# Scraping Paint on Raised Grain



## Betheweb (Jul 26, 2016)

Assuming you are going to put down a solid stain, how do you scrape/feather peeling paint on an old deck with raised grain? Scraper or sander won't get down in between the raised grain. Sanding it completely down to a smooth surface would take days and fasteners are in the way and stuff. Probably not worth it on a deck that old anyway. Deck strippers don't really work on paint. I dunno. I have been gently using a wire wheel on a grinder. It gets the job done, but it's awkward and tedious and easy to gouge the wood. I wonder how other people are approaching it.


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## PNW Painter (Sep 5, 2013)

I think something like the Porter Cable Restorer with the Nylon or Stainless wire brush would work well.

https://www.rockler.com/porter-cable-restorer


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## AngieM (Apr 13, 2016)

I'm not sure what you mean by raised grain? Is it in the cracks of the wood? If you're going to solid stain it, you just need to get it to a sound surface (no peeling or chipping stain) and you can stain over it.

The pic attached is of a deck I did where the customer wanted to switch from a solid stain to a semi transparent. We pressure washed it, stripped it twice, sanded and sanded and sanded it with a random orbital until I finally tried the angle grinder with a 40 grit flap wheel. I could have saved a lot of time by doing that to begin with. Live and learn. The video is on my Instagram.









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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

AngieM said:


> I'm not sure what you mean by raised grain? Is it in the cracks of the wood? If you're going to solid stain it, you just need to get it to a sound surface (no peeling or chipping stain) and you can stain over it.
> 
> The pic attached is of a deck I did where the customer wanted to switch from a solid stain to a semi transparent. We pressure washed it, stripped it twice, sanded and sanded and sanded it with a random orbital until I finally tried the angle grinder with a 40 grit flap wheel. I could have saved a lot of time by doing that to begin with. Live and learn. The video is on my Instagram.
> 
> ...


Angie M. It may have been quicker to replace the boards in your situation. Lol. However, that's usually what I do.. Hit it with the 7" grinder. Hardback with 24-50 grit paper. That will chew through anything. 
So hard on the back though. I've maybe considered one of those stand up floor sanders.. for bigger surfaces.. 
Or as late, I just turn those jobs down! Haha.

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## Wildbill7145 (Apr 30, 2014)

finishesbykevyn said:


> Or as late, I just turn those jobs down! Haha.
> 
> Sent from my SM-T330NU using Tapatalk



Ditto. I can't even remember the last deck job I did and I'm not kidding. I do remember turning down a few over the past several years. At this point I can't imagine how painful it would be to my back or knees to jump in on a big deck job. Now I feel old.


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## AngieM (Apr 13, 2016)

Never again. That deck was a can of a worms. 

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## cocomonkeynuts (Apr 14, 2017)

Mediablast is best


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## Redux (Oct 27, 2018)

The OP’s likely referring to what is known as earlywood “shell-out”. The low points are where the softer earlywood has eroded, the denser latewood not eroding at the same rate. SYP as pictured in Angela’s photo has very dense latewood and very soft earlywood, the shelling usually being extremely pronounced making it difficult to sand flat. It would be a chore to flatten that out even with a Rotex sander in rotary mode, even with #60 grit. I would typically subcontract out something like that to a floor sander. They usually bang me $.50-$1.00/sq ft as long as I countersink the fasteners for them.


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## Betheweb (Jul 26, 2016)

Alchemy Redux said:


> The OP’s likely referring to what is known as earlywood “shell-out”. The low points are where the softer earlywood has eroded, the denser latewood not eroding at the same rate. SYP as pictured in Angela’s photo has very dense latewood and very soft earlywood, the shelling usually being extremely pronounced making it difficult to sand flat. It would be a chore to flatten that out even with a Rotex sander in rotary mode, even with #60 grit. I would typically subcontract out something like that to a floor sander. They usually bang me $.50-$1.00/sq ft as long as I countersink the fasteners for them.


Yep. Trees grow fast in the spring. This forms wide rings of soft wood, called earlywood. Trees grow more slowly in the summer. This forms narrow rings of denser, harder wood, called latewood. Then they go dormant until the next spring. That is why you can tell the age of a tree by counting the rings. The dense latewood is darker in color. That is why wood grain looks the way it does. 

The soft earlywood wears down faster. So after several years of sitting out in the elements, a deck board will no longer be smooth. You get wood that looks like this:









This same process happens much faster if you hit a deck with a pressure washer, using too much pressure. 

If somebody painted a deck with raised grain like this and that paint subsequently failed, it is a paint in the butt. Scraping out failing paint from those troughs is tough because the ridges of latewood get in the way of anything you might try to scrape with. A few interesting ideas on here, though.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Almost posted in DIY*



AngieM said:


> I'm not sure what you mean by raised grain? Is it in the cracks of the wood? If you're going to solid stain it, you just need to get it to a sound surface (no peeling or chipping stain) and you can stain over it.
> 
> The pic attached is of a deck I did where the customer wanted to switch from a solid stain to a semi transparent. We pressure washed it, stripped it twice, sanded and sanded and sanded it with a random orbital until I finally tried the angle grinder with a 40 grit flap wheel. I could have saved a lot of time by doing that to begin with. Live and learn. The video is on my Instagram.
> 
> ...


Betheweb and AngieM, thanks for the post and the reply. I was going to post in DIY chatroom about this because I have done so little deck work that I feel like an amateur asking you guys about this, but since it has come up, I will throw in my 2 cents. My cousin has a deck on his townhouse that is on the rear 1 story above the basement ground level with steps going down the back lawn. He wants it to look nice for his daughter's college graduation and I am trying to help. I am very _na_ about prep work, so doing decks that have been solid color stained is really something I would not like to do!

Solid color stain that is peeling and looks about like AngieM's deck before the grinder. We power washed it last weekend. I told my cousin that after it dries he might power wash it again after some more of the solid color stain lifts up a bit. I also left him a 2 1/2" carbide scraper and a replacement blade.

My cousin really wants the deck to look presentable as he is hosting a graduation party for his daughter with about 60 people coming. He realizes that the deck needs replacing down the road, but he wants to make it look nice for the grad party and a year or so more.

Any thoughts on what to put over this mess that will cover over the remaining solid color stain and last for a season or 2? I am imagining that unless every bit of visible solid color stain is removed, my cousin will have to use more solid color stain over the deck. Can I add EB Emulsa Bond to a solid color stain to make it grip more? Or am I trying to put a gold ring in the snout of a pig?

Last summer I stripped the metal railings and divider on a Marina Towers balcony as well as scrub the floor, then paint everything in a manner I won't discuss and will never do again!!!!!! I agree with AngieM when she says "Never again. That deck was a can of a worms."

Seeing as how my cousin realizes that whatever he does to his deck, it still needs replacing soon...is there a solid color stain that will hang on for 1 or 2 years?

failyos


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## PNW Painter (Sep 5, 2013)

I’ve never heard of the terms earlywood or latewood. It’s interesting that a trees rate of growth changes throughout the year and that’s what causes the deep wood grain I’ve seen on a lot of decks. I’m sure potential clients will find that interesting too.

A few years ago I refinished a deck that had very pronounced earlywood and latewood grain depths. For 2 1/2 days I grinded away at at that deck with 40 grit on my Festool Rotex sander. It was back breaking work and I vowed I would never do it again or at least such a large deck.











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## Betheweb (Jul 26, 2016)

futtyos said:


> Betheweb and AngieM, thanks for the post and the reply. I was going to post in DIY chatroom about this because I have done so little deck work that I feel like an amateur asking you guys about this, but since it has come up, I will throw in my 2 cents. My cousin has a deck on his townhouse that is on the rear 1 story above the basement ground level with steps going down the back lawn. He wants it to look nice for his daughter's college graduation and I am trying to help. I am very _na_ about prep work, so doing decks that have been solid color stained is really something I would not like to do!
> 
> Solid color stain that is peeling and looks about like AngieM's deck before the grinder. We power washed it last weekend. I told my cousin that after it dries he might power wash it again after some more of the solid color stain lifts up a bit. I also left him a 2 1/2" carbide scraper and a replacement blade.
> 
> ...


I don't understand your question. 

Is there a solid color stain that will stick to the previous stain? Yes. That is a non-issue. Slap 2 coats of SuperDeck on there. It is labelled for that. 

Is there a solid color stain that will magically fix the previous stain? Not that I know of. It's like painting anything else. Scrape the loose stuff. Peeling will usually start from a sharp corner, so anything that doesn't get scraped should be feathered. 

Personally, I'm lazy. If he's getting the deck replaced, why kill yourself? It'll look fine for the party almost no matter what you do. He can always do touch ups later if he decides to keep it a little longer.


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## futtyos (Aug 11, 2013)

*Which SuperDeck?*



Betheweb said:


> I don't understand your question.
> 
> Is there a solid color stain that will stick to the previous stain? Yes. That is a non-issue. Slap 2 coats of SuperDeck on there. It is labelled for that.
> 
> ...


Betheweb, thanks for the advice. I just want to be clear (not transparent, but maybe solid) about which product you are speaking of:

https://www.sherwin-williams.com/homeowners/products/catalog/families/superdeck-deck-care-system

or

https://www.superdeck.com/product-category/superdeck/

futtyos


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## Betheweb (Jul 26, 2016)

futtyos said:


> Betheweb, thanks for the advice. I just want to be clear (not transparent, but maybe solid) about which product you are speaking of:
> 
> https://www.sherwin-williams.com/homeowners/products/catalog/families/superdeck-deck-care-system
> 
> ...


I was referring to the the first one. The regular solid deck stain. 

I haven't used the deck and dock, but in general, the elastomerics are thicker and will fill in some imperfections and they look nice. But the flip side of that coin is the material costs kill you. Maybe you could swallow that pill if they held up well, but they just don't.


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## PNW Painter (Sep 5, 2013)

I’d be very cautious recommending an elastomeric product for a deck. My understanding is that elastomeric’s aren’t very permeable, which is a problem for decks that are exposed to lots of moisture. 


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## MDA (Feb 9, 2016)

As has been stated "raised grain" is caused by the soft wood (lignin) being worn away by UV etc. on unprotected wood. The tool I have found for making relatively short work of it is the Diamabrush. It comes in 7" and 4.5" sizes and fits on an angle grinder. There is a learning curve so use an old 2x4 to practice. It also makes a lot of saw dust so I recommend the dust shroud. We did a 13x13 deck in about 2 hrs, taking it from a solid "stain" really paint IMO to a transparent oil based penetrating stain. It will take out the raised grain and you might find you don't need to replace the deck at all. If you still have paint showing between the boards try wrapping an old sawzall blade with sand paper and use it with or without the sawzall, with is faster. Hope this helps.


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## illusionsgame (Aug 1, 2010)

Betheweb said:


> I don't understand your question.
> 
> Is there a solid color stain that will stick to the previous stain? Yes. That is a non-issue. Slap 2 coats of SuperDeck on there. It is labelled for that.
> 
> ...



Absolutely right, or Ben Moore Patio and Deck.. I think that's it's name. I would have just buzzed to level, primer then paint. Then hit spots that crack EVERY summer, not skipping one summer!!


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## jennifertemple (Oct 30, 2011)

Do none of you ever use a belt sander. On heavy, multi layered paint I buzz a lot off with a belt a 40 grit then do it again with 80. I finish at 120 grit. Then I use a detail grinder for tight spots. I could not live without my belt sander for stripping jobs!


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