# Best Primer Period?



## SkinnyAdam (Feb 21, 2013)

I live in a city that had a real estate boom about seven/eight years back. Now all those homes need their first repaint and I'm wondering if there's a primer that stands out from the rest.

Mostly Hardy Plank and LP siding. Some cedar shingles that got a cheap stain. Most houses got flat paint and it's so dang sunny here it's all fading.

Is there a primer out there that really out performs the rest when it comes to these newer, cookie-cutter type houses? I like to get the best when I can, sure makes selling the job easier :thumbsup:


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## Bender (Aug 10, 2008)

Are you familiar with Schrodingers Cat?


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## mudbone (Dec 26, 2011)

Zinsser.


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## Ole34 (Jan 24, 2011)

If I was in an island an could only have one primer it would be cover stain


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## ROOMINADAY (Mar 20, 2009)

We killed a few cells today.

Sent from my SGH-I747M using Paint Talk


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## MIZZOU (Nov 18, 2012)

mudbone said:


> Zinsser.


What he said


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

SkinnyAdam said:


> I live in a city that had a real estate boom about seven/eight years back. Now all those homes need their first repaint and I'm wondering if there's a primer that stands out from the rest.
> 
> Mostly Hardy Plank and LP siding. Some cedar shingles that got a cheap stain. Most houses got flat paint and it's so dang sunny here it's all fading.
> 
> Is there a primer out there that really out performs the rest when it comes to these newer, cookie-cutter type houses? I like to get the best when I can, sure makes selling the job easier :thumbsup:


Agreed. Coverstain is a great all around bridging primer..however on faded siding, i believe only spot priming bare spots would be neccasary. 2 coats of a solid acrylic paint or stain is sufficient. 
Whole house priming would not be neccasary.


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## SkinnyAdam (Feb 21, 2013)

Thanks guys, ill be picking up a five of that. I've used SW multi purpose latex primer in the past. Is that blasphemous or are we talking like a 9 year paint job vs a 11 year job?


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## Tonyg (Dec 9, 2007)

umm, kinda depends on what you are using it for doesn't it? A penetrating oil vs stain killer vs bonding agent vs etc. Substrate - wood, plastic, drywall, plaster, CMU, etc. etc.

I find myself trusting Zinnser products more than regular name brand/manufacturers though


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## SkinnyAdam (Feb 21, 2013)

Just on composite siding and door frames. Never on cedar, but on other bare wood where bleeding isn't an issue


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## Xmark (Apr 15, 2012)

i'll be testing out kilz max primer and sherwin williams premium Wood & Wall primer this week. both of these reportedly sand very well.

http://www.sherwin-williams.com/hom...ringCategory=interior-paint-coatings/primers/

http://www.kilz.com/primer/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=315214dce5542310VgnVCM100000176310acRCRD


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## Stonehampaintdept (Jan 10, 2013)

Too many different circumstances and conditions. If you're generalizing int or ext maybe, but even then their are too many variables.


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## CozzaPainting (Mar 29, 2011)

SW Premium Wall and Wood Primer sands down really nicely to a powder. It really seems to bond well to new wood. I just used it to prime a bunch of alder and mdf cabinet doors. I have heard it is not as good as a primer over previously painted surfaces.


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## SkinnyAdam (Feb 21, 2013)

Sorry, specifically exterior. Nothing crazy, just looking for what will keep the paint truest in a dry, sunny/snowy climate


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## Tonyg (Dec 9, 2007)

SkinnyAdam said:


> Sorry, specifically exterior. Nothing crazy, just looking for what will keep the paint truest in a dry, sunny/snowy climate


CoverStain on raw wood will not hold up as well as a penetrating oil or specialty primer. I use CS often on numerous circumstances/substrates but for new exterior wood I use the BM penetrating oil and for mostly everything else exterior I use Mad Dog or Peel Bond for full prime or spot prime.


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## kdpaint (Aug 14, 2010)

I agree with TonyG. I use CS sometimes as an exterior spot primer, but use long oils for "real" priming. You want 11 year paint jobs over bare wood, long oils plus quality acrylic top coats gets you there.


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## plainpainter (Nov 6, 2007)

The only time I use Cover-stain on an exterior is when the wood is so freaking dried out, I soak it with raw linseed oil first - then as soon as it's in, I cap it with Coverstain. Using a linseed based oil primer over linseed oil is a bit too much.


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## cdaniels (Oct 20, 2012)

+1 for Zinnser but if your repainting 8 yr. old homes what are you priming?


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## A+HomeWork (Dec 10, 2010)

cdaniels said:


> +1 for Zinnser but if your repainting 8 yr. old homes what are you priming?


Exactly what I was about to ask!!

I use Duration Satin almost exclusively on substrates that don't have to breath and if they will release moisture, then I will use Super Paint Satin or even A100 Satin on my repaints. I don't do many NC exteriors where widespread priming is necessary.

I've got houses pushing 11 years with A100 and 9 years with Duration and, other than some caulk lines, they are really looking very good and I didn't prime but a few small areas.


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## A+HomeWork (Dec 10, 2010)

ROOMINADAY said:


> We killed a few cells today.
> 
> Sent from my SGH-I747M using Paint Talk



CoverStain is my friend.:yes:


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## SkinnyAdam (Feb 21, 2013)

Thanks everyone. I'm trying to simplify products this year by getting top quality staples and sticking with them. I'm thinking Coverstain and Peel Bond should have me pretty covered for my area. Thanks again, ton of great info. I look forward to my future here on painttalk.


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## AV Painting (Apr 25, 2012)

Bump. What is everyones go to long oil?


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Definitely best for whole house priming..


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

AV Painting said:


> Bump. What is everyones go to long oil?


PPG 1-70 or. Benjamin Moore Moorwhite.


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## AV Painting (Apr 25, 2012)

Anyone like SW "Wood primer" long oil?


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

You know, I have been reading some journal articles from the Forestry Service, plus watching my repaint cycles and I am losing confidence in oil for exterior siding. Too brittle and I think its penetrating capabilities may be over rated.

There is a cottage we did near Lake MI on Lake Macatawa that was originally done with solid oil Moorwood stain. It had tannin bleed and some surface cracking of the film. We painted it in 2008 with the oil. On the worst area, a bay window on the southside, we used a quart of the 089 Solid acrylic stain. In 2013 we did the cottage again. There was only tannin bleed on oil stain areas, not the acrylic. Of course acrylic had better color retention. Acrylic also did not exhibit surface cracking. This was a dark brown house.

On an other project, we had to work on an new home that was originally primed with slow dry oil primer (BM 100) and then the solid oil stain. It bled tannin, surface cracked, etc over very high quality cedar. In just a couple years. Finally switching to acrylic with XIM Bleed Control 100 to try that since oil was getting us nowhere on that one. This what a white house (Dutch Colonial style).

I have read a few journal articles from the Forestry service, and it sounds like oil primers really are not offering any benefit from reduced surface cracking and long term durability compared to all acrylic systems.

I have long been a believer in a slow dry (usually BM 094 lately or the discontinued 366 primer, sometimes 100) for raw wood on siding. But, I am beginning to doubt that approach. Seeing the test board on here about MadDog that had PeelBond, Coverstain, Maddog and another oil primer IIRC reminded me about this a couple weeks back.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

Dean,

We gave up on solid color oil stains a while ago. Between the cracking and fading, they didn't have much to recommend them.

OTOH, for painting western red cedar, especially old WRC, we have not found anything to beat long oil.


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## daArch (Mar 15, 2008)

DeanV said:


> You know, I have been reading some journal articles from the Forestry Service, plus watching my repaint cycles and I am losing confidence in oil for exterior siding. Too brittle and I think its penetrating capabilities may be over rated.
> 
> There is a cottage we did near Lake MI on Lake Macatawa that was originally done with solid oil Moorwood stain. It had tannin bleed and some surface cracking of the film. We painted it in 2008 with the oil. On the worst area, a bay window on the southside, we used a quart of the 089 Solid acrylic stain. In 2013 we did the cottage again. There was only tannin bleed on oil stain areas, not the acrylic. Of course acrylic had better color retention. Acrylic also did not exhibit surface cracking. This was a dark brown house.
> 
> ...


I used to swear by Calif Universal primer that advertised "Linseed Oil", and in later years with acrylic over it.

But lo and behold, linseed DOES feed mold and mildew. 

You are right Dean, acrylic systems have progressed greatly in the past 20 years. And the castration of oil paints makes them even more susceptible to early failure.


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

Gough said:


> Dean,
> 
> We gave on solid color oil stains a while ago. Between the cracking and fading, they didn't have much to recommend them.
> 
> OTOH, for painting western red cedar, especially old WRC, we have found anything to beat long oil.


You have found ANYTHING to beat long oil? I am guessing this is a typo.


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## I paint paint (May 4, 2014)

I think he is missing an "up" in the first sentence and a "not" in last sentence.


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## jprefect (Mar 4, 2015)

Honestly, you probably dint need to prime. Two coats of Aura Ext, even over bare wood, covers and sticks like crazy. Goes without saying you need to back-brush, but I said it anyway.


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

Dean and I Paint Paint, thanks for catching my typos.

As the Forest Products Lab's articles point out, oil may still be the better choice for bleed-prone woods, like redwood and red cedar. Since that's about the only wood siding that we see here and since we rarely have mildew problems, long oil is still our exterior primer of choice.


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## finishesbykevyn (Apr 14, 2010)

Buuut. Whaat about all those rusty nail heads on clapboard.. Will your acrylic primer work on those. That being said, I guess a long oil isnt designed for rust either. Correct me if im wrong..


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## DeanV (Apr 18, 2007)

On an exterior we just did, the interior guys did the new cedar exterior railings. Two coats woodscapes waterbase. No tannin bleed and they look great. I had priced for 1 oil prime plus 2 finish coats.


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

I don't do much cedar, but when I do I use woodscapes. 

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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## Gough (Nov 24, 2010)

Rbriggs82 said:


> I don't do much cedar, but when I do I use woodscapes.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk












Around here, just about anything built before 1970 is clad with Western Red Cedar and painted. Repainted well, it holds paint like stink.

The newer cedar-clad homes are mostly stained, and that works well. Mostly it works well because the siding is rough cut, not planed. Also, most of the siding is junk, since the price for Clear VG Heart has gone through the roof.


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## Rbriggs82 (Jul 9, 2012)

Gough said:


> View attachment 52154
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh yea, if it's been painted and re-painted before then I'd stick with it. Starting fresh I think woodscapes is the ticket, plus it saves a coat of primer which is an added benefit.


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## Mike2coat (Nov 12, 2013)

Spot prime the rusty nails with a rattle can of red oxide rust block primer. Use Sherwin williams Multi purpose primer and apply to proper coverage, so what if you get some tannin bleed it only matters if you have a light color and its bleeding through. You can spot prime. Keep it simple.


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## AV Painting (Apr 25, 2012)

Very interesting Dean, thanks for the info. What is this test board you speak of with Maddog Peel Bond and cover stain? Link?

So speaking of acrylic primers, these are ones in my market to consider:
1. Bullseye 123 - $17.60/g in a 5g from HD or $14.99/g in a 2g. WTF?
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Zinsser-...ior-Exterior-Primer-and-Sealer-2000/100398392
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Zinsser-...r-Exterior-Primer-and-Sealer-259115/202713102
2. SW Quick dry latex - $12.95
3. SW Multipurpose - $27.99
4. SW Wood Primer - $28.95

What would you use for spot priming, what would you use for new raw wood? Not considering tannin bleed issues. What are the real differences in those SW products?


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## Jazz_Painter (Feb 22, 2015)

Is there a good stain alternative (PPG, BM, Sansin) for the woodscapes stain?

Oh and maybe Woodford can help me there concerning BM Freshstart primers :

There are two alkyd exterior primers that seem to do more or less the same thing, what makes the two products different and what are their preferable applications ?

Fresh Start Exterior wood primer 094
Fresh Start Moorwhite Exterior Wood Primer 100

The 094 is fast drying and recommended for cedar and redwood.
The 100 is slow drying and recommended here for the same use.


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