic, but I've been directed to use elastomerics on these and now wonder if that wasn't the best option. Especially if it's a footing/foundation that's going to get plenty of moisture exposure.


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## Toolseeker (May 25, 2017)

To be honest I have used them but I wish someone would really explain them to me. I thought they were made for conditions like stucco where the question is not if they are going to crack but when. Then for the small hairline type cracks there would be some give so the crack would not open up and show.


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## Sully (May 25, 2011)

I've used aura twice this year. First time was on asbestos shingles. I did one coat of emulsifying primer tinted to the color and a single coat of aura. Second time was last month. Did one coat of SW inkwell over a faded navy blue. Covered nicely. Time will tell if it fades. My rep is pushing 1 coat to prevent too much paint build up leading to failure. Kind of makes sense. 

As for stucco I just used Texcrete smooth a water proofing acrylic coating. It's a high building film that filled in some gaps and cracks but stays "breathable". Went on like an elstomeric. I liked the results and so did the customer.


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

kmp said:


> In Az that is Spanish lace. Cementious stucco will suck up a lot of paint. I would use 40 50 gallons of regular paint on a stucco house with two coats, one sprayed and back rolled and one sprayed. One heavy coat of elasto is to hard to control so that is why i would spray one heavy with a back roll and come back and spray a second. I would never use elastomeric on new construction. paint it with regular paint and let it crack,because it will and use elastomeric on the repaint if it is needed.


We've actually been advised to do the opposite. 

Put the elastomeric first so as to limit the cracking, using the stretching ability hence the word "elasto". Then come back and put a regular acrylic on top for color changing/refresh. 

Doing it enough times, I would personally do elasto first. Then keep it maintained with regular acrylics.


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

Eagle Cap Painter said:


> Apologies for the slight derail, but how do you folks that deal with elastomerics on a daily basis feel about using them on brick, block, and masonry substrates in a climate where we get the full gamut of weather? I prime with Loxon and usually topcoat with a standard acrylic, but I've been directed to use elastomerics on these and now wonder if that wasn't the best option. Especially if it's a footing/foundation that's going to get plenty of moisture exposure.



Nothing wrong with them at all. 

Put it this way. For acrylics, pretty much ANY acrylic, if your dealing with a ponding water situation, it will fail. If the water is up against a building or say a footing, that at times, might actually be UNDER water. It's not a good choice, don't care what manufacturer it is.

But for normal conditions, above grade, etc. I use 100s of gallons of it per month and I've never had a call back about delamination etc. I also tell customers if I see it, if you have a sprinkler system and it hits it every single day or twice a day 365 days a year you might see premature wear. But I wouldn't stand behind any acrylic that is in a constantly wet environment. 

Just know your situations and your products and you'll be just fine.


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

Toolseeker said:


> To be honest I have used them but I wish someone would really explain them to me. I thought they were made for conditions like stucco where the question is not if they are going to crack but when. Then for the small hairline type cracks there would be some give so the crack would not open up and show.



You are correct. They have a higher elongation value than "normal" exterior paint. 

Here is what "elastomeric" means:
_*Elastomeric *refers to the rubber-like properties of a polymer, i.e., a material being able to regain its original shape when a load is removed from the material. It is related to having the properties of elastomers._

However, keep in mind that paints can be formulated differently chemically. So elastomeric "paint" is not always the "same". 

So for example:
According to ASTM D2370

Sherlastic has an elongation value of 200%

Conflex has an elongation value of 300%

But measured by ASTM D1653

Sherlastic has a vapor permeance of 37.1 perms.

Conflex has a vapor permeance of 22 perms.


So what does that all mean?  
It means that Conflex is more flexible with good water vapor resistance. Whereas Sherlastic has less elongation, but comparatively, is more breathable. Breathability is measured as passage of water vapor. 


Hopefully this helps you out some.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

So you do two coats of elasto on NC? Back in Reno everyone just did one coat. This was on tracts, and we even thinned it a bit, but put it on thicker than molasses running down the wall. We were using Kelly Moore. One coat on the whole thing, and trimmed out with acrylic. I think the only time we ever double coated was a huge custom, that after we painted we found out the designer had the body and trim colors backwards in our spec sheet. Oops. It definitely looked a lot smoother, but I couldnt imagine anyone shelling out for that much extra paint. Those paint jobs lasted a long time. The fascia needed repaints years before the body ever did, so other than looking a lot smoother, I dont think the second coat was necessary.

I remember the Sherwin Elasto was a lot thinner, and was really cheap, like $80 a five. The Kelly Moore Elasto was good stuff though.

250 elongation and 20 perms.

http://kellymoore.com/docs/default-source/material-safety-technical-data-sheets/1118-TDS-11.pdf?sfvrsn=0

It does say to do 2 coats if the stucco isnt primed, but noone ever followed that rule that I know of...


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

Woodco said:


> So you do two coats of elasto on NC? Back in Reno everyone just did one coat.


New construction doesn't get painted stucco. 

Reason being is they use elastomeric stucco as the top coat. The cheap tract homes, and I mean CHEAP, will do a grey coat and then get sprayed with a cheap acrylic for color only (no back roll). 
Those are the houses that we'll eventually come back and have to fix cracking etc. Top coat with elastomeric because it needs an elongation coat, and the number of hairlines is too much to go around and patch 1 by 1. 

When we paint we usually will do a primer and then a top coat and that 99.9% of the time will apply enough product.

Remember these paints aren't getting applied like "normal" latex paint. I would say typical milage when we spray is probably in the 20 - 30's wet per coat.

I don't typically thin them, the only thing I will do is add latex extender because of the heat. If not, the backstroke will show and you'll have roller lines in the final look because it's drying as your rolling. Extender = problem solved + working smart.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

I dont see how its possible not to backroll on new heavy lace stucco. Its just too damn rough... You couldnt get it to cover. 

Im talking about that Spanish lace or heavy lace though, like that picture I posted. 

Here in Austin, what gets stucco'd is usually the color coated Dryvit stuff.


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## Jerr (Feb 15, 2017)

woodcoyote said:


> We've actually been advised to do the opposite.
> 
> Put the elastomeric first so as to limit the cracking, using the stretching ability hence the word "elasto". Then come back and put a regular acrylic on top for color changing/refresh.
> 
> Doing it enough times, I would personally do elasto first. Then keep it maintained with regular acrylics.


Did not think the acrylic would have the same elongation as "elasto". Thus the acrylic cracking, then the acrylic delaminating from "elasto". A potential failure I would not want to pay for.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

I've never heard of acrylic delaminating from elasto. I've never seen a problem from trimming it out with acrylic either. The tracts I was doing, we put Kelly Moore Flat on the trim, and looking up close, it tended to have microchecking, but that was considered normal, and it never, ever peeled off or anything. The only thing I ever saw on an elasto'd house, even 15 years later was fading, except one house where someone obviously did something very wrong like paint it before the stucco was cured, or something. We even painted exteriors in the winter on the less cold days. The builders signed a waiver though, so we were in the clear if the cold messed it up somehow. But yeah, I have only seen one house where I considered the paint a failure, and it wasnt really failing. It was checked out and faded really bad, but it was stuck to the wall like superglue, so we coated it again with elasto.


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

Jerr said:


> Did not think the acrylic would have the same elongation as "elasto". Thus the acrylic cracking, then the acrylic delaminating from "elasto". A potential failure I would not want to pay for.


That's what you want to do the elasto first. Because most homes will do 90% of the settling within the first 5 to 6 years. Therefore, the movement is the most when the building is first built and less later.


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

Woodco said:


> I dont see how its possible not to backroll on new heavy lace stucco. Its just too damn rough... You couldnt get it to cover.
> 
> Im talking about that Spanish lace or heavy lace though, like that picture I posted.
> 
> Here in Austin, what gets stucco'd is usually the color coated Dryvit stuff.


We do backroll. Spray + backroll. Only real way to do it right, unless you want to spend an extra couple of days re-rolling everything over and over again.

It's the only prescribed way to fill the pores of the stucco. On most floated stucco we use 3/4 nap, sometimes 1 inch. But* I don't like real heavy naps because they sprinkle a lot and then we have more issues to deal with. 

On heavier stucco like the lace or knock down (knock down being heavier) then we'll go to a 1 1/4 inch.

The synthetic lambs wool is real popular for back rolling. A long with regular lambs wool. <shrugs>


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## MikeL (Jan 5, 2015)

Here in SW Florida for repaints like yours we'll use Loxon Guide Coat first if there is any chalkiness left after pressure washing. Have the guide coat tinted 25% to the top coat color which will help with color change. Fill hair line cracks with elastomeric. We get the gallon and brush it in the cracks. We use SuperPaint Satin on the majority of the homes. We rarely use flat for exteriors. As an upgrade we use Duration or Emerald. Only once did we use an elastomeric coating and this was on one large wall on the back of a house. It was requested from a water damage restoration contractor we do some work for. The wall had tons of hairline cracks. We did two coats of the elastomeric. Never heard back if that did the trick. We don't use BM products often, but Aura would be a nice upgrade from Ultra Spec.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

MikeL said:


> Here in SW Florida for repaints like yours we'll use Loxon Guide Coat first if there is any chalkiness left after pressure washing. Have the guide coat tinted 25% to the top coat color which will help with color change. Fill hair line cracks with elastomeric. We get the gallon and brush it in the cracks. We use SuperPaint Satin on the majority of the homes. We rarely use flat for exteriors. As an upgrade we use Duration or Emerald. Only once did we use an elastomeric coating and this was on one large wall on the back of a house. It was requested from a water damage restoration contractor we do some work for. The wall had tons of hairline cracks. We did two coats of the elastomeric. Never heard back if that did the trick. We don't use BM products often, but Aura would be a nice upgrade from Ultra Spec.


After reviewing a few engineering articles relating to the painting of stucco, MikeL's system seems to be the preferred method. 

1. Following the recommended stucco cure time and ph appropriate primer, Elastomeric was recommended to be brushed only on hairline cracks that occurred during the curing process.

2. The finish coat recommended, is a 100% acrylic satin exterior paint. The satin was probably recommended to better blend with the elastomeric crack treatments.

When I began painting in the late 70's, this was exactly the same way we treated stucco with the exception of using a flat acrylic exterior finish that unfortunately, would reveal a lot of the patch work.

Full elastomeric applications were thought to be overkill if not applied to a surface with real structural problems. And, possibly having the potential to create more problems than they were solving. Granted, this was during a time when products like Sears TEX-Coat were being targeted for not meeting their product claims, along with a string of major failures due to improper installation.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

Do you have any examples of product failure by using elasto? Like I said, I've only come across ONE semi-failure on a stucco house in my career.

It sounds to me, like both methods work fine, but elasto hides any stucco cracking better than acrylic, so Im going with that, for anything new. For Repaints, Im going with acrylic though, maybe spot priming cracks with elasto.

Not sure what to think here...


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Woodco said:


> Do you have any examples of product failure by using elasto? Like I said, I've only come across ONE semi-failure on a stucco house in my career.
> 
> It sounds to me, like both methods work fine, but elasto hides any stucco cracking better than acrylic, so Im going with that, for anything new. For Repaints, Im going with acrylic though, maybe spot priming cracks with elasto.
> 
> Not sure what to think here...


I think it's just a matter of preference, although less square footage out of a material means higher costs. And if you're not applying elastomeric at the recommended WFT, it's probably not performing much better than a generic 100% acrylic anyways.

As far as building what may amount to an unnecessary thick coating of elastomeric over stucco, I suppose that's debatable given the variables that drive the environment a coating will have to perform in.


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## Jerr (Feb 15, 2017)

Just Google it.
https://www.google.com/search?q=ela...hVQ2mMKHQMvBRAQ_AUIESgD&biw=360&bih=612&dpr=4


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

Jerr said:


> Just Google it.
> https://www.google.com/search?q=ela...hVQ2mMKHQMvBRAQ_AUIESgD&biw=360&bih=612&dpr=4


not one of those videos has an example of failing elastomeric on stucco. I even put stucco in there too, and didnt find a single example... WTF?


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Woodco said:


> not one of those videos has an example of failing elastomeric on stucco. I even put stucco in there too, and didnt find a single example... WTF?


I did a google image search for elastomeric failure and got several hits. There are also numerous articles on the subject.

The consensus is, elastomerics are considered specialty coatings that require more attention during planning and application than regular acrylic paints do.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

CApainter said:


> I did a google image search for elastomeric failure and got several hits. There are also numerous articles on the subject.
> 
> The consensus is, elastomerics are considered specialty coatings that require more attention during planning and application than regular acrylic paints do.


Im not seeing a single instance in google images, or videos, of failing elastomeric paint on stucco. Not on the first few pages, anyway. I dont know what you guys are seeing that Im not.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Woodco said:


> Im not seeing a single instance in google images, or videos, of failing elastomeric paint on stucco. Not on the first few pages, anyway. I dont know what you guys are seeing that Im not.


Try googling "elastomeric failure" under images and videos. 

Are you having concerns about applying elastomeric? Just follow the recommendations and you'll be fine.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

Like I said, I did. I dont see one single instance of elastomeric paint failure on stucco. 

No, Im not having concerns, it was a legitimate question. If people out there are advising against using elasto for stucco, I want to know/see exactly what can go wrong. I googled as both of you suggested, and I dont see one thing about it. If you see something that I dont, please provide the link on here. Im trying to understand. I hate when people say not to do something but dont explain what can go wrong if they do.


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

Years ago Gabe Ewing posted a ton of info about elastomeric coatings on here. There was a lot of good discussion on the pros and cons of that type of system from guys using it frequently in the field. 

From what I remember the basic rule for whether an elastomeric was appropriate or not had to do with the possibility of moisture intrusion. Creating a moisture barrier over a surface that is still subject to intrusion could lead to bubbling and peeling of the coating, as well as further deterioration of the substrate. 

Nothing is fool proof, if you look long enough you’ll find failure situations for any coatings system. 

Here’s one of Gabe’s old threads on the subject with a link to his blog that contains in-depth articles. 

http://www.painttalk.com/f16/elastomeric-paints-14995/

There are several more if you want to dig deep enough into this forum. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Woodco said:


> Like I said, I did. I dont see one single instance of elastomeric paint failure on stucco.
> 
> No, Im not having concerns, it was a legitimate question. If people out there are advising against using elasto for stucco, I want to know/see exactly what can go wrong. I googled as both of you suggested, and I dont see one thing about it. If you see something that I dont, please provide the link on here. Im trying to understand. I hate when people say not to do something but dont explain what can go wrong if they do.


I just read through the whole thread and no one said not to use elastomeric. There were replies suggesting it is a specialty coating and that it isn't a necessary system in a lot of cases. Especially, given the amount needed and the potential to trap moisture if not applied correctly. 

Elastomeric can absolutely be considered overkill if conditions don't require it. Just like a two component epoxy coating system can resist the harshest of chemicals and abrasion , but are rendered fragile and useless if applied to sheet metal duct work. Or, a better example would be applying epoxy paint on drywall that could have received a basic latex.

I mean, if using this specialty coating system has worked for you as a selling point, I'd continue using it. But, with the understanding that it requires more effort than other systems that would be adequate.


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## Brushman4 (Oct 18, 2014)

CApainter said:


> I just read through the whole thread and no one said not to use elastomeric. There were replies suggesting it is a specialty coating and that it isn't a necessary system in a lot of cases. Especially, given the amount needed and the potential to trap moisture if not applied correctly.
> 
> Elastomeric can absolutely be considered overkill if conditions don't require it. Just like a two component epoxy coating system can resist the harshest of chemicals and abrasion , but are rendered fragile and useless if applied to sheet metal duct work. Or, a better example would be applying epoxy paint on drywall that could have received a basic latex.
> 
> I mean, if using this specialty coating system has worked for you as a selling point, I'd continue using it. But, with the understanding that it requires more effort than other systems that would be adequate.


I've painted numerous sheetrock walls along with block in labs and chemical companies, with epoxies. They were specked with this because epoxy has excellent chemical resistance. Of course, all these were primed with a good quality PVA.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

I've seen water get behind elastomeric coats on stucco before that blew bubbles like they were actually Bubblicious instead of paint. If there is enough water getting behind it elastomeric will fail. Catastrophically. Elastomeric coats are not designed for hydrostatic water pressure. At all. Ever. If they are, then they are no longer called or classified as elastomeric paints. They are then classified as hydrostatic coatings. (Dryloc and the like) Two totally different things. In fact, i would much rather see old cracking stucco painted with Drylock than an elastomeric.


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

PACman said:


> I've seen water get behind elastomeric coats on stucco before that blew bubbles like they were actually Bubblicious instead of paint. If there is enough water getting behind it elastomeric will fail. Catastrophically. Elastomeric coats are not designed for hydrostatic water pressure. At all. Ever. If they are, then they are no longer called or classified as elastomeric paints. They are then classified as hydrostatic coatings. (Dryloc and the like) Two totally different things. In fact, i would much rather see old cracking stucco painted with Drylock than an elastomeric.


If theres water getting behind it, isnt that a much bigger problem than just failing paint?

Like I said, Im trying to understand. When I think of elasto on Stucco, Im picturing the tracts everyone did back inn Reno. This stucco was so ridiculously rough, I dont see how anything other than elasto could even be applied to the raw surface. We used a 629 tip about 6 inches from the wall blasting this stuff on, and a backroller with a 1 3/4 nap roller working it into the nooks and crannies. Even though its not supposed to be just single coated, thats what everyone did, and they all last 20 years or more. Slight fading is the only reason I've seen anyone repaint them. Also, we sprayed the eaves with it, and they were raw wood, and they held up too. 

I just dont see how an acrylic could even be applied to raw heavy-lace stucco. I've been under the impression that elasto is meant to be a form of block filler and paint in one, for this type of stucco. Its as if its being used for the sheer mils you can put on more than a waterproof coating.

I doubt I'll ever even do another raw heavy-lace stucco house, Im just trying to understand, and am still looking for a visual example of elasto on stucco failure


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## Jmayspaint (Mar 26, 2013)

Woodco said:


> If theres water getting behind it, isnt that a much bigger problem than just failing paint?
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Dude, I don’t think anybody’s doubting that an elastomeric coating can be quite effective in a lot of applications. The anecdotal evidence of your experience is additional testimony of that. 

New track homes in Reno are sure to present a somewhat different challenge to a coating than a repaint with existing cracks in Florida. 

Your absolutely right that water intrusion is a bigger problem, but we still have to deal with it in choosing the right coating for the job. 

If you can’t find images of elastomeric failures on google your not looking very hard. 













Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

I've actually seen water bubbles that held more than five gallons of water. It was pretty neat actually. Mainly because it was a Frazee product and the painter went against our spec. No visible problems, other than a big a55 pregnant wall. (it was actually caused by the duma55 not being able to apply the product properly to the second floor. Lots of pinholes and skippers. really amazingly bad application. First tropical depression after the job and wham! 9 months preggo!)


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## Woodco (Nov 19, 2016)

Jmayspaint said:


> Dude, I don’t think anybody’s doubting that an elastomeric coating can be quite effective in a lot of applications. The anecdotal evidence of your experience is additional testimony of that.
> 
> New track homes in Reno are sure to present a somewhat different challenge to a coating than a repaint with existing cracks in Florida.
> 
> ...


That picture is neither elastomeric, nor stucco....

I'll shut up about it, but its a little irritating when multiple people say "google it" and I cant find one, single example there. 

The closest thing I can find is this link here, which describes the possibility of failure with too many repaints of elasto, making way too thick of a film,but even then, the water needs a way to get behind it. http://www.paintinfo.com/cn/cnp-021.shtml

All I did was ask for specific examples of elasto failure on Stucco, and Pacman supplied one. Google didnt, despite three people telling me it does.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

Woodco said:


> That picture is neither elastomeric, nor stucco....
> 
> I'll shut up about it, but its a little irritating when multiple people say "google it" and I cant find one, single example there.
> 
> ...


I think if you refer to an elastomeric TDS, like SW Sherlastic for instance, you'll find that it confirms the concerns that have been offered here.


From the Sherlastic TDS under "Caution":
-For exterior use only. 
-Protect from freezing. 
-Non-photochemically reactive. 
-Not for use on horizontal surfaces (floors, roofs, decks, etc.) where water will collect. 
-Not for use on overhead horizontal surfaces (under sides of balconies, soffits, etc.) 
-Not for use below grade. 
-*Will not withstand hydrostatic pressure.*


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

The following link is to a blog from former active member Gabe Ewing. 

http://ewingpainting.net/elastomeric-paints 

He talks about elastomeric coatings. Hope this helps.


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

CApainter said:


> I think if you refer to an elastomeric TDS, like SW Sherlastic for instance, you'll find that it confirms the concerns that have been offered here.
> 
> 
> From the Sherlastic TDS under "Caution":
> ...


All that explains....is that people shouldn't be idiots by applying it to things such as floors. It's a catch all from a scientific standpoint.

If it was not designed for a wall application it wouldn't state in the pds this as well:
*Wind-Driven Rain Test*
 ................ *Passes *
 ASTM D6904-03 
 1 ct Loxon Primer at 3.2 mils dft 
 2 cts at 4.0-6.0 mils dft/ct 



And also:
"This product will protect against wind-driven rain when used on tilt-up, precast, or poured-in-place concrete, CMU, and stucco"


If anyone is worried about water proofing, etc. It's important to apply it properly. 

" *SPECIFICATIONS
*A minimum total dry film thickness of 8 - 
12 mils of topcoat and a surface with 10 
or less pinholes per square foot is re-
quired for a waterproofing system."


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

Woodco said:


> If theres water getting behind it, isnt that a much bigger problem than just failing paint?
> 
> I just dont see how an acrylic could even be applied to raw heavy-lace stucco. I've been under the impression that elasto is meant to be a form of block filler and paint in one, for this type of stucco. Its as if its being used for the sheer mils you can put on more than a waterproof coating.
> 
> I doubt I'll ever even do another raw heavy-lace stucco house, Im just trying to understand, and am still looking for a visual example of elasto on stucco failure


Exactly, if water is getting behind the substrate I wouldn't expect very many paints (maybe other than oil) to fail. And I think honestly oil would fail over time as well, because chances are the water will eventually make its way under that coating and just pull it loose from the substrate, because after all oil doesn't have that great a perm rating either. 

An acrylic could be applied to a lace if it's been primed properly. You'll have a hard time of it with just a 1 coat application on raw stucco.


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

Woodco said:


> I'll shut up about it, but its a little irritating when multiple people say "google it" and I cant find one, single example there.
> 
> All I did was ask for specific examples of elasto failure on Stucco, and Pacman supplied one. Google didnt, despite three people telling me it does.


Look it's just like anything else, if applied right IN the right conditions (situational), you'll be just fine. 

I have seen large bubbles in walls before, in BOTH elastomeric and acrylic. In fact, I've seen bubbles in STUCCO, forget paint, I'm talking about the actual stucco itself. Because like I said, most stucco applied now adays is synthetic. 

I've also seen walls slump and pull away from the building, because water has gotten into the wall structure and rotted out the metal lath that holds the actual stucco in place. 

It's over dramatic when people talk about "elastomeric failure". I'm sure one could find just as much if not more failures in other "coatings" such as deck coatings, 100% acrylics, primers, etc. When looking for something you'll usually find it.

The only real differences in elastomeric vs. 'other' exterior paints are the elastomers in the formulation (for elongation) and of course the viscosity which allows you to apply it thicker, similar to block filler, a heavy viscosity coating. The paint is still an acrylic at the end of the day, hence it's water based clean-up. 


If everyone was so concerned with water permeance than everything would be made or coated with concrete, which old stucco use to be made. It absorbs and released water like a sponge, hence it "breathes", but with that comes other pros/cons. 

Long story short, prep it right, apply it right and everyone will be just fine. Problem solved.


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## CApainter (Jun 29, 2007)

woodcoyote said:


> Look it's just like anything else, if applied right IN the right conditions (situational), you'll be just fine.
> 
> I have seen large bubbles in walls before, in BOTH elastomeric and acrylic. In fact, I've seen bubbles in STUCCO, forget paint, I'm talking about the actual stucco itself. Because like I said, most stucco applied now adays is synthetic.
> 
> ...


I think you're missing the point. Elastomeric systems are good coating options, but aren't necessary in every stucco application. And consumers should understand this before they shell out the bucks for what is considered a specialty coating. Especially, given the limited coverage you get per gallon.


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## woodcoyote (Dec 30, 2012)

CApainter said:


> I think you're missing the point. Elastomeric systems are good coating options, but aren't necessary in every stucco application. And consumers should understand this before they shell out the bucks for what is considered a specialty coating. Especially, given the limited coverage you get per gallon.


What exactly makes this a specialty coating? You keep referring to it as a specialty paint, but haven't defined what makes it special.

In fact I don't think it's any more special than a regular acrylic paint, other than its elongation factor.


In my opinion there are other paints out there that I feel have better qualities, and in my opinion elastomerics are to be used on stucco that has a lot of hairline cracks, has never been coated before, or might benefit from a thicker coating. And that's pretty much it.

Other paints can be applied down to 35 degrees, elastomerics aren't recommended below 50. Hydrostatic pressure is another thing that it doesn't offer (aka below grade). Isn't rain ready in less than 2 hours like some higher quality paints. Etc. 

So again, what makes this a specialty coating because the more I describe the other paints the less it sounds like a specialty coating.


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## PACman (Oct 24, 2014)

woodcoyote said:


> All that explains....is that people shouldn't be idiots by applying it to things such as floors. It's a catch all from a scientific standpoint.
> 
> If it was not designed for a wall application it wouldn't state in the pds this as well:
> *Wind-Driven Rain Test*
> ...


Last time i checked, "wind driven rain" was water coming from the outside or exposed side of a coating. Not water coming from the substrate moving outward. Hydrostatic applies to horizontal surfaces as well as floors. Or Drylock would have been out of business a looooooong time ago.

Elastomeric when properly applied will work great on stucco, provided there is no moisture in the substrate and the substrate is properly sealed or otherwise protected against water getting in to it from the uncoated side.

Hairline cracks in stucco color coat are cosmetic and are not of themselves a structural failure. Therefore an elastomeric paint is not required.

And stucco cracks beyond the typical hairline cracks ARE structural, and no amount of elastomeric anything is a fix for them.

Elastomeric coatings originated as a coating for large commercial buildings that are subjected or can be subjected to large amounts of "wind driven rain". That is the reason that many people, paint manufacturers included, consider them as "specialty" coatings. That and the fact that the proper application is critical and only skilled, experienced painters should be applying it. Just because some manufacturers have marketed elastomeric coatings as the be-all of exterior masonry coatings doesn't make them necessarily the best, most economical choice in most applications. In fact, on a typical home it would be cheaper to apply a new stucco coat than to apply a coat of elastomeric.

Also, most residential stucco is done as cheaply as possible, which very much opens up the possibility that using an elastomeric would be an unnecessary expense. a coat of masonry conditioner and a coat or two of an acrylic flat is all that those houses actually warrant. No elastomeric paint is going to compensate for the cheap stucco product that was initially used.

"No matter how much perfume you dump on it, cow 5hit is still cow 5hit."


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